Why is Google translate Thai-English so incredibly bad?

[kriswillems]

Another thing. In Thai the subjects are often not written. So to translate the text you need to deeply understand the whole story. Computers are not at this level yet. For this reason, it is even for a human translator very difficult to translate an extract from a bigger Thai text.

Edited September 5, 2013 by kriswillems

[ozzibitch]

Strewth!

[RamblingSam]

Thailand is one of those countries which (as many Thais will proudly point out) wasn't/hasn't been 'colonised' by for instance, the British or French. It's written language does not use the alphabet, but 'symbols' which differ from others around it, Most of these 'symbols' have multiple meanings and trying to 'fit' the sentence structure 'we' use which comes with the alphabet, is not easy. I'm reminded of one example when one of the Kings of Thailand attended a very important international meeting around WW1, and was shocked to discover that 'falangs' thought that the Thai national flag has a mouse, rather than an elephant on it! The flag was then promptly changed to what it is now. If historically, only that far back, you can get misunderstandings as basic as that, it's I suppose not surprising that there aren't any decent language translators available!

[jayceenik]

I have used the English to Thai Google translate when I was writing email letters to ThaiLoveLinks ladies.

Not bad, very usable and, fortunately, I read Thai so I was able to correct the meaning/words mistakes before emailing them.

A couple days ago I translated a UK mailonline article in French to email to a French friend.

It came out mostly intelligible but not very good.

I don't know what sort of Ubon Isaan Thai my present Pattaya TGF uses when not with me but I often can't make sense of what she writes on her facebook and neither can Google translate !!

Here is one of her fb postings today in "Thai" (?) :

อีควายมึงจะคุยหาพ่อหาแม่มึงอะไรนักหนากูจะนอนอีสัสมึงรู้จักปะความเกรงใจปะอีเหี้ย

and here is what Google translate gives me :

Easy to talk to his mother buffalo U U E week's What's So I'm going to bed as the cover art, e damn rude.

[Torrens54]

I would pose the question the exact opposite way around: "Why does Google translate does as good a job as it does do under the circumstances?" What are the circumstances?

First Google uses the methodology called "statistical machine-translation". The following is from WIkipedia:

"Google Translate is a free, multilingual statistical machine-translation service provided by Google Inc. to translate written text from one language into another."

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Translate and the section called "Translation Methodology". The statistical method is explained as follows: "According to Och, a solid base for developing a usable statistical machine translation system for a new pair of languages from scratch would consist of a bilingual text corpus (or parallel collection) of more than a million words, and two monolingual corpora each of more than a billion words.^[27] Statistical models from these data are then used to translate between those languages."

Google's difficulties are summarized, "Google Translate, like other automatic translation tools, has its limitations. While it can help the reader to understand the general content of a foreign language text, it does not always deliver accurate translations. Some languages produce better results than others. Google Translate performs well especially when English is the target language and the source language is one of the languages of the European Union. Results of analyses were reported in 2010, showing that French to English translation is relatively accurate^[9] and 2011 and 2012 showing that Italian to English translation is relatively accurate as well.^[10][11] However, rule-based machine translations perform better if the text to be translated is shorter; this effect is particularly evident in Chinese to English translations.^[9]"

English-Spanish-English has a huge database of translated material from which to draw statistical inferences; the amount of Thai-English-Thai material available in the Google database is necessarily much more limited. This limitation means that accuracy necessarily suffers.

Howcome it is self-imposed on us? I didn't ask Google to translate anything but it keeps showing up everytime I respond to anything on Facebook.

Google Translate is a heap of rubbish. Any idea how I can rid my computer of this pesky intrusion?

[Fookhaht]

Thailand is one of those countries which (as many Thais will proudly point out) wasn't/hasn't been 'colonised' by for instance, the British or French. It's written language does not use the alphabet, but 'symbols' which differ from others around it, Most of these 'symbols' have multiple meanings and trying to 'fit' the sentence structure 'we' use which comes with the alphabet, is not easy.

RamblindSam does ramble, indeed. TV is really a hub of misinformation more often than we should be comfortable with.

The poster is describing a logographic script (such as Egyptian hieroglyphs or Chinese characters). Each symbol represents a meaning.

Thai script IS INDEED, AN ALPHABET, like western alphabets, in that each character/symbol represents a phonetic sound, NOT A MEANING.

Edited September 5, 2013 by Fookhaht

[DGIE]

It is because the translations in google are just contributions from people.

People translate per words.

Phrase consists of some words that when said, they have different

meaning from that translated word by word.

when translated word by word it will become wrong.

[RickBradford]

Strewth!

Nope, Google Translate couldn't do anything with that, either.

[ripper15]

Would someone tell me what is the most authoritative and complete Thai to English, hard copy dictionary that is available? Looking for a high quality academic tome. Is there any chance that it may work as well with formal Thai vs street or everyday Thai? Is there a slang reference available, such as the urban dictionary in the US.

[Fookhaht]

It is because the translations in google are just contributions from people.

People translate per words.

Phrase consists of some words that when said, they have different

meaning from that translated word by word.

when translated word by word it will become wrong.

Each workday, I get about 5-7 broadcast emails in Thai from my work colleagues. Of course, I have to use Google Translate to get through them. The funniest results are the translations of some Thai names by Google. I usually snicker and chuckle all the way through most emails, but sometimes entirely lose it when I get to their name at the bottom of the message. It comes out with things like....

"Miss America Too"

"Toxic Use"

"Buxom glory"

Yes, I do get strange looks when I burst out laughing at my desk.

Edited September 5, 2013 by Fookhaht

[rijb]

I would pose the question the exact opposite way around: "Why does Google translate does as good a job as it does do under the circumstances?" What are the circumstances?

First Google uses the methodology called "statistical machine-translation". The following is from WIkipedia:

"Google Translate is a free, multilingual statistical machine-translation service provided by Google Inc. to translate written text from one language into another."

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Translate and the section called "Translation Methodology". The statistical method is explained as follows: "According to Och, a solid base for developing a usable statistical machine translation system for a new pair of languages from scratch would consist of a bilingual text corpus (or parallel collection) of more than a million words, and two monolingual corpora each of more than a billion words.^[27] Statistical models from these data are then used to translate between those languages."

Google's difficulties are summarized, "Google Translate, like other automatic translation tools, has its limitations. While it can help the reader to understand the general content of a foreign language text, it does not always deliver accurate translations. Some languages produce better results than others. Google Translate performs well especially when English is the target language and the source language is one of the languages of the European Union. Results of analyses were reported in 2010, showing that French to English translation is relatively accurate^[9] and 2011 and 2012 showing that Italian to English translation is relatively accurate as well.^[10][11] However, rule-based machine translations perform better if the text to be translated is shorter; this effect is particularly evident in Chinese to English translations.^[9]"

English-Spanish-English has a huge database of translated material from which to draw statistical inferences; the amount of Thai-English-Thai material available in the Google database is necessarily much more limited. This limitation means that accuracy necessarily suffers.

Howcome it is self-imposed on us? I didn't ask Google to translate anything but it keeps showing up everytime I respond to anything on Facebook.

Google Translate is a heap of rubbish. Any idea how I can rid my computer of this pesky intrusion?

Interesting. You're smart enough to determine that "Google Translate is a heap of rubbish". But, you're not smart enough to turn it off...

[BruceSmith]

Learn how to use it properly and it is fine.

A bad workman blames his tools.

I agree,

could it be because a good workman chooses good tools?

BS

[Traveling Sailor]

Well, in a forum where 90% don't know the difference between there and their

you cant have much hope,right?

Ditto for "TWO", "TOO" and "TO"!

[andrewrooney]

I have used the English to Thai Google translate when I was writing email letters to ThaiLoveLinks ladies.

Not bad, very usable and, fortunately, I read Thai so I was able to correct the meaning/words mistakes before emailing them.

A couple days ago I translated a UK mailonline article in French to email to a French friend.

It came out mostly intelligible but not very good.

I don't know what sort of Ubon Isaan Thai my present Pattaya TGF uses when not with me but I often can't make sense of what she writes on her facebook and neither can Google translate !!

Here is one of her fb postings today in "Thai" (?) :

อีควายมึงจะคุยหาพ่อหาแม่มึงอะไรนักหนากูจะนอนอีสัสมึงรู้จักปะความเกรงใจปะอีเหี้ย

and here is what Google translate gives me :

Easy to talk to his mother buffalo U U E week's What's So I'm going to bed as the cover art, e dam_n rude.

I hope that wasn't directed at you!

It's not really Isan, pretty much everything there is Central Thai... it's just way too rude for google!

[Aforek]

Languages ( any languages ) are too complicated for google traduction or equivalent: too many grammatical exceptions , only a human brain can manage.

for the example "พูดภาษาไทยได้นิดหน่อย", it's evident that google can't guess there is no article at the beginning of the sentence: every body knows it but not

google, because sometimes there is an article, sometimes there is not . Because it doesn't understand it , google say " Thailand" because in the sentence

there is the word " ไทย "

[Richard W]

I hadn't contributed to this post because I didn't have anything to add.

It's been said that Thai word order is very different to English. I don't think it is usually so very different - it is usually quite easy to start a sentence in one language and finish it in the other. Complex sentence construction is different - I haven't yet got the hang of it.

As has been said, one thing that makes translating between European languages is that there has been enough word for word translation between them that their phraseology is mostly quite similar. It also helps that most of them were one language no more than 8000 years ago and have been in some sort of contact ever since.

One can do a lot of fairly mechanical translation between European languages. With Thai, it is more often necessary to understand what one is translating, and then recast it, and that make it hard for a machine.

It's written language does not use the alphabet, but 'symbols' which differ from others around it, Most of these 'symbols' have multiple meanings and trying to 'fit' the sentence structure 'we' use which comes with the alphabet, is not easy.

I think you mean to refer to something other than the alphabet, namely punctuation. Does anyone know whether richly punctuated Thai translates better? I suspect the lack of a full stop is something of a problem for machines.

[OldChinaHam]

Google Translate explains the answer to your question in its documentation:

They say that the accuracy of the translations you find on Google is related to the number and quality of the translated documents the Google search engine is able to find on the internet.

They say that if their search engine is able to find more translated documents on the internet that are translated accurately then the translations you find on Google translate will be better.

The search engine looks through millions and millions of Thai documents which have been translated into English in order to come up with the machine translation you see on Google Translate.

The answers you seek

Are all provided by

Google

Thing.

Never, Never

Doubt Google.

You should doubt the humans that provide the English-Thai-English translations

Upon which the Google results are directly based.

I love Google.

I don't like humans.

[Aforek]

Google Translate explains the answer to your question in its documentation:

They say that the accuracy of the translations you find on Google is related to the number and quality of the translated documents the Google search engine is able to find on the internet.

They say that if their search engine is able to find more translated documents on the internet that are translated accurately then the translations you find on Google translate will be better.

The search engine looks through millions and millions of Thai documents which have been translated into English in order to come up with the machine translation you see on Google Translate.

The answers you seek

Are all provided by

Google

Thing.

Never, Never

Doubt Google.

You should doubt the humans that provide the English-Thai-English translations

Upon which the Google results are directly based.

I love Google.

I don't like humans.

[Aforek]

Let's speak of two european languages very common on the Internet, English and French ( French is my language )

I have asked Google to translate this text

" Pol.Col. Rathasak Imritha , marine police superintendent Pranburi province received a report by Mr. Olec Okorodof, Uzbekistani citizen, of a stolen white 2 wave luxury sailboat name ‘Misa’ from the marina Beach Road Pattaya , Sattahip, Chonburi , since September 1st.

A fishing boat that goes around that area reported that they saw a similar looking sailboat in the middle of the ocean in Cha-am Beach, Petchuri about 12 miles away from the shore. After tracking down the sailboat they also found a young Russian citizen 20 years old, he has now been detained for stealing property.

The suspect confessed that he did steal the yacht for travelling to Indonesia and Philippines. As for stealing the sailboat he has spent monitoring the sailboat for two days once he found the opportunity he swam towards the sailboat which was about 5 meters from the shore. When he reached he found the keys, started the engine and took-off. The gasoline was over and therefore he was in the middle of the ocean while he was caught. "

in French : I can tell you that, even if the translation is not completely null, there are many mistakes, and never a French speaking person will write like this: I still need to have the english text beside to understand what Google speaks about.

For many, many years, I trust more a human and professional translator than a machine; I imagine it's worst with European languages and thai language.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Aforek

[Fookhaht]

Well, in a forum where 90% don't know the difference between there and their

you cant have much hope,right?

Ditto for "TWO", "TOO" and "TO"!

Oh, oh--the grammar Nazis are coming out of the woodwork!

[RobU]

I think there is an element of 'precious wokey' by the translation team. For example toilet has a direct translation to a word in Thai , however when used in a sentence the word is changed to bathroom hence you get the translated phrase "I'm just going to fix the bathroom in the bathroom"🤣. It also changes he to she and vice versa, boy to girl and vice versa, it changed my wife's name to a highly insulting word.

It changes many words that have direct equivalents in English into completely different words or phrases. I understand Google has laboratories in China. Perhaps there is a deliberate element to make English speakers sound stupid and insolent

[GammaGlobulin]

On 9/4/2013 at 5:26 PM, Jingthing said:

I don't think there is any doubt that the Thai-English google translator is shockingly poor. I wonder why exactly. I can compare it to Spanish-English which I would expect to be better, but not so MUCH better.

I assume a large part of the problem is the nature of the Thai language. Is that the only reason? Is google's tool not as good as other automatic Thai-English translation tools?

YOUR assumption is COMPLETELY incorrect.

 

What you need to do is to learn how Google Translate works.

 

Google Translate does NOT DO TRANSLATION, for one!

 

I suggest you do your research and learn that Google Translate works by comparing text written in Thai with text that relates to it in English.

 

Therefore, the PROBLEM as you have complained about it is due to the dearth of Thai documents which have been translated into English, and so much more.

 

You seem to have a totally invalid conception of how Google Translate works.

 

Just sayin'.....

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

On 9/7/2013 at 7:01 AM, OldChinaHam said:

Google Translate explains the answer to your question in its documentation:

They say that the accuracy of the translations you find on Google is related to the number and quality of the translated documents the Google search engine is able to find on the internet.

 

 

Yes.

Please contact JT with this correct info.

 

Thank you!

 

JT knows a lot about Freud, however....

For what that is worth....

 

 

Edited January 8 by GammaGlobulin

[GammaGlobulin]

On 9/7/2013 at 7:01 AM, OldChinaHam said:

Google Translate explains the answer to your question in its documentation:

They say that the accuracy of the translations you find on Google is related to the number and quality of the translated documents the Google search engine is able to find on the internet.

They say that if their search engine is able to find more translated documents on the internet that are translated accurately then the translations you find on Google translate will be better.

The search engine looks through millions and millions of Thai documents which have been translated into English in order to come up with the machine translation you see on Google Translate.

The answers you seek

Are all provided by

Google

Thing.

Never, Never

Doubt Google.

You should doubt the humans that provide the English-Thai-English translations

Upon which the Google results are directly based.

I love Google.

I don't like humans.

 

This "poster/pretender" never knew what he was talking about.....

 

Take if from me....

 

Believe me....

 

I know, first hand.

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

On 9/7/2013 at 7:01 AM, OldChinaHam said:

Google Translate explains the answer to your question in its documentation:

They say that the accuracy of the translations you find on Google is related to the number and quality of the translated documents the Google search engine is able to find on the internet.

They say that if their search engine is able to find more translated documents on the internet that are translated accurately then the translations you find on Google translate will be better.

The search engine looks through millions and millions of Thai documents which have been translated into English in order to come up with the machine translation you see on Google Translate.

The answers you seek

Are all provided by

Google

Thing.

Never, Never

Doubt Google.

You should doubt the humans that provide the English-Thai-English translations

Upon which the Google results are directly based.

I love Google.

I don't like humans.

 

 

THE PENNY DROPS:  Would you think that Google Translate might be able to translate this British Idiom into passa Thai?

 

The Penny Drops....

 

Might this be a double entendre in the case of OldChinaHam?

 

 เงินหยด

Google Translate, in the case of passa Thai...is....still...not...

Up to Snuff.

 

Also, OldChinaHam was, IMHO, a few cards short of a full deck:

 

a few cards short of a full deck...ไพ่สองสามใบยังขาดสำรับเต็ม

 

 

[Puccini]

On 9/5/2013 at 3:39 PM, jayceenik said:

I have used the English to Thai Google translate when I was writing email letters to ThaiLoveLinks ladies.

Not bad, very usable and, fortunately, I read Thai so I was able to correct the meaning/words mistakes before emailing them.

A couple days ago I translated a UK mailonline article in French to email to a French friend.

It came out mostly intelligible but not very good.

I don't know what sort of Ubon Isaan Thai my present Pattaya TGF uses when not with me but I often can't make sense of what she writes on her facebook and neither can Google translate !!

Here is one of her fb postings today in "Thai" (?) :

อีควายมึงจะคุยหาพ่อหาแม่มึงอะไรนักหนากูจะนอนอีสัสมึงรู้จักปะความเกรงใจปะอีเหี้ย

and here is what Google translate gives me :

Easy to talk to his mother buffalo U U E week's What's So I'm going to bed as the cover art, e damn rude.

http://static.thaivisa.com/forum//public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.png

 

Finally, someone who gives an example of a Thai text he translated with Google Translate. Thank you.

 

 

I copy-pasted the text into the Google Translate app on my Android phone and got a better translation:

 

I find the expression พ่อหาแม่ a bit unusual. It usually is only พ่อแม่, which translates as "parents" but in conversation is often used as an exclamation, for example to express frustration, and can be translated something like "for heaven's sake". I asked Google Bard about it, with this result:

[Puccini]

14 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

 

THE PENNY DROPS:  Would you think that Google Translate might be able to translate this British Idiom into passa Thai?

 

The Penny Drops....

 

Might this be a double entendre in the case of OldChinaHam?

 

 เงินหยด

Google Translate, in the case of passa Thai...is....still...not...

Up to Snuff.

 

Also, OldChinaHam was, IMHO, a few cards short of a full deck:

 

a few cards short of a full deck...ไพ่สองสามใบยังขาดสำรับเต็ม

 

 

 

Never expect a regular dictionary or a machine translation to give you a "translation" of an idiom or a proverb. Instead, use a ChatGPT to to give an idiom or proverb with the same meaning in the other language. Alternatively, use a special dictionary for idioms and proverbs if you can find one for the respective languages.

[GammaGlobulin]

9 minutes ago, Puccini said:

 

Never expect a regular dictionary or a machine translation to give you a "translation" of an idiom or a proverb. Instead, use a ChatGPT to to give an idiom or proverb with the same meaning in the other language. Alternatively, use a special dictionary for idioms and proverbs if you can find one for the respective languages.

 

Of course, nobody would translate and idiom or proverb literally, word by word.

 

The point is that Google Translate can give the meanings of idioms in some cases and for some languages.

 

And again, if one asks Google, then Google Translate does NOT USE machine translation, as people here have been saying for years.

 

Maybe this video might help?

 

 

 

Or, if one is willing to read...then....Google itself provides a description of the process by which Google Translate gives corresponding meanings in various languages.

 

[KhunBENQ]

I think it has improved in the last 11 years (when the thread was started by @Jingthing)

[GammaGlobulin]

Here is a simpler UTUBE video discussing this Topic which was recorded about 13 years ago.

 

So, as previous commenters have already stated, there are more documents and data available ONLINE in some languages, such as Chinese, compared to other languages, such as Thai.

 

AI requires massive amounts of data, as we know, as well.

 

Anyway, here is the simpler video: