Hey guys,

I am taking Chinese right now in college, they don't teach Thai, I have no real problem learning the langauge I just don't have enough time to 'get the grade'. With all the classes and kids and job I can't study it enough to get a passing grade. So, I am thinking about switching to a langauge that might be easier for an english speaker......like German. Anyone here with German speaking skills that can advise me?

Cheers,

Thaibebop

Dr Naam has Klingon and a smattering of Jerry.

German is much easier I would think, well I would expect any European language would be easier for an English speaker.

My first two real girlfriends were German and French, so I have a smattering of both (but more French)

I believe German is one of the most difficult, structurally speaking, languages to learn.

My problem when I tried it was running out of breath halfway through some of the words.

Try 'strine, I've heard it's quite easy.

German is not too hard, yes some of the words are hard to pronounce but you'll find that with any language. Most Euro languages are easy enough to learn to conversational level, taking it to top academic level is hard for any language.

ps when I say euro, I would avoid some of the eastern euro languages. After 10 days in Poland I could barely say 'Hello, how are you, and give me a beer!'

german is not a difficult language at all. in Germany even small children age four and five speak german fluently. so why should it be difficult for a (i assume) grown up Brit to learn the language?

one caveat though. the chance that a foreigner will ever be able to use correct german grammar is equivalent to the one of a snowball in héll. making grammar mistakes is a burden even highly educated Germans have to bear. it's a breeze for a German to learn english but not the other way round.

by the way, i beg to differ as far as german "difficult" pronunciation is concerned. there are rather strict rules which cover (my guess) 95% of the words although the rules are not as easy to learn as the french or spanish pronunciation rules. english has no pronunciation rules and it happens quite often that i ask my wife how an english word is pronounced although i have known, read and wrote it a zillion times but never heard it spoken.

I found German words quite easy to pronounce, but didnt actually enjoy learning. Personally I found the language a bit harsh sounding. I prefer the smoothness of French, but my fav of all is Spanish. Rapid fire speech! Would love to learn Japanese, but I still havent mastered my own language never mind any others!

I suggest thinking about which one may be more useful to you personally and/or listening to some foreign language films to see which one you are more drawn to. If after an hour of watching the sound begins to grate on you, it is probably not your best choice for study. As you have a choice in what you study, go for the one that seems most intriguing and interesting to you. One that you would actually enjoy learning and speaking.

Thanks for posting you guys.

Right now I am working on a BA in East Asian History. I plan to continue on to PhD level to research and teach college. My focus is Sino-Thai relations. I am interested how these two peoples have dealt with each other over the centuries as well as now. So, in this sense German will not help. However, with a family it's not easy to move and the college I am at ,University of Kansas, the Chinese program is harsh. It is designed by a bitter women has told her students Chinese is too hard for almost all Americans, she however is different I guess. In other words to get my BA and continue my work it might be a good idea to find a langauge as well as a professer that is a little more reasonable.

German is for me a ancestral language, at least from one side. I am American and my last Name is Brammer, so I always wanted to learn it and the parts of Europe I wanted to see is where I can use it. I have always wanted to see Northern Europe, UK and Russia. I know I can use German is many countries to help get by, but it won't help me academically, besides helping me meet my language requirement for my BA.

german is not a difficult language at all. in Germany even small children age four and five speak german fluently. so why should it be difficult for a (i assume) grown up Brit to learn the language?

one caveat though. the chance that a foreigner will ever be able to use correct german grammar is equivalent to the one of a snowball in héll. making grammar mistakes is a burden even highly educated Germans have to bear. it's a breeze for a German to learn english but not the other way round.

by the way, i beg to differ as far as german "difficult" pronunciation is concerned. there are rather strict rules which cover (my guess) 95% of the words although the rules are not as easy to learn as the french or spanish pronunciation rules. english has no pronunciation rules and it happens quite often that i ask my wife how an english word is pronounced although i have known, read and wrote it a zillion times but never heard it spoken.

I have heard something like this before. What is the major differences between High and Low German? That is the correct way to refer to the differences right?

german is not a difficult language at all. in Germany even small children age four and five speak german fluently. so why should it be difficult for a (i assume) grown up Brit to learn the language?

one caveat though. the chance that a foreigner will ever be able to use correct german grammar is equivalent to the one of a snowball in héll. making grammar mistakes is a burden even highly educated Germans have to bear. it's a breeze for a German to learn english but not the other way round.

by the way, i beg to differ as far as german "difficult" pronunciation is concerned. there are rather strict rules which cover (my guess) 95% of the words although the rules are not as easy to learn as the french or spanish pronunciation rules. english has no pronunciation rules and it happens quite often that i ask my wife how an english word is pronounced although i have known, read and wrote it a zillion times but never heard it spoken.

I have heard something like this before. What is the major differences between High and Low German? That is the correct way to refer to the differences right?

"low german" does not exist. besides "normal" german, different dialects are spoken. some of them vary so much that people from different areas are not able to communicate if using these dialects. even villages located only a few kilometers apart might use completely different words.

as far as "high german" is concerned two versions exist. one is based on using exclusively words with germanic roots, the other one is substituting (when possible) the germanic roots with romanic ones. people with basic education will have no problems to understand "high german" with germanic roots. it is however possible that two Germans use the romanic version and a not highly educated german listener will understand only a part and not get the gist what is discussed.

comparing english with german one finds thousands of words with the same spelling but different pronunciation or same proncunciation but different spelling. examples: finger, hand, arm, house, land.

bepop

for european language thats easier, Id propose Spanish. it also has wide use, and is one of UN official language so can come very handy

(I had an interest in german myself , still do actually, but didnt manage to learn it as the pronunciations are impossible for me)

for asian language, instead of chinese or japanese, why not try indonesian? is in demand if you want to work in south east asia, relatively easy, if for no other reason it is romanised, and i believe has minimal grammar. you can use it in indonesia, but will also be able to manage in malaysia once you have learnt it

I agree with Miggie. Indonesian is much easier and has the added benefit of using the same alphabet. I studied Mandarin for 3 years at Uni level and for me, it wasn't the speaking part that was so difficult but memorizing all the characters. Indonesian (and Bahasa Malay) is much easier. and it has the added benefit of relevance to your degree. Now the big question is, does the U of K offer Indonesian?

I agree with Miggie. Indonesian is much easier and has the added benefit of using the same alphabet. I studied Mandarin for 3 years at Uni level and for me, it wasn't the speaking part that was so difficult but memorizing all the characters. Indonesian (and Bahasa Malay) is much easier. and it has the added benefit of relevance to your degree. Now the big question is, does the U of K offer Indonesian?

The college I am at doesn't offer SEA langauges, otherwise I would learn Thai, as I know we will end up there one day. They offer Chinese (Mandarin) Japanese, Tibetan, Korean and a couple other Central Asia langauges, small pickings for sure. I was thinking about going to another school that offers Thai for my masters, we have a few that are SEA based schools, Washington State has a great program. However, we are spuer poor right now and have two kids to move as well. So, I am trying to everything up to the masters level done in one school than head for Thailand and research central, worry about that PhD after that. Geograpgy frustrates me!!!

bepop

for european language thats easier, Id propose Spanish. it also has wide use, and is one of UN official language so can come very handy

(I had an interest in german myself , still do actually, but didnt manage to learn it as the pronunciations are impossible for me)

for asian language, instead of chinese or japanese, why not try indonesian? is in demand if you want to work in south east asia, relatively easy, if for no other reason it is romanised, and i believe has minimal grammar. you can use it in indonesia, but will also be able to manage in malaysia once you have learnt it

Many people have suggested Spanish, it's like the fall back foreign langauge for Yanks. I have taken a year of Spainsh a long time ago and I just don't like it. My mouth doesn't like it, the feel of it. I sang in my youth as well and sang many German works, loved it!! Seems strange right?

german is not a difficult language at all. in Germany even small children age four and five speak german fluently. so why should it be difficult for a (i assume) grown up Brit to learn the language?

one caveat though. the chance that a foreigner will ever be able to use correct german grammar is equivalent to the one of a snowball in héll. making grammar mistakes is a burden even highly educated Germans have to bear. it's a breeze for a German to learn english but not the other way round.

by the way, i beg to differ as far as german "difficult" pronunciation is concerned. there are rather strict rules which cover (my guess) 95% of the words although the rules are not as easy to learn as the french or spanish pronunciation rules. english has no pronunciation rules and it happens quite often that i ask my wife how an english word is pronounced although i have known, read and wrote it a zillion times but never heard it spoken.

I have heard something like this before. What is the major differences between High and Low German? That is the correct way to refer to the differences right?

"low german" does not exist. besides "normal" german, different dialects are spoken. some of them vary so much that people from different areas are not able to communicate if using these dialects. even villages located only a few kilometers apart might use completely different words.

as far as "high german" is concerned two versions exist. one is based on using exclusively words with germanic roots, the other one is substituting (when possible) the germanic roots with romanic ones. people with basic education will have no problems to understand "high german" with germanic roots. it is however possible that two Germans use the romanic version and a not highly educated german listener will understand only a part and not get the gist what is discussed.

comparing english with german one finds thousands of words with the same spelling but different pronunciation or same proncunciation but different spelling. examples: finger, hand, arm, house, land.

I am assuming that "high German" is what is taught in American Universities, right?

I am assuming that "high German" is what is taught in American Universities, right?

that is correct. it is virtually impossible to teach german dialects because for that purpose phonetics do not exist.

I am assuming that "high German" is what is taught in American Universities, right?

that is correct. it is virtually impossible to teach german dialects because for that purpose phonetics do not exist.

Thanks so much!

I am assuming that "high German" is what is taught in American Universities, right?

that is correct. it is virtually impossible to teach german dialects because for that purpose phonetics do not exist.

Thanks so much!

If it exists "high German" is actually spoken by most TV news readers or broadcasters.

High German means speaking German without an accent but a 100% accent free German does not exist.

The so called "high German speaker area" is around Hanover in Lower Saxony and north of it.

"high German" is the more common language spoken in the north rather than in the southern parts of Germany.

For a native "high German" speaker it is not difficult to learn and speak a dialect except a few. Its true some

German dialects are hard to understand even for native speakers.

Naam, why is it that when Germans come to visit Holland they many times ask for directions to either Zandvoort or Scheveningen in German.

Yes we Dutch learn English, German, French, Spanish and Latin and sometimes old Greek in school.

What languages the German people learn on school and why.

My suggestion; as SEA languages are not available, continue with the Chinese. Do not let the fact the proffessor is a shrew deter you. You will meet people like that all your life and in no way should they create impediments to your own success. My daughters 12 and 14 are both taking Chinese and they say its not that difficult save for all the character memorization. You can do it. Good Luck.

My suggestion; as SEA languages are not available, continue with the Chinese. Do not let the fact the proffessor is a shrew deter you. You will meet people like that all your life and in no way should they create impediments to your own success. My daughters 12 and 14 are both taking Chinese and they say its not that difficult save for all the character memorization. You can do it. Good Luck.

Your daughters are right, but it's more than just the mean teacher it's the program as well. Six times a week you meet and each day something is due, homework, quiz, test. Each week a new lesson with 30 vocab plus 8 to 10 grammer structures. I have three other classes a wife and two kids at home, that I babysit quite often as my wife works and a job to hold down as well. I don't feel like I have the time for Chinese anymore. I still have to have a language and a western one seems more reasonable and do-able given the limited time I have to study. I am very frustrated about it but my wife keeps telling me that I now know that I can learn it so learn it later when I have the time.

Naam, why is it that when Germans come to visit Holland they many times ask for directions to either Zandvoort or Scheveningen in German.

Yes we Dutch learn English, German, French, Spanish and Latin and sometimes old Greek in school.

What languages the German people learn on school and why.

What languages the German people learn on school and why.

As in every country of the world they learn to read an write and the grammar. The latter, when it comes to German, is the most difficult part of that, even for native speakers.

In school the might learn the so called "high German" but I strongly doubt that a Bavarian teacher will talk to its students without an accent... But like in Chinese German is the

same in writing, but when it comes to dialects its a different matter. Can a Cantonese speaker communicate by word with a Mandarin speaker? NO. Only by writing.

In Germany it is not like that, except some words can have a different meaning depending on the country area spoken. In general the south will understand the north and vs.

In case of the Dutch language I trust only a very few words are similar to German or have the same meaning.

Naam, why is it that when Germans come to visit Holland they many times ask for directions to either Zandvoort or Scheveningen in German.

Yes we Dutch learn English, German, French, Spanish and Latin and sometimes old Greek in school.

What languages the German people learn on school and why.

1. because dutch is closely related to german and it's easy for a Dutch to understand german and of course vice versa. a well known fact is that more Dutch speak german than there are Germans speaking dutch.

2. that depends on the "line of schooling".

-basic education english only,

-higher education has two "strains". one with the emphasis on latin and ancient greek adding english and french later, the other one starts with english adding french after two years and then there are various options to add e.g. latin, ancient greek and/or spanish. explaing "why" in details would lead too far.

If it exists "high German" is actually spoken by most TV news readers or broadcasters.

High German means speaking German without an accent but a 100% accent free German does not exist.

The so called "high German speaker area" is around Hanover in Lower Saxony and north of it.

"high German" is the more common language spoken in the north rather than in the southern parts of Germany.

For a native "high German" speaker it is not difficult to learn and speak a dialect except a few. Its true some

German dialects are hard to understand even for native speakers.

in this respect one has to differentiate between spoken "Hochdeutsch" (high german) and the written grammatical one. the teachers in Bavaria, Saxony or Baden-Württemberg might speak with a heavy accent but the grammar they use and teach is exactly the same what is taught in Hannover, Düsseldorf or Hamburg.

quite interesting is the fact that a german who was being brought up in an area where german with a heavy accent is spoken has virtually no chance to lose every trace of that accent when speaking a foreign language. in my case, even with utmost efforts, i could never hide that i am a German no matter whether i speak english, french, spanish or italian. i am not sure whether this applies to other languages too in which i can converse but not really fluently.

an exception of course is when i use my mother tongue klingonese

acquired area dialect accents are so dominant that in most cases i can pinpoint the area where a German grew up down to a radius of 100km even though he speaks english!

Most German schools will teach English or French as major foreign language. Before the wall came down it was Russian as well but this applied mostly to the former DDR.

To become a physician you have to learn Latin as well. According to German education law to learn one foreign language is a must - but I might be wrong.

When it comes to relation between Dutch and German I agree a Dutch might understand better than vs. But in the northern parts of Germany some people are able to speak a dialect

which is called "low German" and here you can find many similarities to Dutch. But look to Nordic countries, like Denmark or even Norway. You will find similarities as well.

BTW German language is one of the most spoken languages of the world Source

i was told that in germany the older generation (40 and above) would have had more exposure to Latin

the latter generation more to english

not sure if accurate or not...

but Naam's answers seem to be somewhat in agreement ?...with more specifics of course

i was told that in germany the older generation (40 and above) would have had more exposure to Latin

the latter generation more to english

not sure if accurate or not...

but Naam's answers seem to be somewhat in agreement ?...with more specifics of course

not really, it all depended on the individual selection of the school or the options available at some schools. to study at university level law, medicine, pharmacy, priesthood, and some other subjects latin is mandatory.

we are talking about a german or austrian "gymnasium" or a swiss or french "lycée". all of them are secondary education but cannot be compared with the american "high school". the graduates of these schools are going directly to university instead to "colleges" which do not exist in Germany. the same goes (very few exceptions prove the rule) for "bachelor degrees". you do your master's at university or you have nuttin' to show.

the funny thing is that our master's degrees are called "Diplomas" and that can lead to even funnier misunderstandings and situations :

Nigeria, 1980

Ministry of Interior

subject: work/residence permit

Dear Dr. Naam,

we regret to inform you that a work/residence permit cannot be issued as you do not meet the qualifications specified in your employment contract. your diploma is not a substitute for the required master's degree.

Interesting that. I got a post-grad diploma (in Training & Development) and had to get a letter from the uni saying it was indeed a 'post-grad' diploma as the word 'diploma' in some countries doesn't mean anything.

Interesting that. I got a post-grad diploma (in Training & Development) and had to get a letter from the uni saying it was indeed a 'post-grad' diploma as the word 'diploma' in some countries doesn't mean anything.

because in some countries one can acquire a "diploma" in a two week long course.

Indeed I had a similair problem when I showed my diploma's, very embarassing.

OP, I have the perfect solution.

Why not learn sign language?

Can use all over the world.