Camerata's Guide To The Permanent Residence Process

[Mario2008]

Your tabien baan is the ultimate proof.

[NewlyMintedThai]

None of that is needed for you now.

[GabbaGabbaHey]

Great. Thanks for the confirmation.

[Dork]

My experience is that if you get the Permanent Resident's ID card, apart from immigration & leaving the country, you will never need any of those books again. Doing any kind of commercial transaction or dealing with bureaucracy is much easier because most systems in Thailand are designed for the combination of ID card and Tabien Baan. Handing over a passport, residence certificate, alien certificate and work permit perplexes most clerks because their computer systems don't have fields for those documents.

[onthemoon]

My experience is that if you get the Permanent Resident's ID card, apart from immigration & leaving the country, you will never need any of those books again. Doing any kind of commercial transaction or dealing with bureaucracy is much easier because most systems in Thailand are designed for the combination of ID card and Tabien Baan. Handing over a passport, residence certificate, alien certificate and work permit perplexes most clerks because their computer systems don't have fields for those documents.

I'd love to have one of those "Permanent Resident's ID cards" but am afraid they don't exist.

I'm still in the game for a pink ID card, but I don't think this is what you are referring to. The normal thing for a PR holder to get is the blue PR book and the red Alien Registration

book. There is no standard ID card for PR holders, unfortunately.

I'd love it if you proved me wrong.

Edited December 14, 2013 by onthemoon

[Arkady]

My experience is that if you get the Permanent Resident's ID card, apart from immigration & leaving the country, you will never need any of those books again. Doing any kind of commercial transaction or dealing with bureaucracy is much easier because most systems in Thailand are designed for the combination of ID card and Tabien Baan. Handing over a passport, residence certificate, alien certificate and work permit perplexes most clerks because their computer systems don't have fields for those documents.

I'd love to have one of those "Permanent Resident's ID cards" but am afraid they don't exist.

I'm still in the game for a pink ID card, but I don't think this is what you are referring to. The normal thing for a PR holder to get is the blue PR book and the red Alien Registration

book. There is no standard ID card for PR holders, unfortunately.

I'd love it if you proved me wrong.

PR ID cards don't exist but there is a pink ID card for non-Thais that, according to the letter of the regulations, PRs are all supposed to have, since around 2008 when a lot of new regs were written pursuant to the 2008 Civil Registration Act amendments. Many district offices refuse to believe their own regulations and won't issue the pink cards to PRs but some have been successful in obtaining them. Most of the people who get these cards are stateless persons who are not permitted to travel outside their districts without permission, as stated on the back of the card. Since some stateless persons in these districts are eligible for PR, the original intention may have been that all non-citizens in these districts should have the cards to make things easier for them and the authorities. The travel restriction does not apply to PRs but is still on their cards. Another type of pink card is issued to workers from neighboring countries. It looks identical at first glance but in fact has details of their employer and a different legend on the back. Previously there were different coloured cards for different minorities etc but making the minority/PR and the foreign labourers' cards all pink and looking the same has caused a lot of confusion amongst the public and district office staff.

See thread http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/590057-thai-non-thai-id-card-for-permanent-residents/

[CMexpat]

My residence book is full of stamps and I need to get a new one. What dokuments are required? Can I do this at Chaeng Wattana?

Yes at CW. Passport, residence book, alien book and tabien baan, photographs, completed application form (available online) and some of the folding stuff for the fee. It takes a few days for a new book. You can either have the old re-entry permit transferred over or, if it is close to expiry, you can get a new 12 month one and new 12 month visa in your passport. The choice is yours.

Slightly incorrect.

I was at CW this week for a new residence book. This will take 4 days to process.

They will NOT transfer the old re-entry permit to the new book, and have told me I must apply and pay for a new one for 12 months.

Not sure what my docs in relation to Brit or Angkrit, because they have kept them, and I am currently without any ID.

I was told that it would take 4 days, when I explained that I did not have so much time in BKK they offered to process the whole thing in 2 days. Thumbs up to them!! I did pay for a new re-entry permit in the new book, but the old one was expired. I do not think that they will transfer old ones into a new PR.

Edited: Deleted what appeared to formatting code. Ubonjoe

[Arkady]

My residence book is full of stamps and I need to get a new one. What dokuments are required? Can I do this at Chaeng Wattana?

Yes at CW. Passport, residence book, alien book and tabien baan, photographs, completed application form (available online) and some of the folding stuff for the fee. It takes a few days for a new book. You can either have the old re-entry permit transferred over or, if it is close to expiry, you can get a new 12 month one and new 12 month visa in your passport. The choice is yours.

Slightly incorrect.

I was at CW this week for a new residence book. This will take 4 days to process.

They will NOT transfer the old re-entry permit to the new book, and have told me I must apply and pay for a new one for 12 months.

Not sure what my docs in relation to Brit or Angkrit, because they have kept them, and I am currently without any ID.

I was told that it would take 4 days, when I explained that I did not have so much time in BKK they offered to process the whole thing in 2 days. Thumbs up to them!! I did pay for a new re-entry permit in the new book, but the old one was expired. I do not think that they will transfer old ones into a new PR.

Edited: Deleted what appeared to formatting code. Ubonjoe

I was offered the option of transferring the old visa some years ago but it seems they no longer offer that.

[onthemoon]

They don't transfer the visa any more, but you can use the visa in the old passport to re-entry. Been there, done that.

[Bangel72]

Has anyone still in the PR pending queue had their six monthly visa extension done in recent weeks?

I normally do this at Chaeng Wattana, is it impacted by the demonstrations and are there any alternative venues in play?

I noticed they had alternatives for 90 days notice but it's rare that anyone apart from the PR desk in Chaeng Wattana know much about the PR pending visa.

Cheers for any info, thanks.

[Mario2008]

See here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/695053-bangkok-immigration-opens-additional-offices-during-demonstrations/

There are two temporary offices you can turn to.

But call first to see which one is best for you.

Edit: List of phone numbers http://bangkok.immigration.go.th/tel.html

[ubonjoe]

There is also a list of temporary numbers here: http://bangkok.immigration.go.th/tel.html

[GabbaGabbaHey]

I imagine this has been covered somewhere in this thread so sorry for asking again: is the red book mandatory to carry when travelling outside Thailand? Anyone knows?

[onthemoon]

I imagine this has been covered somewhere in this thread so sorry for asking again: is the red book mandatory to carry when travelling outside Thailand? Anyone knows?

The answer is a clear No.

You do need to bring the blue book with you when travelling abroad, though.

[onthemoon]

I imagine this has been covered somewhere in this thread so sorry for asking again: is the red book mandatory to carry when travelling outside Thailand? Anyone knows?

The answer is a clear No.

You do need to bring the blue book with you when travelling abroad, though.

I mean: No, you don't need to bring the red book (rather than: No, nobody knows).

Sorry for the confusion.

[Arkady]

The Satish Seghal deportation case seems to be a good example of a government using a sledge hammer to crush a nut. Even though Satish seems to have overstepped the mark as a foreigner, it is amazing to see the amount of time and effort that the Immigration Commission, the Immigration Bureau, the Interior Ministry et al has put in just to make a vindictive point that changes nothing in the political game. And it is not yet finished as Seghal is seeking a civil court injunction, filing a case with the Administrative Court and has filed an appeal to HMK.

I note that the head of the Immigration Bureau has commented that 8 PRs have been deported since 2002 - none of them made the headlines and he didn't elaborate on the nature of their offences. The Immigration Act allows an appeal but only to the Immigration Commission which is the same body issuing the order to terminate PR. There is no requirement to allow the defendant to appear before the commission at any point. However, since Administrative Court was set up, everyone has the right to appeal a government decision there. I also note that the Immigration Bureau was initially reluctant to pursue the case, pointing out the likelihood of the defendant appealing in the Administrative Court and obviously not wanting the hassle and the risk of a humiliating defeat. I would guess that the 8 PRs deported since 2002 were convicted of criminal offences with a court recommendation for deportation which would be very clear cut for Immigration to deal with.

What the case really highlights is that these governement agencies can pull out all the stops for political reasons and convene several meetings of the Immigration Commission etc at very short notice. If they put the same energies into processing PR applicants, they could probably have got through the whole backlog in the same time.

BTW this is not intended to open a political discussion on the Seghal case. There are other threads for that. Just interesting for PRs and PR applicants to see the process of termination of PR in action.

[tamvine]

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The Satish Seghal deportation case seems to be a good example of a government using a sledge hammer to crush a nut.

Even though Satish seems to have overstepped the mark as a foreigner, it is amazing to see the amount of time and effort that the Immigration Commission, the Immigration Bureau, the Interior Ministry et al has put in just to make a vindictive point that changes nothing in the political game. And it is not yet finished as Seghal is seeking a civil court injunction, filing a case with the Administrative Court and has filed an appeal to HMK.

I note that the head of the Immigration Bureau has commented that 8 PRs have been deported since 2002 - none of them made the headlines and he didn't elaborate on the nature of their offences. The Immigration Act allows an appeal but only to the Immigration Commission which is the same body issuing the order to terminate PR. There is no requirement to allow the defendant to appear before the commission at any point. However, since Administrative Court was set up, everyone has the right to appeal a government decision there.

What the case really highlights is that these governement agencies can pull out all the stops for political reasons and convene several meetings of the Immigration Commission etc at very short notice. If they put the same energies into processing PR applicants, they could probably have got through the whole backlog in the same time.

Can't agree more with the Naked Truth. Kudos to Arkady for exposing the absolute truth.

[sas_cars]

The Satish Seghal deportation case seems to be a good example of a government using a sledge hammer to crush a nut. Even though Satish seems to have overstepped the mark as a foreigner, it is amazing to see the amount of time and effort that the Immigration Commission, the Immigration Bureau, the Interior Ministry et al has put in just to make a vindictive point that changes nothing in the political game. And it is not yet finished as Seghal is seeking a civil court injunction, filing a case with the Administrative Court and has filed an appeal to HMK.

I note that the head of the Immigration Bureau has commented that 8 PRs have been deported since 2002 - none of them made the headlines and he didn't elaborate on the nature of their offences. The Immigration Act allows an appeal but only to the Immigration Commission which is the same body issuing the order to terminate PR. There is no requirement to allow the defendant to appear before the commission at any point. However, since Administrative Court was set up, everyone has the right to appeal a government decision there. I also note that the Immigration Bureau was initially reluctant to pursue the case, pointing out the likelihood of the defendant appealing in the Administrative Court and obviously not wanting the hassle and the risk of a humiliating defeat. I would guess that the 8 PRs deported since 2002 were convicted of criminal offences with a court recommendation for deportation which would be very clear cut for Immigration to deal with.

What the case really highlights is that these governement agencies can pull out all the stops for political reasons and convene several meetings of the Immigration Commission etc at very short notice. If they put the same energies into processing PR applicants, they could probably have got through the whole backlog in the same time.

BTW this is not intended to open a political discussion on the Seghal case. There are other threads for that. Just interesting for PRs and PR applicants to see the process of termination of PR in action.

This is not limited to the PR holders. I guess even a naturalized guy's citizenship can also be revoked and he/she be deported due to these political conflicts.

[skyaslimit]

The Satish Seghal deportation case seems to be a good example of a government using a sledge hammer to crush a nut. Even though Satish seems to have overstepped the mark as a foreigner, it is amazing to see the amount of time and effort that the Immigration Commission, the Immigration Bureau, the Interior Ministry et al has put in just to make a vindictive point that changes nothing in the political game. And it is not yet finished as Seghal is seeking a civil court injunction, filing a case with the Administrative Court and has filed an appeal to HMK.

I note that the head of the Immigration Bureau has commented that 8 PRs have been deported since 2002 - none of them made the headlines and he didn't elaborate on the nature of their offences. The Immigration Act allows an appeal but only to the Immigration Commission which is the same body issuing the order to terminate PR. There is no requirement to allow the defendant to appear before the commission at any point. However, since Administrative Court was set up, everyone has the right to appeal a government decision there. I also note that the Immigration Bureau was initially reluctant to pursue the case, pointing out the likelihood of the defendant appealing in the Administrative Court and obviously not wanting the hassle and the risk of a humiliating defeat. I would guess that the 8 PRs deported since 2002 were convicted of criminal offences with a court recommendation for deportation which would be very clear cut for Immigration to deal with.

What the case really highlights is that these governement agencies can pull out all the stops for political reasons and convene several meetings of the Immigration Commission etc at very short notice. If they put the same energies into processing PR applicants, they could probably have got through the whole backlog in the same time.

BTW this is not intended to open a political discussion on the Seghal case. There are other threads for that. Just interesting for PRs and PR applicants to see the process of termination of PR in action.

This is not limited to the PR holders. I guess even a naturalized guy's citizenship can also be revoked and he/she be deported due to these political conflicts.

Very True

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[ubonjoe]

It is a much harder to take away Thai nationality than PR. The final approval has to be done by the King. This from a quick read of the nationality act.

[simon43]

The message that is very clear (IMHO), is that a holder of PR is not a Thai citizen and has no rights afforded to Thai citizens. They definitely should not meddle in politics (of any persuasion).

Simon

[Arkady]

Naturalised Thais can lose Thai nationality for offences against social order and national security, the process being the reverse of the application process, i.e. starting with special branch, up to the Committee for Nationality and then to the minister.

It would indeed be much harder to do because there would be the issue of your constitutional right to freedom of expression as a Thai and maybe the risk of a case in the Constitutional Court as well as the Administrative Court.

We are informed that 8 people were stripped of their PR and deported since 2002 but I have not been able to find a single case of revocation of nationality from a naturalised Thai announced in the Royal Gazette. There are many announcements of revocation of nationality of people who were Thai through birth in Thailand to 2 alien parents (since 1971 both must have PR) either for staying abroad for more than 5 years or for committing a serious criminal offence like drug smuggling.

[enflips]

Was informed yesterday by an immigration official that PR for 'aliens' is no longer available

Can anyone confirm or deny this ?? PLEASE

[ubonjoe]

Was informed yesterday by an immigration official that PR for 'aliens' is no longer available

Can anyone confirm or deny this ?? PLEASE

He probably meant that you cannot apply now. Applications are only accepted in December.

PR is still possible.

[skyaslimit]

Dear all, most of you know that I was granted PR in 2012, I never done any endorsements because I never left Thailand since, my passport expires late last month and I did a renewal, my question is, I am not planning to leave Thailand in near future, I do need a renewal of my driver' s licence soon but I am holding a plain brand new blank passport without any stamps what so ever, any experience/ suggestions will be highly appreciate

Sent from my A088 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[camerata]

When I applied for my driver's licence at Mor Chit they absolutely insisted I have a valid re-entry visa in my passport. They even brought out a supervisor to assure me this was necessary, but no one could give me a reason why. I mentioned this to Immigration when I went to get the re-entry/endorsement and they said, "Maybe they don't understand the rules."

[skyaslimit]

When I applied for my driver's licence at Mor Chit they absolutely insisted I have a valid re-entry visa in my passport. They even brought out a supervisor to assure me this was necessary, but no one could give me a reason why. I mentioned this to Immigration when I went to get the re-entry/endorsement and they said, "Maybe they don't understand the rules."

How long ago?

[camerata]

3 or 4 years ago.

[asiaexpat]

Early this year when I renewed my 5 year at Suk 99 location they insisted on copies of my passport and the current permuted to stay stamp page. Although I have a Tabien Baan and Thai ID number they used the passport number for my DL number this time. So I would suggest a trip to Immigration and have Permit to stay stamp transferred to the new passport.

[Dork]

If you get the Alien ID (pink) ID card for Permanent Residents, the Land Transport department are happy with that and a copy of your Tabien Baan. You don't need anything else.