Technical problem leaves Bangkok BTS in rush hour meltdown

[webfact]

Thai capital's BTS Skytrain resumes service
By Digital Content



BANGKOK, Dec 24 - The Thai capital's BTS Skytrain elevated railway resumed service before noon after a 5-hour suspension due to technical glitch in the control system halted operations across the system for the first time in 14 years.

Service resumed around 11am at Mo Chit Terminal Station, allowing the public to commute as usual.

The problem reportedly occurred at 3am, when trains could not operate normally.

A large number of commuters were forced to change their mode of transportation after the system suspended service on both Silom and Sukhumvit routes for the first time since it began operations.

Surapong Laoha-anya, Chief Operating Officer of Bangkok Mass Transit System Pcl which operates the BTS system, said an error or defect in software caused the computer programme for the Silom and Sukhumvit routes to malfunction.

Transport Minister Chadchart Sittipunt inspected the Mo Chit Terminal Station this morning and admitted that the incident has inconvenienced many commuters and added to traffic congestion in the Thai capital this morning.

He assigned the Transport Co, Ltd to provide 2,000 buses in 39 routes to help carry stranded passengers to their intended destinations. (MCOT online news)


-- TNA 2013-12-24

[arthurboy]

No movement at On Nut in either direction. BTS has shut down again.

sent from my hippo phone

[arthurboy]

Service running again. No idea if it is limited or not.

Hey ho. Christmas shopping it is then.

sent from my hippo phone

[simon43]

Radio communications used by the demonstrators and/or press/TV could jam the BTS communication systems, if they stray on to the same wavelength.

You said the problem was that the BTS control room uses wi-fi...

Wi-fi operates at about 2.4GHz over a short distance. I am not aware that demonstrators/press/TV crews are using high power, 2.4GHz transmitters......

Simon

[shunima]

Keep on whining... I like the BTS. One of the neat thingies that kept me happy on a daily basis while living in BKK for 10 yrs. Hope they get it fixed and resume their services that are a huge benefit for the city and its citizens.

[kaobang]

Bts?of course run by idiots..where else in the world people need to queue 2 times,to get the coins first,and then the tickets.eventually 3 queues waiting for room on the platforms.it takes 15 minutes freom thonglo to siam,but 30 minutes to get the ticket.does it make any sense?

MRT and airportlink are so much better

[pedro01]

Station at Asok closed about 30 mins ago. Shutters down. No passengers being allowed in

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

So as of 2 pm, are the trains running or not???

[lomatopo]

Service re-commenced ~ 11:15 AM. I boarded at Asoke in-bound ~ 11:17 AM.

But reviewing Twitter I see the Sukhumvit Line closed down sometime later, but maybe now has re-re-opened?

Supposed to be a press conference at 2:00 PM.

Edited December 24, 2013 by lomatopo

[kaobang]

Service re-commenced ~ 11:15 AM. I boarded at Asoke in-bound ~ 11:17 AM.

after that it was re-suspended...look above

[Prbkk]

They are not running Sukhumvit line now and there is a terrible jam in Asoke.

[Scott]

Numerous off-topic posts and replies have been deleted. The situation has not been resolved. Please limit your comments to relevant information about the operational status of the BTS or related information.

[david555]

Somebody walking accross bangkok predicted he would close down whole BKK.......forgot ?

[alex8912]

Trains are running in and out of Chong Nonsi right now. I like the sky train. Never had a problem with it and use it many times per week. It's immaculate. If you don't want to line up twice get a rabbit card and fill it up from time to time when there are no lines at the window, simple! I bet half of you posters have broken down many more times over the last 14 years 5555!!!! if not daily! Merry Christmas! I hope some New Year resolutions involve more positive feedback. This forum is fun to read sometimes but posting gets so lame cause you never can say barely anything without so many old negative posters attacking you.

[Estrada]

Radio communications used by the demonstrators and/or press/TV could jam the BTS communication systems, if they stray on to the same wavelength.

You said the problem was that the BTS control room uses wi-fi...

Wi-fi operates at about 2.4GHz over a short distance. I am not aware that demonstrators/press/TV crews are using high power, 2.4GHz transmitters......

Simon

Wi-Fi operates at any frequency not just 2.4GHz. The Wi-Fi Alliance defines Wi-Fi as any "wireless local area network"

BTS Wi-Fi operates on BTS's frequency as a wireless local area network that links all the stations, signalling, trains and trackside equipment.

The problem is well known to BTS Engineers and they have been having intermittent problems with signal jamming due to local radio operators who stray near their frequency. In the past the system has been suffering momentary failures lasting up to a few minutes as the main control has to recalculate where all the trains are before resuming service after losing and then regaining communication. BTS engineers told me that the problems in the past were due to local taxi services, local and amateur radio, and that is a fact.

[Lakegeneve]

Anytime there is two drops of rain in NYC the subways get messed up. but at least there are alternatives there.

How many pax use the NYC system vs Thai BTS?

How old are the respective systems?

How extensive are the respective systems?

Please don't compare the BTS issues to those in nyc. NYC is constantly under real threat of terrorism, for example.

Can you imagine the Thais being able to thwart any would be terrorists? Not likely.

It's their first break down in 14 years of service. Even in Singapore, their MRT has broken down a few times this year for hours. Things like this happen, don't have to go into the 'Thailand sucks' rant.

Yes, I agree with that, BUT, I think what posters tend to forget is that the voiced displeasure of posters (like me) is not comprised of merely one facet of the issue. Rarely do people isolate issues that carefully and argue them individually. That's not the goal of the rants, anyway.

The BTS is a joke of a system.

The stations are designed without any focus on efficiency? I mean, ticket booths in the middle where people must cue to go into the system? Dumb. Criss-crossing traffic to enter and exit -- dumb. A complete lack of traffic engineering.

Signage lacking and improperly placed. For instance, you ever try to see what station you're at once the doors open? Often, it's not possible. That's dumb.

Capacity planning? Nope. Often, across several stations, there is not even enough room to get onto the platform. People tripping over each other getting off the world's slowest escalators.

Trains long enough? No - again capacity planning.

Enough places to hold oneself up (such as near where pax sit)? No. That's dumb.

What about these new station guard systems their putting online? How long does it take? But, they got wasteful TVs in each of them on both sides! Dumb.

What about the fact that by now there should have been 12 (TWELVE), not 2 (TWO), lines criss-crossing this unnavigable city. What happened? Corruption. That's pathetic.

So, before you attempt to be positive about the BTS, please take into account how much of a failure it is to live up to world class standards DESPITE being fairly new. Certainly not over a century old as some systems are.

EDIT:

Not to mention the food vendors and other exhibits and nonsense they have constantly clogging up the little bit of ill-designed space there. It's not only incredibly dumb, but dangerous.

Some of what you have written is pertinent, such as in relation to pax traffic flows, the ticketing modality and siting of ticketing offices. I'd agree with you that there are some major problems on those fronts. Some will be solved in time with a new ticketing system and expanded stations. Others will not.

However, much of what you wrote is just a whine over petty issues, eg. slow escalators (think about children & the elderly) or "station guard systems"??? What the is that? Are you referring to new half height Platform Screen Doors??? People whine & rant about public transport everywhere in the world as it cannot ever be perfect for all.

Half of what you have written displays a complete ignorance about how mass transit in Bangkok works. If you knew a bit more you'd probably be able to make some insightful, relevant criticism on point rather than displaying patent ignorance.

The BTSC (operator of the BTS) is a private company. It has nothing what so ever to do with building new metro lines in Bangkok. It only tenders to operate new lines.

That is the responsibility of the MRTA, BMA (which has funded & built the 3 BTS exts and subsequently contracted the BTSC to run them) and the SRT with policy coordination by the OTP and decision making by the Ministry of Transport. The MRTA is responsible for the Bearing to Samut Prakhan ext currently under construction as it is outside BMA city limits.

The BTSC, as a private company operating as a concessionaire aims to make a profit hence leading to a few of the problems you refer to. It was previously heavily indebted for the first 6 yrs of operating which is why extra rolling stock purchases hav been delayed by years thus leading to overcrowding - new train deliveries were also delayed at the production end. This lack of extra rolling stock has been a major problem and shows the fundamental flaw of a private concessionaire model that exists in BKK with different operators and different ticketing systems when the operator has insufficient cash (the same applies to the BMCL operator of the MRT). A well run govt agency would have the funds to purchase new stock to meet rising patronage as required.

We also have the problem of various govts agencies being responsible for different aspects of planning, decision making and implementation. Some of them compete with each other given the underlying politics involved and inter agency rivalry. If you added the 8 govt agencies agencies/depts responsible for mass transit with the 3 operator companies (the SRTET is a subsidiary of the SRT) you see that there is much scope for dysfunction and a lack of coordination.

Fundamentally, the mass transit model and framework in Bangkok is flawed - though it does work elsewhere. It makes little sense and has worked poorly especially within the political framework which exists in Thailand. The policy framework is conducive to vested influences dictating policy on which lines get built next rather than a transport needs based policy approach but that is not really a surprise is it. Some exts or new lines are some 5-10 years overdue, eg. the BTS ext from Mo Chit to Saphan Mai was originally meant to open in 2008 and yet we are still waiting for a tender!!! BKK is about 15 years behind from where it should be on expaning the metro network.

Ideally, a single govt agency funded by the central govt (as it involves 5 provinces) would be responsible for planning, building and managing a multi model system with a fully integrated ticketing system (train, bus, ferry). Unfortunately, that will never happen. (Though the integrated ticketing system is belatedly on the way)

At the end of the day the BTS is not perfect but most do say that it is a great transit system. Clearly, you disagree which is why you are entitled to avoid it and be stuck in traffic on a bus or in a taxi. The main thing is that the choice exists. If you knew BKK in the 80s or 90s, that was not the case.

[Lakegeneve]

^^^BTW, you might find some info in this thread useful as many of the same critiques have been made and you'll read about the frustrating constant delays in implementation of new lines. It alos includes a summary of all lines planned to be built, http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/406991-the-new-skytrain/page-11#entry7200402

This is what the metro & SRT suburban network is eventually planned look like by about 2030 or so,

[Prbkk]

Sukhumvit and Silom running again, half empty, at 3.15pm.

[webfact]

BTS clarifies 5 hour Skytrain suspended service due to door control computer software problem; cost company Bt5 million in damages /MCOT

[Crossy]

This would be related to the (belated) installation of Platform Edge Doors perhaps?

I feel a claim against the Contractor coming on.

[SOTIRIOS]

...it would be nice to have full disclosure....I don't feel safe on the Skytrain anyway....but I would like to know EXACTLY what went wrong....

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Dunno if it's related or not, but I noticed a couple of different times earlier this week, that arriving trains on the Sukhumvit line pulled in and stopped, but didn't open their doors.

Because the trains had stopped a foot or two or three short of exact line-up with the new station door-barriers. Then after a few seconds, the trains inched forward 1-2-3 feet,

paused and then the doors opened normally.

Dunno if that's the drivers getting used to the new station door barriers in operations, or the control system having problems precisely locating the train stopping points.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Not seeing any updates here on this from the BTS end of things...

But I see the BKK Post on their website is saying a BTS official told Thai PBS TV this morning that the problem occurred during the "testing of a new system."

What new system?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Well, I guess BTS is saying this was related to the Platform Screen Doors system.

https://www.facebook.com/SkyTrain.BTS/posts/553613078058431

And a Google Translate version of the Thai version:

Identify the reason for the failure BTS !

BTS opening statement the car failure.

Posted at 14:00 AM on Tuesday, December 24, 2556 bankok Executive Chairman and Chairman of the Board Dr. Arbhabhirama Management

and Mr. Laoha Anya Director and Chief Operating Officer Company. Bangkok Mass Transit System Public Company Limited ( ),

along with Mr. Thomas Godfrey, Regional Engineering Director Diego 's company Bombardier . Trans Sport Interactive Signal ( Thailand) Co., Ltd. has

released a statement to the press .

BTS Skytrain case of failure. This resulted in two lines along the BTS Silom and Sukhumvit Line . Not available normally from 06.00 pm of the same day.
For the cause of the failure is caused by the company . Has installed a fence. Automatic gate barrier and the platform (Platform Screen Doors PSD)

on the station to enhance the safety of passengers. After the installation is completed. To test the system before launch.

The test was performed after the system service time is from 24.00 am onwards at this company. Tested in Silom line finished.

During the test, the Sukhumvit Line , which appears to have found a defective signaling system .

At approximately 3:00 am on Tuesday morning at 24 December 2556, which affected the system control bus failure.

I have checked and corrected immediately accelerated .

Mr. Tong said the preliminary investigation by the company. Bombardier Diego is expected to be the cause of the PSD system reinstallation.

This makes communication system bus control system failure. Currently, the Company and Bombardier Diego Airport .

Accelerated to modify the system to return to work . And try to open as much as possible. Until after 24:00 tonight to make a thorough examination .

And correct problems before 06.00 am the next day. As well as a way to prevent another failure .

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Here's a better version from the BTS corporate website in English:

http://www.bts.co.th/corporate/en/03-news-pr.aspx?page=1&show=111

Bangkok Mass Transit System Public Company Limited led by Mr. Keeree Kanjanapas, Executive Chairman & Chief Executive Officer;
Dr. Anat Arbhabhirama, Chairman of Management Committee; Mr. Surapong Laoha-Unya, Director & Chief Operating Officer together
with Mr. Thomas Godfrey, Regional Engineering Director of BOMBARDIER held a press conference at the Meeting Room, BTSC Head Office on Phahonyothin Road.

Bangkok Mass Transit System Public Company Limited (BTSC) reported that on Tuesday 24^th December 2013 at approximately 05.50 a.m,
the BTS SkyTrain service was disrupted due to a technical fault in the train operating system on both Silom and Sukhumvit Lines.
As this impacted services throughout the system, all BTS stations were temporarily closed.

Mr Keeree explained that the cause of the failure was connected with the commissioning test of recently completed installation of new Platform Screen Doors(PSD),
prior to operational launch. The testing and commissioning had been conducted after train operating hours, with the process having already been completed
on the Silom Line, with the Sukhumvit Line still in progress. The failure was found in the signaling system at 03.00 a.m. on Tuesday 24^th December 2013,
which affected the train control system.

Mr. Keeree added that the investigation conducted by Bombardier( BTSC resignalling contractor ) found that the cause of the failure may have occurred
due to the software upgrades associated with the newly installed PSDs. The Company and Bombardier have taken urgent steps to rectify the failure
to enable normal service to resume. After midnight on 24^th the company will conduct additional testing and closely monitor the proper functioning of the system
throughout the night, to ensure that the BTS SkyTrain system is operating as usual and to analyse ways of preventing any future system failures.

And the BTS website has a message scrolling that says:

***Normal service of the BTS SkyTrain resumed at 01.07 p.m.***

Edited December 24, 2013 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[StreetCowboy]

If you want a bit of random speculation, I'd guess from the information released to date that they were testing the interface with the platform gates last night, trialling a test version of the signalling software, and they had a problem cutting back into the operational signalling system. The Facebook page says as much.

EDIT: We have that to look forward to in KL, when the new 4 - car trains and platform edge gates enter service on the monorail...

SC

Edited December 24, 2013 by StreetCowboy

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

This little nugget was in ThaiVisa's daily recap thread from earlier in the afternoon, but no mention of it seems to have been made here.

Just to be clear, this problem was remedied earlier in the afternoon. But the post below adds some detail about what happened during the second shutdown on the Suk Line.

Posted Today, 13:02

Skytrain service of Asoke station goes down again
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- Skytrain service at Asoke station is still not resumed despite BTS’s announcement that all services were in place after the break-down early morning.

BTS is fixing the problem as there were some passengers trapped in a car when the function at Asoke station went down.


-- The Nation 2013-12-24

Edited December 24, 2013 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[PaullyW]

Radio communications used by the demonstrators and/or press/TV could jam the BTS communication systems, if they stray on to the same wavelength.

You said the problem was that the BTS control room uses wi-fi...

Wi-fi operates at about 2.4GHz over a short distance. I am not aware that demonstrators/press/TV crews are using high power, 2.4GHz transmitters......

Simon

Wi-Fi operates at any frequency not just 2.4GHz. The Wi-Fi Alliance defines Wi-Fi as any "wireless local area network"

BTS Wi-Fi operates on BTS's frequency as a wireless local area network that links all the stations, signalling, trains and trackside equipment.

The problem is well known to BTS Engineers and they have been having intermittent problems with signal jamming due to local radio operators who stray near their frequency. In the past the system has been suffering momentary failures lasting up to a few minutes as the main control has to recalculate where all the trains are before resuming service after losing and then regaining communication. BTS engineers told me that the problems in the past were due to local taxi services, local and amateur radio, and that is a fact.

Is it normal to use a wireless system for such mission critical infrastructure? That seems very dumb indeed.

[whybother]

Radio communications used by the demonstrators and/or press/TV could jam the BTS communication systems, if they stray on to the same wavelength.

You said the problem was that the BTS control room uses wi-fi...

Wi-fi operates at about 2.4GHz over a short distance. I am not aware that demonstrators/press/TV crews are using high power, 2.4GHz transmitters......

Simon

Wi-Fi operates at any frequency not just 2.4GHz. The Wi-Fi Alliance defines Wi-Fi as any "wireless local area network"

BTS Wi-Fi operates on BTS's frequency as a wireless local area network that links all the stations, signalling, trains and trackside equipment.

The problem is well known to BTS Engineers and they have been having intermittent problems with signal jamming due to local radio operators who stray near their frequency. In the past the system has been suffering momentary failures lasting up to a few minutes as the main control has to recalculate where all the trains are before resuming service after losing and then regaining communication. BTS engineers told me that the problems in the past were due to local taxi services, local and amateur radio, and that is a fact.

Is it normal to use a wireless system for such mission critical infrastructure? That seems very dumb indeed.

Yeah. They should have the trains connected up with wires. Real stretchy ones.

Sent from my phone ...

[rreddin]

Only in Thailand, does this country not realize that they are just the laughing stock of the civiliesd world.

Jeebus, get a grip.

Mass transit systems have outages frequently. Some such as the London tube have catastrophic fires. The Paris and Montreal Metro systems have stoppages. The NYC transit system often has a line down for a period on any given day. Do I need to go on?

Sh*t happens. Life goes on. No one outside BKK cares.

"No one outside BKK cares." How true that is.