Bangkok’s Bible Thumpers

[TokyoT]

The only harm they do is remind some people that they have wandered off the path. Some of you people must feel pretty guilty to hate them so much. If you dont like what they say just ignore them.

Which path might that be?

The Catholic path?

The muslim path?

The Jewish path?

Or the middle way?

If only I could find my way back to that darn path, where was it now? I know I was on it just a minute ago until I got distracted by that lovely ladies behind I was following. Now it seems I've lost my way, yet again. Oh dear.

BTW as far as just ignoring them – if it were only that easy.

The loudspeakers/bullhorns make that a bit difficult. Not to mention they seem to have an uncanny ability to block by path.

[Oleg_Rus]

The only harm they do is remind some people that they have wandered off the path. Some of you people must feel pretty guilty to hate them so much. If you dont like what they say just ignore them.

Which path might that be?

The right one, ok?

why Americosa Presidenta talks on behalf of Holy, giving blessing left and right, and nobody even says a word, Balday Mala ( oops, I think Dalbay Lama ? ) wandering around the world with complete dillusion speeches, and so... But bunch of Thumpers are not allowed to express themself ?

[PeaceBlondie]

Some of you folks, such as you who live in Bangkok, must go to different places than I go, and I've been to some naughty places. Three years in Thailand, as a believer in Jesus, I never saw a bible thumper who was in people's faces, as described in the opening post.

The OP rambled a lot, first against Bible thumbers, then against the enemies of sex, then onto something else. That's okay. Of course, that kind of opening post opened the door to opinion, which is what ThaiVisa.com forums are for. So, the anti-Bible thumpers get a chance to rant against all the evils of righteousness, or the righteousness of evils, or whatever. Free speech.

As GuestHouse said, Christians (or Christian missions) do a lot of good work in Thailand. Within Christianity, blaring evangelism and old-fashioned missions work have been transformed into lifestyle evangelism ("earn the right to be heard, before you evangelize") and missiology (respect the native culture, do good works before you start preaching, etc.). Most denominations often, eventually, realize the error of their methods and modify their approach.

The only missionaries I worked with very much were in a conflict zone in Chiapas, Mexico, and many of the best were Catholic Jesuits priests, the very folks my religion professor warned me against. They allowed the people (tribal Catholics) to retain their customs, and to develop their own ethical system, such as Christian pacifism based on the literal words of the Bible. Remarkable. And when 45 of the native tribespeople were massacred, the parish priest eventually got deported for merely criticizing the Mexican government for trying to cover up the major political party's sponsor of the massacre and its lack of response to the survivors.

What would have happened if a Christian missionary had objected to the Thai government's complicity in the massacres in Thailand? He'd have been deported. Oddly enough though, the only farang I know who's gotten deported was a staunch opponent of missionaries!

It's hard to tell that Thailand is anything other than a Buddhist nation, with Buddhist Thais, although the tuktuk driver for the gay clientele of Chiang Mai is a practicing Catholic, converted by missionaries.

[GuestHouse]

Just because you don't understand the cultural and religious rules of the country you've come to play in doesn't mean to say there are no cultural and religious rules.

And perhaps that is what is at the heart of the post, Christian Missionaries are reminding you of the cultural and religious rules that you do understand.

[camerata]

More insidious than public bible-thumpers are the international schools in Thailand, some of which attempt to turn Thai kids into Christians at an age when they are most vulnerable. At least one of the well-known schools is run by Creationists who teach that the world was created 6,000 years ago and all dinosaur fossils are fakes.

I've met several educated Thais who told me they were Christians because they went to a Christian school, or who had ended up half-Buddhist, half-Christian as a result of attending an international school.

[Brother_Tony]

Believe it or not, I am one of the "Bible thumpers" that many in here are posting about. I believe the gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation as it is written: "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." (Romans 1:16); therefore I believe in the preaching of the gospel as my Saviour commands: "...Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." (Mark 16:15); and the gospel is this: "...how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:" (I Corinthians 15:3-4). And again, it is written: "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God." (I Corinthians 1:18).

Why do I believe the gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth? ten years ago, I was an idol worshipping, fornicating, drunk sinner who was boxing (Thai style) on Thai television for money living in a Thai-boxing stable full of hate and on my way to hel_l. But ten years ago, a Christian full of the love of God with no fear to preach to such a sinner such as myself preached the gospel of Christ to me in Pattaya, Thailand. And I called upon the name of the Lord to be saved by faith as it is written: "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Romans 10:13). And now, it is my Christian duty, as I am debtor to all man, to preach the gospel of Christ. Not only do we preach on the streets of Bangkok, but I also travel all over Thailand and its neighboring countries preaching the gospel to every creature. We do not force anyone to believe, for faith is of the heart. And if you do not like to hear it, you do not have to listen. Amen.

We do not use voice ampliphiers, nor do we hand out papers: we just preach the gospel of Christ. And we try to preach only in the entrances of the streets as to not interfere with what is going on the streets itself. Also, we preach the abovementioned gospel; therefore, you will not hear us attack anyone, anyone's lifestyle, or religion. We just preach the gospel since I have experienced the power of faith in the gospel. For those of you who have tried to argue with us, we are not there to argue or debate; therefore, I am sorry for ignoring some of you who have come up to us to argue. But if anyone is willing for prayer or wants to hear more of God's word, we usually meet them somewhere else.

Also, we do not belong to any religious organization or structured church organization or denomination. And no one pays us or commands us to preach. We are just believers in God's word and preach it. As I found this website by doing a search on the web for "Bible thumpers in Bangkok", I have been very encouraged that the preaching of the gospel has had such in impact on you here that you would write so much about it. Thank you. And if you are ever in need of prayer or a Bible, please feel free to come up to us if you see us out on the streets preaching. God bless you.

[thaibebop]

God portect me and Thaivisa from your followers.

[Gary A]

Sorry Brother Tony but the born again christian bible thumpers are the worst. That said, I'm glad you have seen the light and that it has helped you. I was born and raised catholic and believed all the things I was being taught until I went into the US Navy. After seeing many fine people of other religions, I discovered I no longer believed that all people who had other beliefs were damned to hel_l. I really think the Buddhists are the only sane ones of the bunch.

[ThaiPauly]

Well you gotta hand it to the guy.

Can't deny that I beleive in a "Higher Power" of some desciption.

He made no effort to protect himself from what is bound to follow or argue about the posts that were made before

If it makes him HAPPY..well what can you say?

[beammeup]

Believe it or not, I am one of the "Bible thumpers" that many in here are posting about. I believe the gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation as it is written: "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." (Romans 1:16); therefore I believe in the preaching of the gospel as my Saviour commands: "...Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." (Mark 16:15); and the gospel is this: "...how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:" (I Corinthians 15:3-4). And again, it is written: "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God." (I Corinthians 1:18).

Why do I believe the gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth? ten years ago, I was an idol worshipping, fornicating, drunk sinner who was boxing (Thai style) on Thai television for money living in a Thai-boxing stable full of hate and on my way to hel_l. But ten years ago, a Christian full of the love of God with no fear to preach to such a sinner such as myself preached the gospel of Christ to me in Pattaya, Thailand. And I called upon the name of the Lord to be saved by faith as it is written: "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Romans 10:13). And now, it is my Christian duty, as I am debtor to all man, to preach the gospel of Christ. Not only do we preach on the streets of Bangkok, but I also travel all over Thailand and its neighboring countries preaching the gospel to every creature. We do not force anyone to believe, for faith is of the heart. And if you do not like to hear it, you do not have to listen. Amen.

We do not use voice ampliphiers, nor do we hand out papers: we just preach the gospel of Christ. And we try to preach only in the entrances of the streets as to not interfere with what is going on the streets itself. Also, we preach the abovementioned gospel; therefore, you will not hear us attack anyone, anyone's lifestyle, or religion. We just preach the gospel since I have experienced the power of faith in the gospel. For those of you who have tried to argue with us, we are not there to argue or debate; therefore, I am sorry for ignoring some of you who have come up to us to argue. But if anyone is willing for prayer or wants to hear more of God's word, we usually meet them somewhere else.

Also, we do not belong to any religious organization or structured church organization or denomination. And no one pays us or commands us to preach. We are just believers in God's word and preach it. As I found this website by doing a search on the web for "Bible thumpers in Bangkok", I have been very encouraged that the preaching of the gospel has had such in impact on you here that you would write so much about it. Thank you. And if you are ever in need of prayer or a Bible, please feel free to come up to us if you see us out on the streets preaching. God bless you.

If it makes you happier stick with it! Good luck and all the same too you. You will probably get some abuse here but I am sure it woun't bother you.

[kerryk]

I was reading on another website an article where the author postulated that Nana Plaza was the heaven and hel_l of an alien race from another planet. It you had lived an exemplary life you came back as a 60 year old punter living at Nana for eternity and if you had lived an evil life you came back as a bible thumper working Nana. I can imagine it must be very difficult for them. I keep thinking of Somerset Maughan and his story "Rain."

As a child I was beaten up by Jesuits and Augustinians. It was my impression that the Augustinians hit a little harder but the Jesuits had better aim when throwing erasers.

[TokyoT]

The only harm they do is remind some people that they have wandered off the path. Some of you people must feel pretty guilty to hate them so much. If you dont like what they say just ignore them.

Which path might that be?

The right one, ok?

why Americosa Presidenta talks on behalf of Holy, giving blessing left and right, and nobody even says a word, Balday Mala ( oops, I think Dalbay Lama ? ) wandering around the world with complete dillusion speeches, and so... But bunch of Thumpers are not allowed to express themself ?

I must restate my position.

What is the right path?

If not the path of the illustrious Americosa Presidenta, or the luminous Dali Lama?

Like I said I think I was on the path once, and now seem to have lost my way.

As for the thumpers and free expression – no problems. Express away – just stay the frek away from me. I have more important things to attend to.

[TokyoT]

Just because you don't understand the cultural and religious rules of the country you've come to play in doesn't mean to say there are no cultural and religious rules.

And perhaps that is what is at the heart of the post, Christian Missionaries are reminding you of the cultural and religious rules that you do understand.

Just as many of the forefathers of the good ol’ US of A settled in the US to escape religious persecutions and basically being forced to abide by the religious doctrine of the time. Many of us find it refreshing not to be squashed by the religious doctrines of the west here in Thailand.

[Scott]

I find them to be a mild nusiance, only. They neither offend me nor convert me. They sometimes inconvenience me. Most of them are nice enough people who are trying to do good and thus I am usually pleasant to them, but I do tell them I have a religion and thank them with a "no-thank you."

[Insight]

God portect me and Thaivisa from your followers.

And your atrocious spelling

[calibanjr.]

I would like to live and let live, but the "associates" of the bible thumpers, the Christian Right of the US, my country, hold sway over the administration who are manipulating the uneducated masses, including most of the military (yes, I said that), into their vision of the world. So I wish they would go home and help the poor of their own, increasingly troubled country.

[Kerryd]

I generally don't have a problem with these people, until they start trying to force their beliefs on me.

It's pretty much useless pointing out to them the errors of their ways, as they have, for the most part, been thoroughly brainwashed. Most are incapable of even contemplating anything that seems to contradict their beliefs, even when all the evidence shows them to be wrong.

They all seem to think (quite arrogantly) that their way is the only true path blah blah blah.

The fact that the other major religions all seem to think the same thing totally escapes them. Everyone else is wrong, only we are right ! Believe as I believe or burn in hel_l !

Fox (er, I mena Faux) had a report recently about how some people think the current Middle East crisis was written about in the Book of Revelations ! They are trying to use the Christian bible to justify the conflict between the Muslims and the Jews (yes, that is what it boils down to. It isn't about Israel and the Palestinians, or the Arabs. It is about wiping out the Jewish presence in what the Muslims hope to be the heart of their future empire, or "Grand Caliph").

Any ways. What the people in the Fox report forgot to take into account is that the other side also has a "bible" (the Koran, or Qu'ran), that they use to justify their actions. Who is right ?

Is "God" playing sides ? Favouring some people some of the time, while ignoring others ?

Look at WWII in Europe. The Germans were (still are) God fearing people (for the most part). They believed God was on their side in the war.

The Allies believed God was on their side as well. Must have been right as they won.

Personally, even if you could prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that God existed, I wouldn't believe in him. What ever cruel being that could sit on high and allow so many of "His" children to suffer and die so callously, all over the world, is not a being I would respect or believe in.

Besides, Better to be Ruler in hel_l, than a Slave in Heaven !

[suegha]

Well, some interesting posts. Some condeming the type of behaviour they exhibit in their posts!

However, while I don't want to engage in all of the points raised, just a small reminder that not all Christians believe in Heaven/hel_l going at death. I mention this as many posts referred to hel_l and damnation.

Many of the 'extremist' Christians mentioned would be 'extremist' whatever, Muslims, Nazis, whatever. Many use whatever it is they do to justify their behaviour. I hope this makes sense.

Let's not stereotype anyone, and accept that people are different and are entitled to their views. Just one point in closing on the comments of my friend KerryD - God allows Man to run (and ruin) the earth, however, it will all change as Jesus will return to establish a righteous kingdom when all wrongs will be made right!

[britmaveric]

however, it will all change as Jesus will return to establish a righteous kingdom when all wrongs will be made right!

And if he doesnt return??????

[Axel]

And if he doesnt return??????

He will return. Some two thousand years delay means nothing in heavenly traffic.

As for the bible thumpers... Not really an idea who they are, some guys walking around Bangkok, wearing white shirt, tie and looking rather stange?

[kerryk]

When the Thai Buddhist monks start going to Las Vegas, London and Rome in the red light areas and begin preaching to the Asians there then it is time to send the Bible thumpers to Nana. Until that happens I think they should stay home.

[Soju]

And if he doesnt return??????

He will return. Some two thousand years delay means nothing in heavenly traffic.

As for the bible thumpers... Not really an idea who they are, some guys walking around Bangkok, wearing white shirt, tie and looking rather stange?

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't a lot of you here talking about Mormons? The young guys that always wear the same white shirts and tie and look like they all came out of the same mold? I'm no expert on Mormonism (is that even the correct term?), but don't think that they hold the Bible in the same regard as does mainline Christianity. They have their own book, the Book of Mormon, and the teachings of their prophet, Joseph Smith. From what I gather, their religion is based very loosely on the Bible and they more or less use it as a leadin to their own unique teachings. So calling these Mormons "Bible thumpers" or even "Christians" isn't totally accurate from what I can see. I think many mainline Christians would consider the Mormons to be more along the lines of a cult because they deny parts of the Bible and add onto it their own new teachings.

Growing up in the States, I recall so many people complaining about the Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses because they were the ones who always came around knocking door-to-door and had a reputation of being hard to get rid of.

But I have to agree with some of the other posters in that there's absolutely nothing wrong with what they're doing. If that's what they believe in then why shouldn't they be allowed to tell others. It's simple enough to just ignore them if you don't want to listen to them. America, and other western countries were founded on the ideas of free speech and of people being able to believe however they wanted to without fear of religious persecution. I firmly believe in the right for everyone to believe as they want to and to freely speak as they want. There seems to be a lot of Christianity bashing on this forum lately and I think perhaps some of those doing it are doing so because they have a guilty conscience. If you are truly firm in your belief or disbelief, you have no need to bash those who believe differently than you do. As long as they don't do anything to harm me or others, I don't let anything any religious person does bother me. I am firm in what I believe in and nothing they do will change my view. However, once they cross the line and start harming people (terrorists come to mind), then the gloves are off.

Edited July 31, 2006 by Soju

[Axel]

You might be right Soju, as I said, "...as for the bible thumpers... Not really an idea who they are".

Anyway, as long as they don't bother me, I do not really care, although, some guys peddling

their religion give me quite a strange feeling.

Keep religion in the church or temple, where it belongs.

[John K]

I want to first Welcome Brother Tony to Thaivisa as I see you just joined earlier this week. To be honest I am surprised you used the a phrase ashamed. There is nothing at all to be ashamed about in your belief. Every religion has it’s belief.

I started this thread because of some of the comments I heard, and I was curious what other thought in a broader forum than the nightlife venues. As in the states telemarketers became such an annoyance they put laws up with no call lists. Simply there is a time and place for everything. The approach you use although you feel is nonintrusive it is actually the opposite. The people who are sitting within ear shout of you don’t have the luxury of chasing you away as they would vendors trying to sell things. The proper approach would be to ask them if they would like to hear what you have to say. If they say yes then good for you, if they say no then you should honor their wishes.

As with all people who come to Thailand will eventually step on some cultural toes by accident. You should think how the local culture reads you. I did not make up anything in the opening post. I only know this because I was curious how the Thais were seeing you. It was a tuk tuk driver who told me that. Basically you are alienating people to your cause by being so overt.

Look at the bad face the terrorists have given the Muslim faith. It is difficult to look at them without forming some sort of prejudice wondering if they are packing explosives or not. Even though it is a very low percentage of Muslims that are extremists they are all looked at that way.

Look at the Catholic faith, many see them as arrogant because of their position with the condoms/birth control/STD issue. That has nothing at all to do with the scandals of some priests who have had sexual activity whit children. Although it is only a few it is hard to separate the thoughts from good priests.

Actions speak louder than words in Thailand, simply because not everything you hear is true. That being a significant percentage I might add. If you want to make a good impression do it with actions and not words. Then the people you help you can tell them of your beliefs and I am very certain they would be a receptive audience. Then in turn they will help spread the word too. As an example look at what Thaksin did. He by far is not someone who is viewed highly, but his actions did things to get him in office. Look at what the King has done for the people and the overwhelming respect the Thais and the world has for him. It is actions and not words in Thailand that count. You are wasting your time and energy doing what you are doing now, you need to change your tactics.

[Erwin1011]

As fellow human beings, when they knock on my door, I will offer them a moment of coolness in the shade of my home and some water or tea to quench their thirst. I'm willing to sit down with them and discuss or throw bible quotes at each other. Some times we quote the same verses and when we verify our sources, their bible seems to be different from mine (mormons) or somehow to have a different translation than mine. Real great stuff. (funny enough my old book of mormon ( 1949 edition) seems to be different from the new edition they carry)

Then somehow the "quoting" always seems to end up in arguments that I'm referring to "False" interpretations or translations and that I should study the only correct one i.e. theirs !

By that time we have finished our water or tea and it's time to go separate ways. Theirs out of my door, mine back to what ever I was doing at the time.

I do not mind them having different opinions or interpretations, I do not mind if they are willing to discuss matters in a intelligent way and open enough to possible multiple interpretations. I do start having a problem, when it becomes argumentative and blindly hanging onto to 1 and 1 only as being the ultimate correct one and trying to force that upon me or the rest of the world.

I do notice however that monotheistic religions tend to be more proselyting prone and tend to be more stuck to their scriptures than other religions.

And so therefore

back to signature 1

[lomatopo]

Mormon (Church of the Latter Day Saints) missionaries are very easy to identify. They will be dressed in black pants (or skirt), white shirt with tie (or blouse) with nametags in English and Thai ( male = Elder, female = Sister ). I've seen the bangers outside NEP and these are not Mormons.

I have a strong respect for freedom of religion, and for a separation of religion and state (government/politics). The Founding Fathers of my country were, in my opinion, quite prescient, in many matters including this one.

Since we are in Thailand we really should leave it up to Thai authorities to make the call on foreign missionaries. Since they seem to practice freely I assume the Thai authorities do not have any problems. I'll respect that.

[Sing_Sling]

Reading through some of the posts here one would think that these bible thumpers are invading our space and forcing themselves upon us . . . funny, but I've had chats with some of them, butthey always went away when I told them I was busy or wasn't interested. Live and let live, why get all irate about these people?

I'm not religious at all, really - though I'm sure a God is going to give me a walloping for not believing in him/her/it.

Oh, here's a picture of one of those pesky nuisance bible-bashing missionary mongrels:

Oh, her name is Mother Theresa.

[GuestHouse]

And here's another Bible Basher - You'll find him working in Klong Toey with drug addicts, HIV/AIDS sufferers, Orphans, the stateless and the poor.

Father Joe

[Axel]

As I said, as long as they don't bother me, I do not really care.

Every day I pass by lower Sukhumvit in Bangkok. You find all kind of people.

Street vondors, street walkers, bible thumbers. Let everybody do what they think is right.

Err, tonight the street vendors are not there, due to the weekly clean-up-day. It is a bit of a relief.

Edited July 31, 2006 by Axel

[farangsay]

And here's another Bible Basher - You'll find him working in Klong Toey with drug addicts, HIV/AIDS sufferers, Orphans, the stateless and the poor.

Father Joe

There you go again , guesthouse.

Maybe it's me , but I think you've missed the point of the post.

Yes , there are Christians who are awesomely good people.

You must have seen Mobi d'Ark's post and the reaction to it.

The people he is talking about happen to be Christian , have read the book and

understood the message. Sermon on the mount and all that.

Such people arouse , for me , a profound respect and a certain humility.

Such is not true for the guys or gals that come knocking on my door or marching up

to me when I'm having a quick beer in soi sanuk wanting to give me "the good news".

These people are about as much use as a sore arse to a jockey.

They are also IMO stupid.

Let me tell you a story.

Had a friend/neighbour was "studying" at an American-run "Bible Institute".

He often used to pop around for a drink (I had a good wine cellar at the time).

He was a nice guy but he just couldn't help slipping in a Bible reference into the

conversation from time to time. I never said anything , didn't want to hurt his feelings.

Then one day I said :

"So the whole bible , Genesis to Revelations is literal truth right ?" - "Yes"

"Genesis , God made Adam and Eve nobody else right?" - Yes

"They had children , not just Cain and Abel - lots of them right ?" - Yes

"Their children had children , lots of them right ?" - Yes

"Incest was OK in those days right ?" - "Oh , I never thought about that"

How to be a "bible thumper"

1. Open book Genesis chapter 1 Page 1

2. Switch brain off

3. Memorise book

4. Repeat words you have learned to anyone you can corner

The first group of people I referred to are good people (although as the frogs say the word is weak)

The second group are mindless boring <deleted>

That is the subtle difference

May your God go with you , because I don't want him hanging around pestering me.