UK pensions

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

2 hours ago, Faz said:

May I ask what your nationality is Chiang Mai?

British, American or Australian.

Just wondering as you constantly deviate from this topic (UK Pensions) and when mentioned, you reply you don't need lectures.

Obviously you do, or at least a reminder.

 

I think a few members who have followed this topic are more than tired of the constant deviations (Moderators note) and to be honest, frankly I don't care about the Australian or US Pensions as they don't affect me as a British national.

As for speculating what may be coming in the pipeline, we won't know until it's in the pipeline, so why speculate!

I agree with you that the point he is making is entirely speculative but I felt it was an exercise in insightful speculation and I am inclined to agree with his analysis. He might be wrong but I am inclined to think he is right. It's true that we don't know if he is right but even if he is wrong in the detail, I entirely agree with the proposition that the direction of future pension policy for expats will be unfavorable and that policy in Australia and the USA are poignant indicators. 

[chiang mai]

5 hours ago, Faz said:

May I ask what your nationality is Chiang Mai?

British, American or Australian.

Just wondering as you constantly deviate from this topic (UK Pensions) and when mentioned, you reply you don't need lectures.

Obviously you do, or at least a reminder.

 

I think a few members who have followed this topic are more than tired of the constant deviations (Moderators note) and to be honest, frankly I don't care about the Australian or US Pensions as they don't affect me as a British national.

As for speculating what may be coming in the pipeline, we won't know until it's in the pipeline, so why speculate!

 

I am British.

 

I think it is not sensible to look at UK State Pension in isolation, if you want to examine the issue of yearly uplift it's not unreasonable to look at what other countries have done, ditto if you want to try and understand what might be in our future, looking at comparable schemes around the world, particularly in Australia and the US may give some useful clues.

 

Another poster wrote very recently (now deleted) that discussing future likely scenario's for the State Pension was nothing more than scaremongering unless a consultation document had been issued and any changes were actively being discussed by working parties - I disagree that is scaremongering, I think it is sensible "what if" advance planning and the more forum members are made aware of likely future options and potential threats, the more they can make informed choices for their future.

 

If all you want is to have just a very narrow focus on the topic (and also a very narrow field of vision), by all means try and restrict the debate by doing nothing more than  simply adding to the 105 pages of existing moans about how unfair it all is. Alternatively, you should feel free to ignore this aspect of the debate, just as you might ignore other threads/posts that don't interest you - having these posts here doesn't exactly use up some limited amount of space, there's plenty of room for different views, not all of which will interest everyone.

 

Finally, regarding needing reminders: I didn't raise that issue I merely responded to another posters comments on it, as you well know!

 

And finally finally, I think that if you have difficulty with anything I post, the report button is there for you to use and I would urge you to use it, I do, frequently!

 

 

Edited September 18, 2016 by chiang mai

[canopus1969]

If the Waspi's get knocked back (and they live in the UK) then we have no chance  

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/pensions-retirement/financial-planning/minister-no-money-for-women-who-lost-out-on-state-pensions-and-t/?WT.mc_id=e_DM163682&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_09_21&utm_campaign=DM163682

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

Within the same article it is stated: " Now, as Mr Harrington settles into his new office, the Waspis are ramping up their campaign. "

Campaigns are never won by people who have given up !

[evadgib]

HMG surely realise any attempt to appease the WASPIs will attract the attention of the consortium and the APPG.

[nong38]

I have just returned from Blighty and I dont know if anyone picked up on Damien Smith, the New Pension Top Dog, has been saying or maybe not saying?

Nothing is likely change that much in this Parliament but after that the triple lock maybe changed as its seen to be to friendly to pensioners as opposed to workers, a few figures are tossed about but not our loss of interest from our savings accounts as per usual!

It seem that pensioner perks may be up for re examination in the next parliament and it looks like the thinking is that those who can do without "winter fuel allowance" etc due to their wealth may have it withdrawn, whilst non of this applies to many here it will worry some that they may fall into the trap, so be aware and watch developments as a lot of Osbornes austerity measures have been halted for the time being apparently, that does not of course mean that the debts are forgotten and the ways mentioned above are on the agenda possibly.

We dont know yet and we wont for a while how our chums in the EU countries are going to be handled during the Brexit negotiations, another elephant in the sitting room.

All we can do is watch and wait and hope for the best, the future does not seem to be in our hands, the world as a whole has the problem of an ageing population and how to cope with it, perhaps we are lucky, it is not going to get better as time goes on is it?

[rockingrobin]

The effects of the EU and other pension bi-laaterall agreements are slowly been eroded

 

7.23 As is currently the case for people who reached state pension age before 6 April 2010, years of insurance or residence in another Member State of the European Economic Area (EEA) or in certain countries with which the UK has a bilateral social security agreement (for example, the United States) will count towards the MQP. However, entitlement to new state pension will be based solely on UK contributions, on a pro-rata basis. For example, a person with only five years of UK National Insurance contributions who has a further 30 years of insurance in another EEA Member State would satisfy the MQP through the combination of their UK and foreign insurance and be entitled to 5/35ths of the full rate of the new state pension.

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/173/pdfs/uksiem_20150173_en.pdf

[evadgib]

Report on APPC AGM held recently:

 

http://frozenbritishpensions.org/2016-agm-appg-frozen-british-pensions/

[sandyf]

Another blow for UK pensioners, pound opens down today, currently 1.286/USD.

So much for the recovery that we keep hearing about.

[chiang mai]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

Another blow for UK pensioners, pound opens down today, currently 1.286/USD.

So much for the recovery that we keep hearing about.

 

I think we both understand that this is going to be a slow decline comprised of fits and bumps that will continue for many months, possibly a year or more, the likelihood of this was understood way back when. At some point however values may reverse but when and by how much is so unclear that it would be an extremely brave man or a fool who would try and guess at what those numbers might be.

[Scott]

Inflammatory post and replies removed.  

[theoldgit]

Can I remind members that this thread is about UK Pensions, not Brexit, please refrain from going off topic.

 

I've removed a number of Brexit associated posts.

[Scott]

An off-topic post has been removed.   The thread is about UK pensions.  

 

Please stay on topic. 

[Jip99]

This one is doing the rounds on Facebook. I can't really argue with the sentiment.

 

 

 

Edited October 6, 2016 by Jip99

[jayboy]

This one is doing the rounds on Facebook. I can't really argue with the sentiment.
 
 
 

I can argue with it because it's nonsense.It's nothing to do with working hard or even paying taxes.It has everything to do with paying (or having paid for you) the required level of contributions over the necessary number of years.

[nong38]

There was a piece doing the rounds over the last few days from Paul Johnson of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, he has been on the Radio and been reported on the BBC web pages generally stating that people born in the 1940s, 50s and 60s have a jolly good time and should not now be enjoying a rather handsome pension, he is stating that some generous pensions should be cut, RPI to CPI which most providers are moving to and this will mean a fall in the pension in both State and Private, he also seems to be under the impression that many of the people who are now or recently have become or about to become pensioners have more than one house because of the luck of when they were born and were able to get on the property ladder very easily, something that I certainly do not recognize. Yet again he thinks we should be trying to help todays young to get on the housing ladder.

When I was looking at retiring, in my 40s, I set myself targets for when I did retire and how my retirement was to be funded, I knew I would have a State and Private Pension and I could get an estimate of them. I also had a few dividend paying shares to count on and then I had my savings to get interest from, when I retired I was getting 5% interest on my savings, I did not foresee until it was about to happen that this revenue stream was to dry up and the interest I was missing was suddenly being transferred to cheap mortgages for young people to get on the housing ladder, they might have been barely able to afford them as well but we all know that if the rates for mortgages go up the housing market will collapse so the chances of my/our savings interest revenue returning is virtually nil, we are stuck with amounts now under 1%.

Maybe we were lucky to be born when we were but we made the most of it and handled our money carefully only to be dealt bum deals by the like of Osborne/Clegg who reigned in our tax allowances so that the "young" could catch us up. I would like the young to have a try at rationing like we did to see the value of money, 1 ounce of bacon a month for one!

[nong38]

A date for your diaries, Chancellor''s Autumn Statement is November 23rd.

New Chancellor and maybe a more fairer approach?

Judging by what the new PM said the Conference maybe, a bit more help for savers and a squeeze on cheap mortgages at savers expenses and end to QE which has not helped our savings wealth one jot.

May says that recently the rich hace richer and the poor have got poorer and she is going to make the UK a fairer society, lets hope there is something there for us then eh?

[Ricardo]

22 hours ago, nong38 said:

 

we all know that if the rates for mortgages go up the housing market will collapse so the chances of my/our savings interest revenue returning is virtually nil, we are stuck with amounts now under 1%.

 

 

But you won't be getting the medal you deserve, for your/our personal-sacrifice, in reducing the costs for our over-borrowed/over-spending fiscally-prudent political-leaders of recent times !

 

They dare not let interest-rates rise, or it would screw-up their financial-plans  ...  Gordon Brown would no-doubt still describe this as 'being prudent' !

 

However inflation should rise, in response to the recent/on-going devaluation in the value of the Pound, and force their hands.

[Jip99]

On 6/10/2559 at 11:50 AM, jayboy said:

 

I can argue with it because it's nonsense.It's nothing to do with working hard or even paying taxes.It has everything to do with paying (or having paid for you) the required level of contributions over the necessary number of years.

 

 

 

Good point.

 

 

You may not have worked hard for the contributions that you contractually acquired.

 

 

 

[sandyf]

On 10/6/2016 at 11:50 AM, jayboy said:

 

I can argue with it because it's nonsense.It's nothing to do with working hard or even paying taxes.It has everything to do with paying (or having paid for you) the required level of contributions over the necessary number of years.

 

You are quite right to argue, but not on the basis stated.

State pension is certainly not welfare, comes from a separate source.

 

Your taxes and public spending
This shows a break down of how your taxes have been or will be spent by government.

Welfare (25.3%)
Health (19.9%)
State Pensions (12.8%)
Education (12.5%)
Defence (5.4%)
National Debt Interest (5.0%)
Public Order and Safety (4.4%)    
Transport (3.0%)
Business And Industry (2.7%)
Government Administration (2.0%)    
Culture eg sports, libraries, museums (1.8%)     
Environment (1.7%)    
Housing and Utilities eg street lighting (1.6%)    
Overseas Aid (1.3%)    
UK Contribution to the EU Budget (0.6%)    

[jayboy]

36 minutes ago, sandyf said:

You are quite right to argue, but not on the basis stated.

State pension is certainly not welfare, comes from a separate source.

 

Your taxes and public spending
This shows a break down of how your taxes have been or will be spent by government.

Welfare (25.3%)
Health (19.9%)
State Pensions (12.8%)
Education (12.5%)
Defence (5.4%)
National Debt Interest (5.0%)
Public Order and Safety (4.4%)    
Transport (3.0%)
Business And Industry (2.7%)
Government Administration (2.0%)    
Culture eg sports, libraries, museums (1.8%)     
Environment (1.7%)    
Housing and Utilities eg street lighting (1.6%)    
Overseas Aid (1.3%)    
UK Contribution to the EU Budget (0.6%)    

I don't understand what point you are making or the relevance of the tax expenditure breakdown.We were discussing what entitles an individual to a UK state pension.I explained that it was nothing to do with paying tax or working hard, just how many contributions have been paid.

[Liquorice]

On ‎07‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 9:19 AM, nong38 said:

 

May says that recently the rich hace richer and the poor have got poorer and she is going to make the UK a fairer society, lets hope there is something there for us then eh?

 

Recently!!! Where's she been for the last 50 years.

Promises of a fairer society come around every 5 years at election time.

 

Vote for me for a fairer and equal society...........then I'll screw your Pensions and Savings later.

Have you ever seen a poor PM or MP?

[billd766]

57 minutes ago, Faz said:

 

Recently!!! Where's she been for the last 50 years.

Promises of a fairer society come around every 5 years at election time.

 

Vote for me for a fairer and equal society...........then I'll screw your Pensions and Savings later.

Have you ever seen a poor PM or MP?

 

Michael Foot and his donkey jacket springs to my mind.

[Liquorice]

6 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

Michael Foot and his donkey jacket springs to my mind.

 

Good one Bill, but have you seen the price of Donkey jackets............not for the poor.

[billd766]

51 minutes ago, Faz said:

 

Good one Bill, but have you seen the price of Donkey jackets............not for the poor.

 

About 50 years ago I used to have one when I drove a coal lorry on my rounds. Coal was OK but the bags were small. Coke was much worse as it tended to rub together and the resulting grit used to go down the collar of my donkey jacket and between my shirt and skin. It was like wearing a coarse sandpaper shirt.

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, jayboy said:

I don't understand what point you are making or the relevance of the tax expenditure breakdown.We were discussing what entitles an individual to a UK state pension.I explained that it was nothing to do with paying tax or working hard, just how many contributions have been paid.

No discussion, a comment about an image.

[howerde]

Not sure if this is the right place, but worth a read, got it off Paul Lewis  money website

http://www.royallondon.com/Global/documents/GoodWithYourMoney/TOPPING-UP-YOUR-STATE-PENSION-GUIDE.pdf

 

 

Edited October 8, 2016 by howerde

[dabhand]

4 hours ago, howerde said:

Not sure if this is the right place, but worth a read, got it off Paul Lewis  money website

http://www.royallondon.com/Global/documents/GoodWithYourMoney/TOPPING-UP-YOUR-STATE-PENSION-GUIDE.pdf

 

 

 

This Guardian article is a limited version of what Royal London has set out in detail.

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/oct/08/how-to-boost-state-pension

 

 

[OJAS]

On 10/3/2016 at 0:54 PM, evadgib said:

Report on APPC AGM held recently:

 

http://frozenbritishpensions.org/2016-agm-appg-frozen-british-pensions/

 

Rather than unfreeze our State Pensions here in Thailand, I fear that the trend being followed by the UK government is more likely to be in the opposite direction.

 

In particular, I would think it highly unlikely that they would make the negotiation of a suitable social security agreement with the EU a top priority after Article 50 has been invoked, bearing in mind the savings to the coffers of UK plc which could be made through depriving pensioners living in France, Spain, etc of the annual increases.

 

What would then be to stop them from tearing up whatever few social security agreements remain with non-EU countries such as the Philippines, just as they did in the case of Australia some years ago?

 

And now we understand that the triple-lock method of calculating increases for pensioners living in Blighty is under threat.

 

All in all, this is arguably one way of creating a level playing field, I suppose. But one which certainly sounds perverse to my ears and also, I suspect, to those of fellow State Pensioners wherever we choose to live on this great planet of ours.

 

[nong38]

6 hours ago, OJAS said:

 

Rather than unfreeze our State Pensions here in Thailand, I fear that the trend being followed by the UK government is more likely to be in the opposite direction.

 

In particular, I would think it highly unlikely that they would make the negotiation of a suitable social security agreement with the EU a top priority after Article 50 has been invoked, bearing in mind the savings to the coffers of UK plc which could be made through depriving pensioners living in France, Spain, etc of the annual increases.

 

What would then be to stop them from tearing up whatever few social security agreements remain with non-EU countries such as the Philippines, just as they did in the case of Australia some years ago?

 

And now we understand that the triple-lock method of calculating increases for pensioners living in Blighty is under threat.

 

All in all, this is arguably one way of creating a level playing field, I suppose. But one which certainly sounds perverse to my ears and also, I suspect, to those of fellow State Pensioners wherever we choose to live on this great planet of ours.

 

I doubt the triple lock pension will be in operation after the 2020 GE, unless inflation takes off.