California Wow Raises Renewal Fees

[garet]

I'm rather amazed at people here supporting CaWow Sucksperience changing the lifetime membership to a monthly membership fee. I don't know how they could get away with it.

They should've spent less money on dozens of speakers blasting that cheesy house music and flat screen TVs endlessly looping promotion videos and bloody CNN news.

The atmosphere was always terrible, the locker rooms are atrocious, and the pathetic house music is always too loud. If I wasn't already locked into their "Lifetime Membership" sham, I'd gladly pay more to join Fitness First, which has 7 or 8 well maintained branches in Bangkok.

How are you "locked in"?

Okay, let me rephrase: We were sold a one-time lifetime membership. Now the company is cheating it's customers in an effort to keep 2 locations, that most of us can't use, in business. Would anyone have bought the "lifetime membership" if the owners could ask you for an additional 7000 baht per month in the future?

[tropo]

It is the principle that is wrong. The customer shouldn't get screwed over so they can stay in business.

Principles are unimportant when you don't have a choice of good places to train. I'm not going to shoot myself in the foot (i.e. stop training) because I don't like the principles of a certain gym. It's not like I've got 10 gyms to choose from and I can investigate the principles of each gym in order to make a decision which one to join.

Currently I'm a member of Tony's in Pattaya. I don't like the gyms and don't like the principles of the owner - but I joined because I need a place to train.

Having said that, there's nothing unprincipled about a gym trying to survive and stay open, even if it means changing the rules.

... but you're suggesting it's better they close and no one has an opportunity to train because of some (bloody) principles.

I don't think too many lifetime members thought it would be lifetime. I knew they were in financial difficulty when I joined, but the deal was good and I took a gamble. Did you really think you were going to get a lifetime?

Edited August 11, 2012 by tropo

[tropo]

When I got my lifetime membership it was discounted to 9,000 baht (down 1,000) if I promised to date one of 6 sales rep girls at Siam paragon that day.

I wonder to this day if my discount is unique....

I've heard of people getting the 9k deal without have to date staff members. Perhaps you're more handsome.

Edited August 11, 2012 by tropo

[garet]

It is the principle that is wrong. The customer shouldn't get screwed over so they can stay in business.

Principles are unimportant when you don't have a choice of good places to train. I'm not going to shoot myself in the foot (i.e. stop training) because I don't like the principles of a certain gym. It's not like I've got 10 gyms to choose from and I can investigate the principles of each gym in order to make a decision which one to join.

Currently I'm a member of Tony's in Pattaya. I don't like the gyms and don't like the principles of the owner - but I joined because I need a place to train.

Having said that, there's nothing unprincipled about a gym trying to survive and stay open, even if it means changing the rules.

... but you're suggesting it's better they close and no one has an opportunity to train because of some (bloody) principles.

I don't think too many lifetime members thought it would be lifetime. I knew they were in financial difficulty when I joined, but the deal was good and I took a gamble. Did you really think you were going to get a lifetime?

I'm afraid you're still missing my point. A contract was signed for a one time lifetime membership fee. They don't have the right to break their contracts and start charging monthly memberships to it's lifetime members. They have the right to close locations (and a few of those locations such as Major Ratchayothin were the pits), but if they stay in business a s CAwow, they can't break it's thousands of lifetime membership contracts. They wouldn't get away with it in most countries.

Simple question: Do you think a company has a legal right to break it's contracts AND still stay in business to try to make a profit? If they eventually start turning a profit again, will they be bound to refund the money for all the contracts they broke? Of course not.

Anyway, even if I didn't have to pay a monthly membership on top of my lifetime membership, I would almost never make it to Siam or Chiangmai so I'm screwed either way.

I wonder if they will still keep the banner "World's number one fitness centers!"

[tropo]

I'm afraid you're still missing my point. A contract was signed for a one time lifetime membership fee. They don't have the right to break their contracts and start charging monthly memberships to it's lifetime members. They have the right to close locations (and a few of those locations such as Major Ratchayothin were the pits), but if they stay in business a s CAwow, they can't break it's thousands of lifetime membership contracts. They wouldn't get away with it in most countries.

Simple question: Do you think a company has a legal right to break it's contracts AND still stay in business to try to make a profit? If they eventually start turning a profit again, will they be bound to refund the money for all the contracts they broke? Of course not.

Anyway, even if I didn't have to pay a monthly membership on top of my lifetime membership, I would almost never make it to Siam or Chiangmai so I'm screwed either way.

I wonder if they will still keep the banner "World's number one fitness centers!"

I'm afraid I didn't miss your point as you've repeated it over and over. I got it the first time.

Logic is lost on you.

The company is broke, therefore I don't care about contracts, principles and what should be. If there is a chance this payment can keep their doors open I'll go for it because I love training there. In Pattaya I don't believe it will happen, but if it does happen in Bangkok, then good on them.

I'm not alone, so be amazed. Plenty of lifetime members feel the same.

In the end, for myself and other serious gym goers it's all about the workout. We don't care about what goes on behind the scenes.

Unlike you, when I paid for a ridiculously low lifetime membership I wasn't expecting it to be for a lifetime. I got 3 years out of mine - better than I expected.

In a practical sense (obviously not your strong suit), if they close, the ex-members will be paying more than the "maintenance fee" to join somewhere else, so it makes perfect sense. In Pattaya the situation is even more desperate as we have no good gym choices at all. There isn't one place even close to California Wow in quality, and we have a gym tyrant filling up the town with sub-standard dumps. Right now the future looks bleak in the gym business.

Anyway, by now we should understand each other's point of view, so we should give it a rest.

[bonobo]

Actually, by going into bankruptcy, in the West, a company like CaliWow would be able to break the so-called "life-time" contracts. This has happened time and time again. Bankruptcy trumps contracts. I think that sucks, and I personally am out $130k because of a bankruptcy, but that's the way it is.

And I think what CaliWow is doing sucks, too. But as tropo says, I would not shoot myself in the foot because of it. My lifetime membership is a sunk cost. If the Pin Klao branch were still open, I would have to make the determination if paying the new fee is a better option than any other work-out option I have. And from what I have seen so far, I would pay the fee. Not because I am happy about it or want to support CaliWow, but because I need a place to work out, and with the equipment they have, the new 600+ monthly fee is still the best option out there for me.

It is a moot point, though. Pin Klap is not open, so CaliWow is not even an option for me.

[JanKlaasen]

It is the principle that is wrong. The customer shouldn't get screwed over so they can stay in business.

Ok, so they are not allowed to stay in business amd get legs up tomorrow.

So you will have to fork out something like 20.000 Baht a year to join a gym that comes close to Cawow, but yet not the same standard.

Make a wild guess who is screwed .

[tropo]

Actually, by going into bankruptcy, in the West, a company like CaliWow would be able to break the so-called "life-time" contracts. This has happened time and time again. Bankruptcy trumps contracts. I think that sucks, and I personally am out $130k because of a bankruptcy, but that's the way it is.

Do they have lifetime memberships in your home country? In Australia they were outlawed back in the 80's after a big fitness chain closed up and took all the money. Obviously they got away with it on fine print, but these type of contracts are now illegal.

I would have thought that most people realise lifetime memberships in Thailand are a big gamble and would go in with that in mind.

[Flex2791]

I got my "lifetime membership" in Nov. 2008 from the Paragon club for 6000bt which means I got almost 4 years out of it so far. That works out to about 130bt a month. I think I got my moneys worth. Those complaining about their "contracts" might want to read it before posting here. I have mine in front of me now. It doesn't mention "Lifetime" anywhere on it. It only says yearly with a 100bt renewal fee. Either way, I will gladly pay 698bt a month at any gym that can provide the equipment California Wow had/has. Especially at the Silom club when it was on the 19th floor. I sincerely hope 99% of the members refuse to pay the new membership fees. I will surely enjoy the elbow room.

[tropo]

I got my "lifetime membership" in Nov. 2008 from the Paragon club for 6000bt which means I got almost 4 years out of it so far. That works out to about 130bt a month. I think I got my moneys worth. Those complaining about their "contracts" might want to read it before posting here. I have mine in front of me now. It doesn't mention "Lifetime" anywhere on it. It only says yearly with a 100bt renewal fee. Either way, I will gladly pay 698bt a month at any gym that can provide the equipment California Wow had/has. Especially at the Silom club when it was on the 19th floor. I sincerely hope 99% of the members refuse to pay the new membership fees. I will surely enjoy the elbow room.

That's a good point - there's no "lifetime" mentioned on the contract.

If 99% of members refuse to pay you'll not need elbow room as the doors will certainly be closed.

[garet]

It is the principle that is wrong. The customer shouldn't get screwed over so they can stay in business.

Ok, so they are not allowed to stay in business amd get legs up tomorrow.

So you will have to fork out something like 20.000 Baht a year to join a gym that comes close to Cawow, but yet not the same standard.

Make a wild guess who is screwed .

No, the company didn't manage it's business well and had to fold a number of clubs. But with those 2 clubs open, they don't have the right to ask existing lifetime members to change to be monthly members. If they do that, then they are trying to make their money back at the members' expense.

Once again. The salespeople flat out told me, and my Thai wife in English and Thai, that I WOULD NEVER HAVE TO PAY ANOTHER BAHT after paying the 30000 lifetime membership. Then, after 5 years, there would be a one hundred baht yearly renewal fee, which was really just a way cancel memberships for people who were out of the country after five years, or people who stopped going to the gym and forgot to pay it after 5 years.

If you lease a car for 5 years and the company goes under, they can't expect you to pay an additional monthly rate on top of your lease contract.

People who dropped 20,000 to 30,000 baht should not pay more to support this company breaking it's contracts, allowing them to make more money while satisfying only their Siam Paragon and Chiangmai customers.

[garet]

It is the principle that is wrong. The customer shouldn't get screwed over so they can stay in business.

Ok, so they are not allowed to stay in business amd get legs up tomorrow.

So you will have to fork out something like 20.000 Baht a year to join a gym that comes close to Cawow, but yet not the same standard.

Make a wild guess who is screwed .

Oh, I'm completely aware that I'm screwed out of my lifetime membership money. The Siam location is too far, so even if I accepted the company cheating me by demanding more money every month on top of my lifetime membership, I wouldn't join.

Fitness First is more expensive but it's much better maintained. The machines aren't jammed so close together, all of the treadmills and exercise bikes work, and when one breaks, it is quickly serviced. The music isn't as oppressively loud, and the sales staff isn't half as agressive as the CAWow staff was. There is also air-con in the locker rooms so you're not sweating into your clean clothes. At least in Bangkok, Fitness First has 7 prime well-maintained locations. Hope they expand to Pattaya too.

After dropping 30000 at Cawow, it will be hard for me to drop money down on a new gym, even though I know it is run well and isn't going to disappear in a year or two.

For anyone in Bangkhen area of BKK, you could join Vipawadee hospital fitness centre, with a pool for 9000 baht/year (6000 for students). It's an interesting alternative.

[garet]

I'm afraid you're still missing my point. A contract was signed for a one time lifetime membership fee. They don't have the right to break their contracts and start charging monthly memberships to it's lifetime members. They have the right to close locations (and a few of those locations such as Major Ratchayothin were the pits), but if they stay in business a s CAwow, they can't break it's thousands of lifetime membership contracts. They wouldn't get away with it in most countries.

Simple question: Do you think a company has a legal right to break it's contracts AND still stay in business to try to make a profit? If they eventually start turning a profit again, will they be bound to refund the money for all the contracts they broke? Of course not.

Anyway, even if I didn't have to pay a monthly membership on top of my lifetime membership, I would almost never make it to Siam or Chiangmai so I'm screwed either way.

I wonder if they will still keep the banner "World's number one fitness centers!"

I'm afraid I didn't miss your point as you've repeated it over and over. I got it the first time.

Logic is lost on you.

The company is broke, therefore I don't care about contracts, principles and what should be. If there is a chance this payment can keep their doors open I'll go for it because I love training there. In Pattaya I don't believe it will happen, but if it does happen in Bangkok, then good on them.

I'm not alone, so be amazed. Plenty of lifetime members feel the same.

In the end, for myself and other serious gym goers it's all about the workout. We don't care about what goes on behind the scenes.

Unlike you, when I paid for a ridiculously low lifetime membership I wasn't expecting it to be for a lifetime. I got 3 years out of mine - better than I expected.

In a practical sense (obviously not your strong suit), if they close, the ex-members will be paying more than the "maintenance fee" to join somewhere else, so it makes perfect sense. In Pattaya the situation is even more desperate as we have no good gym choices at all. There isn't one place even close to California Wow in quality, and we have a gym tyrant filling up the town with sub-standard dumps. Right now the future looks bleak in the gym business.

Anyway, by now we should understand each other's point of view, so we should give it a rest.

Alright, the snide comments aren't necessary. You do get my point and you and some other members accept and have no problem having their contract broken and then asked to pay more. I can be practical too (one of my strong senses), but I will never give more money to a company that just reneged on their contracts and is asking more money from the same people they said would never have to pay again. They cheated us, and they deserve to go under 100%

In Bangkok, there are 2 alternatives, the well run Fitness First with 7 or 8 prime locations, or True Fitness, which has 2 or 3 locations but this one is a bit high-end for my tastes. Neither of these clubs are cheesy and pretentious like CAWOW and they don't bombard everyone every room with loud house music either.

In the meantime, I've got some dumbells and a hard floor for pressups. There is a park a pool nearby for cardio. I'll be fine without CaWoW

[tropo]

In the meantime, I've got some dumbells and a hard floor for pressups. There is a park a pool nearby for cardio. I'll be fine without CaWoW

...and you were the one telling me you don't need to know about my (bloody) workouts.

You can easily let a gym go because your training requirements are minimal. Some of us need more. Some of us don't do quite so well without California Wow.

[Fgis]

Contract or not it os of course better to pay 700 Thb at Cwow than 2000 at Ftiness first that might close sooner or later anyway :-)

I just hope that Cwow is not stupid enough to ask people to have 700 Thb automaticallu taken from their bank account every month ? The best way to make sure that nobody will trust them enough to allow them to withdraw this money every month...

But if 700 Thb must be paid at the desk, maybe ok.

[Searat7]

Before I bought my Lifetime Membership I was paying 1,600 a month at California so I figure that the payback period was 9 months which is excellent. I am happy to see them do something about the fee problem because 90% of members have Lifetime status ( was told this 6 months ago by CA Wow manager) and the alternative to raising fees is complete closure for sure.

I used the Silom Club before and I notice they have new stairway from main building lobby to the second floor now with the original entrance turned into a store or something (not finished). I think there is a strong possibility another gym may have taken this location and a CA WOW employee at Paragon told me he thought another gym would be there. Has anyone else heard anything about this possibility ?

Does anyone know when the new monthly fee will be effective ? At the normal annual renewal date ?

[troy04]

When I got my lifetime membership it was discounted to 9,000 baht (down 1,000) if I promised to date one of 6 sales rep girls at Siam paragon that day.

I wonder to this day if my discount is unique....

Me and a friend get lifetime membership 2-3 years ago at Ekamai for a 10'000 (discounted from 2x'xxx thb) with renewal 100 a year and we both did VIP upgrade last year for a 8'000 at Paragon - some other branches said they couldn't do it for that money... we wondered what's going on in this company since it took several calls with main office which was not informed at all and months to proceed our cards and enhanced membership.

I guess this is just tactics, maybe even planed, to get some more cash out of it for a while, maybe to receive more bank credits even. With such a monthly fee a gym might be able to work profitable, but here they just screw their customers, some members go well along with it it seems.

The contract might be bulletproof for their interests I bet. Now lifetime members got a renewal fee 12 x 6xx thb, what an experience!

Edited August 12, 2012 by troy04

[garet]

In the meantime, I've got some dumbells and a hard floor for pressups. There is a park a pool nearby for cardio. I'll be fine without CaWoW

...and you were the one telling me you don't need to know about my (bloody) workouts.

You can easily let a gym go because your training requirements are minimal. Some of us need more. Some of us don't do quite so well without California Wow.

Alright, that workout comment was just an aside at the end. I prefer a full gym as well, but due to CAWow's poor management and business decisions, that option is shot for 90% of it's members

[garet]

Contract or not it os of course better to pay 700 Thb at Cwow than 2000 at Ftiness first that might close sooner or later anyway :-)

I just hope that Cwow is not stupid enough to ask people to have 700 Thb automaticallu taken from their bank account every month ? The best way to make sure that nobody will trust them enough to allow them to withdraw this money every month...

But if 700 Thb must be paid at the desk, maybe ok.

It is highly unlikely Fitness First will go out of business as it's an international chain with branches in many countries. It has slowly built up it's number of branches in Bangkok, and they are all well-maintained. The branch in Landmark Hotel, Terminal 21, and Central Rama 9 are top notch.

Of course, it is expensive, but you can get promotions for 1500 baht a month.

The advantages of FF over CaWOW Experience

1) Better maintained equipment which is not crammed too close together.

2) Locker rooms with air con and more space.

3) No cheesy slogans such as "Where the superstars workout", and "The World's No 1 Fitness Centres!"

4) Music is not too loud, so you can actually have a peaceful workout, or listen to your own music without blowing your ear-drums out. No horrendous house music either.

5) Less agressive sales staff.

6) Fewer fruitcakes lurking around in the locker room and toilets

7) Haven't closed any locations in Thailand.

Cons:

Higher price (although CA Fitness will probably start charging new members a similar amount)

[bonobo]

Contract or not it os of course better to pay 700 Thb at Cwow than 2000 at Ftiness first that might close sooner or later anyway :-)

I just hope that Cwow is not stupid enough to ask people to have 700 Thb automaticallu taken from their bank account every month ? The best way to make sure that nobody will trust them enough to allow them to withdraw this money every month...

But if 700 Thb must be paid at the desk, maybe ok.

It is highly unlikely Fitness First will go out of business as it's an international chain with branches in many countries. It has slowly built up it's number of branches in Bangkok, and they are all well-maintained. The branch in Landmark Hotel, Terminal 21, and Central Rama 9 are top notch.

Of course, it is expensive, but you can get promotions for 1500 baht a month.

The advantages of FF over CaWOW Experience

1) Better maintained equipment which is not crammed too close together.

2) Locker rooms with air con and more space.

3) No cheesy slogans such as "Where the superstars workout", and "The World's No 1 Fitness Centres!"

4) Music is not too loud, so you can actually have a peaceful workout, or listen to your own music without blowing your ear-drums out. No horrendous house music either.

5) Less agressive sales staff.

6) Fewer fruitcakes lurking around in the locker room and toilets

7) Haven't closed any locations in Thailand.

Cons:

Higher price (although CA Fitness will probably start charging new members a similar amount)

I am not sure about # 6 there, but for the rest of your pros, I would agree with you. However, for a con, the equipment they do have is lower quality, and the variety of equipment is smaller than CaliWow. Sure, the environment seems better, but the bottom line was what you can do when you are there.

But as I am in Thonburi, CaliWow is not an option. Fitness First is not good enough. I just wish I could find an option for workweek nights where I could get a decent workout without having to drive to Sathorn (where I have a great free gym at which I can exercise.)

[WebBangkok]

I get they have to do it to survive. But I went to Pinklao branch which was a bit of a drive for me. I paid 10 year advance in the yearly 100 baht fee.

I got my moneys worth from Cawow. Im with fitness first now. the equiptment is so much better.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect App

[HardenedSoul]

No horrendous house music either.

That wasn't house music they played at CaWOW. That was dance music - BIG difference.

Still, you're right - it was horrendous

[Gaccha]

Contract or not it os of course better to pay 700 Thb at Cwow than 2000 at Ftiness first that might close sooner or later anyway :-)

I just hope that Cwow is not stupid enough to ask people to have 700 Thb automaticallu taken from their bank account every month ? The best way to make sure that nobody will trust them enough to allow them to withdraw this money every month...

But if 700 Thb must be paid at the desk, maybe ok.

It is highly unlikely Fitness First will go out of business as it's an international chain with branches in many countries. It has slowly built up it's number of branches in Bangkok, and they are all well-maintained. The branch in Landmark Hotel, Terminal 21, and Central Rama 9 are top notch.

Of course, it is expensive, but you can get promotions for 1500 baht a month.

The advantages of FF over CaWOW Experience

1) Better maintained equipment which is not crammed too close together.

2) Locker rooms with air con and more space.

3) No cheesy slogans such as "Where the superstars workout", and "The World's No 1 Fitness Centres!"

4) Music is not too loud, so you can actually have a peaceful workout, or listen to your own music without blowing your ear-drums out. No horrendous house music either.

5) Less agressive sales staff.

6) Fewer fruitcakes lurking around in the locker room and toilets

7) Haven't closed any locations in Thailand.

Cons:

Higher price (although CA Fitness will probably start charging new members a similar amount)

I am not sure about # 6 there, but for the rest of your pros, I would agree with you. However, for a con, the equipment they do have is lower quality, and the variety of equipment is smaller than CaliWow. Sure, the environment seems better, but the bottom line was what you can do when you are there.

But as I am in Thonburi, CaliWow is not an option. Fitness First is not good enough. I just wish I could find an option for workweek nights where I could get a decent workout without having to drive to Sathorn (where I have a great free gym at which I can exercise.)

Colonel, have you checked out the numerous hospitals in Thonburi e.g. Thonburi 2 hospital. Any of them might have a decent fitness centre....

I've already checked out the hotels and there is nothing out there.... Except maybe the ultra high-end ones on the river bank...

[tropo]

No horrendous house music either.

That wasn't house music they played at CaWOW. That was dance music - BIG difference.

Still, you're right - it was horrendous

Complaints about music are just plain silly. You can't please everyone and they tend to favour the younger generation who prefer it loud. It makes business sense. If they were playing Beethoven and Mozart they'd have more complaints. Older people need to be more flexible and learn how to adjust.

I used to allow the music to bug me before I came to SE Asia, but it's easy to learn to switch it off. It's all about concentration and motivation.

[bonobo]

Contract or not it os of course better to pay 700 Thb at Cwow than 2000 at Ftiness first that might close sooner or later anyway :-)

I just hope that Cwow is not stupid enough to ask people to have 700 Thb automaticallu taken from their bank account every month ? The best way to make sure that nobody will trust them enough to allow them to withdraw this money every month...

But if 700 Thb must be paid at the desk, maybe ok.

It is highly unlikely Fitness First will go out of business as it's an international chain with branches in many countries. It has slowly built up it's number of branches in Bangkok, and they are all well-maintained. The branch in Landmark Hotel, Terminal 21, and Central Rama 9 are top notch.

Of course, it is expensive, but you can get promotions for 1500 baht a month.

The advantages of FF over CaWOW Experience

1) Better maintained equipment which is not crammed too close together.

2) Locker rooms with air con and more space.

3) No cheesy slogans such as "Where the superstars workout", and "The World's No 1 Fitness Centres!"

4) Music is not too loud, so you can actually have a peaceful workout, or listen to your own music without blowing your ear-drums out. No horrendous house music either.

5) Less agressive sales staff.

6) Fewer fruitcakes lurking around in the locker room and toilets

7) Haven't closed any locations in Thailand.

Cons:

Higher price (although CA Fitness will probably start charging new members a similar amount)

I am not sure about # 6 there, but for the rest of your pros, I would agree with you. However, for a con, the equipment they do have is lower quality, and the variety of equipment is smaller than CaliWow. Sure, the environment seems better, but the bottom line was what you can do when you are there.

But as I am in Thonburi, CaliWow is not an option. Fitness First is not good enough. I just wish I could find an option for workweek nights where I could get a decent workout without having to drive to Sathorn (where I have a great free gym at which I can exercise.)

Colonel, have you checked out the numerous hospitals in Thonburi e.g. Thonburi 2 hospital. Any of them might have a decent fitness centre....

I've already checked out the hotels and there is nothing out there.... Except maybe the ultra high-end ones on the river bank...

I never thought of trying the hospitals. Good idea.

The Peninsula has a decent gym. I tried it once while staying at the Oriental for a long weekend. But the cost is prohibitive as a member, at least to me.

There is a new gym going up near the southern bus terminal. It will open next month. I may put up with the drives to Sathorn for now and wait to find out more about that one before I choose my workweek option.

[tropo]

I never thought of trying the hospitals. Good idea.

I wouldn't use hospital gyms - too much risk of picking up a virus.

[Fgis]

No horrendous house music either.

That wasn't house music they played at CaWOW. That was dance music - BIG difference.

Still, you're right - it was horrendous

Complaints about music are just plain silly. You can't please everyone and they tend to favour the younger generation who prefer it loud. It makes business sense. If they were playing Beethoven and Mozart they'd have more complaints. Older people need to be more flexible and learn how to adjust.

I used to allow the music to bug me before I came to SE Asia, but it's easy to learn to switch it off. It's all about concentration and motivation.

Finally something that makes sense ::-)

These people always complaining about the music should stay home...

Music is not made to be listened to but to avoid that Thai fall asleep :-)

[garet]

No horrendous house music either.

That wasn't house music they played at CaWOW. That was dance music - BIG difference.

Still, you're right - it was horrendous

Complaints about music are just plain silly. You can't please everyone and they tend to favour the younger generation who prefer it loud. It makes business sense. If they were playing Beethoven and Mozart they'd have more complaints. Older people need to be more flexible and learn how to adjust.

I used to allow the music to bug me before I came to SE Asia, but it's easy to learn to switch it off. It's all about concentration and motivation.

I agree to a point. I didn't let the music stop me from working out. However it WAS annoying, and none of the other fitness centers play music so loud. Most young people have their own music too, so I doubt they were going there for the music.

[garet]

Now that Cawow is finally out of business, I understand that True Fitness is buying up some of their old locations. That is good news, as it will likely be better run and more well-maintained than before. Of course, I doubt that they would honour Cawow memberships

[JanKlaasen]

Now that Cawow is finally out of business, I understand that True Fitness is buying up some of their old locations. That is good news, as it will likely be better run and more well-maintained than before. Of course, I doubt that they would honour Cawow memberships

Where did you read that Cawow is finally out of business?I read that they had a court case today where the landlords were summoned to reopen the clubs.