World Cup - Usa

[WarpSpeed]

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Appreciated. Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

Well since we originated it and it is the only championship of it's kind world wide and not contested outside of the states it stands to reason it's labeling is accurate....

[lomatopo]

I think what he is getting at is when the champions of MLB of NFL or NBA are crowned, they are crowned World Champions - which is a bit strange considering they are national leagues. 

None of these leagues crown their ultimate annual winners as "World Champions". Major League Baseball

has called their final series the "World Series" since 1903 when the name was more of a marketing statement. The winner of the World Series is called World Series Champions. MLB is the primary sponsor of the World Baseball Classic. The National Football League has playoffs, and a final game called the "Super Bowl", whose winner is called the Superbowl Champions or NFL Champions. The National Basketball Association has playoffs and the "Finals", the winner of which is crowned NBA Champions. The National Hockey League has playoffs where teams vie for the Stanley Cup, and are called Stanley Cup winners.

[NADTATIDA1]

[WarpSpeed]

But you need to make sure you copy the Dutch coaching models, lots of five asides on small pitches plus training young players in every position. Rather than the English coaching model which is lots of weights sessions in the gym and learning to kick the ball as far as possible

The size of your population is no guarantee of footballing success, look at the Solvenians pop 2 million who regularly qualify for top tournaments whereas Russia regularly miss out, also China footballs very popular but they are rubbish. I proper coaching philosophy like the dutch total football idea, which Johan Cruyff exported to Spain and is used at Barcelona, gives a much better chance of world cup success than a large population.

What is it with you Americans in your constant need to knock the English at football are you trying to tell me you couldnt learn a thing from the English at football?

And i am telling you as a fact Johan Cruyff did not export total football to Spain ... try Rinus Michels.

Not American my friend, English, and I think the Americans would be wise not to learn anything from the English regarding football.

As you were pointing out yourself on the England thread, where you put forward some very good criticism of the English youth system.

Yes but the Americans wouldnt be going to local FA's that are run by the local lord or some other nepotistic connected person its the FA that im critical of ...... theyd be going to clubs like Man U, Arsenal etc who without doubt could teach a thing or 2 ... apply what the top few good footballing clubs do to all levels and no country would go too far wrong.

But yes if they copy the English FA run by the oldboys network theyd be shooting themselves in the foot.

It has to be said that at some point there was something to be gleaned from all nations styles and that's one reason for the influx of Americans into European soccer but conversely if they had not the skills to compete at that level then it is no doubt that they would not be there, it's a self fulfilling prophecy and credit needs to be given for that as well...

[WarpSpeed]

But you need to make sure you copy the Dutch coaching models, lots of five asides on small pitches plus training young players in every position. Rather than the English coaching model which is lots of weights sessions in the gym and learning to kick the ball as far as possible

The size of your population is no guarantee of footballing success, look at the Solvenians pop 2 million who regularly qualify for top tournaments whereas Russia regularly miss out, also China footballs very popular but they are rubbish. I proper coaching philosophy like the dutch total football idea, which Johan Cruyff exported to Spain and is used at Barcelona, gives a much better chance of world cup success than a large population.

What is it with you Americans in your constant need to knock the English at football are you trying to tell me you couldnt learn a thing from the English at football?

And i am telling you as a fact Johan Cruyff did not export total football to Spain ... try Rinus Michels.

Not American my friend, English, and I think the Americans would be wise not to learn anything from the English regarding football.

As you were pointing out yourself on the England thread, where you put forward some very good criticism of the English youth system.

Apologies for refering to you as a Septic.

So where's that mod warning from the England WC thread about flames and insults now??? Turn about's fair play yes?

It's also not lost that the post was edited to include the flame and insult...

Edited June 24, 2010 by WarpSpeed

[hansum]

Americans would no sooner discard the term "World Series" than the English would do away with the name "Premier" league even though they may not be the best league in UEFA.

Premier refers to it being the top league in the country. Just as Serie A refers in Italy to it being the top league there. That's where the claim ends.

The world is apparently still flat Rix.

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Yes this argument is as as boring and predictable as the its called football not socccer debate.

[NADTATIDA1]

[hansum]

Apologies for refering to you as a Septic

So where's that mod warning from the England WC thread about flames and insults now??? Turn about's fair play yes?

Its rhyming slang Septic Tank = Yank, you call us Limeys as a jibe and we really dont give a <deleted> about that ...... its akin to calling the Scottish .... sweatysocks ... but take offence if you wish and report me.

[Moonrakers]

Apologies for refering to you as a Septic

So where's that mod warning from the England WC thread about flames and insults now??? Turn about's fair play yes?

Its rhyming slang Septic Tank = Yank, you call us Limeys as a jibe and we really dont give a <deleted> about that ...... its akin to calling the Scottish .... sweatysocks ... but take offence if you wish and report me.

I suspect that he knows that already but still gets touchy about it.

Warpspeed, if you can't accept a little banter then the football forum really is not the place for you.

[rixalex]

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Appreciated. Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

Well since we originated it and it is the only championship of it's kind world wide and not contested outside of the states it stands to reason it's labeling is accurate....

To repeat: Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

[koheesti]

Just think you could play Uruguay or S Korea if you beat Ghana so it really does mean it is a World Cup that your country is involved in maybe most of the American population needs time to find its identity first before they can understand the concept of a World cup involving other countries?

I'm trying to figure out what you're getting at here. If you are insinuating that Americans don't participate in sports at a world level I would have to ask what planet you have been living on. The US has been participating in international football (soccer) for decades. Americans are also, of course, active participants in international Olympic basketball and hockey which now allow professionals to play. The last World Baseball Classic involved 16 nations and its final was the most widely watched sporting event of any kind in the history of televised sports in Japan. True, American football is not an international competition since it is only really popular in North America but I'm sure they would be glad to play any teams the rest of the world outside of the US and Canada might want to field if they truly felt suicidal. Rugby is only really played at the amateur level in the US and there is really no interest in cricket to speak of but I'm sure the Americans would send teams to international competions in these sports too if they became popular enough.

I think what he is getting at is when the champions of MLB of NFL or NBA are crowned, they are crowned World Champions - which is a bit strange considering they are national leagues.

The NFL team is the World Champs because nobody else plays. The NBA team is World Champs because they are so much better than any other league. Although I'd LOVE to see the NBA champ take on the Euroleague champ. The MLB is a little trickier because the Cuban champs could probably take them. Maybe even the Japanese. The MLB needs to stick with MLB Champs.

btw - as far as Cricket is concerned - the first International Cricket match was held in New York between the USA and Canada in 1844.

AND, the first Baseball World Cup was held in 1938 and Great Britain were the champs!

[StevieH]

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Appreciated. Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

Well since we originated it and it is the only championship of it's kind world wide and not contested outside of the states it stands to reason it's labeling is accurate....

well far be it for a limey to point out the origins of the 'world series' baseball to a native yankee, but the competition actually gets its name from the new york world newspaper sponsoring the first tournament doesn't it?

[WarpSpeed]

Apologies for refering to you as a Septic

So where's that mod warning from the England WC thread about flames and insults now??? Turn about's fair play yes?

Its rhyming slang Septic Tank = Yank, you call us Limeys as a jibe and we really dont give a <deleted> about that ...... its akin to calling the Scottish .... sweatysocks ... but take offence if you wish and report me.

First off never called any pom a limey in my life . Secondly "septic" is a fair bit more disparaging and insulting then a slang word for Brit that frankly we had naught to do with in the first place.. JFYI as it's more commonly understood is a septic as in "sepsis" refers to Americans as being a contagious fatal illness not a septic tank but thanks for the laugh anyway...

[koheesti]

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Appreciated. Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

Well since we originated it and it is the only championship of it's kind world wide and not contested outside of the states it stands to reason it's labeling is accurate....

well far be it for a limey to point out the origins of the 'world series' baseball to a native yankee, but the competition actually gets its name from the new york world newspaper sponsoring the first tournament doesn't it?

Apparently that is an urban legend.

[WarpSpeed]

Apologies for refering to you as a Septic

So where's that mod warning from the England WC thread about flames and insults now??? Turn about's fair play yes?

Its rhyming slang Septic Tank = Yank, you call us Limeys as a jibe and we really dont give a <deleted> about that ...... its akin to calling the Scottish .... sweatysocks ... but take offence if you wish and report me.

I suspect that he knows that already but still gets touchy about it.

Warpspeed, if you can't accept a little banter then the football forum really is not the place for you.

Wait a minute? Sorry I thought this was the American world cup thread?? So now it's not possible to post on the American world cup thread without having to be dictated to and lectured by other Brits who have only the agenda of flaming and antagonizing??

[Moonrakers]

So now warspeed knows more about cockney rhyming slang than we do as well.

Edited June 24, 2010 by Moonrakers

[WarpSpeed]

Of course some day the USA will win the World Cup. It is inevitable, especially with our huge pool of Latino origin people. Dream final -- Brasil vs. USA.

One thing you have in your favour is getting as good as a free pass to the world cup as the CONCACAF region gets too many places at the world cup in relation to the quality of teams in it.

America have a chance of fluking it to the final of this World cup as theyve potentially an easy route to the final ...

Really?? While I know they aren't in the CONCACAF what about Spain? And then there is that little pre-world cup contest known as the Confederations Cup, seems we fared pretty well in that tourney against some pretty respectable competition being runner up only to Brazil..

JFYI that "fluking it" as you called it is due to our own good play so don't marginalize it that way..If it was England they'd have 'EARNED' their position in the ranking but in this case it's "fluking it" since it's the US? fluke off.....

Nice backhanded compliment in your closing BTW ....

It wasnt a backhanded compliment you insular man.

In that context it certainly was...It was the very definition of a backhanded compliment...

[WarpSpeed]

It was not my intention to start an argument. It has been called the "World Series" for 107 years and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Let's leave it at that and return the thread to the topic of the World Cup.

Appreciated. Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

Well since we originated it and it is the only championship of it's kind world wide and not contested outside of the states it stands to reason it's labeling is accurate....

To repeat: Would though just for once be nice to hear an American agree that it is a daft bit of false advertising that should be done away with, rather than tying themselves up in knots trying to justify it.

So for you anything less then such an admittance is denial?? Sorry, too bad, not happening just because you choose not to understand or accept...

Edited June 24, 2010 by WarpSpeed

[WarpSpeed]

So now warspeed knows more about cockney rhyming slang than we do as well.

Nope only know what I've been told by other Brits and Euros take it up with them....Maybe it's you that hasn't the clue ........................... Nah not possible is it? I guess they're all wrong and you're right......

Edited June 24, 2010 by WarpSpeed

[Moonrakers]

May I suggest that you consider using google more often warpspeed.

[StevieH]

Apparently that is an urban legend.

ah really? shame. so it really is a totally insular and provincial mentality thing then?

[NADTATIDA1]

Warp speed you have just stated the fact yourself .....yes this is a World Cup thread about the USA in South Africa.

I have just read your posta here and to be honest with you,not once have you actually stated anywhere on this thread about your teams performance so far in this comp,all you have done is continually waffle on about American this and American that ,is it that you are here for only the reason to antagonize people because you dont see the irony(yes sarcasm also)in there posts or is simply that you don't understand the English sense of humour.

Today you have ranted on about name calling which on a forum is stupid,everybody does it but is meant as light hearted banter,do you want me to refer you to posts made of yours before which a moderator said he would let it slide this time?

Every thread i have read you have some problem with somebodys view,we are all entitled to our opinion and so are others but you keep to continually think you are in the right on every point you make.

This is a football forum that involves banter and fun at the expense of other teams,people take the piss and we laugh at each other and don't continually have to make remarks against others point of view simply because they don't agree with our own.

In short mate it is a happy forum and you have got to laugh at yourself sometimes why don't you actually talk about soccer and how well your team is doing in the World Cup i think you would get a bit more respect that way...don't you?

The USA play Ghana at the weekend did you forget that,what about the team? ...the players?...Ghana? how do you think they will play?

[hansum]

In that context it certainly was...It was the very definition of a backhanded compliment...

OK strange person i will explain this to you -

1. The following sentence i wrote was more a statement on what could happen, it was not a compliment nor a backhanded compliment -

America have a chance of fluking it to the final of this World cup as theyve potentially an easy route to the final ... a few draws along the way and winning on penalties as Argentina done in 1990 then who knows .

2. Now this was the compliment -

though theyve played extremely well as a team and i take my hat off to them for that.

3. Can you now explain to me how sepsis rhymes with YANK.

[mrtoad]

So now warspeed knows more about cockney rhyming slang than we do as well.

It appears that way Moonrakers

[Jingthing]

Arent i right in thinking the Hispanic population in the US on the whole is Mexican and historically Mexico at best have never been better then average despite a huge pool of Latinos.

No, you are not really right at all. Mexican origin Hispanics are about 65 percent. Hardly would call that on the whole.

Edited June 24, 2010 by Jingthing

[rixalex]

Arent i right in thinking the Hispanic population in the US on the whole is Mexican and historically Mexico at best have never been better then average despite a huge pool of Latinos.

No, you are not really right at all. Mexican origin Hispanics are about 65 percent. Hardly would call that on the whole.

Wouldn't you? 65% seems fairly close to what i would have described as being "on the whole". If not "on the whole" then "an overwhelming majority".

[billaaa777]

What is it with you Americans in your constant need to knock the English at football are you trying to tell me you couldnt learn a thing from the English at football?

Unless I am mistaken and I am not. The US won the Group and England was 2nd. Are not the losers supposed to look to the winners for inspiration. You really should be asking what can England learn from the US shouldn't you?

After all England spends more money on the sport than every other country in the world and could not even beat the US who spends no money on it at all when compared to the other sports Americans actually enjoy.

It is just so sad, Americans could give a rats as s about soccer and English fans have only one thing they care about and talk about and still can't win a thing.

As for Americans knocking English football, what a bunch of hogwash. Never happens, but why not take the opportunity to gloat when the only thing you even care about finishes 2nd to the US which was 1st. You must feel so BAD, and I feel so sorry for you. NOT!!!

[IMA_FARANG]

I watched the Algeria vs USA match. I am an American, but I wouldn't honestly say i was thrilled about their play. As someone said, as they were right, they play in spurts. To be a consistant winner they need to play that way for the whole match.

Having said that, I'm a USA suppporter, and will remain so. They can be exciting and of course I want them to win. What's so unusual about that?

For whoever made the comment about the team be made up of mostly "Latinos", the winning goal was scored bay Donovan. What's Latino about that name?

The USA is becoming a multi-cultural society, and I for one am happy it is. There are a lot of Mexicans in the US, but there are also a lot of Latinos who are from Nicuragua, Hondurous, Puerto Rico (yes it is a Spanish speaking commonwealth)..and so on.

But back to the football. I believe the USA can beat Ghana...but they need to play a whole game that is fast and exciting...not reley on the last 5 minutes. I hope they will.

By the way I picked the US to make it to the 16...frankly I'm not sure they will go to much further. But they can. As always it depends what happens on the field...opinions and trash talking don't count.

Soccar in the US is a secondary sport. Baseball, basketball, American football, ice hockey, and even stock car racing have a lot of money and television exposure. They tend to overpower soccar coverage in the US. This world cup team, if it goes further on, are making an audience aware of soccar/football in the US. The further they go, the more they will have to gain against those other, more entrenched sports, in the US.

So I'll go out on a limb...the USA over Ghana 2 goals to 1.

Edited June 24, 2010 by IMA_FARANG

[Jingthing]

Arent i right in thinking the Hispanic population in the US on the whole is Mexican and historically Mexico at best have never been better then average despite a huge pool of Latinos.

No, you are not really right at all. Mexican origin Hispanics are about 65 percent. Hardly would call that on the whole.

Wouldn't you? 65% seems fairly close to what i would have described as being "on the whole". If not "on the whole" then "an overwhelming majority".

So we are talking semantics now? No, I would never describe a 65 percent majority as on the whole. Or in other words, on the whole I would never use on the whole that way. Cheers.

[koheesti]

There are only 3 Latinos on the US WC team. I guess the good ones don't feel the need to immigrate.

Every player on the team was born in the USA. I remember it was about 20 years ago when most players were from somewhere else. So soccer/footie is obviously making a lot of progress in the US. While some traditional football powers seem to be losing their edge in the game, the US looks to only get better. Preferably sooner than later starting this Saturday night!

Edited June 24, 2010 by koheesti