Apparently No Need To Leave Country For Tourist Visa To Ed Visa Change

[disagree]

I was yesterday at the Immigration Office to prolong my 60-day tourist visa with 30 additional days. Since I came a week later, it was quite expensive... :-) But since the overstay was paid off ( 500 THB per day ), the 30 days counted from yesterday. ( My own stupidity, and I expected it to be only 4-5 days, since my calculation was very vaguely based on months and not exact days and me forgetting to count the arrival date into it :-) But as I said, my own stupidity )

Anyhow;

Brought a friend of mine with me, who speaks Thai very well and who has a great ability to get the ladies behind the desks talking, to help me with cost reduction and risks of overstay. About overstay the ladies said that money talks; if you have the cash, there's no risk with it. So unless you don't run into an immigration bust in some drug area, or run out of cash - it should be all fine. ( My last overstay was 368 days, paid 20k THB at the airport, no problems whatsoever - just some smirking officers :-) )

But the more interesting part for me was what they said about the ED Visa - since I'm planning on getting an ED Visa in the future, my friend was asking a few questions about it, and was actually notified that it's not necessary to leave the country to move from a ( in my case ) 60 day tourist visa to an ED visa. Which was quite surprising as all information on the learning school websites indicates otherwise.

( However in my specific case it was not possible, since I violated the visa with the overstay - had I not done that, they said they could change it without me leaving the country. )

This was just a 'by the way' question while we were already leaving. I was surprised to hear that, and we had 3 of the immigration ladies at J2 talk about it and all agreed about this statement.

So am I missing something here, or why do all school websites write about having to leave the country? Maybe it was changed recently? Anyway, something worth looking into to save yourselves a visa run!

[lopburi3]

Conversion is not normally done except for full time university type study and most people are talking about part time language study. It may also make a difference what immigration office you are talking about.

If you are stopped on overstay by normal police you will likely go to jail/court/fined and be deported.

[disagree]

Conversion is not normally done except for full time university type study and most people are talking about part time language study. It may also make a difference what immigration office you are talking about.

My friend was specifically asking for Thai ED visa to learn Thai Language - it was also written down like that in my extension request. Is there a difference between Thai ED Visa? What are the conditions for the 'conversion' and who's the decision maker on that?

Immigration office was main office in Chaeng Watthana.

If you are stopped on overstay by normal police you will likely go to jail/court/fined and be deported.

From personal experience : I was stopped 2 times @ drug control. Nothing happened as I had other identification documents than passport with me - driver's license/personal ID.

Also my friend specifically asked about the effects of overstay as in if it stays on file, and what conditions there are to become imprisoned; Overstay does not stay on file ( no such thing as airport black lists ) and as she so eloquently put it : "prison doesn't benefit anyone - it's the money that is important".

This also is the general consensus in deportation/imprisonment stories I've read so far ( since I've been very interested in this topic before flying out with 360+ days of overstay ) - either lack of funds, or criminal activity/getting in trouble with authorities/not bribing when it was expected.

There is a reason that the stay here is so limited, that immigration workers have the nicest gold rings and live in the best parts of town, and that there is a sole desk with 2 workers at the airport just specifically to pay the overstay fine - it's goood money.

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[koolbreez]

I suspect the ladies were using that ingrained Thai trait of putting on the impression they knew what they were talking about when in fact they did not.

You can not get an ED visa issued inside Thailand. It is not a case of simply changing the extension as they were leading you to believe, it is the issuing of a completely new non-im ED visa, and that can not be done inside Thailand. You can not extend a tourist visa for one year, or even 90 days, and you can not change it to a different class of visa to extend it inside Thailand no matter who, and how much you bribe. They did not provide your friend accurate information in this case.

Edited November 10, 2012 by koolbreez

[disagree]

I suspect the ladies were using that ingrained Thai trait of putting on the impression they knew what they were talking about when in fact they did not.

You can not get an ED visa issued inside Thailand. It is not a case of simply changing the extension as they were leading you to believe, it is the issuing of a completely new non-im ED visa, and that can not be done inside Thailand. You can not extend a tourist visa for one year, or even 90 days, and you can not change it to a different class of visa to extend it inside Thailand no matter who, and how much you bribe. They did not provide your friend accurate information in this case.

koolbreez, thank you for your reply. I will have to take your word against the words of 3 immigration officials who are handling these cases on a daily basis. Also if I may note your statement contradicts lopburi3's statement further above.

The only time when they were debating something was regarding to how the situation is with a current visa on overstay where the unison was that it's not possible. They didn't need to impress us, as we were on our way out already ( had all papers), as the situation didn't apply to me anyway and I trust that my friend is quite fluent in filtering bs in Thailand as it's part of his job.

That's why I decided to post about it here, so this could be investigated further. Seeing as there is a general consensus that it's not possible ( this counts/counted also for me ) and official information found online is quite outdated.

Maybe it's something that doesn't apply to the visa-on-arrival, as it's not a real visa?

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[lopburi3]

Conversion of entry visa would only be done in the extension of stay process. A visa is not issued by immigration as just a visa.

[disagree]

Conversion of entry visa would only be done in the extension of stay process.

Aha, so you could convert your Visa on Arrival visa after 30 days have passed at the Immigration Office to a Student ED? So are there official conditions for this? Is it at the liberty of the immigration office worker?

A visa is not issued by immigration as just a visa.

I don't quite understand this sentence. May you please elaborate further?

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[lopburi3]

They only issue a non immigrant visa entry (not for use later) and they only do this if you qualify for an extension of stay (normally for retirement or marriage). The requirements would be those normally required for one year extensions of stay.

[merijn]

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

Only extensions can be done inside Thailand.

I think that the immigration officers where fishing for some extra cash in your case.

Regarding the overstay, This is taken very serious by the Thai Police.

If you go to the airport without problems you should be fine in most cases as you pay the fine and you are on your way.

But if the police stop you during the overstay period and they are checking your status you WILL be arrested and deported.

I saw this many times happening and helped personally some of them with getting them flight tickets back home so they could be released from jail and put on the plane.

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

Only extensions can be done inside Thailand.

I think that the immigration officers where fishing for some extra cash in your case.

Regarding the overstay, This is taken very serious by the Thai Police.

If you go to the airport without problems you should be fine in most cases as you pay the fine and you are on your way.

But if the police stop you during the overstay period and they are checking your status you WILL be arrested and deported.

I saw this many times happening and helped personally some of them with getting them flight tickets back home so they could be released from jail and put on the plane.

[lemoncake]

I suspect the ladies were using that ingrained Thai trait of putting on the impression they knew what they were talking about when in fact they did not.

You can not get an ED visa issued inside Thailand. It is not a case of simply changing the extension as they were leading you to believe, it is the issuing of a completely new non-im ED visa, and that can not be done inside Thailand. You can not extend a tourist visa for one year, or even 90 days, and you can not change it to a different class of visa to extend it inside Thailand no matter who, and how much you bribe. They did not provide your friend accurate information in this case.

Just like some people on this board

Yes you can and always could. I had 1 for 2 years, not only i did not have to leave the country to get one, but did not have to report every 90 days either.

the no reporting option was 5000 baht (extra)difference in price.

[lemoncake]

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

Only extensions can be done inside Thailand.

I think that the immigration officers where fishing for some extra cash in your case.

Regarding the overstay, This is taken very serious by the Thai Police.

If you go to the airport without problems you should be fine in most cases as you pay the fine and you are on your way.

But if the police stop you during the overstay period and they are checking your status you WILL be arrested and deported.

I saw this many times happening and helped personally some of them with getting them flight tickets back home so they could be released from jail and put on the plane.

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

Only extensions can be done inside Thailand.

I think that the immigration officers where fishing for some extra cash in your case.

Regarding the overstay, This is taken very serious by the Thai Police.

If you go to the airport without problems you should be fine in most cases as you pay the fine and you are on your way.

But if the police stop you during the overstay period and they are checking your status you WILL be arrested and deported.

I saw this many times happening and helped personally some of them with getting them flight tickets back home so they could be released from jail and put on the plane.

again incorrect, for 35000-45000(depending on the law firm or friends you use), one can be issued in Thailand without having to leave the country or provide anything but your passport

[TCA]

incorrect, for 35000-45000 (depending on the law firm or friends you use), one can be issued in Thailand without having to leave the country or provide anything but your passport

That might be the case but exactly how valid are these? My local immigration office will do likewise for a large fee, but this is contrary to their own regulations and an individual would be leaving themselves open to potential problems down the line. I'd say it's a gamble and for that sum of money would rather have a couple of days in KL or wherever, and get a real ED visa there.

Edited November 10, 2012 by TCA

[disagree]

I just came back from a meeting where what I heard yesterday was confirmed to me by another individual who also didn't have to leave the country to get his. No getting out of the country necessary in that case as well.

Are Thai language schools maybe using the Thai ED visa runs to promote/commission from their visa run sister companies on an unnecessary visa run?

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[disagree]

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

Only extensions can be done inside Thailand.

I think that the immigration officers where fishing for some extra cash in your case.

...

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.

I understand that this was the general consensus until now preached by Thai Schools based to the unknowing and ill-informed. Based on the feedback so far this seems to have been proven now to be incorrect!

No bribes were even hinted at. It was a strictly informal conversation with all the immigration workers who were handling cases at the time in the J2 apartment. Actually the ladies acted very professional to my colleague who is half-native Thai and a very charming speaker who has my absolutely full trust.

In case of bribes we would have rather expected them to happen during the overstay negotiations, as we know of cases where 20k were reduced to 10k + "tip" just by being witty and getting an officer in a good mood. So I fully trust the discussion as it was not the sleezy type, and also based on the feedback from other members and individuals I have independently spoken to.

Regarding the overstay, This is taken very serious by the Thai Police.

If you go to the airport without problems you should be fine in most cases as you pay the fine and you are on your way.

But if the police stop you during the overstay period and they are checking your status you WILL be arrested and deported.

I saw this many times happening and helped personally some of them with getting them flight tickets back home so they could be released from jail and put on the plane.

I have once already written a post about it. That it's taken seriously by police is no doubt if there are reasons for such a check, e.g. misconduct, bad attitude towards authorities, lack of money, illegal actions, unwanted ethnicity or corrupt officials. This seems to be true with all cases that I've read so far about.

I usually tend to be well dressed and courteous to the authorities around me and had no problems at all so far; police officers who I came in contact with were very courteous, even though they were checking the cab for drugs.

There is a chance of it happening, but it's not as serious as generally assumed from my experience and also from people I've met in similar situations. The case that you mention sterns from lack of funds.

Let me make it clear, it's not an optimal solution by far, but it's not as dangerous as pointed out if you know what you're doing! I fixed my current overstay in the immigration bureau, not at the airport. Had a good Thai speaker with me, who it seems I wouldn't have even needed. It was a strictly professional exchange of money without any further repercussions.

Just like some people on this board

Yes you can and always could. I had 1 for 2 years, not only i did not have to leave the country to get one, but did not have to report every 90 days either.

the no reporting option was 5000 baht (extra)difference in price.

Thank you for your comment. This further confirms that it's not necessary to get out of the country to convert a tourist visa to an education visa.

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[disagree]

Very interesting. An article from 21st August 2009 confirms that this is not hogwash. It highlights the difficulty of course and must be taken with a grain of salt due to the advertisement of the legal firm itself:

Visa status conversion can be a somewhat difficult process within the Kingdom. There is always the option of going abroad, obtaining a new visa, and reentering under a different immigration classification, but for those who do not wish to leave the country, this option may be unacceptable. When changing categories in the Kingdom, the general rule is that the applicant for change of status must have at least 21 days of validity left on their current Thai immigration stamp.

Changing status from one category to another can be more difficult depending upon the original category. Generally, the Royal Thai Immigration Police do not prefer to change an applicant’s status from visa exemption to a proper category. In these situations, they prefer that the applicant depart the country, obtain a proper visa, and return for a Thai visa extension at a later date. That being said, conversion from an exemption to a visa category can be achieved, but conversion is done at the discretion of the Royal Thai immigration officer.

From http://integrity-leg...om-of-thailand/

Edited November 10, 2012 by disagree

[lemoncake]

incorrect, for 35000-45000 (depending on the law firm or friends you use), one can be issued in Thailand without having to leave the country or provide anything but your passport

That might be the case but exactly how valid are these? My local immigration office will do likewise for a large fee, but this is contrary to their own regulations and an individual would be leaving themselves open to potential problems down the line. I'd say it's a gamble and for that sum of money would rather have a couple of days in KL or wherever, and get a real ED visa there.

Just as valid as any other visa, as it is issued by immigration with an official immigration stamp and receipt. While during the check at some point, immigration can see the irregularity, i have serious doubts they would bring it up as they are well aware, this visa made a nice donation to the captain of issuing office

[ignis]

So just maybe this all makes seance now.......

Well over a year ago now went to Laos and got a ED Visa, with extension renewalable every 90 days at Immigration, on Visiting my Immigration the Officer said there would have been no need to go to Laos......... she said had the school issued a paper to Immigration NOT a Thai Embassy then a conversion from any type of Visa would have been 2,000 baht + 1,900 baht from the ED stamp extension.. The Officer has been there for years, so should know what she is talking about..

She also stated that this type of conversion can only be done at Chaeng Watthana, but that after this 1st conversion, the the next 90 days can be done at the local office..

I had no idea, and of course was to late anyway, never gave it another thought until this post.......... So them it appears this is possible ? and no large fees

Edited November 10, 2012 by ignis

[Maestro]

As mentioned before, an ED visa can not be issued inside Thailand and the initial ED visa has to obtained at an Thai embassy / Consulate.Only extensions can be done inside Thailand...

Immigration offices can issue a single-entry non-ED visa in the course of a change of visa preparatory to a one-year extension of stay if the applicant qualifies for such extension. Generally, immigration offices do not do this for study at a private Thai language school but there were reports by members that an immigration office in the South of Thailand did it. Later, there were reports that this immigration office would change policy and no longer do it.

If Chaeng Wattana now does it as a matter of policy, this is a welcome change and I hope that members who get such change of visa and extension of stay will report it in this forum for confirmation. Until this happens, it remains a rumour and hearsay.

[Proctor]

I got bored of reading all the lengthy replies to this topic but I thought I'd add my own anyway in case Disagree still disagrees.

I tried to do this exact same thing 3 months ago. Had all the paper work and approval from the MOE for a non-ed visa. I still had a little time left on my double entry tourist though and because I was completely misinformed by the immigration officers and documentation at Chaeng Watthana I insisted to the language school that we do the switch in Bangkok, as I was not keen to leave Thailand. They were surprised, and said that it would not be possible. I still argued and we eventually attempted the switch in Bangkok anyway.

The truth is this... The approval letter for the visa, given to you by the MOE will be addressed to someone. For Thai language courses it will be addressed to a Thai Embassy, for permanent study at a university (eg. Chula or Mahidol) it will be addressed to Thai immigration. Hence, there are different types or standards of non-ed visas, I also believe the one for permanent study (attained only from a recognised university) is valid for 1 year where as the one for the learning Thai is valid for 3 months, however 3 month extensions can be done.

When I went to immigration at Chaeng Watthana I was accompanied by a very pretty Thai lady and we were met by a very not so pretty Thai male immigration officer. He explained the address problem to us and said that he had never processed a new non-ed visa for a farang wanting to learn Thai, he had only processed the extensions. After pleading with him (the Thai lady doing most of the pleading) in the most seductive voice possible, we were still turned away. He said "sorry, the letter or visa approval is not even addressed to the immigration office so I cannot help you." He was actually almost laughing a little bit, like a sympathy laugh.

I was left sad and angry that day because the information that had previously been given to me at immigration was misleading.

2 weeks later I processed the visa in Penang, Malaysia without any problem at all. A fun visa run it was.

So dude, if you're gonna insist on this switch in Bangkok, good luck, but I believe that your mate is no where near as charming as you think and that your fate is determined before the immigration visit. The letter of approval that the MOE gives you is key. Perhaps speak to the ladies in that office.

Cheers.

[disagree]

The truth is this... The approval letter for the visa, given to you by the MOE will be addressed to someone. For Thai language courses it will be addressed to a Thai Embassy, for permanent study at a university (eg. Chula or Mahidol) it will be addressed to Thai immigration.

When I went to immigration at Chaeng Watthana I was accompanied by a very pretty Thai lady and we were met by a very not so pretty Thai male immigration officer. He explained the address problem to us and said that he had never processed a new non-ed visa for a farang wanting to learn Thai, he had only processed the extensions. After pleading with him (the Thai lady doing most of the pleading) in the most seductive voice possible, we were still turned away. He said "sorry, the letter or visa approval is not even addressed to the immigration office so I cannot help you." He was actually almost laughing a little bit, like a sympathy laugh.

So dude, if you're gonna insist on this switch in Bangkok, good luck, but I believe that your mate is no where near as charming as you think and that your fate is determined before the immigration visit. The letter of approval that the MOE gives you is key. Perhaps speak to the ladies in that office.

The charm part was not related to the information received, but rather to the genuinity and that bribing was not any part in the conversation. Hence I will have to disagree with you on this part, as he was extremely well received by everyone(!) we encountered, so the immigration workers were very forth-coming and happy to help.

My job was to keep my mouth shut, his job was to chit chat about all kind of stuff with the workers from topics such as the taste of the smoothie they drank until their long commuting hours from their homes in Sathorn - and it worked flawlessly. But I am not here to promote my friend; I'm rather here to find out what it takes to not do a visa run when attempting the ED switch.

So I can agree on the letter part, and thank you for sharing that information with us - as this seems to be a key puzzle element. I assume that if this letter would be addressed to the appropriate authority ( the immigration office, as opposed to 'any thai embassy' ), that would help with obtaining the visa without a run. Now the question would be if that is part of the documents that the Thai Language schools send out to the Ministry of Education, or if it's the MoE who decide that themselves.

Edited November 11, 2012 by disagree

[lopburi3]

Off-topic post removed.

[TCA]

incorrect, for 35000-45000 (depending on the law firm or friends you use), one can be issued in Thailand without having to leave the country or provide anything but your passport

That might be the case but exactly how valid are these? My local immigration office will do likewise for a large fee, but this is contrary to their own regulations and an individual would be leaving themselves open to potential problems down the line. I'd say it's a gamble and for that sum of money would rather have a couple of days in KL or wherever, and get a real ED visa there.

Just as valid as any other visa, as it is issued by immigration with an official immigration stamp and receipt. While during the check at some point, immigration can see the irregularity, i have serious doubts they would bring it up as they are well aware, this visa made a nice donation to the captain of issuing office

My cynical nature would think that in the situation you mentioned, you'd be more likely to get tapped for another donation.

And of course if you're calling it a donation then you know it's not strictly legal. 35,000-45,000 baht is obviously not the price for visa purchase.

Would love this to be genuine but it still all sounds at the whim of certain immigration offices.The post by ignis saying 2,000 baht and only possible at Chang Wattana immigration would seem far more plausible.

Edited November 11, 2012 by TCA

[TCA]

Now the question would be if that is part of the documents that the Thai Language schools send out to the Ministry of Education, or if it's the MoE who decide that themselves.

Normally the student supplies the embassy/consulate details to the language school and this is used by the MoE in the resulting paperwork. If it could even be confirmed that Chang Wattana immigration's details could be substituted then this would be welcome news indeed.

Edited November 11, 2012 by TCA

[lemoncake]

incorrect, for 35000-45000 (depending on the law firm or friends you use), one can be issued in Thailand without having to leave the country or provide anything but your passport

That might be the case but exactly how valid are these? My local immigration office will do likewise for a large fee, but this is contrary to their own regulations and an individual would be leaving themselves open to potential problems down the line. I'd say it's a gamble and for that sum of money would rather have a couple of days in KL or wherever, and get a real ED visa there.

Just as valid as any other visa, as it is issued by immigration with an official immigration stamp and receipt. While during the check at some point, immigration can see the irregularity, i have serious doubts they would bring it up as they are well aware, this visa made a nice donation to the captain of issuing office

My cynical nature would think that in the situation you mentioned, you'd be more likely to get tapped for another donation.

And of course if you're calling it a donation then you know it's not strictly legal. 35,000-45,000 baht is obviously not the price for visa purchase.

Would love this to be genuine but it still all sounds at the whim of certain immigration offices.The post by ignis saying 2,000 baht and only possible at Chang Wattana immigration would seem far more plausible.

It is your prerogative to believe whatever you like. No you do not get hit for any donations and yes it is strictly legal because you have a visa stamp from immigration not from somtam lady

the 35000-45000 is the fee charged by the law firm, how they distribute the funds is their business.

and both of mine were issued at Chonburi immigration so it seems your assumption is also incorrect.

[Maestro]

...

and both of mine were issued at Chonburi immigration so it seems your assumption is also incorrect.

In your case of changing from a tourist visa to a non-ED visa, to whom was the letter from the Ministry of Education addressed?

[lemoncake]

...

and both of mine were issued at Chonburi immigration so it seems your assumption is also incorrect.

In your case of changing from a tourist visa to a non-ED visa, to whom was the letter from the Ministry of Education addressed?

never went to school or received any letters. in both cases only handed over my passport and money to the law firm - 7 days later had the visa, HOWEVER, not sure if it makes any difference, i was not changing from tourist but from non B

Edited November 11, 2012 by lemoncake

[TCA]

Would love this to be genuine but it still all sounds at the whim of certain immigration offices.The post by ignis saying 2,000 baht and only possible at Chang Wattana immigration would seem far more plausible.

It is your prerogative to believe whatever you like. No you do not get hit for any donations and yes it is strictly legal because you have a visa stamp from immigration not from somtam lady

the 35000-45000 is the fee charged by the law firm, how they distribute the funds is their business.

and both of mine were issued at Chonburi immigration so it seems your assumption is also incorrect.

never went to school or received any letters. in both cases only handed over my passport and money to the law firm - 7 days later had the visa, HOWEVER, not sure if it makes any difference, i was not changing from tourist but from non B

I haven't made any assumptions. I'm not disputing the fact that you can get a visa stamp from immigration for a certain fee (I also said my local immigration would do likewise), I'm saying it's highly dubious as to the legality of it. Just because yourself or a law firm has paid money to an immigration officer to stamp your passport (and you have a receipt for it), does not mean everything is necessarily above board and legit. Or do corruption and backhanders not exist in Chonburi?

You may never have been pulled up for it, but in Thailand it would hardly be the most surprising thing if it was to happen. Maybe not likely but I doubt impossible. And the fact that you had an ED visa and never went to school at all, would hardly be great for your defence. If you're aware of all this then fine, you took a gamble and won, but let's not pretend there's no risk involved.

I made reference to the main immigration office in Bangkok because ignis stated that they were putting this into practice for a nominal fee of 2,000 baht and it could only been done there at Chang Wattana. So given that this is not recognised practice for ED visas for language schools, I thought perhaps we could infer some legitimacy from this. And maybe not.

So well done to you, but nobody is saying that it's not possible. The question is whether this is now done according to the regulations. If you think it's all good, why would you pay a law firm 35,000-45,000 baht for a visa that costs about 2,500 baht?

[ignis]

I made reference to the main immigration office in Bangkok because ignis stated that they were putting this into practice for a nominal fee of 2,000 baht and it could only been done there at Chang Wattana. So given that this is not recognised practice for ED visas for language schools, I thought perhaps we could infer some legitimacy from this. And maybe not

Just to be clear I did not say that, the Lady Officer at my Immigration Office said that...

No idea if it makes any difference or not, before the 'ED' Visa I was on a 1 year Non '0'

.

[lopburi3]

The whole point of this thread is change to a non immigrant visa inside Thailand - there is no issue of obtaining extensions of stay if you qualify from a non immigrant visa (that is the basic requirement for most) but this has been about getting that non immigrant visa while in Thailand. That happens routinely for retirement and a bit less so for Thai wife.

[lemoncake]

Would love this to be genuine but it still all sounds at the whim of certain immigration offices.The post by ignis saying 2,000 baht and only possible at Chang Wattana immigration would seem far more plausible.

It is your prerogative to believe whatever you like. No you do not get hit for any donations and yes it is strictly legal because you have a visa stamp from immigration not from somtam lady

the 35000-45000 is the fee charged by the law firm, how they distribute the funds is their business.

and both of mine were issued at Chonburi immigration so it seems your assumption is also incorrect.

never went to school or received any letters. in both cases only handed over my passport and money to the law firm - 7 days later had the visa, HOWEVER, not sure if it makes any difference, i was not changing from tourist but from non B

So well done to you, but nobody is saying that it's not possible. The question is whether this is now done according to the regulations. If you think it's all good, why would you pay a law firm 35,000-45,000 baht for a visa that costs about 2,500 baht?

This stamp is just as legal as any other stamps obtained anywhere else, your paranoia is just that a paranoia.

180 hours of school is 24 000(minimum) flight to Oz is another 20000, plus all other expenses.

So to answer your question why i paid 35000-45000

1. Because it would have been same if not more having to fly out and attend school

2. It was far more convenient and time saving

3.Was 100% hassle free, just to give my passport and pick it up 7 days later and not have to worry about anything else, including 90 day reporting.