Pool water is milky

[simon43]

I need some advice about a splash pool at my ex's guesthouse. The pool is circular, 4.6m diameter, 1.4, depth ==> about 5,000 gallons. Water pump, filter, chlorine tablets etc and usually the pool is fine with clear water.

Anyway, the lazy ex did not test the water daily and so the PH value dropped to a very low value, about 2.0. The water started to go green. So I used some pool 'anti-green' which cleared the green colour and I applied soda-ash until the PH was back to about 7.2.

A few days later, the water took on a milky colour. The Ph value is OK and the pool has chlorine tablets OK. The milky colour I assumed was due to some type of sediment. So I used a pool clarifier liquid for the prescribed time/amount.

However, the pool is still milky in appearance. It is not a 'strong' milk - I can see down about 80cm, but I cannot see the bottom of the pool.

Any ideas what is causing this milkiness? I have backwashed/rinsed the filter, but with no improvement.

[kyrre]

If the PH value is a bit to high it may appear milky. Or just after you add soda ash.

I read on another pool forum that thats why the like to keep the ph value a bit under to avoid the milky water and get clear water instead.

[sappersrest]

One assumes the pump strainer basket is clean and the skimmer baskets are clean

To get the Ph from 2 (Are you really sure it was 2) would have taken a hell of a lot of soda ash that is the first part of your problem

The second part is to get a low Ph like that a lot of stabilised chlorine would have been use that contains cynuric acid that will render any existing free chlorine you have in the pool useless.

The third part was that you added yet more chemicals to try and solve the problem.

Basically you have a chemical soup.

The only way you will cure this is by dilution and filtration. keep the filter pump running 24/7 and keep adding fresh water until the pool is clear .

Do not add any more chemicals until the pool is clear.

Once the pool is clear retest the water.

If further chemical adjustment is required add a small amount of chemicals each time then retest.

Once the desired chemical levels are achieved the pump can go back on it's timer.

Remember THE SOLUTION TO POLLUTION IS DILUTION.

As a rule of thumb add 30 litres of fresh water for every bather per day.

I know this is not Europe and cannot be compared , But to put it in some sort of perspective as a guest house you would be classed as a public facility and would have to test the water at least 4 times per day and keep records.

To all you people who own pools please please buy yourselves a decent test kit, get a test kit that tests seven perameters (read the previous post why is my pool green)

Edited May 11, 2015 by sappersrest

[sappersrest]

There are Thai government standards for public facilities I will try and get a copy, and let you know.

[Guest]

One assumes the pump strainer basket is clean and the skimmer baskets are clean

To get the Ph from 2 (Are you really sure it was 2) would have taken a hell of a lot of soda ash that is the first part of your problem

The second part is to get a low Ph like that a lot of stabilised chlorine would have been use that contains cynuric acid that will render any existing free chlorine you have in the pool useless.

The third part was that you added yet more chemicals to try and solve the problem.

Basically you have a chemical soup.

The only way you will cure this is by dilution and filtration. keep the filter pump running 24/7 and keep adding fresh water until the pool is clear .

Do not add any more chemicals until the pool is clear.

Once the pool is clear retest the water.

If further chemical adjustment is required add a small amount of chemicals each time then retest.

Once the desired chemical levels are achieved the pump can go back on it's timer.

Remember THE SOLUTION TO POLLUTION IS DILUTION.

As a rule of thumb add 30 litres of fresh water for every bather per day.

I know this is not Europe and cannot be compared , But to put it in some sort of perspective as a guest house you would be classed as a public facility and would have to test the water at least 4 times per day and keep records.

To all you people who own pools please please buy yourselves a decent test kit, get a test kit that tests seven perameters (read the previous post why is my pool green)

It was really very good of you to take so much time and effort to share your considerable depth of knowledge .. no pun intended.

Hope Simon appreciates it... !!

[kkup]

What's all this talk about milky residue?

[laislica]

Remembering back to my reef fish keeping days:
A chloramate is made by combining low levels of Chlorine with Ammonia/Nitrates.

The way to get rid of it was to add a huge dose of Chrorine, then airate for hours till the ammonia/Nitrates were evaporated off.

The high dose of chlorine broke the chloramate bond and the solurion goes back to free ammonia/nitrates and free chlorine.

(or something like that)

[i had to this to prepare tap water for the fish tank,

The tap water had both nitrates and chlorine in it.

Therefore to get rid of the chloramate I had to do this procedure]

PH is affected by cations and anions so maybe some bicarb is required?

Edited May 11, 2015 by laislica

[realenglish1]

Milky Residue in the Pool OMG

Stop having sex in the pool

[khunPer]

I’m not an expert, but I found that aluminum sulfate (alum crystals) and/or hydrogen peroxide can help.

Alum make the ”milky particles” clutch so they become big enough for the sand filer to clean them out. Alum is harmless and used to clean water – Thais use it for cleaning wells and the crystals are commonly available in local stores for around 20 baht a kilo. It’s the same crystal that is sold a “magic crystal” deodorant.

Another efficient way is to use hydrogen peroxide. Do it at nighttime (no sunlight) and when no guest in the pool. Hydrogen peroxide (H2O2, water with an extra oxygen atom) oxide the water and is harmless when diluted (becomes water 2 x H2O and oxygen O2). Use 35% food grade, which you can buy locally in some pharmacies like Morya for around 225 baht a liter – avoid skin contact as it can cause “burns” when undiluted. You shall properly need some 4-5 liters for your pool (often it has to be a “chock treatment”). Add it evenly in the pool with circulation pump(s) running – normally your water will be clear the following morning. Household hydrogen peroxide for medical use is 3%, your dilution in the pool when mixed in water by circulation will be just around 1:100 of this, or around 0.03%. It’s totally harmless, you can use hydrogen peroxide only – together with little copper sulfate to prevent algae and alum for the clutching particles – for pools; there is a US-company providing an automatic chlorine-free system for that, the method is developed by Nasa and used in space to clean water.

My Thai pool-chemical supplier also recommends hydrogen peroxide when water is unclear instead of adding lots of chemicals.

Just some harmless advice, which I myself found very useful – when one is about to give up, empty the basin, and start all over again – hope they may help you.

[laislica]

I’m not an expert, but I found that aluminum sulfate (alum crystals) and/or hydrogen peroxide can help.

Alum make the ”milky particles” clutch so they become big enough for the sand filer to clean them out. Alum is harmless and used to clean water – Thais use it for cleaning wells and the crystals are commonly available in local stores for around 20 baht a kilo. It’s the same crystal that is sold a “magic crystal” deodorant.

Another efficient way is to use hydrogen peroxide. Do it at nighttime (no sunlight) and when no guest in the pool. Hydrogen peroxide (H2O2, water with an extra oxygen atom) oxide the water and is harmless when diluted (becomes water 2 x H2O and oxygen O2). Use 35% food grade, which you can buy locally in some pharmacies like Morya for around 225 baht a liter – avoid skin contact as it can cause “burns” when undiluted. You shall properly need some 4-5 liters for your pool (often it has to be a “chock treatment”). Add it evenly in the pool with circulation pump(s) running – normally your water will be clear the following morning. Household hydrogen peroxide for medical use is 3%, your dilution in the pool when mixed in water by circulation will be just around 1:100 of this, or around 0.03%. It’s totally harmless, you can use hydrogen peroxide only – together with little copper sulfate to prevent algae and alum for the clutching particles – for pools; there is a US-company providing an automatic chlorine-free system for that, the method is developed by Nasa and used in space to clean water.

My Thai pool-chemical supplier also recommends hydrogen peroxide when water is unclear instead of adding lots of chemicals.

Just some harmless advice, which I myself found very useful – when one is about to give up, empty the basin, and start all over again – hope they may help you.

Many thanks, I've been trying to locate 35% food grade Hydrogen Peroxide for three years but no success.

I live in Changwat Samut Sakhon, do you know where I could buy it there or would it need a trip to Bangkok?

Google was no real help for this.

Cheers

[Pool Boy]

Would it not be a lot easier, quicker and less expensive to replace the 23m3 of your chemical soup by fresh water?

It's a relatively small pool, no salt to loose.

[khunPer]

I’m not an expert, but I found that aluminum sulfate (alum crystals) and/or hydrogen peroxide can help.

Alum make the ”milky particles” clutch so they become big enough for the sand filer to clean them out. Alum is harmless and used to clean water – Thais use it for cleaning wells and the crystals are commonly available in local stores for around 20 baht a kilo. It’s the same crystal that is sold a “magic crystal” deodorant.

Another efficient way is to use hydrogen peroxide. Do it at nighttime (no sunlight) and when no guest in the pool. Hydrogen peroxide (H2O2, water with an extra oxygen atom) oxide the water and is harmless when diluted (becomes water 2 x H2O and oxygen O2). Use 35% food grade, which you can buy locally in some pharmacies like Morya for around 225 baht a liter – avoid skin contact as it can cause “burns” when undiluted. You shall properly need some 4-5 liters for your pool (often it has to be a “chock treatment”). Add it evenly in the pool with circulation pump(s) running – normally your water will be clear the following morning. Household hydrogen peroxide for medical use is 3%, your dilution in the pool when mixed in water by circulation will be just around 1:100 of this, or around 0.03%. It’s totally harmless, you can use hydrogen peroxide only – together with little copper sulfate to prevent algae and alum for the clutching particles – for pools; there is a US-company providing an automatic chlorine-free system for that, the method is developed by Nasa and used in space to clean water.

My Thai pool-chemical supplier also recommends hydrogen peroxide when water is unclear instead of adding lots of chemicals.

Just some harmless advice, which I myself found very useful – when one is about to give up, empty the basin, and start all over again – hope they may help you.

Many thanks, I've been trying to locate 35% food grade Hydrogen Peroxide for three years but no success.

I live in Changwat Samut Sakhon, do you know where I could buy it there or would it need a trip to Bangkok?

Google was no real help for this.

Cheers

Ups, I wrote “Morya Pharmacy”, but can Google that it’s a local chain where I live only. Any pharmacy should be able to order it (from Bangkok) – but it may be another supplier of food grade than medical hydrogen peroxide – I’ve got my little local pharmacist to order it, and she got it two days later. It normally comes a box of 6 bottles, each 1-liter.

[sappersrest]

Aluminium sulphate whilst not a dangerous chemical using it regularly can have detrimental effects, and has links to early onset memory loss , research is on going.

Using it with a cartridge filter will cause the filter block more easily so once the pool is clear give the filters a really good clean, or you may have to do this several times.

Most domestic pools use high rate filtration the problem with using alum is that the filters need to be backwashed throughly to get rid of all traces of the alum, as it will get pushed through the filter bed.Then it will form a plaster of paris like substance and block the filter.That some times cannot be dug out.

Remember Alum is a last chance resort to clarify pool water especially with domestic pool filters.

A better chemical to use is poly aluminium chloride this is sold by many pool shops as a clarifier.

Remember do not use Alum unless you can help it and certainly do not put in the pool, put in the strainer box of the pump as a guide one maybe two large crystals should suffice.

Also it is good to remember that throwing endless amounts of chemicals into the pool is not the answer , Dilution in most cases will work out cheaper and better than swimming in some chemical soup.

Edited May 11, 2015 by sappersrest

[worgeordie]

Most likely cause is the dying off of the algae,as you say you dosed with

Anti-Green, should have siphoned the dead algae off the bottom.

regards Worgeordie

[sappersrest]

Most likely cause is the dying off of the algae,as you say you dosed with

Anti-Green, should have siphoned the dead algae off the bottom.

regards Worgeordie

A good pool cleaner (vac) is also a good idea , make sure you get the one with the correct head , liner pool or tiled pool.

[khunPer]

Aluminium sulphate whilst not a dangerous chemical using it regularly can have detrimental effects, and has links to early onset memory loss , research is on going.

Using it with a cartridge filter will cause the filter block more easily so once the pool is clear give the filters a really good clean, or you may have to do this several times.

Most domestic pools use high rate filtration the problem with using alum is that the filters need to be backwashed throughly to get rid of all traces of the alum, as it will get pushed through the filter bed.Then it will form a plaster of paris like substance and block the filter.That some times cannot be dug out.

Remember Alum is a last chance resort to clarify pool water especially with domestic pool filters.

A better chemical to use is poly aluminium chloride this is sold by many pool shops as a clarifier.

Remember do not use Alum unless you can help it and certainly do not put in the pool, put in the strainer box of the pump as a guide one maybe two large crystals should suffice.

Also it is good to remember that throwing endless amounts of chemicals into the pool is not the answer , Dilution in most cases will work out cheaper and better than swimming in some chemical soup.

Thanks.

Is aluminium really a silent killer? (The Telegraph):

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/9119528/Is-aluminium-really-a-silent-killer.html

And more about aluminum and health,

Gene Key To Alzheimer's-like Reversal Identified: Success In Restoring Memories In Mice Could Lead To Human Treatments:

http://www.viewzone.com/alzheimers.html

Wikipedia about Aluminium sulfate:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium_sulfate

[lianajohn]

Milky Residue in the Pool OMG

Stop having sex in the pool

You made me laugh. It'll take a lot of sex to make ANY pool milky.

[lianajohn]

I also had a similar problem before. According to a technician who is supposedly an expert on pool cleaning told me, the sand (must be a special kind) required to filter the water was too old (whatever that means). Normally, the sand should be replaced every 5 years but I didn't do so for 10 years. Anyway, after having changed with new sand in the filter system, the water became crystal clear again without using any chemicals.

[4u2mad]

Milky Residue in the Pool OMG

Stop having sex in the pool

Or stop adding Pernod!!

[sappersrest]

I also had a similar problem before. According to a technician who is supposedly an expert on pool cleaning told me, the sand (must be a special kind) required to filter the water was too old (whatever that means). Normally, the sand should be replaced every 5 years but I didn't do so for 10 years. Anyway, after having changed with new sand in the filter system, the water became crystal clear again without using any chemicals.

Sand should be changed around every 2-3 years on home pools with hi rate filters, on commercial pools with large filters every 5-7 years.This also depends on usage high usage will decrease these figures. the sand would usually last for a lot longer than the above recomendations it is very rare for high quality filter grade silica sand to wear down. The filters usually get blocked and mud ball due to incorrect filtration rates i.e. to fast a flow through the filters.

The above is a three line version of some very hefty PHD studies and is still on going, way beyond my pay grade.

IF IT DON'T LOOK GOOD ENOUGH TO DRINK IT AINT GOOD ENOUGH TO SWIM IN

[IMHO]

Would it not be a lot easier, quicker and less expensive to replace the 23m3 of your chemical soup by fresh water?

It's a relatively small pool, no salt to loose.

Even if the OP had a SWG, you're only talking about 3 bags of salt anyway

@OP: Before rushing out to implement this idea, make sure your pool is well above the water table, and/or has a hydrostatic valve (opened), and that you have somewhere to dump all that nasty water that's not going to cause an environmental problem. Also, if the pool is fiberglass, make sure the sand/stone backfill isn't waterlogged before you start, and watch it very carefully for signs of buckling as you drain.

[sappersrest]

Would it not be a lot easier, quicker and less expensive to replace the 23m3 of your chemical soup by fresh water?

It's a relatively small pool, no salt to loose.

Even if the OP had a SWG, you're only talking about 3 bags of salt anyway

@OP: Before rushing out to implement this idea, make sure your pool is well above the water table, and/or has a hydrostatic valve (opened), and that you have somewhere to dump all that nasty water that's not going to cause an environmental problem. Also, if the pool is fiberglass, make sure the sand/stone backfill isn't waterlogged before you start, and watch it very carefully for signs of buckling as you drain.

A very good point about emptying a pool , a lot of damage can be caused by emptying and fill to quickly, In severe cases pools actually breaking apart. As IMHO states be very careful in high-water table areas.

If you are, the pool installer should have installed a hydrostatic valve, not always obvious as they are usually installed in the bottom sump. (They are basically a one way valve that will let water into the pool if such a need is required to relieve external water pressure on the pool shell)

A pool should never be filled at a rate greater than 750mm over a 24 hour period, the same applies to emptying ,do not pump out to quickly the same rate applies.

If you have tankers deliver water again make sure the delivery driver discharges as slow as possible and spread deliveries over several days.

Not that we worry about heating pools here, a similar criteria applies for heating and cooling .Not more than .25 deg C per hour.

[FangFerang]

Are your neighbors milking their cows in your pool again?

[RonnyAnderson]

I don't think so you need more solutions but still I have some suggestion for you hope it works

How You Can Keep Your Pool Water Clean And Clear?

[steven100]

you need to get a pool doctor in ... he will know exactly what to do for couple of hundred baht.