Does Ptt Sell "different" Kind Of Gasohol ?

[nullx8]

hey folks, actually i was planning using another topic name .. but in order to keep it neutral this may better.

however .. to the storry, i had serval months problem with my engine .. running not smoothly .. with lower enginespeeds it sounds like a Disel while accelerating, and uses about 12 Liters/100km of Gasohol.

The Garage was already starting to change randomly parts out of not knowing.

i asked then peoples running own garages in Europe .. and one mentioned it may be "bad Gasoline" ... i declined this .. because always use PTT ..

as its represents the crown of THailands Eenery suply's and also have some certification role in matters of gas/gasoline systems.

however ... out of a emergency (last Pump before the Highway ) i used to go to a Esso station this once...

as usual .. dirty one, poor service, no shop, and buying some extra Oil turned into a quite big mission ....

Totally different as the clean and friendly PTT Stations.

however .. the tank was almost empty .. i pay, drove out .. and the AH-HA Effect turned in after just 500 meters of driving.

all Strange bahave of the engine are totally gone ... my ALfa Romeo got its Spirit back

the question is now .. may the guess of the poor quality of the gas may right ?

i refilled same day again .. and also it turned out that the general consume of gas are lower (by about 9 liters)

i drove since this event about 2000 KM using Shell and ESSO Only .. and since this there where no more engine Problems.

does someone else have semilar experiences ? or otherwise ?

[thaicbr]

PTT ARE <deleted>. stick to ESSO. Never a problem with esso. had a few with PTT with my bikes running rough.

[hansnl]

Don't really know about petrol, but I do know the diesel from Shell confirms to Euro 3, while most other diesel sold in Thailand seems to be Euro 2.

Maybe same with petrol, who knows.

[MikeyIdea]

Gasohol is bad quality crap that isn't sold in most countries valuing quality, PTT is not as good as ESSO of course. PTT knows that many Thais don't value quality and that it economically doesn't pay to have it, Thai's will buy anyway

[VocalNeal]

Even before the advent of Gasohol my friends 318i ran badly when he used PTT. But he kept going 'cos it was cheaper. I'm on LPG but avoid PTT. With my bike I strive to use Esso but agreed that is partly because I use their oil.

[LivinLOS]

Shell or esso..

Also stating the obvious but theres multiple grades of gasohol also..

[fredlk]

My Audi A4 V6 drives perfectly on Shell V-Power (95). Anything else like 91 or 95 Gasohol and I can feel the engine lose power.

We also have a Mazda 3 and that runs okay on 91 Gasohol, but when putting in Shell V-Power you notice a slight increase in power and a slight decrease in fuel consumption.

[WarpSpeed]

Short answer is yes, I just made a post about this on another thread.. It's called detonation and Gasohol is especially sensitive to octane break down and that is when it is top grade anyway, so if the correct mixture or additives are not present then it will run like <deleted> and it is doing serious harm to your engine too pitting and scoring the top of your pistons and eventually it will break through..

Basically the fuel is detonating prematurely in high compression engines due to low octane (regardless of listed rating) before the piston is reaching top dead center and the explosion is happening during the upstroke a nano second before the piston reaches TDC and not at TDC so it (the explosion) is smashing into the top of the piston instead of at maximum compression just forcing the piston downward, thus the noise... The reason the octane is low is because the fuel is breaking down too quickly or is not what is advertised, [shock] a big problem especially in hot climes...

If you have to use PTT only put in enough to get to a good station and then fill it the rest of the way and the octane rating will come up enough once mixed, or if you insist on using PTT you should have your timing retarded to accommodate the lower octane but at the cost of mileage and performance..

Not so short an answer after all..

Edited February 28, 2010 by WarpSpeed

[junkofdavid2]

PTT sucked like hel_l when I used it on my Camry. Firstly, I very noticeably had to step on the gas pedal a lot deeper than normal (I usually used Shell) just to get the car up to my usual acceleration. Second (I am constantly monitoring my car mileage), it had much worse mileage than Shell by a significant percentage. This was with both PTT gasohol and with PTT benzene compared to similar Shell.

To be fair to PTT, it could have been the station and not PTT refinery, because I was loading at the PTT very close to my apartment which was a very old station, and it in fact already closed down recently.

Best mileage (and with no noticeable loss of power) for my Camry is Shell Gasohol 91 which also so happens to be the cheapest. I've tested Shell Gasohol 95 (supposedly more 'premium' than 91) and Caltex and other variants and they gave me noticeably worse mileage. Traditional benzene also gave me worse mileage, believe it or not, despite the fact that gasohol is said to get wasted because it evaporates quicker and has less power.

Problem is that Shell stations aren't many, and are hard to find.

I drive an old but very good condition (like mint!) 1995 Toyota Camry.

.

Edited February 28, 2010 by junkofdavid2

[basjke]

I am using diesel but whenever I fill up at any PTT station my mileage is between10 and 15% less over any other brand.Checked it umpteen times so I'm pretty sure.I prefer Caltex as that gives me the best mileage in my opinion.

[bubba]

Interesting to see this as I topped up with PTT Gasohol 91 recently and found that I got nearly 20% fewer km/L than the usual Caltex or ESSO that I use with the same combination of city/highway driving. There was also a noticeable decrease in power on acceleration. I track my km/L continuously with an iPhone app and always ask the attendant to be certain it's completely full, so I am certain that the fuel efficiency was far less that usual. My fuel efficiency returned to normal when I ran out the PTT gasohol and topped up with Chevron. I'm wondering whether someone at PTT or the station was mixing the gasohol with more than 10% ethanol, or maybe it was actually E20 being sold as E10. Whatever the reason is, I'll avoid PTT in the future.

Junofdavid - interesting that you get better mileage using gasohol than straight petrol. Ethanol does indeed have less energy content than petrol, and with 10% gasohol, you are actually getting about 4% less energy in terms of BTUs. Also, where do you find Shell cheaper than all the other brands? All the prices in Bangkok look the same to me:

http://www.eppo.go.th/retail_prices.html

Mikeyidea: Gasohol is marketed and sold all over the world, including Europe and North America. Its sale is mandatory in Sweden and nine US states.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasohol

Edited March 1, 2010 by bubba

[junkofdavid2]

Junofdavid - interesting that you get better mileage using gasohol than straight petrol. Ethanol does indeed have less energy content than petrol, and with 10% gasohol, you are actually getting about 4% less energy in terms of BTUs. Also, where do you find Shell cheaper than all the other brands? All the prices in Bangkok look the same to me:

You are correct and all brands are the same price, I should've been clearer.

I meant Shell Gasohol 91 cheapest compared to any brand Gasohol 95 and any brand Benzene 91 and 95.

As for the fact that my Shell Gasohol 91 should theoretically give worse mileage than benzene, I'm well aware of that.

But my test still showed a MUCH better mileage with Shell Gasohol 91 compared to PTT Benzene 91 from that old PTT station on my soi. (I couldn't compare to Shell Benzene 91 'coz I've never found it available; only Shell Benzene 95 is available and difficult to find as well.)

[bubba]

Junofdavid - interesting that you get better mileage using gasohol than straight petrol. Ethanol does indeed have less energy content than petrol, and with 10% gasohol, you are actually getting about 4% less energy in terms of BTUs. Also, where do you find Shell cheaper than all the other brands? All the prices in Bangkok look the same to me:

You are correct and all brands are the same price, I should've been clearer.

I meant Shell Gasohol 91 cheapest compared to any brand Gasohol 95 and any brand Benzene 91 and 95.

As for the fact that my Shell Gasohol 91 should theoretically give worse mileage than benzene, I'm well aware of that.

But my test still showed a MUCH better mileage with Shell Gasohol 91 compared to PTT Benzene 91 from that old PTT station on my soi. (I couldn't compare to Shell Benzene 91 'coz I've never found it available; only Shell Benzene 95 is available and difficult to find as well.)

Yes, of course Gasohol 91 is cheaper than gasohol 95 or regular 91 or 95 petrol/gasoline. (I hesitate to use "benzene" to describe the fuel, since benzene is the chemical name for an aromatic compound that accounts for less than 1% of the fuel.)

Shell only sells 91 and 95 gasohol in Thailand. It does not sell regular 91 or 95, as is noted in the EPPO link above, and Shells site:

http://www.shell.com/home/Framework?siteId...troduction.html

[EvilDrSomkid]

Strange that people are having trouble with PTT Gasohol 95.

We usually change between filling Shell V-power and PTT (Somtimes Shell) Gasohol 95 in our Audi S6. We do not really notice the difference in consumption.

During the CNY weekend we took it down to Prachuap from BKK and we used Gasahol 95. Average consumption according to the computer was about 10-11L/100km. That with 120kmh cruise and sometimes stepping on it.

Since its a turbo car, it should be more sensitive to changes in quality, but none so far. We did change knock sensor right before, so I was not worried about detonation.

As for OP, he said that the tank was almost empty. It could be a combination of an almost dry tank which is not good for the fuel pump and a bad batch of fuel.

[katabeachbum]

Junofdavid - interesting that you get better mileage using gasohol than straight petrol. Ethanol does indeed have less energy content than petrol, and with 10% gasohol, you are actually getting about 4% less energy in terms of BTUs. Also, where do you find Shell cheaper than all the other brands? All the prices in Bangkok look the same to me:

You are correct and all brands are the same price, I should've been clearer.

I meant Shell Gasohol 91 cheapest compared to any brand Gasohol 95 and any brand Benzene 91 and 95.

As for the fact that my Shell Gasohol 91 should theoretically give worse mileage than benzene, I'm well aware of that.

But my test still showed a MUCH better mileage with Shell Gasohol 91 compared to PTT Benzene 91 from that old PTT station on my soi. (I couldn't compare to Shell Benzene 91 'coz I've never found it available; only Shell Benzene 95 is available and difficult to find as well.)

Yes, of course Gasohol 91 is cheaper than gasohol 95 or regular 91 or 95 petrol/gasoline. (I hesitate to use "benzene" to describe the fuel, since benzene is the chemical name for an aromatic compound that accounts for less than 1% of the fuel.)

Shell only sells 91 and 95 gasohol in Thailand. It does not sell regular 91 or 95, as is noted in the EPPO link above, and Shells site:

http://www.shell.com/home/Framework?siteId...troduction.html

not correct

Shell sells in addition to gasohol, 95 V-Power which contains no Ethanol. Much apriciated by many bikers and old cars needing 95 and cant use Ethanol

[ThailandLovr]

I've noticed my 2008 Altis 1.6 is more responsive on the one (mistake) tank of benzine I got recently. The engine didn't feel as boggish as with gasahol 91 or 95. Anybody dropped the use of gasohol and gone exclusively to benzine for that (or other) reasons? I don't like paying the extra 3-5 baht/liter but I like a car which is running at it's best.

[chalks]

Silly question, but... where do I find the nearest petrol station (gas station?) that sells non-gasohol fuel?

I notice from this link that ULG 95 is twice the price of E85, but really I don't care... I drive 1-2 times week so enjoyment is more important for me than baht! Back in Oz I always filled my old car with 98 octane fuel for the (slim but evident) performance benefits but didn't find anything similar here yet.

I live lower sukhumvit, so anywhere within reasonable driving range is fine, as long as it doesn't involve Asoke - used to live there - will never forget the insanely stupid traffic jams.

Surely there must be somewhere that sells decent fuel?

[nullx8]

Surely there must be somewhere that sells decent fuel?

true, its actually not so easy, to get JUST Esso Gasoline .. as the station network is far smaller as the PTT Network.

this is this thread mainly about.. and as it seems it boils down to the brands ESSO, SHELL and Caltex.

which makes the selection abit better i think.

any experiences regarding the other Thai and Malay Gasoline Brands ?

[bubba]

Silly question, but... where do I find the nearest petrol station (gas station?) that sells non-gasohol fuel?

I notice from this link that ULG 95 is twice the price of E85, but really I don't care... I drive 1-2 times week so enjoyment is more important for me than baht! Back in Oz I always filled my old car with 98 octane fuel for the (slim but evident) performance benefits but didn't find anything similar here yet.

I live lower sukhumvit, so anywhere within reasonable driving range is fine, as long as it doesn't involve Asoke - used to live there - will never forget the insanely stupid traffic jams.

Surely there must be somewhere that sells decent fuel?

First of all, you probably don't want E85, since that is 85% ethanol and only certain specially fitted engines can use that. From what have seen, all ESSO and Caltex stations carry regular, non-gasohol fuels. I've driven in to quite a few Calext stations that didn't even have Gasohol 91, but they had regular 91. From my experience, I don't notice much performance drop with Gasohol 91, and my mileage drop is around 5%, which is reasonable since E10 gasohol has 10% less energy. My engine is spec'ed for E10, so I don't see any reason to spend the extra money for regular 91, when it costs 14% more and I am only getting 5% lower mileage.

I don't know about the quality of Petronas (Malaysia) or the other Thai companies, but with plenty of ESSO, Caltex, and Shell stations around, I'll just stick with the multinationals, particularly after my recent experience with PTT fuel.

[WarpSpeed]

JFYI I just put in half a tank full of Techron 95 octane "gasoline" today and it has all but eliminated the last bit of knocking I had without my needing to change my timing, I will run it a bit longer to run through some good gas and see if it stops knocking 100% it is almost there now.. I love it when I fix a potentially serious problem with a simple change of fuel..