Football In Uk Is Not An Even Competition

[ozinthailand]

Looks like only the top 4-5 teams always win the competition in the UK. Like al other sports when a salary cap was introduced, it evened out the comptition, so that any team can win. It makes it mopre interesting that thye same top 4-5 teams every year

[StevieH]

i'd implement a salary cap in english football in a heartbeat. no player to earn above say 30k a week. would bring down match ticket prices, reduce the cost of satellite tv subscriptions, increase competition for trophies and impact positively on the game at grass roots level. never going to happen though.

[bkkjames]

i'd implement a salary cap in english football in a heartbeat. no player to earn above say 30k a week. would bring down match ticket prices, reduce the cost of satellite tv subscriptions, increase competition for trophies and impact positively on the game at grass roots level. never going to happen though.

I agree (yes it does happen stevie). It works in the US / Canada and who knows with the global economy going the way it is, perhaps football.

But as long as you have multi billionaires as owners of the big clubs, it will be a tough sell.

[MSingh]

Looks like only the top 4-5 teams always win the competition in the UK. Like al other sports when a salary cap was introduced, it evened out the comptition, so that any team can win. It makes it mopre interesting that thye same top 4-5 teams every year

You're way out there Fella..

Name me 2 or 3 others Clubs outside of Rangers & Celtic who can win the Scottish League in the UK ??

& name me the fith in England & i'd be amazed ??

Only joking, i think Football is past the point of no return personally with regards to $$ & see it ( the Prem ) more of a Soap Opera than a Game that i used to ( & probably do if i'm honest with myself even though i hate it at the same time, for what it's become )..

English Football lost it's soul ( already ) for a number of reasons..

1 ) The greed of the initial English Owners who sold out but can you really blame them if you was in their position ??

2 ) SKY TV

3 ) The amount of Foreigners both on the Pitch & off the Pitch in the Boardroom that have little or no idea of the history & culture of English Football ( & we'd be naive to even think they would have ) ..

4 ) The Champions League & the League within a League in the Premiership known by many as " The Big 4 ". I'm not having a go at those particular 4 Clubs personally, it wouldn't matter who the clubs were, be it Stoke, WBA, Hull & Bolton. I'm saying that one of the reasons English Football has already lost its soul is because of how those Clubs ( any 4 Clubs as that's the amount of CL places the Prem gets ) have distanced themselves form the rest of the League financially, which again, you can't blame them for but it is one of the reasons English Football has lost it's soul..

5 ) Society & the Media - The majority of Premiership Players today are not Men, they're a <deleted> Joke of Human Beings who wear poncey Clothes, talk like <deleted> Idiots & have the IQ of the resident Tockay on the back of our Houses/Apartments & it's Society & the Media in the UK who allow them to be like this..

6 ) Money - Where there's an interest, there's an appetite, where there's an appetite, there's success, where there's success, there's money, where there's money, there's greed, where there's greep, there's problems, where there's problems, then things just aren't right, just like in English Football.. Money also has an impact on all of the above ^^ 5 points i made..

We can argue as much as we like about the points i've made, we can't however argue that these points all have a played a part in the loss of the Soul of English Football..

[StevieH]

I agree (yes it does happen stevie). It works in the US / Canada and who knows with the global economy going the way it is, perhaps football.

But as long as you have multi billionaires as owners of the big clubs, it will be a tough sell.

i know it happens james, i said that it's never going to happen in english football.

[StevieH]

Only joking, i think Football is past the point of no return personally with regards to $ & see it ( the Prem ) more of a Soap Opera than a Game that i used to ( & probably do if i'm honest with myself even though i hate it at the same time, for what it's become )..

English Football lost it's soul ( already ) for a number of reasons..

1 ) The greed of the initial English Owners who sold out but can you really blame them if you was in their position ??

2 ) SKY TV

3 ) The amount of Foreigners both on the Pitch & off the Pitch in the Boardroom that have little or no idea of the history & culture of English Football ( & we'd be naive to even think they would have ) ..

4 ) The Champions League & the League within a League in the Premiership known by many as " The Big 4 ". I'm not having a go at those particular 4 Clubs personally, it wouldn't matter who the clubs were, be it Stoke, WBA, Hull & Bolton. I'm saying that one of the reasons English Football has already lost its soul is because of how those Clubs ( any 4 Clubs as that's the amount of CL places the Prem gets ) have distanced themselves form the rest of the League financially, which again, you can't blame them for but it is one of the reasons English Football has lost it's soul..

5 ) Society & the Media - The majority of Premiership Players today are not Men, they're a <deleted> Joke of Human Beings who wear poncey Clothes, talk like <deleted> Idiots & have the IQ of the resident Tockay on the back of our Houses/Apartments & it's Society & the Media in the UK who allow them to be like this..

6 ) Money - Where there's an interest, there's an appetite, where there's an appetite, there's success, where there's success, there's money, where there's money, there's greed, where there's greep, there's problems, where there's problems, then things just aren't right, just like in English Football.. Money also has an impact on all of the above ^^ 5 points i made..

We can argue as much as we like about the points i've made, we can't however argue that these points all have a played a part in the loss of the Soul of English Football..

excellent post. football in england is no longer a sport unfortunately, it's a business. i'd disagree with the 'foreigners on the pitch' angle m, it's not their fault that they're paid stupid money, but i'd throw in also the cult of celebrity inherent in british society as another reason for the game having lost its soul and the players being monotone moronic mannequins with little or no sense of the incredibly priveleged position they find themselves in.

to restore football's soul and with that its competition, you'd have to tear up the current status quo and start again from scratch. and while so many parties make so much money from it, incidentally you can throw in UEFA, FIFA and the FA alongside Sky TV, that's never going to happen. the FA in particular pays appalling lip service to the grass roots of the game while taking massive sponsorship cash from the likes of budweiser and mcdonald's for example.

[Devil]

i'd implement a salary cap in english football in a heartbeat. no player to earn above say 30k a week. would bring down match ticket prices, reduce the cost of satellite tv subscriptions, increase competition for trophies and impact positively on the game at grass roots level. never going to happen though.

If that happened the EPL wouldn't attract the best players in the world anymore. They would go to leagues that paid the most money and would want to play with the best players.

People would start watching the NEW rich league more than the EPL if all the star players went there. I remember the fuss when Klinsman and a few others made it into the EPL years ago and now look at the EPL. As you siad Stevie H , never going to happen...

Just to add to this... I actually think fair play to any one who has the ability to be a Pro footballer and get in the EPL and demand the going rates clubs will pay... I would do! wouldnt you? after all there are only so many people in the world that can do what they do on the pitch at that level. And we all pay to watch it anyway.

Interesting Post by the OP...

[MSingh]

3 ) The amount of Foreigners both on the Pitch & off the Pitch in the Boardroom that have little or no idea of the history & culture of English Football ( & we'd be naive to even think they would have ) ..

..

excellent post. football in england is no longer a sport unfortunately, it's a business. i'd disagree with the 'foreigners on the pitch' angle m, it's not their fault that they're paid stupid money, but i'd throw in also the cult of celebrity inherent in british society as another reason for the game having lost its soul and the players being monotone moronic mannequins with little or no sense of the incredibly priveleged position they find themselves in.

Agree Stevie but i didn't mean the Foreigners that take the money, as i said , we can't blame them for doing it cos we all would to support our Families, just like they do..

I meant the way that the English Game, & English people themselves, was perceived & still a lot want to be perceived IE Strong, honest & fair above all else, which isn't at all helped by Foreigners who, without doubt, have encouraged cheating in our League..

Not all of course..

That's not racist or bigoted at all, it's juts a fact..

The plain fact of the matter is 15 years ago, you would not have seen any English Player dive..

Today we see it regulary & it's sad in my opinion..

It happened for years all over the Continent & S America, it never happened in England ( Very, very, very, very, very rarely ) but it is now & you don't need to be a Rocket Scientist to work out that during the time frame i'm talking about, the influx of Foreign Footballers has been pretty dramatic..

Then again, it may just be a coincidence of course..

No need to name names but we can all see it, we see it week in week out in the Premiership & i despise it as it's plain & simply cheating, & cheating's wrong..

[mrbojangles]

I think every team who is in debt through borrowing to buy big name players, should be kicked out of the EPL and forced to play in Wales.

As for salary caps. Before we had money i would have agreed. But i don't anymore. Tough sh1t if you can't afford to pay the wages

[bkkjames]

I agree (yes it does happen stevie). It works in the US / Canada and who knows with the global economy going the way it is, perhaps football.

But as long as you have multi billionaires as owners of the big clubs, it will be a tough sell.

i know it happens james, i said that it's never going to happen in english football.

I meant we agree stevie from time to time not about the salary cap

[StevieH]

If that happened the EPL wouldn't attract the best players in the world anymore. They would go to leagues that paid the most money and would want to play with the best players.

People would start watching the NEW rich league more than the EPL if all the star players went there. I remember the fuss when Klinsman and a few others made it into the EPL years ago and now look at the EPL. As you siad Stevie H , never going to happen...

Just to add to this... I actually think fair play to any one who has the ability to be a Pro footballer and get in the EPL and demand the going rates clubs will pay... I would do! wouldnt you? after all there are only so many people in the world that can do what they do on the pitch at that level. And we all pay to watch it anyway.

Interesting Post by the OP...

but since attracting the best players in the world the league has become less and less competitive as the champions league clubs have a monopoly on the really top players. it's catch-22, in the 80s serie a in italy was the richest and most successful league, so the players flocked there. in the 90s, it was la liga in spain. now it's england's turn, but the key difference is that neither spain nor italy had the money thrown at it that sky puts into the premier league and the champions league was either not there in serie a's case or not nearly so lucrative in the case of la liga.

disagree, i know it's driven by the free market but the players are absurdly overpaid for their performance on average. a salary cap would sort the wheat from the chaff, weed out the mercenaries and still afford players an appallingly comfortable living while going some way to even up competition and refresh the game at grass roots level.

[StevieH]

I meant we agree stevie from time to time not about the salary cap

no we don't james. i just indulge you every so often you plastic manc you.

[bkkjames]

I meant we agree stevie from time to time not about the salary cap

no we don't james. i just indulge you every so often you plastic manc you.

Ok ok, I understand the nervousness on your side, what one point ahead 20+ games to go. It's been 18 years since you had a taste of it, so i will let it slide.

[Chaimai]

I would have a salary cap linked to the average weekly wage of a qualified Harley Street surgeon. No footballer should earn more - current wages are already too far removed from the average spectator.

If Man Utd win the league for 2 years running Ronaldo has to play for 15 minutes each half with a blindfold. Rooney has to play for one half with a 'gag' for his mouth (that might actually help, though!)

No team can pay more than 5 times their average weekly gross gate receipts (e.g. GBP 20 x 40,000 x 5 = 4 million.

Every ground has to provide at least 2 'English' flavoured pies. (I was pi55ed off that on my last visit to see 'my' team they only balti, chicken curry and some vegetable flavourd sh!te for the pies. I had also forgotten how disgusting a hot dog is when it is a manky frankfurter with a stale non-buttered roll).

I would also have 2 referees - one for each half of the pitch and 4 linesmen. This is a temporary measure to instill relative discipline ala rugby union - should only take 25 years.

I would abolish yellow card and just have red ones - first red card 10 mins in 'sin bin', 2nd red card 15 mins, 3rd red card - take an early bath. I would issue a card for any dissent - only the team captain is allowed to communicate directly with the referee.

I would introduce a "3rd referee" for TV judgements on key decisions - these include ALL penalty decisions and over the line incidents.

Anybody disagree ??

[StevieH]

I would have a salary cap linked to the average weekly wage of a qualified Harley Street surgeon. No footballer should earn more - current wages are already too far removed from the average spectator.

If Man Utd win the league for 2 years running Ronaldo has to play for 15 minutes each half with a blindfold. Rooney has to play for one half with a 'gag' for his mouth (that might actually help, though!)

No team can pay more than 5 times their average weekly gross gate receipts (e.g. GBP 20 x 40,000 x 5 = 4 million.

Every ground has to provide at least 2 'English' flavoured pies. (I was pi55ed off that on my last visit to see 'my' team they only balti, chicken curry and some vegetable flavourd sh!te for the pies. I had also forgotten how disgusting a hot dog is when it is a manky frankfurter with a stale non-buttered roll).

I would also have 2 referees - one for each half of the pitch and 4 linesmen. This is a temporary measure to instill relative discipline ala rugby union - should only take 25 years.

I would abolish yellow card and just have red ones - first red card 10 mins in 'sin bin', 2nd red card 15 mins, 3rd red card - take an early bath. I would issue a card for any dissent - only the team captain is allowed to communicate directly with the referee.

I would introduce a "3rd referee" for TV judgements on key decisions - these include ALL penalty decisions and over the line incidents.

Anybody disagree ??

disagree absolutely. balti pies, known at anfield as 'lava pies', are fuc_king boss.

Edited December 4, 2008 by StevieH

[bkkjames]

quite honestly, its the transfer fees that really hurt the smaller clubs

[StevieH]

quite honestly, its the transfer fees that really hurt the smaller clubs

how do you mean? since the majority of smaller clubs' income comes from developing good young players who are then signed by bigger clubs.

[bkkjames]

quite honestly, its the transfer fees that really hurt the smaller clubs

how do you mean? since the majority of smaller clubs' income comes from developing good young players who are then signed by bigger clubs.

not many torres, robinho's etc being signed by the small ones stevie.

[MSingh]

I would have a salary cap linked to the average weekly wage of a qualified Harley Street surgeon. No footballer should earn more - current wages are already too far removed from the average spectator.

If Man Utd win the league for 2 years running Ronaldo has to play for 15 minutes each half with a blindfold. Rooney has to play for one half with a 'gag' for his mouth (that might actually help, though!)

No team can pay more than 5 times their average weekly gross gate receipts (e.g. GBP 20 x 40,000 x 5 = 4 million.

Every ground has to provide at least 2 'English' flavoured pies. (I was pi55ed off that on my last visit to see 'my' team they only balti, chicken curry and some vegetable flavourd sh!te for the pies. I had also forgotten how disgusting a hot dog is when it is a manky frankfurter with a stale non-buttered roll).

I would also have 2 referees - one for each half of the pitch and 4 linesmen. This is a temporary measure to instill relative discipline ala rugby union - should only take 25 years.

I would abolish yellow card and just have red ones - first red card 10 mins in 'sin bin', 2nd red card 15 mins, 3rd red card - take an early bath. I would issue a card for any dissent - only the team captain is allowed to communicate directly with the referee.

I would introduce a "3rd referee" for TV judgements on key decisions - these include ALL penalty decisions and over the line incidents.

Anybody disagree ??

disagree absolutely. balti pies, known at anfield as 'lava pies', are fuc_king boss.

I disagree too, should be Pie, Mash & Licquer & some Jellied Eels..

Or a Vindaloo of course...

[StevieH]

quite honestly, its the transfer fees that really hurt the smaller clubs

how do you mean? since the majority of smaller clubs' income comes from developing good young players who are then signed by bigger clubs.

not many torres, robinho's etc being signed by the small ones stevie.

LOL! fuc_king hel_l james, what's your definition of a small club? everton?

i'm talking about the clubs in the lower divisions whose existence hinges on selling a talented 19 year old to bolton for a couple of million. you really are a johnny-come-lately glory-hunter aren't you?

[Devil]

Interesting points from all sides...

I think one day there will be a European super league anyway maybe sooner than later? (not a cup) based on the current Champions League format. I know it was in the plans a while back and there was an uproar from the lower teams. Maybe that would be the way forward? The top (richest clubs) compete and that would be a very competitive league...

[StevieH]

Interesting points from all sides...

I think one day there will be a European super league anyway maybe sooner than later? (not a cup) based on the current Champions League format. I know it was in the plans a while back and there was an uproar from the lower teams. Maybe that would be the way forward? The top (richest clubs) compete and that would be a very competitive league...

uefa's expansion of the champion's league to a two-stage group format was a direct response to the threat of a breakaway euro super league dev, and it didn't fly. so they reverted to the current format and you still have, particularly thanks to the seeding at the draw stage, generally the same teams making it through to the lucrative knockout stages. it's a crock. start of each season now there are, what, six teams who might realistically win the CL? meanwhile the money paid to the top three or four in each domestic league for champions league play continues to make the domestic leagues less competitive. it's a viscious circle.

[StevieH]

I disagree too, should be Pie, Mash & Licquer & some Jellied Eels..

Or a Vindaloo of course...

i went to west ham away last season for the first time in a few years, pies were good but fuc_k me the area around upton park has deteriorated hasn't it? was like bloody beirut.

[tw25rw]

I'd bring in measures to force clubs to severely slash their debts. And also make it so that only a portion of player salaries can come from ticket sales, the rest being demonstrated to come from sponsorship, merchandise, TV cash or owner capital.

[StevieH]

I'd bring in measures to force clubs to severely slash their debts. And also make it so that only a portion of player salaries can come from ticket sales, the rest being demonstrated to come from sponsorship, merchandise, TV cash or owner capital.

can't do that, they'd go to the wall. but i think they should be better regulated. plus you have clubs outside of the equation like real madrid who don't have to operate within normal corporate boundaries.

agree with some of your other measures, but a salary cap funded by those means would make for a much more level playing field. at the minute it's like asking joe's burger van to compete with mcdonald's having someone like west brom in the same division as chelsea.

[MSingh]

I disagree too, should be Pie, Mash & Licquer & some Jellied Eels..

Or a Vindaloo of course...

i went to west ham away last season for the first time in a few years, pies were good but fuc_k me the area around upton park has deteriorated hasn't it? was like bloody beirut.

Dont' know about deteriorated, it's always been an absolute sh*t hole, certainly for my 29 years on the Planet & considering my first Game was against your Mob funnily enough, in 1985, that's 20 year plus..

I used to go to School within walking distance of the Ground..

East London in general is a sh*t hole..

I'm from Canning Town/Custom House & this is a true story, some time in 2006, DHL or UPS ( One or the other ) would deliever Parcels to addresses in Baghdad & Kabul, they wouldn't however deliever to London Post Code E16 ( Canning Town/Custom House ) for a full year, which says it all i'm afraid..

Still, for all it's faults, it has my Mecca & i'm not talking about the one in Saudi...

[tw25rw]

I disagree too, should be Pie, Mash & Licquer & some Jellied Eels..

Or a Vindaloo of course...

i went to west ham away last season for the first time in a few years, pies were good but fuc_k me the area around upton park has deteriorated hasn't it? was like bloody beirut.

Dont' know about deteriorated, it's always been an absolute sh*t hole, certainly for my 29 years on the Planet & considering my first Game was against your Mob funnily enough, in 1985, that's 20 year plus..

I used to go to School within walking distance of the Ground..

East London in general is a sh*t hole..

I'm from Canning Town/Custom House & this is a true story, some time in 2006, DHL or UPS ( One or the other ) would deliever Parcels to addresses in Baghdad & Kabul, they wouldn't however deliever to London Post Code E16 ( Canning Town/Custom House ) for a full year, which says it all i'm afraid..

Still, for all it's faults, it has my Mecca & i'm not talking about the one in Saudi...

My first was in 1975 v Chelsea, which I recently learnt was Curbs' debut. I had a blue & white QPR scarf which Dad wouldn't let me wear for some reason.

The area was different then, but no less rough. I hate that walk down Green St and would welcome a move away. They should at least contribute to rebuild the station if they don't move..

[ozinthailand]

I'd bring in measures to force clubs to severely slash their debts. And also make it so that only a portion of player salaries can come from ticket sales, the rest being demonstrated to come from sponsorship, merchandise, TV cash or owner capital.

can't do that, they'd go to the wall. but i think they should be better regulated. plus you have clubs outside of the equation like real madrid who don't have to operate within normal corporate boundaries.

agree with some of your other measures, but a salary cap funded by those means would make for a much more level playing field. at the minute it's like asking joe's burger van to compete with mcdonald's having someone like west brom in the same division as chelsea.

To be honest, I dont even watch football, I am an aussie, nut I discussed this with a matein the UK and he disagreed, sorry to say he didnt understand the concept...... I think this would make the sport better !!! dont u thinK??

[tw25rw]

I'd bring in measures to force clubs to severely slash their debts. And also make it so that only a portion of player salaries can come from ticket sales, the rest being demonstrated to come from sponsorship, merchandise, TV cash or owner capital.

can't do that, they'd go to the wall. but i think they should be better regulated. plus you have clubs outside of the equation like real madrid who don't have to operate within normal corporate boundaries.

agree with some of your other measures, but a salary cap funded by those means would make for a much more level playing field. at the minute it's like asking joe's burger van to compete with mcdonald's having someone like west brom in the same division as chelsea.

To be honest, I dont even watch football, I am an aussie, nut I discussed this with a matein the UK and he disagreed, sorry to say he didnt understand the concept...... I think this would make the sport better !!! dont u thinK??

I am too funnily enough.. I've seen how well the cap works in rugby league where hardly any club has been premiers twice in the last 10 years (only Melbourne I think). Hard to do in football because it's spread over large league structures in very diverse economies.