Slash And Burning In Chiang Mai... You Are Thai, What Do You Think?

[vagabond48]

There is (was) supposedly a number you can call to get the perps fined. Can't see that doing a lot of good though... there needs to be public hangings.

burn them at the stake

and add to the pollution. Tish tish tish.

[Priceless]

Or, the same "<deleted>!?" but expressed in a factual numerical format:

Please dude.

Winnie, where did you get those numbers from, are they available on a daily basis? Also, any idea why there is only a PM10 figure for CM and no others fields contain data, is there a reason for that?

Yes, numbers are available (almost) every day at www.pcd.go.th Click English, then 'Regional Air quality". There's lots of cool graphs as well.

Note there are three stations for Chiang Mai. The others do show the other columns.

The measuring station "Chiangmai" is a mobile unit (see picture). As far as I know it is only equipped to measure particulate matter (PM<10), at least no other data have ever been posted by the Pollution Control Department (PCD). The posted data are of little value for anybody outside the PCD though, since it is not posted where a particular measurement was taken. The unit is frequently based at Phu Ping palace when royalty is staying there, but at other times it is used in other locations, such as when the picture was taken at Thapae Gate. In consequence, all a number for "Chiangmai" tells you is that on the day in question this was the pollution level somewhere in Chiang Mai province

The two measuring stations that provide basis for any kind of analysis are "Chiang Mai" at the Town Hall and "Uparaj College" on Rajvitthi Rd in the old town.

/ Priceless

[sabaijai]

A lifetime diet based on rice is a lot greener than diets based on animal meats.

Then comes a question of physical sizes, an obese European can easily be

described as double or triple the size of a small Thai person ?

and other well fed Caucasians will probably pass 2 to 3 times more methane into the air we breath, not counting the additional methane from the animals that are bred, killed and consumed to satisfy their larger appetites.

Further to this point, per-capita greenhouse emissions in Thailand are far below those in industrialised countries, which is one reason some nations are reluctant to sign in Copenhagen unless every industrialised country does so as well.

[mcgriffith]

Gotta agree.

My country emits several times more CO2 per capita.

But I gave up my turbo Jetta sport wagon, and traded it in for a Wave 100s.

God forgive me...I'm feeling virtuous; I think that is a minor sin.

[Johpa]

The rural farmers have very limited time to plant a second crop, such as soy bean, into the rice fields. The crop must be planted while the level of the ground water is still high and there is sufficient flow in the streams for irrigation. Until an affordable alternative for clearing the rice stubble is found, I am afraid you neo-sahibs in the city, who burn up far more carbon over the course of the year than the farmers, will have to live with some additional smog.

And by the way, I really don't see too many Thais posting here.

[realthaideal]

I am one of many informed and intelligent Farang that contribute to this forum and it seems the bitch n moan typing starts earlier and earlier every year. It gets to where you can't see any topics on the CM forum board other than air pollution postings. I can hardly read anything from across my desk at this moment with the clutter of pollution threads whirring about. I don't know what can be done about this terrible terrible problem that starts every dry season. It seems the Farang are intent on typing about this subject ad infinitum even though they know harboring feelings of upset and alarm can lead to stress, blood pressure problems, and cancer. I cannot believe that though the whole world knows panicking and upset only leads to bodily and mental ills they still insist on being like this.

Other side of the coin.

I love it this time of year. Only the CM forum pollution makes me cough a bit.

[Puwa]

A Thai environmentalist friend explained to me that the pollution that has been choking the north in the past few years is not primarily from small village farmers, but from large new plantations clearing degraded forest and mono-cropping corn. This makes sense to me, since the pollution seems to be getting worse each year but it's not like there is a huge increase in the population of small farmers. Sure, small farmers clear fields and we see those fires and smell that smoke. But they've been doing it for hundreds of years and their farming alone can not explain the north's worsening air.

[mcgriffith]

You know....I just want to whistle a happy tune.

The theme from "Andy of Mayberry" .

Sometimes it really brings me down that some people can't see the grace and beauty that surrounds us all.

Granted there are issues that we must address in terms of global solutions to climate change.

But I agree with RTD and others in observing that this whole issue has taken on a life of its own.

We are living in one of the most beautiful, uncomplicated and un-western places on the whole face of the planet.

It's cold season, and a few miscreants lit a fire. Smell of burning woodsmoke in the air. In December, no less. Bastids.

Nice reminder of home, to me.

[orang37]

I am one of many informed and intelligent Farang that contribute to this forum.

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun RealThaiDeal,

Of course you are, dear, and also one of the most modest.

What happened to Mr. T. ?

best, ~o:37;

[orang37]

Sometimes it really brings me down that some people can't see the grace and beauty that surrounds us all.

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun McGriffith,

Yes, we can see that our human component also can be "infected" at times by the negativity of others, and "lapse" into his own down-at-the-heels-schtick, as well as, at other times, feeling "sympathetic joy" (Pali : mudita) at the happiness and small triumphs of others.

Is the "present" only the morsels the ravenous appetites of the future and the past have not finished devouring yet which the nature of our human insanity demand we proclaim is an overflowing smorgasboord of be-all-and-end-all ?

Yet my Orang soul-mind can see that my Human is the one who creates the distance within himself between the miraculousness of the ordinary and the prison of his memories and cravings. Partly out of fear, partly out of habit, partly because he senses in his own aging an illusory horizon of not-being, which is, he instinctually knows, an end to his fictions.

best, ~o:37;

[mcgriffith]

orang, I agree.

Every day above ground, is a good day, IMHO.

[KevinHunt]

You know....I just want to whistle a happy tune.

The theme from "Andy of Mayberry" .

Sometimes it really brings me down that some people can't see the grace and beauty that surrounds us all.

I agree. If you're going to Whistle a Happy Tune, why not whistle along to this one this one..

Some things in life are bad

They can really make you mad

Other things just make you swear and curse.

When you're chewing on life's gristle

Don't grumble, give a whistle

And this'll help things turn out for the best...

And...always look on the bright side of life...

Always look on the light side of life...

If life seems jolly rotten

There's something you've forgotten

And that's to laugh and smile and dance and sing.

When you're feeling in the dumps

Don't be silly chumps

Just purse your lips and whistle - that's the thing.

And...always look on the bright side of life...

Always look on the light side of life...

[Priceless]

A Thai environmentalist friend explained to me that the pollution that has been choking the north in the past few years is not primarily from small village farmers, but from large new plantations clearing degraded forest and mono-cropping corn. This makes sense to me, since the pollution seems to be getting worse each year but it's not like there is a huge increase in the population of small farmers. Sure, small farmers clear fields and we see those fires and smell that smoke. But they've been doing it for hundreds of years and their farming alone can not explain the north's worsening air.

I'm sorry, but it seems that your basic assumption is wrong. The air in the North, at least in Chiang Mai, has actually got significantly less polluted in the past few years. If you look at the graph below, you will see that the average pollution level is now slightly more than a third below what it was 5½ years ago.

Incidentally, the graph is based on the daily observations posted by the Pollution Control Department ( http://www.pcd.go.th/AirQuality/Regional/Q...fm?task=default ). The reason the graph starts 1 July 2004 is that there is very little data for the first half of 2003, so it is not possible to calculate a meaningful 12-month average earlier than the date shown.

/ Priceless

[Ulysses G.]

Priceless, you obviously made up all the data on that chart up. Don’t you have anything better to do with your time?

The rest of us know by our feelings and Earth’s vibes that Chiang Mai is horribly polluted all year round and full of vicious, marauding redshirts as well!

[KhunDave]

If we take it as a given that slash and burn is not going to end any time soon, then the more burning that gets done earlier the better IMO.

At the moment we still have the benefit of the prevailing North Easterly winds which will blow the stuff away. It's when we get into monsoon transition after mid-February that the problem becomes more acute. The North Easterlies have died away, but the South West monsoon hasn't got going yet, so we get stagnant air sitting over us.

So for my vote, if you must burn, get burning NOW.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Um, not to be overly pedantic, but who changed the title if this topic to slash & burn?? I agree the original poster's title was ridiculous, but whoverer changed it either doesn't know what slash and burn agriculture means, or doesn't know what goes on around Chiang Mai. (or both, of course)

Google it.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Btw Johpa: there IS an alternative to getting rid of the rice stubble: just plough it into the ground! That's actually better for the soil than burning it.

[Thailand]

Looking right out my window I can easily see a haze over Doi Suthep, and, given that it is December, wonder where it is coming from? True, come Feb. - March it will be much worse.

The burning has certainly started earlier this year, already changing the pool filter twice a day and sweeping the ash from the patio.

Roll on Feb/March when Doi Suthep will do a David Copperfield and miraculously disappear for a few weeks TIT

[jackr]

there needs to be public hangings.

burn them at the stake

Yep, that'll do it, Donnyboy... or could even hang, draw and quarter them William Wallace style

[el jefe]

I am one of many informed and intelligent Farang that contribute to this forum and it seems the bitch n moan typing starts earlier and earlier every year. It gets to where you can't see any topics on the CM forum board other than air pollution postings. I can hardly read anything from across my desk at this moment with the clutter of pollution threads whirring about. I don't know what can be done about this terrible terrible problem that starts every dry season. It seems the Farang are intent on typing about this subject ad infinitum even though they know harboring feelings of upset and alarm can lead to stress, blood pressure problems, and cancer. I cannot believe that though the whole world knows panicking and upset only leads to bodily and mental ills they still insist on being like this.

Wow, I didn't think the pollution had gotten so bad you couldn't see your computer moniter. There's a thread about "fever" and another about "lighting Hanukkah candles". Do you really think those are about "pollution" too? Otherwise there's only one thread going about pollution, this one. Personally, I'm not going to tell anyone to stop burning. I probably cause just as much pollution as any Thai farmer burning a rice field, national park worker burning leaves, or policeman burning garbage. But denying that there is a problem doesn't cause it to go away.

What I'd like to see from you, based on your statement above, are the statistics about how "feelings of upset and alarm can lead to stress, blood pressure problems, and cancer." Then we can compare to see if alarm is more likely to cause cancer than air pollution.

If you don't want to read the few pollution threads that come up, they're easy to skip. Feel free to read just the threads about fish and chips, burgers and pizza. You know what's important to you.

Edited December 12, 2009 by el jefe

[Puwa]

A Thai environmentalist friend explained to me that the pollution that has been choking the north in the past few years is not primarily from small village farmers, but from large new plantations clearing degraded forest and mono-cropping corn. This makes sense to me, since the pollution seems to be getting worse each year but it's not like there is a huge increase in the population of small farmers. Sure, small farmers clear fields and we see those fires and smell that smoke. But they've been doing it for hundreds of years and their farming alone can not explain the north's worsening air.

I'm sorry, but it seems that your basic assumption is wrong. The air in the North, at least in Chiang Mai, has actually got significantly less polluted in the past few years. If you look at the graph below, you will see that the average pollution level is now slightly more than a third below what it was 5½ years ago.

vations posted by the Pollution Control Department ( http://www.pcd.go.th/AirQuality/Regional/Q...fm?task=default ). The reason the graph starts 1 July 2004 is that there is very little data for the first half of 2003, so it is not possible to calculate a meaningful 12-month average earlier than the date shown.

/ Priceless

I appreciate your point, but having breathed the air in northern Thailand most years since 1990, I can say even without a graph that it has gotten worse. This doesn't preclude the possibility that a particular measurement such as <PM 10 might rise and fall. Anyway, my point was to share my friend's well-informed remark that small traditional farmers are less to blame than agro-speculators trying to turn a quick buck.

[Mapguy]

OP has a point and a good question.

To respond to the question, first, I know many, many knowledgeable Thais who don't post here and wouldn't think of it, really. They don't think "butt shots," as in a previous off-topic post or two on this thread are in great taste. TV Chiang Mai is not their kind of place.

Of these several Thai acquaintances and friends (I promise I do not exaggerate) all are concerned about slash and burn --- and about the other air pollution problems. Some of them are much more concerned than others. Some are quite active, actually, in different ways to try to mitigate the situation. Some simply shake their heads and talk about how hard it is to change habits and, as well, how hard for police to clamp down because of landowner issues and other factors. Some are very, very active in different ways working on such problems. None say the situation is good. All know where Copenhagen is and what's going on there. But you don't need to talk to Thais who are Copenhagen-wise. Just ask Thais in traffic covering their noses in traffic. That speaks for itself. But OP is asking too much to ask for many Thai opinions and thoughts here on TV Chiang Mai.

Now, UG ( a post above) has said he thought the weather is rather pleasant. Well, it is, but it isn't as pleasant as one would within reason hope. The burning of the rice straw has indeed started. His general point over three years has been that "It [air pollution] doesn't bother everyone." True, I personally am not particularly troubled right now, but it isn't nice. It is worse than "nice." When I smoked, I didn't mind smoky rooms so much, but we are not all smokers in smoky rooms. And the problem of air pollution generally is a lot larger than particular preferences about hanging out in cigar bars or not. And --- yeah, yeah, yeah, my grandmother lived to nearly 100 after smoking at least a pack a day. Actually, that is the truth !! Took her a long time in the morning each morning to get the old lungs (lungs of steel ?!) working, but she did ! I am glad that I have her genes and not her lungs, however.

Now, to some FACTS !!!

Recently, I have received three notices from satellite fire monitoring of the Doi Suthep area. I decided not to say anything about the first couple of notices here. Didn't want to sound pedantic. But today, with this thread and a third notice of a greater number of fires in the area large enough to be captured by satellite, well.................?!

Same kind of thing happened last year. Perhaps I didn't notice before that. I went to Doi Inthanon around the New Year (2009), and I was surprised to see so many burnt-off paddies, some still smoldering. Guess it is on again! I had thought sh*t happened somewhat later in the year. Silly me! After all, Chiang Mai is infamous for late February - early April air pollution. But around the New Year?!

Painless has all the trend charts (limited data taken from very few measuring sites, two really, in the whole province which report on a regular basis). Helpful, but it really doesn't take much to just LOOK, however, does it ?! When the PCD report of PM<10 gets about 50 (per the very few monitoring sites we have locally), it becomes quite visually apparent.

The PCD numbers ( http://www.pcd.go.th/AirQuality/Regional/Default.cfm ) are quite far up in more than a few locations in the last 36 - 48 hours. This could be a brief anomaly, but who really sensibly believes things are getting better recently? Really? How much better?

As UG and others who think I am too dam_n pedantic will tell you, I have been beating this drum now since early 2007. Yes, it can get very boring. So is respiratory disease. So is lung cancer.

One response has been "Okay, don't like it? Then hop a plane to Phuket and hang out by the sea when it is truly awful here. Sorry, I have been sorely bothered by this "solution." Not a lot of people who live here can do that. All they have is cheap government health insurance --- if they can get time off from their 150-400 THB day of work to wait in line, and wait in line, and wait in line, and maybe get a little help. Don't see many of them in Chiang Mai Ram Hospital or on the plane to Phuket.

You want facts and a lot of background information on air pollution? There has been over the past three years a big discussion on TV Chiang Mai that is spread over several threads. Not a lot of "topic discipline" around here, but what the hel_l! It takes time, but you'll find a lot of it by "key wording"on this site with obvious words. One curious one, however," is "raining." Your search will dig up a lot of information about where to go for more information on this subject, local people (Thais) who are involved, and on and on and on reaching all the way to the (WHO) World Health Organization.

For those who say "If you don't like Chiang Mai, then leave it!" No, I like Chiang Mai. I don't want to leave. I hope (and despite the cheap shots that I have taken from time to time from some TV Chiang Mai "regulars,"), I do try to make things better. It isn't about me, anyway! It is about "us."

Anyway, I always thought the rainy season was terribly undersold, UG !

Edited December 12, 2009 by Mapguy

[Johpa]

Btw Johpa: there IS an alternative to getting rid of the rice stubble: just plough it into the ground! That's actually better for the soil than burning it.

Yes, and those few who can afford to do plow it into the ground. But not all have the time nor the finances to plow. In my neighborhood the farmers only rest (and drink) for a day or tow after the completion of the rice harvest before planting a second crop. Burning the padi only takes a day. Besides, burning the rice stubble does not generate the same amount of smoke and pollutants as does burning off the hillsides to clear out land that had been fallow. That begins a little later after everything dries out a bit more. The rice stubble on the irrigated padi burns rather quickly and does not contain all that much fuel.

[Mapguy]

Btw Johpa: there IS an alternative to getting rid of the rice stubble: just plough it into the ground! That's actually better for the soil than burning it.

This is quite true. Indeed, burning rice straw is not universal in Thailand.

Otherwise, with reference to one or more posts above, what we are talking about is not really "slash and burn" agriculture. you can look that up, if you wish. Basically, that is when, in a primitive tropical environment, farming shifts from one location to another after the land is spent. The newer burned-off land is richer for a short stretch of time because of the ash of burning off. However, with the invention of plows, it has been found that plowing under actually is more productive! It took Aussie farmers a long time to realize this! Never mind the problem here in Thailand! Aussies used to love to burn off their field stubble! Never mind recent pyroclastic disasters in the country! But not to fault those folk, the same sort of shotgun encounters by farmers with "environmentalists' have been fought in America and elsewhere! It just took the Aussies longer! What the hey! Anyone surprised !!!

Sorry! Off topic...sort of! Slap my wrist !!

Oh, yes! There is other burning that goes on, almost all in remote hills (but not always so). Poor farmers are trying to clear new land, mainly. Otherwise, there's some burning to help in gathering mushrooms, for example, that gets out of control and has frequently caused larger unintentional forest fires.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Anyone try these "Hed Thob" or "Hed Poh" mushrooms. Hed or Het means mushroom. It's supposed to be the closest thing to a truffle grown in Thailand? As long as I am breathing the air then maybe just once I would like to eat them.

TV Truffle thread

Possibly the most expensive mushrooms in the world

Forest products and the threat of fire in Northern Thailand

The pictures, with healthy forest seen above and degraded forest seen right, illustrate the devastating consequences of annual fires, used for the collection of forest products, in Thai forests. Species-rich ecosystems become degraded and the development of the forest stunted and void of life.

Alex Putman

A study commissioned by the premier online eco retailer, www.e-photoframes.co.uk, the full texts of which were recently published in this newspaper, has found that the high market price of a particular type of wild mushroom, hed thob, and its lucrative allure of potentially doubling a farmer’s yearly income, is one of the main factors underpinning the deliberate setting of forest fires. A phenomenon which, due to the emission of large amounts of smoke containing carbon dioxide, (CO2), is a killer of people and a destroyer of tourism. It is also one of the most significant causes of climate change.

A dairy crop farmer from the north of Thailand, Khun Som, states that, ‘We normally use fire in the forest because, sometimes, it’s hard to walk and find the things we want to collect. We do not hesitate to use it to burn small areas. A fire that accidentally gets out of control can sometimes happen, but such fires often extinguish themselves...’

Alex Putnam, the leader of the research project, states that, ‘The use of fire during the dry season for the collection and propagation of forest products, particularly mushrooms, is a tradition which has been practiced for many decades, and which sustains the livelihoods of local farmers in northern Thailand. However, due to annual burning, the forests are becoming degraded and devoid of all life, and local urban areas are being plunged into a haze of suffocating smog. The degradation of dry forests, (dry diterocarp), in Northern Thailand, due to the use of fire, is also limiting the capacity of the forests to naturally sequester carbon dioxide emissions, therefore exacerbating the issue of climate change’.

The aims and objectives of the study are to explore the causes and effects of deliberate burning within the province of Chiang Mai, Northern Thailand. In addition, the project also proposes solutions to deal with the traditional practice of burning in the province, and sets out a fire prevention plan for 2010 and beyond. The project uses both quantitative, (fire data collection), and qualitative, (semi-structured interviewing), research methods.

In total, during the two month study period, a total of 58 fires were recorded, the majority of which, (36%), occurred within forests, open areas, (19%), and along roadsides, (17.5%), whilst domestic, (15.5%), and agricultural fires, (12% ), recorded the lowest percentage.

The final report will be available online at www.e-photoframes.co.uk from the beginning of June 09. In order to take part in the online discussion, please visit the blog, www.e-photoframes.co.uk/blog. For further information, please contact Alex Putnam by email on [email protected], or call on Thai +66 (0) 86-272-8546 or UK + 44 (0) 127-865-2401.

article location

[orang37]

Yes but flooded rice paddies are a major emitter of methane gas.

Sawasdee Khrup Khun PhilHarries,

Fascinating, thanks for informing me about this !

Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paddy_field

states : "Growing rice has an adverse environmental impact because of the large quantities of methane gas it generates. World methane production due to paddy fields has been estimated to be in the range of 50 to 100 million tonnes per annum.^[1] This level of greenhouse gas generation is a large component of the global warming threat produced from an expanding human population. However, recent studies have shown that methane can be significantly reduced while also boosting crop yield by draining the paddies allowing the soil to aerate, which interrupts methane production"

This study from China (seems to be an example of the practices referred to in the Wikipedia article) may interest you : it's old (2002), and I'd be curious to know the extent to which the practices it mentions, that reduce methane and increase rice yield, are widely adapted (within China ? outside China ?). I do know that kao hom mali (jasmine rice) the most profitable variety which Thailand produces immense amounts of has lower yield compared to other varieties.

http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/2002/1204paddies.html

Lots of good information in this thread. Food for thought while choking in Chiang Mai next month.

regards, ~o:37;

Edited December 13, 2009 by orang37

[orang37]

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun CobraSnakeNecktie,

We read the story on the "research" on mushrooms and fire with interest.

We note that the author of the study, one Alex Putnam, has a BA degree in Geography with honours :

http://www.e-photoframes.co.uk/blog/?author=4

He, evidently, studied an area 40 km. from Chiang Mai, Mae On district, for two months, but there's certainly nothing bashful in his conclusions :

"the high market price of a particular type of wild mushroom, Hed Thob, and its lucrative allure of potentially doubling a farmer’s yearly income, is one of the main factors underpinning the deliberate setting of forest fires. A phenomenon that, due to the emission of large amounts of smoke containing carbon dioxide (CO2), is a killer of people and tourism and is also one of the most significant causes of climate change."

In a blurb for another piece of "research" he carried out : "Skewed Press Coverage in the UK and the Importance of Understanding the ‘Real Causes behind Climate Change’"

http://www.e-photoframes.co.uk/blog/?page_id=200

He reaches the conclusion : "the main message that appears to be being broadcast to the public of the UK is that the potential threat from climate change is real and is happening now. Desertification in the Tropics, Glacial melt in the Arctic and the potential threat they pose to both the developing and the developed world are just two of the many climate change effects being covered in the press. However, such a skewed coverage of climate change focussing only on the effects/impacts is failing to inform the public of the real factors contributing to climate change and therefore failing to inform people of the actual measures needed to tackle climate change. "

Here's a quote from his study methodology : we have taken the liberty of putting a few of his statements in bold type to draw your attention to them (and snipping out the list of newspapers used as sources) :

"The study recognises that the research was only carried out over a short period of time (18 Months) and that for a more robust set of results a longer analysis period would be deemed necessary. Articles for the study were retrieved by typing in Climate Change into each of the individual search engines on each newspapers website. A total of 102 articles were analysed from the following newspapers:- ... snip ... (1). The data collection used a random sampling technique in which articles from the UK press, that covered the topic of climate change, were selected for analysis. There was no formalised system for data collection. The original amount of articles totalled 111. However, due to certain errors during the data collection period, in total nine articles were omitted from the study. E-mails were sent to each of the major broadsheet and tabloid environmental editors (we are still yet to hear back from them)."

We would hypothesize that probably Alex Putnam is a bright young fellow enjoying running around northern Thailand, with a bent to serve humanity, and will have a great future one day ... after he gets some scientific training that qualify him to undertake scientific research in a systematic manner, and rigorously analyze the results of his data in the context of the limitations of its sources and collection techniques; hopefully learning to create hypotheses, rather feeding the current propaganda machine of the so-called ecological movement. It is interesting to imagine there may be a kind of research that is, itself, on a philosophical level, accurately described by the metaphor of "slash and burn."

Science is, by its nature, collegial, and one sign of real science is an author showing awareness of other research, quoting or citing other scientists (there are numerous experts in agronomy, forestry, etc., at the Ph.D. level both farang and Thai in Thailand, many Embassies have full-time science/business consultants in these areas : the UN and WHO and UNESCO and countless major NGO's are active in these areas).

The e-photoframes web site is a very strange mix of promotion of cute frames, and self-applauding for ecological awareness. But I am sure, of course, they are, like every other business or venture reported on, or advertising in, TV, acting from the noblest principles, and all the farangs involved have been drawn to Thailand with that special sense of "a higher calling" that draws farangs here ... like ... flies.

In the spirit of the Kabbalah : "question everything, trust nothing."

best, ~o:37;

Edited December 13, 2009 by orang37

[orang37]

The rural farmers have very limited time to plant a second crop, such as soy bean, into the rice fields. The crop must be planted while the level of the ground water is still high and there is sufficient flow in the streams for irrigation. Until an affordable alternative for clearing the rice stubble is found, I am afraid you neo-sahibs in the city, who burn up far more carbon over the course of the year than the farmers, will have to live with some additional smog.

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun Johpa,

Fascinating, we hope you will frequently post on your observations of agriculture, local farming, and farmers you obviously have an interest in and knowledge of !

We are still fascinated by finding out, in casual conversation with a Thai friend at the health club, that Thailand is a net importer of soy beans (he's in the business of bringing them in from Brazil). Our friend also said soy bean is not a profitable crop here since the soil doesn't have the right whatever to get high-yield. We'd like to know the extent to which soy is grown around northern Thailand.

And by the way, I really don't see too many Thais posting here.

Do we wonder why ?

best, ~o:37;

Edited December 13, 2009 by orang37

[cmdream]

I am one of many informed and intelligent Farang that contribute to this forum and it seems the bitch n moan typing starts earlier and earlier every year. It gets to where you can't see any topics on the CM forum board other than air pollution postings. I can hardly read anything from across my desk at this moment with the clutter of pollution threads whirring about. I don't know what can be done about this terrible terrible problem that starts every dry season. It seems the Farang are intent on typing about this subject ad infinitum even though they know harboring feelings of upset and alarm can lead to stress, blood pressure problems, and cancer. I cannot believe that though the whole world knows panicking and upset only leads to bodily and mental ills they still insist on being like this.

Other side of the coin.

I love it this time of year. Only the CM forum pollution makes me cough a bit.

How true, the Yuppies have found CM and now want to change everything that has made CM a nice little college town. We shall have to subject ourselves to their constant whineings about "what is wrong with this town and its people"

and how "we must change it". Time to move on I fear.

[Johpa]

Possibly the most expensive mushrooms in the world

Forest products and the threat of fire in Northern Thailand

The pictures, with healthy forest seen above and degraded forest seen right, illustrate the devastating consequences of annual fires, used for the collection of forest products, in Thai forests. Species-rich ecosystems become degraded and the development of the forest stunted and void of life.

I am sure that different localities might vary. Our home is within the Doi Suthep-Doi Pui National Forest area, one of many villages "grandfathered" into the national forest as pre-existing to the establishment of the forest boundaries. I have not encountered the burning of the forest for the sole purpose of extracting forest products. I have only seen the burning for the purpose of using the land to plant crops. The most intensive clearing occurs within the neighborhoods of Mong villages where forest is permanently replaced with agricultural crops. This clearing of the forest can be seen around villages both to north and south of the Mae Rim-Samoeng highway such as Nong Hoi and Mae Sa Mai. It can also be seen along the way up to Doi Inthanon. This intensive switch to agriculture has proceeded with the help of the various Royal Projects which act as test beds for new crops, originally sought as substitutions for opium. That is not to say that some may burn to collect forest products, it is simply been my experience that those who collect forest products need not burn to find their products.

With the improvement of all weather roads into what were once remote mountain valleys, one sees continued expansion of agriculture at the expense of the long degraded forest eco-systems. Travel up any of the paved roads north of Samoeng and you might be surprised at the variety of crops now grown. With more guaranteed transportation, farmers can now grow vegetable crops that need to get to market quickly after harvest as opposed to being limited to planting crops such as rice which can be stored.