Is This Safe?

[bkkexplorer]

Hi all,

I am about to purchase a home on landed property in bangkok and have a question. The chanote is currently under the wife of whom I'm negotiating with, a foreigner... It is his request that I make all payments when the deal goes through at the land office to his name only. His missus will only be there to sign documents. Is this going to create problems for me later on? I think they still have a loan to pay off. It is my understanding that once the chanote is signed off to me (my missus actually), we/ she is not liable for anything under the previous owner. Is this true? What am i missing here? Any advise appreciated. thanks.

[Jebhead]

Might be worth having a lawyer involved so everything's above board, it won't be that expensive....

JH

[chachachacha]

You really should get a lawer to handle the Transfer .He will check for any hidden debt linked to the House / land

[bkkexplorer]

Does it mean that even after the Chanote is transfered we could still be liable for dealings the previous owner has made.

Any recommendations on a lawyer? Any idea of the costs? thanks.

[chachachacha]

Does it mean that even after the Chanote is transfered we could still be liable for dealings the previous owner has made.

Any recommendations on a lawyer? Any idea of the costs? thanks.

Yes is the simple answer.All debt will stay with the house unless paid off. For what it will cost a lawyer is the way to go. They will check with the land office if any debt is tied to the property. If you have a copy of the chanote you could prob check it yourself at the land office. Better to be safe in the land of scams

[Jebhead]

Does it mean that even after the Chanote is transfered we could still be liable for dealings the previous owner has made.

Any recommendations on a lawyer? Any idea of the costs? thanks.

Lawyer costs not sure, no more than 20K???

It will be cheaper than paying debts left on the house / land tho....

JH

[InterestedObserver]

It is my understanding that once the chanote is signed off to me (my missus actually), we/ she is not liable for anything under the previous owner.

Any registered mortgages/debts will be listed on the back of the chanote and must be cleared before transfer. Anything owed to the local loan shark is another story altogether. Due diligence (title search) must be done before your wife hands over the cash and you sign that little piece of paper stating that it's not your money..

[gosompoi]

Get lawyer to research the what leans are against the property or at least yourself inquire at the land office what leans might be on the property.

[bkkexplorer]

I missed some details in the original post.

I've actually got the chanote in hand and went down to the land department last week. The officers there confirmed with me that there is a loan outstanding on the house and that the bank people will be there (at the land department) to clear whatever debts there are before the title deed changes hands. First hand experience to confirm this would be here welcomed here. Is there more than this I should worry about? Is there more to the title search?

On the loan sharks... How could one find out this piece of information? How would you know? I don't think and certainly hope this is not the case.

Thanks for the comments once again.

[NanLaew]

A friend of mine (from Australia) was close to sealing a deal to buy a nice beach property, dealing directly with the foreign 'owner' who was working in Hong Kong (chanote in his Thai wife's name) with similar instructions to deal with him directly on the financials. My friend did some snooping and found that the property 'ownership' was currently being disputed in a divorce. Once he contacted the actual chanote holder, he found her to be a well educated Thai woman who only wanted to make sure that she received her legal share of the property sale. He walked away from it.

I smell something is not quite right with your pending deal. Sounds like there was a remortgaging or refinancing that the current foreign 'owner' possibly wasn't clear about or unaware of. He may be unaware of any encumbrance or he could be looking for his money and leaving the new owner with bugger all apart from a 3-way pissing contest with his wife and the bank.

As for the possibility of loan sharks... absolutely no way to ever find out unless the 'owners' wife tells you. If there's other debts involved, maybe you should walk away from this one too.

[phrae]

You should really look at this through the other foreigner’s position.

He has most likely invested a lot of money, and is just trying to make sure he can get a return on his investment, or a percentage of any profit.

You are aware that money is owed to the bank, so contact the bank manager direct to ascertain how much and who the money should be paid too?

After the bank has collected the money, the chanote will be transferred to the foreigner’s wives name, although the bank can transfer it to your wives name at the land office.

Talk directly to the Owner and his Wive, and most likely make out 3 cheques, one to the Bank, one to his wife (owner of the chanote), and one to the foreigner.

If you find out they are fighting over the money, walk away ! !

It is always best to have a lawyer present anyway, 20,000 baht fee for a lawyer is money well spent in this case

[dave111223]

I don't see a problem with making the payment check out in his name, when doing the deal at the land department. It doesn't really matter who's name is on the check; just make sure you get the wife (owner) to sign a photocopy of the check and write something like "Payment for house received".

Do not send him any money directly before the deal; only hand money over at the land department.

As for loans they must be cleared before the land department will allow you to make the transfer.

I really don't see how a lawyer is going to help you? How would a lawyer find out if some local loan shark has an unofficial loan with the owners; surely this would require some kind of private detective, but this seems extreme? And even then it may be only the loan shark himself and the owner that know about it.

A lawyer is not going to provide you with anything if things go pear shape down the road (i don't think there is any such thing as "title insurance" in Thailand is there?)

If i bought a house and some loan shark showed up and said "You owe me money" i'd say "F off"; is there anyone that would actually pay off a loan shark for someone else loan?

Edited March 27, 2011 by dave111223

[antony77]

There are so many farangs tying to make a fast buck involved in land deals. So beware.

Get a good lawyer, don't try and do it yourself. You say there is a mortgage on the chanote. Make the seller pay it off first. I personally would walk away from it and get another piece of land

[bkkexplorer]

I have already spoken to his wife. She is fully aware of what is happening. The chanote is currently in her name. I plan to make all final transactions at the land office with officers/ bank representatives present. I guess I originally posted this question because the husband wanted me to make all payments to him, not his wife. This was my concern. It sounds like it doesn't matter who I make payments to, as long as the debt showing is cleared. I will discuss about making seperate payments, one for him and another for the bank. Thanks for that piece of advise.

[cheeryble]

You really should get a lawer to handle the Transfer .He will check for any hidden debt linked to the House / land

Any encumbrance will be listed on the back of the title deed and the copy at the Land Dept

[ESB7]

It is my understanding that once the chanote is signed off to me (my missus actually), we/ she is not liable for anything under the previous owner.

Any registered mortgages/debts will be listed on the back of the chanote and must be cleared before transfer. Anything owed to the local loan shark is another story altogether. Due diligence (title search) must be done before your wife hands over the cash and you sign that little piece of paper stating that it's not your money..

Local loan sharks take possesion of the Chanote until debt is repaid so if the Chonote is available from the current owner its not a problem

[haveaniceday]

ESB7 said : "Local loan sharks take possesion of the Chanote until debt is repaid so if the Chonote is available from the current owner its not a problem".

With no disrespect to the comment, if that was the case, couldn't the sellers just get a new Chanote from the lands office, could they declare & sign the old one destroyed in a fire accident if a Loan Shark still had the original?

If a bank had a lean on the property this would be documented int he lands office.

Edit, Typo, dam_n spelling

Edited March 30, 2011 by haveaniceday