Aliens, are they leaving?,if so why?

[Ulysses G.]

I don't agree with any of this " nonsense " of how things are more expensive! If you are a single farang living alone in Chiang Mai ( or anywhere else in Thailand ) and like myself you are " not materialistic " ie you rent a nice house for under 3,000 baht and ride a bicycle and don't drink/smoke and keep away from farang food you can live on under 8,000 baht a month " all in " easy!!!! I think that is very reasonable! don't know many places in the world that you can live on that amount of money! Most of Thailand is 3rd World with 3rd World prices.I read on here about farang renting condos in Chiang Mai City for 9,000 baht a month but when I was there a few weeks ago most were on average at 3,500 baht a month and lovely!!!

How about the noise level in these 3500 THB/mo condos? Any idea?

It just depends on the building and where the unit is located. Also, some are very comfortable all year round with no air-con, but it is hard to tell which ones without actually trying it for a while.

[Konini]

All I know about immigration is that last month I went for my renewal (online booking), the place was heaving, lots of tourist's getting extensions and 3 out of 4 names called seemed to be from China.

I concur with you on this. Although last month was only the third time we've been to immigration, I've never noticed any Chinese there; this time there were lots of them, although from what I could see they weren't doing tourist extensions, but student/education extensions

[dave2]

re

How about the guy who walks around in the Japanese soldier uniform?

hes still here coz i saw him in sridonchai road last week but a friend of mr preyuth must have had a word in his shell like coz ive not seen him wear one of his uniforms and he has about three different ones since this coup began

northern john .... the blue shorts man was legal as far as i know coz he used to do visa runs with me in 05

the deaf aid man from johns place was the same i think coz i ran into him getting one in vientiene in about 09

of the three others ... one couldnt come up with the 800 thousand or enough of an income and the other two couldnt do any more tourist / visa runs so they all went to cambodia where the visa rules are easier

dave2

[mesquite]

re

How about the guy who walks around in the Japanese soldier uniform?

hes still here coz i saw him in sridonchai road last week but a friend of mr preyuth must have had a word in his shell like coz ive not seen him wear one of his uniforms and he has about three different ones since this coup began

northern john .... the blue shorts man was legal as far as i know coz he used to do visa runs with me in 05

the deaf aid man from johns place was the same i think coz i ran into him getting one in vientiene in about 09

of the three others ... one couldnt come up with the 800 thousand or enough of an income and the other two couldnt do any more tourist / visa runs so they all went to cambodia where the visa rules are easier

dave2

"Let us be happy in our work"

[Lancelot]

Anyone has any data that would suggest foreigners are leaving? My subjective view is rather the opposite, still more foreigners moving to Thailand.

I agree. I see plenty of foreign tourists and expats in Chiang Mai.

[Showbags]

Even the aliens think thailand is weird.....after that star wars bar, you'd think they could handle anything....to many hubs for them to navigate

[Konini]

How about the noise level in these 3500 THB/mo condos? Any idea?

It just depends on the building and where the unit is located. Also, some are very comfortable all year round with no air-con, but it is hard to tell which ones without actually trying it for a while.

Which is why I always recommend that people stay somewhere for 6 months before committing to a longer lease or spending any money making things more comfortable.

On September 1st we clocked over 6 months, and have made the decision to stay put until we're brought out in boxes, barring anything so drastic happening that we can't. Very unlikely.

We've been in Malaysia for the last week, fly back this afternoon, and tomorrow morning we're going down to Thai Visa Assist. Hopefully we will have a Non-O visa which has been converted to an extension based on retirement by the end of the week, and the workmen in by the end of next week.

[worgeordie]

I see Chiang Mai was voted 4th out of 7 best places to retire

in the Huffington Post,just hope it encourages a few more

people looking for a place to retire,as have house to let,

the more the better,I am sure other Farang businesses

will be hoping the same.

regards worgeordie

[Chiengmaijoe]

I see Chiang Mai was voted 4th out of 7 best places to retire

in the Huffington Post,just hope it encourages a few more

people looking for a place to retire,as have house to let,

the more the better,I am sure other Farang businesses

will be hoping the same.

regards worgeordie

I think there are already too many farangs in Chiang Mai. For the sake of peace and harmony and maintaining a balance, I hope there won't be any increase. Most people in the UK wouldn't say 'the more the better' as regards to immigration and I'm apt to agree. Most communities can handle a certain level of immigration, but once it gets over that level the locals feel uneasy. It's human nature and it should be recognised. Edited September 8, 2014 by Chiengmaijoe

[evenstevens]

after 10 or so days on the board,some 11 pages,and 250 replies

there is not one peice of factual evidence,that aliens are leaving c/mai

all replies are hypothetically , including mine

so to the o/p

its all bulldust,and let sleeping dogs lye

a very nice evening to all

[pgrahmm]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I see Chiang Mai was voted 4th out of 7 best places to retire
in the Huffington Post,just hope it encourages a few more
people looking for a place to retire,as have house to let,
the more the better,I am sure other Farang businesses
will be hoping the same.

regards worgeordie

I think there are already too many farangs in Chiang Mai. For the sake of peace and harmony and maintaining a balance, I hope there won't be any increase. Most people in the UK wouldn't say 'the more the better' as regards to immigration and I'm apt to agree. Most communities can handle a certain level of immigration, but once it gets over that level the locals feel uneasy. It's human nature and it should be recognised.

I agree - my family laughs when I say too many farangs.....can't stand to go to CM and look around some times + make sure it's at a minimum during high season....but I don't the numbers have gone up while the quality/rudeness/arrogance/unruly appearance/crazy entitled rent-a-bikers and pedestrians & shoppers - that's not even touching the Chinese influx which has it's own set of wonderment attached.....the Thai's will never get tired of the possibilty of $$$$$ <> but you can tell from watching from afar they're tired of the rudeness and antics.....It use to be the Pai clinger types were mostly just that Pai'd but it seems more and more that the quality has dimished....sadly, from a lot of what I've seen I don't want the Thai's to lump us all in the same catagory - especially when it's heading in the wrong direction.....I acutally feel I have a duty to protect my family from some of them.....

Edited September 8, 2014 by pgrahmm

[DaamNaam]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

[daveAustin]

I don't agree with any of this " nonsense " of how things are more expensive! If you are a single farang living alone in Chiang Mai ( or anywhere else in Thailand ) and like myself you are " not materialistic " ie you rent a nice house for under 3,000 baht and ride a bicycle and don't drink/smoke and keep away from farang food you can live on under 8,000 baht a month " all in " easy!!!! I think that is very reasonable! don't know many places in the world that you can live on that amount of money! Most of Thailand is 3rd World with 3rd World prices.I read on here about farang renting condos in Chiang Mai City for 9,000 baht a month but when I was there a few weeks ago most were on average at 3,500 baht a month and lovely!!!

Yes it can be done, though I think I'd prefer to be in the ground if it came to that.

[Chiengmaijoe]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

So you don't think that at some point you ever go beyond welcoming foreigners to feeling insecure because there are too many. There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it. We're not at that level yet, but at the same I think we are past the optimum. When I first came to Chiang Mai foreigners automatically got a high level of respect, irrespective of age. That certainly isn't true today and at a guess the huge increase in numbers has a large part to play In that.

Using a quote from a rock band to justify your argument isn't the most convincing of statements.

As regards to the question are they leaving? Yes they've always left, only to be replaced by new arrivals, and I don't think we're at a stage where departures exceed arrivals. Probably the reverse is still true.

Edited September 8, 2014 by Chiengmaijoe

[Chiengmaijoe]

I don't agree with any of this " nonsense " of how things are more expensive! If you are a single farang living alone in Chiang Mai ( or anywhere else in Thailand ) and like myself you are " not materialistic " ie you rent a nice house for under 3,000 baht and ride a bicycle and don't drink/smoke and keep away from farang food you can live on under 8,000 baht a month " all in " easy!!!! I think that is very reasonable! don't know many places in the world that you can live on that amount of money! Most of Thailand is 3rd World with 3rd World prices.I read on here about farang renting condos in Chiang Mai City for 9,000 baht a month but when I was there a few weeks ago most were on average at 3,500 baht a month and lovely!!!

There are those that argue that this sort of simple life leads to you living longer. Most research disproved that, and concluded that you don't actually live longer, it just feels like it.

[Chiengmaijoe]

Just received the CCC Classified Ads and there are about 45 properties,houses, condo's apartments etc for rent this week.

The number available just demonstrates a surplus of properties becoming vacant recently and many are OK with a 6 month lease, whereas a couple of years ago it was rare to see so many places on this site, let alone a six month lease. I think people are leaving and I also believe landlords are becoming desperate because of this, just look at any agency and there is a surplus of places the like of which has never been seen before. It is most definitely a renters market at the moment whether it be for the rental cost or length of lease, so a good time to grab yourself a bargain.

Probably more to do with a property building boom than an exodus.

[Konini]

There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it.

I would actually say that none of the locals like it.

For those that doubt the possibility of this, 2 examples immediately sprang to my mind:

Fiji - locals are outnumbered by ethnic Indians. Entirely the fault of the British Empire who were unable to find sufficient 'natives' to work the sugar plantations and imported Indians en mass to ensure sufficient production and profit. Historically likely to have rather a lot more than the average 2.5 children, there are now more ethnic Indians than native Fijians. Ethnic Indians win the general election, get into power, Uncle Rambuka comes along with his military coup in 1987. Fiji has had more (3?) military coups since and I believe are under military rule at the moment. A sad and unresolvable problem, the majority of the population votes for the Indian polititans, and the army step in to cancel both the result of the election and democracy. Until the next election when the cycle begins all over again. Spot the parallel?

Malaysia - very simplified version - in a 1971 New Economic Policy designed to drastically increase the wealth of native Malya from about 2% of the entire county's wealth (and then in turn to boost the number of native Malays, who were rapidly becoming outnumbered by ethnic Chinese and Indians) provided some outrageous open discrimination which they called 'affirmative action'. By discrimination I'm talking preferential places at universities for those studying and at all government agencies for those in employment, many places where by law, only native Malays can be employed (including the new KL low cost carrier airport) , an allocation by law of 30% of all new housing projects have to be sold to Malays and must by law be sold at a 7% discount of the price of the lowest offered to ethnic Chinese and Indians, and this is all properties from the simplest apartment to multi-million dollar penthouses or mini-mansions in the suburbs. These properties can subsequently only be re-sold to native Malays and I heard (but didn'tthat the pay part if not all of the loan repayments. That's just residential; commercial properties must have a discount of 10%, and the states can fiddle with the quota's, with some states having a minimum of 70% residential and 40% commercial allotments and discounts range between 5% and 15%. Oh, and when native Malays hit the magical number of having 5 children, they get a monthly allowance for having a large family, so they have large families while ethnic Chinese and Indians tend to have 2 or 3 children at most.

Many will not believe me or think I'm exaggerating; I'm not, and the facts and figures are easily checked out. I love Malaysia, would love to live there, but until BN, the coalition party who have been in power since independence from England 57 years ago are removed and the system of discrimination which is in my opinion apartheid by any other name, there's no chance of me going there to live.

This is only 2 relatively recent examples of what can happen when the locals are, or think they are heading towards, being outnumbered.

[jaideeguy]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

And to quote a line from another artist of the same era................

'They paved paradise and put up a parking lot' [Joni Mitchel]

not really a bad idea here with the lack of parking....................

[worgeordie]

after 10 or so days on the board,some 11 pages,and 250 replies

there is not one peice of factual evidence,that aliens are leaving c/mai

all replies are hypothetically , including mine

so to the o/p

its all bulldust,and let sleeping dogs lye

a very nice evening to all

But you keep posting,thats why it wont die!

regards Worgeordie

[worgeordie]

I see Chiang Mai was voted 4th out of 7 best places to retire

in the Huffington Post,just hope it encourages a few more

people looking for a place to retire,as have house to let,

the more the better,I am sure other Farang businesses

will be hoping the same.

regards worgeordie

I think there are already too many farangs in Chiang Mai. For the sake of peace and harmony and maintaining a balance, I hope there won't be any increase. Most people in the UK wouldn't say 'the more the better' as regards to immigration and I'm apt to agree. Most communities can handle a certain level of immigration, but once it gets over that level the locals feel uneasy. It's human nature and it should be recognised.

Hi ChiangMaijoe,There are plenty of houses,condos,shopping malls,restaurants and lots of

businesses that would benefit from an increase in Aliens,(i said aliens,to include Asians and

other peoples not just Farangs} retiring here,the majority of aliens in Chiang Mai just get on

with their lives ,don't cause problems for the host country, tourists thats where problems can

occur.

Remember you are one of the "already too many Farangs",what are you going to do about

that ?.

Regards Worgeordie

[Berkshire]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

So you don't think that at some point you ever go beyond welcoming foreigners to feeling insecure because there are too many. There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it. We're not at that level yet, but at the same I think we are past the optimum. When I first came to Chiang Mai foreigners automatically got a high level of respect, irrespective of age. That certainly isn't true today and at a guess the huge increase in numbers has a large part to play In that.

Using a quote from a rock band to justify your argument isn't the most convincing of statements.

As regards to the question are they leaving? Yes they've always left, only to be replaced by new arrivals, and I don't think we're at a stage where departures exceed arrivals. Probably the reverse is still true.

In terms of too many foreigners, Pattaya and Phuket comes to mind. If we ever become like that, someone should just blow this place up to smithereens.

[Ulysses G.]

As far as I can tell, we have been right up there with Pattaya and Phuket, as far as foreigners living here, for decades already.

[hml367]

Foreigners that make the bulk of their income from foreigners in Chiang Mai would support more foreigners here. Not a non-biased opinion I would think.

I came from a place where foreigners outnumbered "locals" (a very long time before I got there. There was a saying similar to "the last foreigner syndrome". In other words, it was ok for the foreigner with the "no more sentiments" to be there, but no newer foreigners.

What the negative part of having more foreigners in Chiang Mai probably is the foreigners that come and want to change Chiang Mai: more Western food restaurants; more shopping malls; clear footpaths (compared to before); etc. Then complaining about the way Thais run their country, cities, businesses, etc., while all the time saying that they came to Chiang Mai because of its ambiance, people, food, etc.

In Chiang Mai province, I would say there is not that big of total area dedicated to foreigners, but the areas that are dedicated to foreigner type business and activities is certainly different to what long time Chiang Mai Thai citizens are used to.

[Berkshire]

As far as I can tell, we have been right up there with Pattaya and Phuket, as far as foreigners living here, for decades already.

I don't have the stats, but just from observation, it would seem foreigners make up a higher percentage of the population in Pattaya/Phuket than Chiang Mai at any given time (tourists included). But I will concede that there is a large expat population in Chiang Mai which seems to be getting larger every year. Perhaps what makes CM different are the types of expats that settle here.

[onthedarkside]

Off topic post removed.

[DaamNaam]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

So you don't think that at some point you ever go beyond welcoming foreigners to feeling insecure because there are too many. There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it. We're not at that level yet, but at the same I think we are past the optimum. When I first came to Chiang Mai foreigners automatically got a high level of respect, irrespective of age. That certainly isn't true today and at a guess the huge increase in numbers has a large part to play In that.

Using a quote from a rock band to justify your argument isn't the most convincing of statements.

As regards to the question are they leaving? Yes they've always left, only to be replaced by new arrivals, and I don't think we're at a stage where departures exceed arrivals. Probably the reverse is still true.

Nope.

Sounds like self centred balderdash to me.

[DaamNaam]

Foreigners that make the bulk of their income from foreigners in Chiang Mai would support more foreigners here. Not a non-biased opinion I would think.

I came from a place where foreigners outnumbered "locals" (a very long time before I got there. There was a saying similar to "the last foreigner syndrome". In other words, it was ok for the foreigner with the "no more sentiments" to be there, but no newer foreigners.

What the negative part of having more foreigners in Chiang Mai probably is the foreigners that come and want to change Chiang Mai: more Western food restaurants; more shopping malls; clear footpaths (compared to before); etc. Then complaining about the way Thais run their country, cities, businesses, etc., while all the time saying that they came to Chiang Mai because of its ambiance, people, food, etc.

In Chiang Mai province, I would say there is not that big of total area dedicated to foreigners, but the areas that are dedicated to foreigner type business and activities is certainly different to what long time Chiang Mai Thai citizens are used to.

If you think they are building shopping malls and fast food places for foreigners here you are sadly mistaken.

If we all left tomorrow life would carry on without so much as a glitch.

[pgrahmm]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

So you don't think that at some point you ever go beyond welcoming foreigners to feeling insecure because there are too many. There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it. We're not at that level yet, but at the same I think we are past the optimum. When I first came to Chiang Mai foreigners automatically got a high level of respect, irrespective of age. That certainly isn't true today and at a guess the huge increase in numbers has a large part to play In that.

Using a quote from a rock band to justify your argument isn't the most convincing of statements.

As regards to the question are they leaving? Yes they've always left, only to be replaced by new arrivals, and I don't think we're at a stage where departures exceed arrivals. Probably the reverse is still true.

Nope.

Sounds like self centred balderdash to me.

Respectfully do not agree....don't want to see Thailand Americanized/Russianized/Germanized/UKized/Japanesed/Chinesed or turned into main streets no different than a lot of places in the world....I want to see Thailand be Thailand as long as it can be (no bashing required or asked for).....that's part of it's charm.....

Hopefully the new powers that be will continue/start/monitor to handle the growth/demand/overstayers/undesireables/crooks/criminals/fringers/workers w/o permits - to control the influx.....

Growth will take place....hopefully it will be of quality - that said - watching the MacD's spring up is not a hopeful sight.....but maybe they'll play Eagles music there - somehow it matches.....

[DaamNaam]

Farangs saying there are too many farangs here is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Just insanity creeping in.

Talk about wanting your cake and eat it too.

The Eagles once sang "you call some place paradise you can kiss it goodbye". The Last Resort / Hotel California.

So you don't think that at some point you ever go beyond welcoming foreigners to feeling insecure because there are too many. There are plenty of places in the world where immigration has resulted in the locals being outnumbered and very often the locals don't like it. We're not at that level yet, but at the same I think we are past the optimum. When I first came to Chiang Mai foreigners automatically got a high level of respect, irrespective of age. That certainly isn't true today and at a guess the huge increase in numbers has a large part to play In that.

Using a quote from a rock band to justify your argument isn't the most convincing of statements.

As regards to the question are they leaving? Yes they've always left, only to be replaced by new arrivals, and I don't think we're at a stage where departures exceed arrivals. Probably the reverse is still true.

Nope.

Sounds like self centred balderdash to me.

Respectfully do not agree....don't want to see Thailand Americanized/Russianized/Germanized/UKized/Japanesed/Chinesed or turned into main streets no different than a lot of places in the world....I want to see Thailand be Thailand as long as it can be (no bashing required or asked for).....that's part of it's charm.....

Hopefully the new powers that be will continue/start/monitor to handle the growth/demand/overstayers/undesireables/crooks/criminals/fringers/workers w/o permits - to control the influx.....

Growth will take place....hopefully it will be of quality - that said - watching the MacD's spring up is not a hopeful sight.....but maybe they'll play Eagles music there - somehow it matches.....

Here's another Eagles tune that suits this topic, and your post.

Growth will not run in reverse as per your wishes.

Thats part of life, change.

Or in Buddhist Pali (Annicca / Impermanence).

Edited September 9, 2014 by DaamNaam

[Hisseho]

I chose to move to Chiang Mai (a few days) for two reasons:

- The beautiful surrounding countryside

- The significant presence of farang communities for a more varied life.

If you do not like there is always the possibility of settling in Nakhon Sawan or Phitsanulock. But nobody goes there.

I gather that many of us prefer cities populated by people of various origins.