Special report: Investigation into Koh Tao murders seriously flawed

[Jeremy50]

If Prayuth doesn't step in right now, tell the RTP to keep their mouths shut, get some Police/Military there who know what the <deleted> they are doing, stop making contradictory statements, and stop taking cash from the local big shots to "clear" them of any wrongdoing, then nothing will have changed here.

I think something has changed here. The whole world now knows that a foreigner on holiday in Thailand or an expat living in Thailand who is murdered can expect the same sort of investigation where the murderer is not caught or someone is fitted up for the crime i.e a migrant worker. The real murderer is free to murder again.

With your last sentence, you have hit the nail on the head! There are people on Koh Tao who look like they are going to get away with murder. There are people on Koh Tao who will realize that they can murder with impunity. So I ask you: Is that likely to make Koh Tao safer, or even less safe? And my final question: Who in their right mind would visit a place where murderers need not fear being apprehended? The place should be avoided - until the killers are brought to justice. By visiting the island, you are providing those criminals the money they use to buy their way out of responsibility for their actions.

The problem is, it is a tourist destination which attracts the 'Lonely Planet' crowd. They go where their 'bible' tells them to go - one place after another, millions of them following the 'trail' blindly. It's been this way for many years now. If Lonely Planet advised travelers not to go there it would cripple the place.

[littlebw]

I would take a closer look at the police, DNA them all

[pizzachang]

They failed to mention the most important police error, allowing boats to leave the island. Their first and statisticly most probable suspects were Burmese workers, (4000+) most undocumented so they will never know who was even on the island at the time. Everything from that point has been confusion and incompetence. Now the polite are resorting to blame mode for their failure. Game over, bad guys win.

Allowing anyone at all to leave the island was the first mistake but controlling the whole island would have required having police boats stationed in such a way as to cover every exit - a big job, to say the least. If they had done this, they could have focused on the DNA found in/on the female victim. Just a matter of elimination after that.

[greenchair]

Why would they expect to find a woman's DNA on the inside of a condom?

MAybe they were talking about no male DNA on the inside.

Ya think

[NCFC]

With the new condom revelation,

and the zero likelihood any rapist killer with a mafia angle would use a condom on anyone, much less a pretty blonde,

my new suspicion is, Miller and the girl were getting started,

he got hit from behind with the iron bar and then staggered, tried to fight, but was quickly drowned,

that takes two guys,

the third subdues the girl with the hoe,

then they go to town

This is a highly likely scenario but what doesn't make sense is the cigarette butt with Hannah's lipstick and DNA matching that taken from semen. Unless this evidence has been falsified to make it seem that Hannah knew her attackers?

[greenchair]

I believe that condom belongs to a now famous guy that has just left the country in a hurry.

Escorted by the embassy and thai police no less.

Hope i am wrong, but that would be a bit of a bungle of things wouldn't it.

[MJP]

I believe that condom belongs to a now famous guy that has just left the country in a hurry.

Escorted by the embassy and thai police no less.

Hope i am wrong, but that would be a bit of a bungle of things wouldn't it.

That someone needs bringing in.

[Chetzee]

an interesting article in todays Telegraph just appeared . It would be nice to thinks that everything about this case was not in the public domain .

[MJP]

an interesting article in todays Telegraph just appeared . It would be nice to thinks that everything about this case was not in the public domain .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11122966/Police-quiz-Thai-footballers-over-murder-of-British-backpackers.html

[greenchair]

One person had thought about the evidence that would be collected later. And took precautions. Not a Thai nor Burmese Thought process. They just get right on and commit the crime. And worry later. Most of them cannot even comprehend DNA evidence.

That is a foriegn trait through and through. Know your species mr police.

[Thai at Heart]

investigative journalists please step forward

If anyone ends up sending a twitter or brief e-mail to BBC Panorama as discussed in the other thread they may like to send a copy of the same one to Chris Masters , who is regarded as one of Australia's best investigative reporters. Although this murder involved British tourists without doubt a more in-depth coverage would be of great interest to Australians as well

Even if he isn't interested in covering this story himself, he is likely to know someone who could be interested

http://www.chrismasters.com.au/Welcome.html

Happy to oblige. If we all send Chris Masters a link to this discussion even if people are busy and think it's a bother.

This alone will assist our cause ...

Why not instead ask WHY Thai-people in general have not demanded justice in this case? Two foreigners have been brutally murdered in their country and do any of them really care? And why do they not care and demand justice? Why do they not request The General to solve this problem and become a part of all the people (Farangs), who wants to see the right killers get caught?

Why? Where are the smiling and decent buddhist Thai-people, when you need them? Could it be, because there is no personal financial gain in fighting corruption and nothing related to this, will effect them personally? Could it be, because they deep down really could care less of some farangs getting killed? Where are the Thais demanding justice?

Check the stats. There are murdered Thai people every day. There are car accidents, bus accidents, reckless driving, dangerous driving, dodgy doctors, dodgy nurses all killing people every day and they barely figure in the press.. And there most certainly will be no justice for them.

So why should they really expect or demand any difference for foreigners

[mojorison]

If Prayuth doesn't step in right now, tell the RTP to keep their mouths shut, get some Police/Military there who know what the <deleted> they are doing, stop making contradictory statements, and stop taking cash from the local big shots to "clear" them of any wrongdoing, then nothing will have changed here.

I think something has changed here. The whole world now knows that a foreigner on holiday in Thailand or an expat living in Thailand who is murdered can expect the same sort of investigation where the murderer is not caught or someone is fitted up for the crime i.e a migrant worker. The real murderer is free to murder again.

With your last sentence, you have hit the nail on the head! There are people on Koh Tao who look like they are going to get away with murder. There are people on Koh Tao who will realize that they can murder with impunity. So I ask you: Is that likely to make Koh Tao safer, or even less safe? And my final question: Who in their right mind would visit a place where murderers need not fear being apprehended? The place should be avoided - until the killers are brought to justice. By visiting the island, you are providing those criminals the money they use to buy their way out of responsibility for their actions.

The problem is, it is a tourist destination which attracts the 'Lonely Planet' crowd. They go where their 'bible' tells them to go - one place after another, millions of them following the 'trail' blindly. It's been this way for many years now. If Lonely Planet advised travelers not to go there it would cripple the place.

Sorry Jeremy, but lonely planet is pretty irrelevant these days... TripAdvisor, not so. But there is only so much bad stuff you can say about a place. I think it would be in order to lobby dive instructors. The schools are owned by the Thais, but the instructors are mostly Farang... if they had consciences they could boycott working there... that would hit the hip pocket.

[Snookyville]

an interesting article in todays Telegraph just appeared . It would be nice to thinks that everything about this case was not in the public domain .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11122966/Police-quiz-Thai-footballers-over-murder-of-British-backpackers.html

Three footballers arrested. In the CCTV footage at Daily Mail (no linking useful...) three footballers in yellow jerseys are seen walking behind them. Posted maybe a week ago, but that was when no Thai could have done it.. This is just a tiny screenshot of the CCTV footage, half a second later the two other guys will appear but then Hannah is already off-screen.

[englishoak]

Yes we messed up sorry about have a nice flight.................. see you and your wallet next year.

"...sorry about have a nice flight."

And you are English?

Why, are you a grammar Nazi ?

[Wilsonandson]

The 3 footballers in yellow shirts are white aren't they?

[lucaswallachia]

an interesting article in todays Telegraph just appeared . It would be nice to thinks that everything about this case was not in the public domain .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11122966/Police-quiz-Thai-footballers-over-murder-of-British-backpackers.html

"Rumours have circulated about a possible altercation at the AC Bar between the two victims and a group of Thai men.

However, Panya Mamen, the police chief, said interviews with Ms Witheridge's friends indicated there had been "no such confrontation".

Police are thought to be in possession of footage from security cameras inside the nightclub but it has not been made public."

Ok well i wonder if they will release footage of her on the CCTV, if that was the last bar she saw it i will narrow down the time frame.

[Chetzee]

here a picture of a guy the police were looking for a few days ago . I took it from a thai news video.

he's got his hair swept back , but is this the Kamnan's son

[greenchair]

With the new condom revelation,

and the zero likelihood any rapist killer with a mafia angle would use a condom on anyone, much less a pretty blonde,

my new suspicion is, Miller and the girl were getting started,

he got hit from behind with the iron bar and then staggered, tried to fight, but was quickly drowned,

that takes two guys,

the third subdues the girl with the hoe,

then they go to town

This is a highly likely scenario but what doesn't make sense is the cigarette butt with Hannah's lipstick and DNA matching that taken from semen. Unless this evidence has been falsified to make it seem that Hannah knew her attackers?

That's not that hard to figure out. One of those dirty bast--ds , put his filthy mouth on her then took a puff on the ciggarette.

Look at the table. She has a small purse and no ciggies next to it. I don't think she is a smoker. And i don't think these people were crazy drunk either.

[Number 3]

here a picture of a guy the police were looking for a few days ago . I took it from a thai news video.

he's got his hair swept back , but is this the Kamnan's son

Screenshot 2014-09-25 19.34.51.pngScreenshot 2014-09-26 12.27.49.png

Sorry ? They are saying these two pictures are of the same person?

Perhaps misunderstanding this - but this is in no way the same person if that is what is being reported.

[greenchair]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

[Number 3]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

A hero that will see no justice if investigative journalists and family representatives are not prepared to head down to that neck of the woods. It's largely wrapping up now sadly. Two journalists left from daily mail and bbc Thailand. Thai visa newsletter failed to mention it as a real update this evening.

On to the next issue where the army is investigating police abuse there against the Burmese.... Don't get me wrong this too is a very important issue and hugely unfair.

STAY FOCUSED PEOPLE!

[Chetzee]

here a picture of a guy the police were looking for a few days ago . I took it from a thai news video.

he's got his hair swept back , but is this the Kamnan's son

Screenshot 2014-09-25 19.34.51.pngScreenshot 2014-09-26 12.27.49.png

Sorry ? They are saying these two pictures are of the same person?

Perhaps misunderstanding this - but this is in no way the same person if that is what is being reported.

no one is saying that , i was just asking the question. seeing as they have both been on the police radar this week .

Let me just ask one more question ,

are these two guys one and the same ?

[Wilsonandson]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

Is the foreigner Sean?

[lucaswallachia]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

Is the foreigner Sean?

What time was Sean seen with the blood all over him.

Im assuming the blood on his guitar was from that and also there was a report at one stage of 3 guys near there playing guitar and singing.

If Sean said he was asleep and was supposed to meet up with David yet he was seen with the blood on him in the early hours then it means he lied about being asleep which i can see why they have DNA tested his motorbike and the room he was staying in.

[Number 3]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

Is the foreigner Sean?

What time was Sean seen with the blood all over him.

Im assuming the blood on his guitar was from that and also there was a report at one stage of 3 guys near there playing guitar and singing.

If Sean said he was asleep and was supposed to meet up with David yet he was seen with the blood on him in the early hours then it means he lied about being asleep which i can see why they have DNA tested his motorbike and the room he was staying in.

And so he decided instead of hiding until daylight he would report mafia to the police

Who in turn ditched him to his room where he very cleverly chose to spend the night in the jungle. If one murders I would suspect that blood on the most visible item you were carrying would be cleaned off. This guy is a pot head hanging out and chillin in "paradise". All turned bad for him I m afraid ....he was a pegged scapegoat by day three.

[JoeLing]

I believe 3 men 2 Thai and 1 foreigner were attacking Hannah and David went to save her. He is atrue hero.

Is the foreigner Sean?

Let's assume Sean would be part of this "gang" how comes no one pointed

the fingers at him?

Considering Thai's do have the habit of pointing fingers at foreigners, for any

reason, considering the awards on offer, no one, until 10 days later, pointed

the finger at him.

Worried if he would be caught he would sing like a birdy? If that would be

the case, I'm fairly sure, he would be lying there with the other two victims

and not just been threatened - several days after the murder happen.

[joedot]

Sean Mcanna looks like a complete wuss wad. He couldn't have been part of this even casting the DNA evidence aside

[Wilsonandson]

I'm interested in this footballers party at the ac bar, does it mention on the community fb anything about this?

[meand]

Can somebody answer why the Thais can't bring in outside help on something like this.

[MJP]

Can somebody answer why the Thais can't bring in outside help on something like this.

1. Face;

2. Doing so may result in real justice;

3. No brown envelopes.

Sorry for being cynical.