Farang-Thai road accident and discrimination

[Stradavarius37]

Many years ago (30 actually) I had a mate who worked for Australian Department of Foreign Affairs in the AUSTEMB BKK. I was staying with him, briefly, when he explained to me the Thai logic when it comes to Motor Vehicle Accidents involving farangs.

Put simply. As a farang you are only a visitor in Thailand, it is not your country, so, if you weren't here in the first place, like you're not meant to be, then the accident would never have occurred. Whether you be in the 'right' or in the 'wrong'. This 'logic' has been compounded even further over the years by the lead from the top attitude of, rich farang, fair game concept.

Naturally I was pretty appalled when he told me this, and I never forgot it.

Armed with that knowlege I have avoided buying or driving a car in the LOS ever since, and choose to live in a place where I can get away with not owning one, where transport and taxis are plentiful.

My Thai friends jibe me sometimes they think I can't drive a car. When I explain this to them, and tell them I was driving a car when they were riding around on buffalos in the provinces, they understand and cannot help but agree with me. Some even voice their disdain for it.

I have often thought about whether or not I should get a car. But it is what I say about understanding the rules of the game before you play. I choose not to play.

I am certainly not defending the Thais, I think it is a disgraceful attitude, but most unfortunately it is the way it is. God I hate thieves and people who are unable to take responsibility for their own actions.

I am glad it is not me. I feel for you, and all the others who have been ripped. I wish you luck OP.

Ahh, one of those classic "My friend told me this..." tales. And one of the Falang classics as well! Good for you for believing it without question - your credibility has been determined.

[I knew this would happen]

Firstly, I'm surprised you don't know the way things work here after living here for 11 years. Also, you need your wife to do the talking?

This is not a Thai farang issue. When an accident happens the 2 parties size each other up. It is to do with how much 'power' you have. Granted, at first most Thais will see a foreigner, especially white one, and think they know nothing/nobody, especially if they are in Pattaya or tourist area. These stupid farang can't even speak the language - of course they won't know 'the law' or the procedure. I wouldn't be surprised if the OP didn't know what 'Boon Khun' is, for example.

I've had accidents here - one time the pick up was on the wrong side of the road and had a head on with me. As I was limping about with a broken foot I heard them say that I was at fault. What to do? Boon Khun time! I called someone and they came and I ended up getting 1 months salary compensation, my car fixed and hospital costs. The guy was also fined 400 baht.

But, my car took 3 months to get fixed and the insurance didn't pay for my rented car so what now? Sue the pricks. A police friend was going to help. Delay - my friend became senator of the region so wait a month until he's in office. Delay, Taxsin and his government is booted out. Plan 2 - settle for half the money by bribing someone in the insurance company.

Usually the bigger vehicle pays. It has all to do with positioning on the social ladder. Thais look at the woman that foreigners are with and know instantly if the farang could have any power.

I hear people talking about having a get out of jail card. I have used these before and can't stress the importance of getting to 'know' people here if you plan on living happily for years. Learn the language, have Thai friends, join clubs etc.

I can't believe that some people leave the country because another car hits theirs.

I do have a buddy who was hit from behind by an off duty soldier. The soldier attacked him with a machete as he lost face when he approached my friend's car and said it was his fault and tried to grab his keys. My mate grabbed his hand and would give them. He said if he hadn't been a black belt in karate and ex army, he'd have been dead as the machete weilder was trying to kill him. Warning - never toot your horn to show someone is in the wrong. It could cost you your life. 3 months ago In khon kaen central street a man was shot dead for hooting his horn. I have a friend who's son's friend was shot in the head for tooting his horn.

Integrate, learn the language, learn the ways to get out of trouble. Don't think it of them and us. I can't emphasize how important it is to learn the language - how the hell are you going to know what's going on if you don't?

It´s not that easy to adopt such madness and even integrate. I can understand that some people might just give up and leave this place. Thailand is a special place, and when you check the dictionary you can see that "special" has a wide range of meanings. Not everyone can get along with it. That`s a never ending discussion. But you made a fine example of what is possible here.

[richard_smith237]

I got involved in a minor accident in 2011 where I was hit by a minibus who was trying to squeeze his way between mine and another car. I was stationary and had been for a minute when he hit me. The result was a four foot long scraping on the minibus from when he tried to squeeze by.

The driver of the minibus called the police to the scene, and the chaos that followed caused the attention of other drivers. Basically, the driver of the minibus wanted money. A lot of money. I got the impression others got interested when they heard the amounts being discussed, and for this reason another driver came forward and claimed I had hit his car. He also wanted money. Soon the police officers decided to have a go; if they're getting money, we're having some as well!

I will not go into detail of the ugly and unfortunate events that followed (though sdk here on TV actually knows the details), but this event triggered a decision to fly my family out of Thailand (which they did within 48 hours), close my business and sell my two houses and leave Thailand. Which I did soon after my business was closed.

I have always wondered what triggers someone to lie, cheat, bend the rules or even use criminal actions to extort money from others, and it's clear that jealousy is a huge factor. In my case, being a farang and driving a new BMW 5-series probably didn't help. In Europe, youngsters are getting robbed of their mobile phones by school kid bullies. Thailand is no different, only here it's grown ups doing the bullying..

And you let them !!! ???

Was this somewhere like Samui ?

The reason I ask is that the law and locals are a different breed on some of the Islands - the mob-greed mentality is still readily visible.

In areas such as Bangkok things are handled in a much fairer manner (with a handful of newsworthy exceptions).

Middle of Bangkok.

That's a surprise and a very scary story... I've always been dealt with fairly here in Bangkok. As have friends, we've all had car accidents... one where the BiB sided with my friend against a foul-mouthed Hi-So in a Merc who refused to accept blame.

I often wonder what would happen should I find myself in a similar situation - I do also feel that it would be difficult to be in that situation as the 'get out of trouble' mentality kicks in...

Example in hand: A Woman tried to overtake me in a car park. It was 9am, I was late and looking for a space (I imagine she was also late and in a hurry), I'd slowed down to ask the guard if there were any spaces on that floor or should I go up to the next floor. As I slowed down, my car was hit and scratched along the side by this lady driver.

Within 5 minutes there were about 20 guys and gals in support of her telling me it was my fault - I smiled and replied "Up to you"...

Got back in my car, called my insurance.

Insurance arrived - I was told, the girl says its 100% my fault + pay some damages or she will call the Police.

I agreed - Please call the Police !!.... They did, I called my friend (also BiB).

He contacted the local Police station and called me back - OK, go to the Police station, they will agree that its 100% the Girls Fault !!

She was about to get a bit of a shock in her assumption that Thai-Vs-Foreigner the Thai will always win...

With that, I called my friend back - The security guard who saw the accident told me that he thought it was 50:50 as I had pulled over and slowed, but not stopped while the impatient girl over took me - I could see his point. I told my insurance that I'll sign a 50:50 blame and did so.

I called my friend back who told me there was no need to go to the Police Station and that when the girl went she would be told to accept 50:50 or I will push for 100%... I never heard any more on the matter... I figured I was very fair but IMO it was only a very minor matter. I was mildly amused by the way the girl had attempted to strong-arm me with 20 or so people by her side.

No BiB came to my scene, but when they do I guess its down to the individual officer on the scene - I do have a dash-cam as I feel protection against this type of extortion you mention is necessary (these days with the fraudulent claims I would also use a dash-cam in the UK too).

I agree with what Neeranam wrote, all highly valid points...

[I knew this would happen]

I called my friend back who told me there was no need to go to the Police Station and that when the girl went she would be told to accept 50:50 or I will push for 100%... I never heard any more on the matter... I figured I was very fair but IMO it was only a very minor matter. I was mildly amused by the way the girl had attempted to strong-arm me with 20 or so people by her side.

1.Seems you always have to swallow a bitter pill no matter if you did anything wrong or not.

2.Blody lynch mop mentality against the evil farang, i really hope karma hits thai people hard someday (or maybe it already does, look at the government and the flood)

3.Not everyone has a joker within the BiB.

But there´s light at the end of the tunnel, the majority of us gets treated fair i´d say. Some real frightening stories make the whole thing look worse than it is.

[aussieinthailand]

Yu'p a dash cam gives you some protection in traffic accidents,

I have a dash cam with 2 lenses, one pointing forward into traffic, and the other at the drivers side window also for protection from the BIB trying to extort tea money, so I just smile and point to the cam showing him on screen.

[samran]

As others have said, this isn't a farang vs thai thing, it is Rich vs Poor thing.

As long as there is no trumped up criminal charges against you, and the insurance firm is willing to cop the payment, then that is probably the path of least resistance.

[klubex99]

My advice when anyone comes up against this and it has already been established that it was the other person's fault.

If later it changes, and all of a sudden, it is YOU that has to pay regardless that you, insurance and police have already agreed otherwise. Then you can actually go to your embassy and explain things. They do help when you have problems regarding the police and the law.

Usually a complaining phone call from your embassy to the relevant police station and it goes away.

[craigt3365]

It is not just foreigners that have this problem. In my wifes village, an old guy ran into her uncle who was stopped. Everybody agreed it was the old guys fault. Except the old guy. The court begged him to plead guilty. He wouldn't. Finally, after 2 years of court cases, the uncle gave in and negotiated 100k...feeling sorry for the old man.

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Shurup]

Seems like the insurance premiums don't account for the previous claims in Thailand? Is it so? 50/50 would be an easy way out even if it's not your fault at all.

[Pitts]

Many years ago (30 actually) I had a mate who worked for Australian Department of Foreign Affairs in the AUSTEMB BKK. I was staying with him, briefly, when he explained to me the Thai logic when it comes to Motor Vehicle Accidents involving farangs.

Put simply. As a farang you are only a visitor in Thailand, it is not your country, so, if you weren't here in the first place, like you're not meant to be, then the accident would never have occurred. Whether you be in the 'right' or in the 'wrong'. This 'logic' has been compounded even further over the years by the lead from the top attitude of, rich farang, fair game concept.

Naturally I was pretty appalled when he told me this, and I never forgot it.

Armed with that knowlege I have avoided buying or driving a car in the LOS ever since, and choose to live in a place where I can get away with not owning one, where transport and taxis are plentiful.

My Thai friends jibe me sometimes they think I can't drive a car. When I explain this to them, and tell them I was driving a car when they were riding around on buffalos in the provinces, they understand and cannot help but agree with me. Some even voice their disdain for it.

I have often thought about whether or not I should get a car. But it is what I say about understanding the rules of the game before you play. I choose not to play.

I am certainly not defending the Thais, I think it is a disgraceful attitude, but most unfortunately it is the way it is. God I hate thieves and people who are unable to take responsibility for their own actions.

I am glad it is not me. I feel for you, and all the others who have been ripped. I wish you luck OP.

Definitely agree with this. Only buy a car if you can afford a full time driver to go with it.

The Law is just not on your side in Thailand, best to just avoid the unfortunate outcome entirely.

[samran]

Many years ago (30 actually) I had a mate who worked for Australian Department of Foreign Affairs in the AUSTEMB BKK. I was staying with him, briefly, when he explained to me the Thai logic when it comes to Motor Vehicle Accidents involving farangs.

Put simply. As a farang you are only a visitor in Thailand, it is not your country, so, if you weren't here in the first place, like you're not meant to be, then the accident would never have occurred. Whether you be in the 'right' or in the 'wrong'. This 'logic' has been compounded even further over the years by the lead from the top attitude of, rich farang, fair game concept.

Naturally I was pretty appalled when he told me this, and I never forgot it.

Armed with that knowlege I have avoided buying or driving a car in the LOS ever since, and choose to live in a place where I can get away with not owning one, where transport and taxis are plentiful.

My Thai friends jibe me sometimes they think I can't drive a car. When I explain this to them, and tell them I was driving a car when they were riding around on buffalos in the provinces, they understand and cannot help but agree with me. Some even voice their disdain for it.

I have often thought about whether or not I should get a car. But it is what I say about understanding the rules of the game before you play. I choose not to play.

I am certainly not defending the Thais, I think it is a disgraceful attitude, but most unfortunately it is the way it is. God I hate thieves and people who are unable to take responsibility for their own actions.

I am glad it is not me. I feel for you, and all the others who have been ripped. I wish you luck OP.

Definitely agree with this. Only buy a car if you can afford a full time driver to go with it.

The Law is just not on your side in Thailand, best to just avoid the unfortunate outcome entirely.

If you take that attitude, you'd never leave you home country.

Not sure about the OZ embassy. 30 years ago, sounds like a Les Patterson interpretation of 'how Thai's thought'....

[jpeg]

In other words, íts not a given that you will be stitched up in the event of an accident.

Unless you live on Phuket.

[jpeg]

As others have said, this isn't a farang vs thai thing, it is Rich vs Poor thing.

And bearing in mind that ALL farang are perceived to be wealthier than 'poor' Thais, even those who drive SUV's and their like, blind ignorance and xenophobia WINS!

[kikoman]

Transportation cost are very reasonable nation wide, I pay 200 baht for a round trip to the local hospital, 14 kilometers away, 750 baht for a 120 kilometer monthly shopping round trip to Nakhon Sawan.

So your solution to the problem is to hop on a minibus...?

Right...

Why would you assume I go in a minibus, because you were involved in an accident with one?

Your assumption is wrong I go in a private vehicle, as about 5-6 villagers make their living charging a fee to drive you to where you need to go in their private vehilce.

It is still my contention that one needs to know more about Thai law before they consider driving in Thailand.

In the US (ARIZONA) if you are making a turn and you are involved in an accident , you are at fault because the law states you must wait till you can make the turn safely, since you were in an accident while making a turn it was your fault, because you did not wail till you could make the turn safely.

If you were involved in an accident, that you can clearly prove was not your fault, and you do not have insurance, valid drivers licence and/or a valid car registration, you are automatically at fault because you should not have been driving at all.

While many will believe that it is the established practice of the BIB, from top to bottom that a Farang is automatically at fault, if the person involved in the accident had documented proof that the other party was at fault, knowing western Falangs, I believe someone would have contested the practice in a Thai court.

The court system is the final interpreter of the law, all way up to the top court of the land.

Just my opinion!

Cheers:

[Forethat]

Transportation cost are very reasonable nation wide, I pay 200 baht for a round trip to the local hospital, 14 kilometers away, 750 baht for a 120 kilometer monthly shopping round trip to Nakhon Sawan.

So your solution to the problem is to hop on a minibus...?

Right...

Why would you assume I go in a minibus, because you were involved in an accident with one?

Your assumption is wrong I go in a private vehicle, as about 5-6 villagers make their living charging a fee to drive you to where you need to go in their private vehilce.

Well...I didn't assume anything, I used the minibus as an example of acquiring other transportation than driving yourself. My point as that driving yourself tends to ascertain crucial aspects of driving skills and behaviour, something that isn't the case if someone else is driving.

Your remark suggest that all of the risks related to hopping on a minibus doesn't apply in your case because you travel with someone who charges money for a service (for which they are not insured, and probably not qualified to perform) by driving you in his private vehicle. Your problems are likely to be terminal in case they materialise; in that aspect it might not be so bad after all, I agree with that. But as long you're happy things are jolly well.

IMHO, acquiring a personal vehicle tends to be a solution to exactly the problem you perceive as an opportunity. Ever considered the complexity of the situation if you had a family? Not all expats are single men...

Edited October 11, 2013 by Forethat

[A1Str8]

Indeed. The best way to deal with them is just say: it was my fault too. Otherwise they are going to deny everything. They would rather die than to admit their wrongdoing. That would make them lose face. Even if they dont have a f_ckin face anymore because it was so badly injured in the accident, they still insist on keeping face.

Edited October 11, 2013 by A1Str8

[norrona]

tolerated not wanted OP.....once you have come to terms with that then you will be alright....

[BngkkB]

One day I was riding with my Thai GF and a couple of kids. We were going to drop the GF off on the way to take the kids home. When the taxi pulled to the side of the road to let the GF out, when she opened her door it was immediately hit by trwo people passing the stopped taxi between the curb and the taxi. As soon as the accident happened I could tell there was no serious damage to motor cycle or passengers. I told her to stay in the car and not say anything, (Thinking that in the US if someone even says they are "Sorry" it can be used in court as an admission of guilt.

As more and more people arrived they all pointed at me in the front seat and said "Farang, Farang did it" They were saying they saw the Farang open the door. I never touched the door. When the police came, which was right away, the first thing they asked was if she was my wife. The taxi driver told them he didn't think so as we were dropping her off so she could grab another taxi and go to a near by mall. I reiterated that she was the Nanny and not my wife. But I had to laugh about all the eye witnesses that saw me open the door into the motor cycle.

After some time in the police station and never admitting guilt we were let go to come back on another day. About a week later we went back to the police station. Our appointment was at 1:00 pm. We arrived at 12:00 pm and we arrived after the insurance adjuster for the motor cycle. When we arrived the police said he had thought about it and decided it was all the GF's (Nanny) fualt. I then produced the driving manual and showed him where it said that it was illegal for a motor cycle to overtake a car on the curb side. He read it a couple of times and told the insurance adjuster that it was his clients fault. With lots of protest and dramatics the guy would not have it that it was his fault. After he realized he did not have a leg to stand on he started in with that the GF (Nanny) was a bad Thai as she didn't even get out of the car to say she was sorry. I explained very calmly that she stayed in the car at my request to keep the children calm as they were scarred with all the commotion.

After that didn't work, he went on to say that his passenger was loosing income as a singer as she could not go to work as she was recovering from the accident and that no one offered to help with the expenses. Remember if he had been following the law there wouldn't have been any expenses. Then he started in on her being a bad Thai not wanting to help. That is when the GF, (Nanny as everyone still thought that was who she was) lost it. She went off on the guy saying that he was irresponsible and didn't know anything about her. She then pulled out a sealed envelope with the lady that got hurts name on it. Handed it to the police and told him to please open it. When the police opened it he found a very nicely written letter to the lady saying that she hoped that the enclosed 2,000 Baht would help her while she recovered.

The police thanked her very much and let us go while he proceeded to fine and lecture the motor cycle driver.

My conclusion to this whole thing. Throw out anything you learned in the USA or UK about not helping a victim at a scene of an accident or saying your sorry. Keep your cool at all times. Have something to refer to show your innocence, rule book, photos etc.... Never believe an eye witness. Never be the only Farang at an auto accident.

[kikoman]

Transportation cost are very reasonable nation wide, I pay 200 baht for a round trip to the local hospital, 14 kilometers away, 750 baht for a 120 kilometer monthly shopping round trip to Nakhon Sawan.

So your solution to the problem is to hop on a minibus...?

Right...

Why would you assume I go in a minibus, because you were involved in an accident with one?

Your assumption is wrong I go in a private vehicle, as about 5-6 villagers make their living charging a fee to drive you to where you need to go in their private vehilce.

Well...I didn't assume anything, I used the minibus as an example of acquiring other transportation than driving yourself. My point as that driving yourself tends to ascertain crucial aspects of driving skills and behaviour, something that isn't the case if someone else is driving.

Your remark suggest that all of the risks related to hopping on a minibus doesn't apply in your case because you travel with someone who charges money for a service (for which they are not insured, and probably not qualified to perform) by driving you in his private vehicle. Your problems are likely to be terminal in case they materialise; in that aspect it might not be so bad after all, I agree with that. But as long you're happy things are jolly well.

IMHO, acquiring a personal vehicle tends to be a solution to exactly the problem you perceive as an opportunity. Ever considered the complexity of the situation if you had a family? Not all expats are single men...

Again you assume that my remarks "suggested" something other than what I posted, My remark were aimed solely at answering a question you assumed, nothing more or nothing less.

It seems your assumptions are aimed at manipulation of what the post clearly stated in responding to your post.

Another assumption of the qualifications of those that drive me, why would that be a concern of yours in the first place, The lord only knows what could be "terminal", i will go with the practice that I already have in place for my driving needs, that have served me well for the last 12 years I have lived in Thailand, with not a single accident and/or incident (by my most qualified drivers) for those 12 years!

In replying to your last assumption, I am most happily married and have a family, we get along very well on motorbikes and private and public transportation where we find it necessary to travel out side of our motor bike range.

Your concern is not necessary as I have my transportation needs well covered and definitely have no desire to acquire an automobile in this lifetime.

Cheers:

[wprime]

OP's case isn't discrimination of farangs, it's discrimination of the wealthy. The car driver almost always has to pay for damages in motorbike - car collisions regardless of race. It's a shit system and in my mind contributes a long way to the recklessness of motorcycle riders but that's the way it is. Consider yourself lucky that it's only happened once in 11 years.

[Forethat]

So your solution to the problem is to hop on a minibus...?

Right...

Why would you assume I go in a minibus, because you were involved in an accident with one?

Your assumption is wrong I go in a private vehicle, as about 5-6 villagers make their living charging a fee to drive you to where you need to go in their private vehilce.

Well...I didn't assume anything, I used the minibus as an example of acquiring other transportation than driving yourself. My point as that driving yourself tends to ascertain crucial aspects of driving skills and behaviour, something that isn't the case if someone else is driving.

Your remark suggest that all of the risks related to hopping on a minibus doesn't apply in your case because you travel with someone who charges money for a service (for which they are not insured, and probably not qualified to perform) by driving you in his private vehicle. Your problems are likely to be terminal in case they materialise; in that aspect it might not be so bad after all, I agree with that. But as long you're happy things are jolly well.

IMHO, acquiring a personal vehicle tends to be a solution to exactly the problem you perceive as an opportunity. Ever considered the complexity of the situation if you had a family? Not all expats are single men...

Again you assume that my remarks "suggested" something other than what I posted, My remark were aimed solely at answering a question you assumed, nothing more or nothing less.

It seems your assumptions are aimed at manipulation of what the post clearly stated in responding to your post.

Another assumption of the qualifications of those that drive me, why would that be a concern of yours in the first place, The lord only knows what could be "terminal", i will go with the practice that I already have in place for my driving needs, that have served me well for the last 12 years I have lived in Thailand, with not a single accident and/or incident (by my most qualified drivers) for those 12 years!

In replying to your last assumption, I am most happily married and have a family, we get along very well on motorbikes and private and public transportation where we find it necessary to travel out side of our motor bike range.

Your concern is not necessary as I have my transportation needs well covered and definitely have no desire to acquire an automobile in this lifetime.

Cheers:

Well I guess I dont have to assume that you and I have a completely different opinion on what is responsible parenthood since you're being pretty much straightforward in that. Oh, and please dont assume that I believe to have anything to do or that I'm interested or care, I'm only concluding the evident.

I still feel a bit perplexed that there actually are individuals who argues that the risk of financial foul play should be mitigated by introducing a bigger risk (but I'm sure your Thai friend and driver are competent and well educated like a majority of drivers).

You cant save your oranges by refraining from eating apples.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Forethat

[Banzai99]

In England they have (or had ) an L plate for learner drivers, they should have an F plate for Farangs in Thailand.

Then every road user would know to take care around them, as they don't know about driving in Thailand.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Banzai99

[kikoman]

Forethat,

I usually don't reply to post I consider maybe from trolls, which your post "suggest" an assumption on my part no doubt, as your attempts to antagonize are in vain, sorry you will have to tango alone. I have no interest in any type of communication with you. period.

Please place me on your "ignore" list.

Cheers:

Edited October 11, 2013 by kikoman

[Forethat]

Forethat,

I usually don't reply to post I consider maybe from trolls, which your post "suggest" an assumption on my part no doubt, as your attempts to antagonize are in vain, sorry you will have to tango alone. I have no interest in any type of communication with you. period.

Please place me on your "ignore" list.

Cheers:

Personally, I find it easier to simply accept that other's have opinions even though I dont always agree with them. I also find it more or less pathetic when posters uses invectives and name calling as soon as it occurs to them how wrong they are.

Feel free to let me know if you want to discuss this further, I have a firm belief that a personal vehicle carries less risk than travelling with the general Thai driver who's carrying passengers for money without permit - in particular since this is illegal and in breach with insurance policies. And then I haven't even mentioned the training required to acquire a Thai driving license. If you want to put your family in one of them that's fine with me, but I hope you understand that there are plenty of people - in particular families - who'd rather walk passed a lion pride wearing a filet mignon suit than stick children in the hands of a Thai driver. I'm sure there are plenty of responsible and skilled Thai drivers, I just haven't seen one yet.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Forethat

[MAJIC]

In England they have (or had ) an L plate for learner drivers, they should have an F plate for Farangs in Thailand.

Then every road user would know to take care around them, as they don't know about driving in Thailand.

And how about a T plate for Trolls then!

[Banzai99]

Look , you all live here, well, some of you do, ok, not many of you do, alright, most of you don't live in Thailand, so really, what do you know ?

So easy to diss Thai people, you don't live here cos it's such a bad place, right ?

Seems like on ThaiVisa, it's a competition to see who can slag off Thai people the most, most posters don't live in Thailand and don't know <deleted>, there are a few posters I respect on ThaiVisa, only a few, Neeranam, Guesthouse etc etc, guys like that, anyway, I gotta go now, bye.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Banzai99

[benalibina]

I got involved in a minor accident in 2011 where I was hit by a minibus who was trying to squeeze his way between mine and another car. I was stationary and had been for a minute when he hit me. The result was a four foot long scraping on the minibus from when he tried to squeeze by.

The driver of the minibus called the police to the scene, and the chaos that followed caused the attention of other drivers. Basically, the driver of the minibus wanted money. A lot of money. I got the impression others got interested when they heard the amounts being discussed, and for this reason another driver came forward and claimed I had hit his car. He also wanted money. Soon the police officers decided to have a go; if they're getting money, we're having some as well!

I will not go into detail of the ugly and unfortunate events that followed (though sdk here on TV actually knows the details), but this event triggered a decision to fly my family out of Thailand (which they did within 48 hours), close my business and sell my two houses and leave Thailand. Which I did soon after my business was closed.

I have always wondered what triggers someone to lie, cheat, bend the rules or even use criminal actions to extort money from others, and it's clear that jealousy is a huge factor. In my case, being a farang and driving a new BMW 5-series probably didn't help. In Europe, youngsters are getting robbed of their mobile phones by school kid bullies. Thailand is no different, only here it's grown ups doing the bullying..

I'm glad you left - overreaction thy name is farang

What a ......silly comment. To say politely.

[snake24]

I got involved in a minor accident in 2011 where I was hit by a minibus who was trying to squeeze his way between mine and another car. I was stationary and had been for a minute when he hit me. The result was a four foot long scraping on the minibus from when he tried to squeeze by.

The driver of the minibus called the police to the scene, and the chaos that followed caused the attention of other drivers. Basically, the driver of the minibus wanted money. A lot of money. I got the impression others got interested when they heard the amounts being discussed, and for this reason another driver came forward and claimed I had hit his car. He also wanted money. Soon the police officers decided to have a go; if they're getting money, we're having some as well!

I will not go into detail of the ugly and unfortunate events that followed (though sdk here on TV actually knows the details), but this event triggered a decision to fly my family out of Thailand (which they did within 48 hours), close my business and sell my two houses and leave Thailand. Which I did soon after my business was closed.

I have always wondered what triggers someone to lie, cheat, bend the rules or even use criminal actions to extort money from others, and it's clear that jealousy is a huge factor. In my case, being a farang and driving a new BMW 5-series probably didn't help. In Europe, youngsters are getting robbed of their mobile phones by school kid bullies. Thailand is no different, only here it's grown ups doing the bullying..

OMG that is serious indeed. Where did you move your family to? Your home country? Is your wife thai by any chance? So you have not resided in thailand since 2011?

[kikoman]

I got involved in a minor accident in 2011 where I was hit by a minibus who was trying to squeeze his way between mine and another car. I was stationary and had been for a minute when he hit me. The result was a four foot long scraping on the minibus from when he tried to squeeze by.

The driver of the minibus called the police to the scene, and the chaos that followed caused the attention of other drivers. Basically, the driver of the minibus wanted money. A lot of money. I got the impression others got interested when they heard the amounts being discussed, and for this reason another driver came forward and claimed I had hit his car. He also wanted money. Soon the police officers decided to have a go; if they're getting money, we're having some as well!

I will not go into detail of the ugly and unfortunate events that followed (though sdk here on TV actually knows the details), but this event triggered a decision to fly my family out of Thailand (which they did within 48 hours), close my business and sell my two houses and leave Thailand. Which I did soon after my business was closed.

I have always wondered what triggers someone to lie, cheat, bend the rules or even use criminal actions to extort money from others, and it's clear that jealousy is a huge factor. In my case, being a farang and driving a new BMW 5-series probably didn't help. In Europe, youngsters are getting robbed of their mobile phones by school kid bullies. Thailand is no different, only here it's grown ups doing the bullying..

Oh so you are that "Forethat"!

I never put 2 x 2 together as my post was to the OP and you only quoted the part of my post that stated to my preference of using available, private or public transportation for my personal transportation needs. and responded only to that by posting "So your solution to the problem is to hop on a mini-bus...? Right"

As my response was not directed at you, it seem with all the assumptions you posted to my post to the OP of how I chose my personal travel in Thailand, like many of the actions/post of the army of trolls that pollute the forum.

As I read "Your woe is me" post I find it as a prime example of an incident I could have used to reaffirm my travel choice, I stated if you drive in Thailand, without a firm knowledge of the traffic laws of Thailand You will be held responsible for your questionable choices, if you become involved in an accident while driving in Thailand.

That is what exactly happened to you, (is it not) which resulted in your questionable actions / decisions placed your financial investment at risk, that you felt the need to fly your family out of the country within 2 days and sells all your property in Thailand.

If your story is factual and I have reasons to believe it may not be as you contradict you tale, when a poster stated to you that he could not believe someone would leave the country simply because he was involved in a fender bender, you stated, if you find someone that did let me know, (not verbatim but only my recollection) your post also suggested that you also left the country.

While you failed to discuss your situation with at least two posters who posted directly to your posted tale, you chose to attack my opinion and clearly dispute your statement "personally, I find it easier to simply accept that other's have opinions even though I dont always agree with them" and "I also find it more or less pathetic when posters uses invectives and name calling as soon as it occurs to them how wrong they are" Another ASSUMPTION of yours, My logic and or decisions if anything have been proven to be absolutely right in the face of your Tale of Woe, has it not!

Go back and read your post you were the one that reverted to name calling and stupid assumptions, according to your statements , you knew they were wrong when you made them as started by attempting to manipulate what in reality was stated in your failed effort to save face.

Your assumptions were an attempt to antagonize, by assuming I placed my family at risk, simply for using available transportation instead of driving in Thailand. Is hypocritical, in the face of you being involved in a fender bender and your handling of such a minor incident, you brought the possibility of harm to them that it was necessary for them yo leave the country immediately

I have a right to my opinion, I also have a right to know the underlying motivation for a poster to attack my personal opinion. (Just my Opinion)

Cheers:

[snake24]

I got involved in a minor accident in 2011 where I was hit by a minibus who was trying to squeeze his way between mine and another car. I was stationary and had been for a minute when he hit me. The result was a four foot long scraping on the minibus from when he tried to squeeze by.

The driver of the minibus called the police to the scene, and the chaos that followed caused the attention of other drivers. Basically, the driver of the minibus wanted money. A lot of money. I got the impression others got interested when they heard the amounts being discussed, and for this reason another driver came forward and claimed I had hit his car. He also wanted money. Soon the police officers decided to have a go; if they're getting money, we're having some as well!

I will not go into detail of the ugly and unfortunate events that followed (though sdk here on TV actually knows the details), but this event triggered a decision to fly my family out of Thailand (which they did within 48 hours), close my business and sell my two houses and leave Thailand. Which I did soon after my business was closed.

I have always wondered what triggers someone to lie, cheat, bend the rules or even use criminal actions to extort money from others, and it's clear that jealousy is a huge factor. In my case, being a farang and driving a new BMW 5-series probably didn't help. In Europe, youngsters are getting robbed of their mobile phones by school kid bullies. Thailand is no different, only here it's grown ups doing the bullying..

Oh so you are that "Forethat"!

I never put 2 x 2 together as my post was to the OP and you only quoted the part of my post that stated to my preference of using available, private or public transportation for my personal transportation needs. and responded only to that by posting "So your solution to the problem is to hop on a mini-bus...? Right"

As my response was not directed at you, it seem with all the assumptions you posted to my post to the OP of how I chose my personal travel in Thailand, like many of the actions/post of the army of trolls that pollute the forum.

As I read "Your woe is me" post I find it as a prime example of an incident I could have used to reaffirm my travel choice, I stated if you drive in Thailand, without a firm knowledge of the traffic laws of Thailand You will be held responsible for your questionable choices, if you become involved in an accident while driving in Thailand.

That is what exactly happened to you, (is it not) which resulted in your questionable actions / decisions placed your financial investment at risk, that you felt the need to fly your family out of the country within 2 days and sells all your property in Thailand.

If your story is factual and I have reasons to believe it may not be as you contradict you tale, when a poster stated to you that he could not believe someone would leave the country simply because he was involved in a fender bender, you stated, if you find someone that did let me know, (not verbatim but only my recollection) your post also suggested that you also left the country.

While you failed to discuss your situation with at least two posters who posted directly to your posted tale, you chose to attack my opinion and clearly dispute your statement "personally, I find it easier to simply accept that other's have opinions even though I dont always agree with them" and "I also find it more or less pathetic when posters uses invectives and name calling as soon as it occurs to them how wrong they are" Another ASSUMPTION of yours, My logic and or decisions if anything have been proven to be absolutely right in the face of your Tale of Woe, has it not!

Go back and read your post you were the one that reverted to name calling and stupid assumptions, according to your statements , you knew they were wrong when you made them as started by attempting to manipulate what in reality was stated in your failed effort to save face.

Your assumptions were an attempt to antagonize, by assuming I placed my family at risk, simply for using available transportation instead of driving in Thailand. Is hypocritical, in the face of you being involved in a fender bender and your handling of such a minor incident, you brought the possibility of harm to them that it was necessary for them yo leave the country immediately

I have a right to my opinion, I also have a right to know the underlying motivation for a poster to attack my personal opinion. (Just my Opinion)

Cheers:

could u link to that thread?