karlos Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 That's a pretty good power output for this style of bike, not too far off of the ER6 and Ninja650. I’m still skeptical if it is actually 54RWHP and not a reading at the crank..... If the power figure remains true it's a lot of bang for the buck, but i did see someone mentioning that the bike will be built in Japan, which would either mean there's another production line in Thailand, or Thailand isn't getting this bike anytime soon......??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramds Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Cb500 looks like <deleted> to me. I m not sure who will buy it man haha. Looks really gay to me too! But it will be at least 15.000 thb cheaper than cbr 500. To each their own. I love naked bikes. They are built for a purpose, taking you from A to B. I will most definitely buy one. So not sure what you would call me then. And you can be sure, they will sell a lot of these CB's, wouldn't be surprised if they sell more than CBR's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 That's a pretty good power output for this style of bike, not too far off of the ER6 and Ninja650. I’m still skeptical if it is actually 54RWHP and not a reading at the crank..... If the power figure remains true it's a lot of bang for the buck, but i did see someone mentioning that the bike will be built in Japan, which would either mean there's another production line in Thailand, or Thailand isn't getting this bike anytime soon......??? Out of interest what's the output on kawas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaicbr Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 That's a pretty good power output for this style of bike, not too far off of the ER6 and Ninja650. Im still skeptical if it is actually 54RWHP and not a reading at the crank..... If the power figure remains true it's a lot of bang for the buck, but i did see someone mentioning that the bike will be built in Japan, which would either mean there's another production line in Thailand, or Thailand isn't getting this bike anytime soon......??? Out of interest what's the output on kawas. 72 hp sent from my Q6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karlos Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 That's a pretty good power output for this style of bike, not too far off of the ER6 and Ninja650. I'm still skeptical if it is actually 54RWHP and not a reading at the crank..... If the power figure remains true it's a lot of bang for the buck, but i did see someone mentioning that the bike will be built in Japan, which would either mean there's another production line in Thailand, or Thailand isn't getting this bike anytime soon......??? Out of interest what's the output on kawas. 2012-2013 model is rated between 71-72 depending on where you read it. Myself being somewhat biased believe it to be 72bhp But I am sure this is crank output, which would result in around 67RWHP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 54rwhp is certainly okay for a new 170k Honda. What's the price of the new Ninja 250? around 26rwhp and 160k baht? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Out of interest what's the output on kawas. 72 hp crank or RW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdsandBooze Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 The CBX looks nice and if available in that matt black I can see the ER6 making way for it in the garage. The CB500 also looks pretty good. IMHO the CBR looks a bit slabby and staid and globally I can see the CBX and CB both outselling it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karlos Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) Out of interest what's the output on kawas. 72 hp crank or RW? I'm certain it's crank, as most dyno videos i have seen have the stock bike running at around 66-67hp at the rear wheel. And yes this is going to be some stiff competition for the Ninja250/300 but i can't see this bike taking to many sales from the ER6 / Ninja 650. It certainly doesn't make much sense to buy the Ninja 250/300 anymore, unless you really like the styling and i for one love it! But that power the new Honda offers up is going to be hard to resist at only 10k more.... We'll have to wait for a review of the bike to see which bike handles better, i'm sure the new honda is the better bike for the city while the Ninja 250/300 would shine on a twisty track Edited November 12, 2012 by karlos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Yeah, will be interesting to see proper RWHP figures and get the actual price. If really 54RWHP, and under 180k, then it's a hell of a deal, even if it is mostly built with bargain basement CBR250 parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantan Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Yeah, will be interesting to see proper RWHP figures and get the actual price. If really 54RWHP, and under 180k, then it's a hell of a deal, even if it is mostly built with bargain basement CBR250 parts. CBR150 parts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 ^ Well the forks and swing arm look like it. Any torque figures being invented by magazines yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 after seeing the official pics i think the cbr500r looks quite boring. Looks more than a tourer than a sports bike also that exhaust is pretty lame nowadays... for my taste its a fail. I think the looks are the biggest asset of this bike. Of course it's heavy and underpowered, and not really a 'CBR' - but this is a Honda and this is Thailand so looks and image are the most important thing. This bike ticks all the boxes... 1. It's cheap. 2. It looks expensive. 3. It's a Honda. 4. It doesn't use much gas (see point 1) This bike will sell well if priced in line with the US. It represents good value and will be a decent touring/commuter bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 it's heavy and underpowered If the stated (by magazines) RWHP is true at 54. What is the RWHP to Weight ratio compared to say the Ninja 250, or even the Ninja 650? It's closest competitor in Thailand will be the N250 due to similar price. How much heavier is it than that, seeing as it's reported to have 100% more RWHP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 it's heavy and underpowered If the stated (by magazines) RWHP is true at 54. What is the RWHP to Weight ratio compared to say the Ninja 250, or even the Ninja 650? It's closest competitor in Thailand will be the N250 due to similar price. How much heavier is it than that, seeing as it's reported to have 100% more RWHP. I was comparing it to the Ninja 650. I don't believe it will make 54hp at the wheel. Maybe 45ish. At 420 lbs that's heavy and underpowered for a bike labelled as a cbr with 500cc in my opinion. To put it in some kind of context, a 'real' 2012 600cc sports bike makes around 110 hp and maybe 45 lbs of torque. It also weighs a LOT less. Of course we are in Thailand so unfortunately we have to compare it to the other scant (and often overpriced) offerings available, but this bike even makes the modest er6 series look aggressive. It's good value though... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) it's heavy and underpowered If the stated (by magazines) RWHP is true at 54. What is the RWHP to Weight ratio compared to say the Ninja 250, or even the Ninja 650? It's closest competitor in Thailand will be the N250 due to similar price. How much heavier is it than that, seeing as it's reported to have 100% more RWHP. I was comparing it to the Ninja 650. Posted weight and RWHP are closer to N650's, but price wise (and thus competition wise) it's right there in the N250 range (presumably). If specs posted are correct, it would be 0.126 rwhp/lb compared to the N650 1.5 rwhp/lb. The N250, which will likely be just cheaper, is about 0.068 To put it in some kind of context, a 'real' 2012 600cc sports bike makes around 110 hp and maybe 45 lbs of torque. It also weighs a LOT less. Of course we are in Thailand so unfortunately we have to compare it to the other scant (and often overpriced) offerings available True. Kawa have always overpriced their little N250, the 650's always looked like good value though. Of course real sports bikes, which you seem to want this cheap p-twin, sub 180k baht (probably) bike to somehow match or compare to are really uncomparable for so many reasons. Edited November 12, 2012 by cbrer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikster Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Out of interest what's the output on kawas. 72 hp crank or RW? I'm certain it's crank, as most dyno videos i have seen have the stock bike running at around 66-67hp at the rear wheel. And yes this is going to be some stiff competition for the Ninja250/300 but i can't see this bike taking to many sales from the ER6 / Ninja 650. It certainly doesn't make much sense to buy the Ninja 250/300 anymore, unless you really like the styling and i for one love it! But that power the new Honda offers up is going to be hard to resist at only 10k more.... We'll have to wait for a review of the bike to see which bike handles better, i'm sure the new honda is the better bike for the city while the Ninja 250/300 would shine on a twisty track It's even worse than that the Ninja 300 is significantly more expensive than the 250, at least in the USA. So unless Kawa just replaces the 250 with the 300 at the same price, removing the "Thai premium" they seem to be applying to the 250.... the 300 would cost exactly the same as a CBX500. Jeez. If the CBR500 is $2000 more than the 250 then clearly it would be $160 - 175k for the CBR here. Amazing prices, that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loserlazer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) 54 rwhp does not seem realistic to me too. Maybe 54 crank hp which is still ok. Better than a mere 47 hahah. And yes, this is thailand and we dont have much legal and proper big bikes so these new mid series of honda is like a gem. Of course everybody prefer a 600 inline four but what to do guys. I just pray at least we get this from honda man haha. And what else? a 250 ninja for the same price? Do you really buy a 250 ninja now for 160 k or go for a 180 k proper big bike? It will kill the sales of ninja 250 for sure Or another version: If you want to buy a big bike in Thailand, do you really buy a kawa 650 with 25 percent more performance for 40 percent more price? How many buyers will fell the difference of 15 hp? It will definitely get a lot of sales from 650 kawas too for sure! Honda will sell good amounts. Hope to see them here we all hope. Just be honest people. So we can compare cbr500 with ninja 250 and 650f/n at tbe same time. Sent from my GT-N7100 using Thaivisa Connect App Edited November 12, 2012 by loserlazer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikster Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 it's heavy and underpowered If the stated (by magazines) RWHP is true at 54. What is the RWHP to Weight ratio compared to say the Ninja 250, or even the Ninja 650? It's closest competitor in Thailand will be the N250 due to similar price. How much heavier is it than that, seeing as it's reported to have 100% more RWHP. I was comparing it to the Ninja 650. I don't believe it will make 54hp at the wheel. Maybe 45ish. At 420 lbs that's heavy and underpowered for a bike labelled as a cbr with 500cc in my opinion. To put it in some kind of context, a 'real' 2012 600cc sports bike makes around 110 hp and maybe 45 lbs of torque. It also weighs a LOT less. Of course we are in Thailand so unfortunately we have to compare it to the other scant (and often overpriced) offerings available, but this bike even makes the modest er6 series look aggressive. It's good value though... Bingo. Value is the whole point. Good little bikes for very little money. No idea why you'd want to compare this to a "real" 600cc sports bike. Honda makes a CBR600RR as well, but it will probably cost 2x as much as the CBR500. The CBR500 is $6,000. The old 2012 CBR600RR was $11,500. The 2013 price is TBD but I imagine if it doesn't stay the same, it'll go up. The Ninja650 is still competitive with these new cheap Hondas - it has a bigger engine, more power, and costs $1,500 more. Looks like that equation will be skewed a bit towards Honda in Thailand if they really come in at $90k less than the Kawas. CBX looks good in black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 If you want to buy a big bike in Thailand, do you really buy a kawa 650 with 25 percent more performance for 40 percent more price? How many buyers will fell the difference of 15 hp? tbf, I think the quality of parts on the N650's will be day and night over the cheap, budget made 500's. I haven't checked, but those forks look identical to the 250 ones, and they look skinny on that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macknife Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 CBR looks nice, as does the CBX. CBF not so. If the price is just say 150-170,000B then I'll have to get the CBR. I must say I'd prefer the Ninja 650 as it looks much better quality and much nicer looking, however the difference in price does matter. I also think the CBR would be more fun to ride as living in BKK I doubt I'd get out of 3rd gear on the Ninja 650. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Everyone has personal taste, I think they're just about better than average looking, which I guess is what they're all about. Cheap, efficient, with a bit of styling, but made using the cheapest of parts. If the US price stated is correct, and they're cheaper than that here, then I'm sure they'll sell well. But they must be made seriously cheaply to ring in at less than 170k thb for the naked version after it's been shipped to the states. If they can get that to 155k thb, then wow. If geared for torque than the CB and CBX could be very nice for BKK city riding. Though personally I hoped the CB would be more aggressive looking. It looks like the ER-6n's little gay brother. So do we now play 'guess the promotion price' then? CBR500 - 174,999. CB500F - 154,999. CB500X - 184,999. I failed the 'guess what's under the covers' game...I'm not going to embarrass myself again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I'm certain it's crank, as most dyno videos i have seen have the stock bike running at around 66-67hp at the rear wheel. And yes this is going to be some stiff competition for the Ninja250/300 but i can't see this bike taking to many sales from the ER6 / Ninja 650. It certainly doesn't make much sense to buy the Ninja 250/300 anymore, unless you really like the styling and i for one love it! But that power the new Honda offers up is going to be hard to resist at only 10k more.... We'll have to wait for a review of the bike to see which bike handles better, i'm sure the new honda is the better bike for the city while the Ninja 250/300 would shine on a twisty track I'm also of the mind it won't take many sales (not that compared to Honda Kawi has many big bike sales) away from the 650 bikes, but Kawasaki's in a world of hurt for sure trying to offload their 250s. You can get a very comparable bike right now for 66% of the price or a much better bike for an estimated 133%. We'll see how the Ninjette compares on the track; from the professional racing series against the CBR250 it never acquitted itself all that well did it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Nice bikes, downside is that the production will be in the Kumamoto Factory in Japan... (according to Takanobu Ito, the CEO of Honda, who talked about a new series of motorcycles which will first be introduced in North America). Are you talking about the below quote? Which reads a lot like to me to be about bikes bigger than Honda's NC700 bikes...which a 500cc machine doesn't fit. Or perhaps you have a different quote? “In the area of large-sized motorcycles, following the New Mid Series, Honda will introduce a series of large-sized models with a new concept, which enable customers to more easily enjoy daily commuting and weekend touring. This stylish new series will be equipped with a “torqueful” engine, low seat height which increases the ease of handling, and a comfortable ride with high stability in maneuvering. The production of the first model in this new series will begin in February 2013 at Kumamoto Factory, Honda’s global motorcycle production operation, and sales will begin from North America.” Only the bigger bikes will be manufactured in Japan, the 500 series in Thailand. Richard just wants to put us off the idea of buying a Honda, so we can all spend our hard earned cash on a Chinese superbike. [citation needed] I'm not saying you're incorrect, but having proof is only what I'm asking for all. I am giving Richard the chance to explain how I am wrong in reading the statement and am asking you where there's any evidence of the bike being produced in the Kingdom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yankee99 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) Nice bikes, downside is that the production will be in the Kumamoto Factory in Japan... (according to Takanobu Ito, the CEO of Honda, who talked about a new series of motorcycles which will first be introduced in North America). Are you talking about the below quote? Which reads a lot like to me to be about bikes bigger than Honda's NC700 bikes...which a 500cc machine doesn't fit. Or perhaps you have a different quote? “In the area of large-sized motorcycles, following the New Mid Series, Honda will introduce a series of large-sized models with a new concept, which enable customers to more easily enjoy daily commuting and weekend touring. This stylish new series will be equipped with a “torqueful” engine, low seat height which increases the ease of handling, and a comfortable ride with high stability in maneuvering. The production of the first model in this new series will begin in February 2013 at Kumamoto Factory, Honda’s global motorcycle production operation, and sales will begin from North America.” Only the bigger bikes will be manufactured in Japan, the 500 series in Thailand. Richard just wants to put us off the idea of buying a Honda, so we can all spend our hard earned cash on a Chinese superbike. [citation needed] I'm not saying you're incorrect, but having proof is only what I'm asking for all. I am giving Richard the chance to explain how I am wrong in reading the statement and am asking you where there's any evidence of the bike being produced in the Kingdom. I only quoted what mityon kawasaki big bikes said "honda 500cc made in thailand". I guess they wouldnt be building that huge big wing shop if they dont have any inventory? Mityon seems to operate a semi successful operation. Edited November 12, 2012 by yankee99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 That's a pretty good power output for this style of bike, not too far off of the ER6 and Ninja650. I’m still skeptical if it is actually 54RWHP and not a reading at the crank..... If the power figure remains true it's a lot of bang for the buck, but i did see someone mentioning that the bike will be built in Japan, which would either mean there's another production line in Thailand, or Thailand isn't getting this bike anytime soon......??? If Honda has the same HP/cc that Kawasaki gets for their 650, than you could expect 60.9 crank HP ((72 * 550)/650)for the 550...12% driveline loss puts the RWHP at 54. As an aside, it seems that Honda took a leaf out of Kawasaki's playbook and made their engine a 180* crankshaft...so the exhaust note should sound pretty similar I'd assume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I only quoted what mityon kawasaki big bikes said "honda 500cc made in thailand". I guess they wouldnt be building that huge big wing shop if they dont have any inventory? Mityon seems to operate a semi successful operation. Ok, I'm not looking to start a fight or anything, it's just that due to the phenomenal sales numbers that Honda regularly puts out I tended to believe the postings that their factory was running close to full production. There's a good chance that they've caught up on the CBR250 orders and can switch over to the 500's, but I don't know as to whether that is just wishful thinking on my part (I really do want one of those CBR500 at 170K!) or reality. Thus the query for a link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yankee99 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 No worries i may be misinformed too. They also predicted the z800. The ducati dealer also mentioned new bikes produced here. If they are doing mostly assembly i would think it is quite easy to ramp up production. Lots of parts on my dtracker are stamped made in japan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowflake Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Why complain about power figures??? We should be happy as pigs in shit... More big bikes are coming... Does anyone know the seat height of the new cbr? Can my go fit one? Yes she is a midget... And How high is that CBX? I like that one... All I know is that I was going to buy a kawasaki next year, thought z1000 but now, maybe keep the er6f and get the CBX... Hmm difficult, when will ducati release theirs? How difficult it is to choose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikster Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Ducatis new 820cc HyperMotard/Multis were just introduced. Honda is going for cheap and affordable, Ducati is going the exact other way so should be easy to choose between the two. In the US these bikes cost 2x as much as the hondas, they start at $12k, $15k for the SP version. In Thailand Ducati is more expensive than in the US so in Thailand these will likely cost around 500k - 600k. Or 3x the price of these new little Hondas. Of course they also have 110HP, Ohlins/Brembo/Marzocci kit, traction control, ABS, riding modes, ride by wire, weight less than 200kg. They should address the concerns of the enthusiasts here and do that in style. For a price Are they worth 3x the price? It really depends. It's hard to decide - I was going to get a new mini multi and I'd probably swallow the pricetag too - except that the Hyper Multi is the ugliest Ducati in a long while. The Hypermotard looks awesome as expected but something went wrong with that little multi. Very sad. Honda 500 CBX is the sweet spot for good looks, fantastic price, and some performance, I'd think. Even for Versys owners - it's a bit lighter, has a bit less power. But how many Versys riders use *all* the power of the bike? There's only a handful of roads up here in the north where I can max it out. Trade for a lighter bike with less HP... hmm... HFL is buying into the concept, I agree with them. Unsurprising they were also big fans of the CBR250 and these ones are the logical extension of that. Good little bikes for little money. That concept is very simple, and just... good. http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2012/11/for-5500-the-most-important-new-bikes-this-year/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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