No Travel Insurance Proves Costly For British Tourist

[NamKangMan]

It's really pretty simple. When a bank has been around for 150 years or so they have seen it all including those iconoclasts who felt much as you and got stung. The insurance companies I'm sure will survive even with those that feel they are ahead of the game avoiding their clutches evil or otherwise.

Lloyd's has been around for about 350 years and I'm sure in their early days they saw the odd few ship owners who didn't feel the need to spend any time in the coffee shop.

So I'm relaxed about all this as well.

Perhaps you can explain to us how health.travel Insurance companies manage to stay in business, I mean, you seem to think that everyone should buy health insurance so that must surely mean that lots of people are getting sick and claiming on these policies otherwise there would be no need to buy it in the first place? That being the case and the insurance companies are paying all these large hospital bills, surely that means the business they are in is not very profitable, no?

Health insurance is a prime example for what insurance is meant to be: small risk, but if you're unlucky enough a big financial risk. So big that most people can not carry the risk themselves. The same e.g. with house insurance: originally meant to insure against a catastrophical risk, e.g. fire that destroys the house. With travel insurance it is meant to cover expatriation or major health problems overseas, The add ons like luggage insurance are really not important, most people can carryu the risk of some lost clothes themselves. But most people don't have the finances to carry a risk like having their house destroyed, getting sick abroad and needing lengthy hospital treatment plus expatriation or a serious accident themselves, therefor need insurance.

This sums it up perfectly.

Insurance is a necessary evil. We don't like paying it - but if/when we need it, we are happy we did pay it. I view insurance as just another bill, or tax to pay.

I've mentioned in other threads, it's amazes me the amount of ageing expats that make sure their car is insured, but not their health.

What's your average Japanese small car worth in Thailand, maybe 650,000 baht. The hospital is charging the guy in the OP over 100,000 baht a day. The value of the car that most expats insure, is the equivalent to only 6 days in an intensive care hospital, and that's not taking into account any ongoing medical treatment as a result of the injury/illness.

Edited January 30, 2013 by NamKangMan

[renrut salohcin]

It's really pretty simple. When a bank has been around for 150 years or so they have seen it all including those iconoclasts who felt much as you and got stung. The insurance companies I'm sure will survive even with those that feel they are ahead of the game avoiding their clutches evil or otherwise.

Lloyd's has been around for about 350 years and I'm sure in their early days they saw the odd few ship owners who didn't feel the need to spend any time in the coffee shop.

So I'm relaxed about all this as well.

Perhaps you can explain to us how health.travel Insurance companies manage to stay in business, I mean, you seem to think that everyone should buy health insurance so that must surely mean that lots of people are getting sick and claiming on these policies otherwise there would be no need to buy it in the first place? That being the case and the insurance companies are paying all these large hospital bills, surely that means the business they are in is not very profitable, no?

You're misuderstanding it Chiang Mai. Insurance is a very profitable business because most of the insured don't need to make a claim.

People don't take out insurance because they are sick and need to make a claim (those people don't get offered insurance unless the premium is high), insurance is bought as a safeguard just in case it's needed, and in most cases it's not. That's one of the reasons insurance companies make nice profits

[chiang mai]

It's really pretty simple. When a bank has been around for 150 years or so they have seen it all including those iconoclasts who felt much as you and got stung. The insurance companies I'm sure will survive even with those that feel they are ahead of the game avoiding their clutches evil or otherwise.

Lloyd's has been around for about 350 years and I'm sure in their early days they saw the odd few ship owners who didn't feel the need to spend any time in the coffee shop.

So I'm relaxed about all this as well.

Perhaps you can explain to us how health.travel Insurance companies manage to stay in business, I mean, you seem to think that everyone should buy health insurance so that must surely mean that lots of people are getting sick and claiming on these policies otherwise there would be no need to buy it in the first place? That being the case and the insurance companies are paying all these large hospital bills, surely that means the business they are in is not very profitable, no?

You're misuderstanding it Chiang Mai. Insurance is a very profitable business because most of the insured don't need to make a claim.

People don't take out insurance because they are sick and need to make a claim (those people don't get offered insurance unless the premium is high), insurance is bought as a safeguard just in case it's needed, and in most cases it's not. That's one of the reasons insurance companies make nice profits

Exactly, I rest my case.

[JLCrab]

You haven't made any case. You just say in the past you have as it turns out NOT been one of the persons that has needed it and you expect for the next 20 or 30 or whatever remaining years of your life such will remain the case.

For someone who would be almost certainly ineligible to buy insurance today based on prior medical history, this is all moot point anyway.

Edited January 30, 2013 by JLCrab

[chiang mai]

This is almost a circular disucssion with you, you fail to acknowlege that I chose not to buy insurance, that I made substantial savings as a result, that the industry is predecated on fear, that there are alternatives, here, read this:

http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/truth-about-health-insurance-premiums-profits

And I expect no such thing for the next 20 or 30 30 years, I have my fall back positions of 1) using accumulated wealth to pay cash, 2) return to the UK to use the free NHS, 3) return to the US to use Medicare, plenty of optioon there to avoid paying premiums.

Finally, whilst you may wish to personalise these arguments I prefer to deal with them purely as a debate, that I may or may not be able to buy insurance is neither here nor there since the debate is about the merits of buying insurance, not the merits of can Chiang Mai buy insurance or not and should he have in the past!!!

[JLCrab]

As a debate you started off as a premise (on another topic) that by not purchasing insurance you are way ahead of the game and that you intend to stay that way. I said in this post that there advantages to having Thai insurance while living permanently in Thailand that even having ample cash reserves and alternative coverages in the USA or UK cannot provide.

You seem to regard these intangible benefits as meaningless such as not having to fly half-way around the world in a weakened condition for treatment.. It is not all about cash flow regardless of how you might choose to think.

As for the merits of buying insurance, anyone living here in Thailand should buy it here in Thailand while the medical insurance underwriters are happy to have you. Once anyone loses that opportunity, their choices are become null.

Edited January 30, 2013 by JLCrab

[MAJIC]

There may be reasosn why he didn't get insurance - he may have a medical condition that makes it hard to get coverage. When my mother comes to visit she doesn't always get cover simply because she can't. Sometimes the company will allow it (it is often a lot of money several hundred pounds) sometimes the same company says 'no'. The goal posts shift all the time and the "yes"/"No" comes from the computer ("Computer says 'no'!") so no argueing. She can no longer get annual travel insurance at all - and when she can get individual trip insurance it is so restrictive that it is pointless anyway (and expensive). This is simply because she had a blood clot that cost her a lung ten years ago (was mis-diagnossed as asthma!) and now is on blood thinners for life. She takes her tablets and doesn't go jogging then she's fine - in fact probably safer than most of us on long distance flights - deep vein thrombosis and all that!

At the prices of care here it is often just as good to risk it (she has lots of tests throughout the year - so major stuff like needing bypass surgery etc would show well before coming anyway) - its cheaper than her buying insurance.

The cost for 2,300baht (fifty quid) or so for intemsive care is very low - in the UK an intensive care bed costs hundreds each day.

2300 GBP a day not Baht!

Ah OK - that's a bit different (note to self - RTFM)

It shook me too!

[qdinthailand]

He is a lightweight next to an american.

But still a Muppet for no insurance

Excuse me but there are thinnies and fattys from every country sir.

I bought some 'travel insurance' upon departing the U.S. for a multi-year motorcycle trip - from North America to South America, Africa, Middle East, Europe. No pre-existing conditions. But when I truthfully answered about family history (a grandmother with diabetes, father had cancer) and truthfully stated that I was 240 lbs, the price then quoted wasn't the 'promotional rate' as shown online, but 50% higher in the email received back after submitting my application. The quoted price went from something like $1400 to $2200 for the annual policy with limits of $100,000 per incident , 1/2 million lifetime with a $500 annual deductible.

Trying again, I lied the 2nd time and took out an annual policy, renewed 2 more times, for the roughly $1400 price, which rose to nearly $1700 by the 3rd year. But...I never was quite sure if it would cover me in a motorbike accident. I was traveling by motorbike, same as you would travel by car - not going to foreign countries and renting a motorbike like you would do for 'fun'.

And as I realized, if I ever did file a claim for serious damages, they may have found out that I had lied about my actual weight to get the lower premium and denied all claims, not to mention what would happen should the claim be the result of a motorbike crash.

As it turned out, in the 4+ years of travel, I never had bills in any year totaling more than the $500 deductible - just some malaria and deworming in Guatemala, some dental work in Colombia, a checkup in South Africa for 'loss of appetite' issue, flu in Tanzania, not malaria!

Anyway - don't go by what the 'teaser' rates are online. In reality, when you submit your details for an actual quote, the price is likely to come back much higher - especially if you tell the truth about age, pre-existing conditions, your weight, your family history (who doesn't have diabetes or cancer in their family history back to their grandparents?).

Look up Nomad travel insurance.

You can't get Nomad travel insurance for that duration of time.

[SouthernMan3]

He is a lightweight next to an american.

But still a Muppet for no insurance

Excuse me but there are thinnies and fattys from every country sir.

I bought some 'travel insurance' upon departing the U.S. for a multi-year motorcycle trip - from North America to South America, Africa, Middle East, Europe. No pre-existing conditions. But when I truthfully answered about family history (a grandmother with diabetes, father had cancer) and truthfully stated that I was 240 lbs, the price then quoted wasn't the 'promotional rate' as shown online, but 50% higher in the email received back after submitting my application. The quoted price went from something like $1400 to $2200 for the annual policy with limits of $100,000 per incident , 1/2 million lifetime with a $500 annual deductible.

Trying again, I lied the 2nd time and took out an annual policy, renewed 2 more times, for the roughly $1400 price, which rose to nearly $1700 by the 3rd year. But...I never was quite sure if it would cover me in a motorbike accident. I was traveling by motorbike, same as you would travel by car - not going to foreign countries and renting a motorbike like you would do for 'fun'.

And as I realized, if I ever did file a claim for serious damages, they may have found out that I had lied about my actual weight to get the lower premium and denied all claims, not to mention what would happen should the claim be the result of a motorbike crash.

As it turned out, in the 4+ years of travel, I never had bills in any year totaling more than the $500 deductible - just some malaria and deworming in Guatemala, some dental work in Colombia, a checkup in South Africa for 'loss of appetite' issue, flu in Tanzania, not malaria!

Anyway - don't go by what the 'teaser' rates are online. In reality, when you submit your details for an actual quote, the price is likely to come back much higher - especially if you tell the truth about age, pre-existing conditions, your weight, your family history (who doesn't have diabetes or cancer in their family history back to their grandparents?).

Look up Nomad travel insurance.

You can't get Nomad travel insurance for that duration of time.

You can if you pay taxes in your home country and are therefore a resident.

[vijer]

I'm 50 & as far as I can see I can't get insurance for the big things at all, ie. over 200000 bhts of problems without having to get a policy that includes all the small things & then they hit you for 5500 bhts a month at least, which is outrageous, dunno what the solution to this is, but as a reasonably healthy 50 year old without a lot of financial backing I can't afford to get insured... If anyone knows of a sensible policy that would cover me only for the big risks I'd be delighted to see it....

Try BUPA Thailand.

http://www.bupathailand.com/

Based on the details on BUPA's website, you aren't covered very well. The best policy is cheap, 8,571 baht per year, but it only covers 50,000 per illness, with an aggregate yearly payment of 600,000. Sounds like you're paying if it is something serious like a heart attack. It is a Thai website so the design is crap and maybe out of date and translated poorly, the Grammar is bad on the site, and it doesn't even say if the price displayed is for foreigners.

But hey if you have a heart attack you will probably worry about the bill later.

[normac44]

Most travel agents here in Australia will always advise travel insurance. Their motto is "if you can afford the trip , you can afford the insurance". Couple of years ago a friend(72 yr old) with me in bangkok had a fall in the shower. Ended up in Bumrumgrad Hospital in bangkok for 25 days with a fractured spine.No Travel insurance. Cost him his entire life savings and some.Repat back to Melbourne was $35,000 which had to be paid up front. It was cheaper for him to stay in Hosp.

By the way that Hospital is like a 5 star Hotel. Just yesterday our newspapers were full of Thailand. The most dangerous place on earth for Australians to travel to. One Australian dies there every 4 days(Newspaper Quote.)

[NamKangMan]

He is a lightweight next to an american.

But still a Muppet for no insurance

Excuse me but there are thinnies and fattys from every country sir.

I bought some 'travel insurance' upon departing the U.S. for a multi-year motorcycle trip - from North America to South America, Africa, Middle East, Europe. No pre-existing conditions. But when I truthfully answered about family history (a grandmother with diabetes, father had cancer) and truthfully stated that I was 240 lbs, the price then quoted wasn't the 'promotional rate' as shown online, but 50% higher in the email received back after submitting my application. The quoted price went from something like $1400 to $2200 for the annual policy with limits of $100,000 per incident , 1/2 million lifetime with a $500 annual deductible.

Trying again, I lied the 2nd time and took out an annual policy, renewed 2 more times, for the roughly $1400 price, which rose to nearly $1700 by the 3rd year. But...I never was quite sure if it would cover me in a motorbike accident. I was traveling by motorbike, same as you would travel by car - not going to foreign countries and renting a motorbike like you would do for 'fun'.

And as I realized, if I ever did file a claim for serious damages, they may have found out that I had lied about my actual weight to get the lower premium and denied all claims, not to mention what would happen should the claim be the result of a motorbike crash.

As it turned out, in the 4+ years of travel, I never had bills in any year totaling more than the $500 deductible - just some malaria and deworming in Guatemala, some dental work in Colombia, a checkup in South Africa for 'loss of appetite' issue, flu in Tanzania, not malaria!

Anyway - don't go by what the 'teaser' rates are online. In reality, when you submit your details for an actual quote, the price is likely to come back much higher - especially if you tell the truth about age, pre-existing conditions, your weight, your family history (who doesn't have diabetes or cancer in their family history back to their grandparents?).

Look up Nomad travel insurance.

You can't get Nomad travel insurance for that duration of time.

I just looked at the Nomad insurance website. You can get a 18 month policy.

Edited January 31, 2013 by NamKangMan

[SouthernMan3]

"You can't get Nomad travel insurance for that duration of time.

I just looked at the Nomad insurance website. You can get a 18 month policy."

And then another one, etc........

[stoli]

Poor bugger, gotta feel sorry for him. Its such a cheap outlay to get travel insurance, perfect example of expect the unexpected I suppose. Hope we get to hear how much it ends up costing him but hes probably just happy to be alive!

Why did they tie him to the bed?...So he cant leave without paying the bill?

When I had a heart bypass at Bangkok Heart Hospital, they also had me tied to the bed when I came out of surgery. In my case, they did not want me moving around much due to my rib cage being broken to get to the heart. Might have something to do with stabilizing the heart.

[stevenl]

it doesn't even say if the price displayed is for foreigners.

And why would a foreigner pay a different price from a Thai for the same coverage? Remember this is health insurance you're talking about, not travel insurance, which is what this topic is about BTW.

[vijer]

it doesn't even say if the price displayed is for foreigners.

And why would a foreigner pay a different price from a Thai for the same coverage? Remember this is health insurance you're talking about, not travel insurance, which is what this topic is about BTW.

Why do old fat people that drink and smoke pay more for health insurance? So maybe foreigners are subject to higher premiums.

[stevenl]

it doesn't even say if the price displayed is for foreigners.

And why would a foreigner pay a different price from a Thai for the same coverage? Remember this is health insurance you're talking about, not travel insurance, which is what this topic is about BTW.

Why do old fat people that drink and smoke pay more for health insurance? So maybe foreigners are subject to higher premiums.

You have no idea what you're talking about here.

[heazille]

I do wonder what cover other young Brits who live long term in Thailand without working here have and how much it costs?

I wonder that because I should probably get it too...

30 year old living here, $575 a year

Everybody should have cover living here, those that say " i'll just fly home" are living in a dream world.

R

[hawker9000]

Travel insurance is by no means a no-brainer. Lots of ripoffs out there, and lots of issues with Thai hospitals, which vary greatly in their willingness to accept the insurance up-front (vs your having to pay 1st out-of-pocket and then seek reimbursement, which is ANOTHER furball). It's most certainly a good idea, but you have to do your homework, and not rely on a few positive or negative anecdotes from bloggers & even friends. After you navigate the insurance maze, THEN you have to decide what hosital to use. They also vary greatly in terms of quality of care and COST for substantially the same level of care, drugs, procedures, etc. Again, you can't escape having to DO your homework if you expect any real security, in Thailand anyway.