NCPO explains why it rejects UDD’s public discussion on draft charter

[Jon Wetherall]

If you don't like it stifle it, squash it, kill it.

And demonstrate your insecurity and self-doubt to the whole world.

Right about now, all the countries which condemned the junta for anti-democratic actions are shown to have been right.

[jesimps]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Only by force of arms and loads of sleight of hand. In all honesty, do you really believe the "legal" bit?

[Linky]

@ Linky

It is up to the Thais to decide who they want to vote into office. If they want violence and murder against people that is entirely up to them.

I cut ur post down to that one sentence.

Sorry that I do.

But this can not be the basis for a peaceful coexistence within a society?

"If they want violence and murder against people that is entirely up to them."

???

Perhaps not clear. There is an election. People vote for who they want. If the govt is bad etc then they can be voted out. It is completely up to the voters as to what govt should be elected, good or bad, up to them. It is not up to those that are not elected to determine how things are done.

If the elected govt are very bad it doesnt say much for the party that was defeated. The people determine the lesser of two evils, so to speak.

[Trouble]

Thailand will never be a democracy as is known in the West. This latest crap spoken by the NCPO spokesman just goes to show that there is to be no debate over a new Constitution. Why don't they just proclaim this new constitution and forget a referendum on the damn thing. 20 Charters/Constitutions since 1932 and they have not managed to get it right. Pathetic bunch of losers involved in this military junta and Thai politics in general.

[espinoza]

This junta is not very clever in pr, nor in active politics. Their promises about getting rid of corruption, will fail. Because this promise was given by corrupt ones. Why does not the Thai government give any help in the refugee problems in Europe. The Thai economy is ok, but they do not have any single bath to spend on the biggest human crisis ever?????

[onelasttime]

Call me an old cynic BUT... given that the rural poor are continually disenfranchised by the elite, could this be a ploy to enrage the red north in order to incite unrest and further entrench Prayut's power base. I mean, Suthep yes / Jutuporn no..it's not even mildly subtle.

[jaidam]

I would have rejected the red nutters requests purely on the basis that had it been up to them we would at present be in a state of pure anarchy, with all prisons emptied of all criminals, no laws left on the books, absolute mayhem on the streets, just so their little tin pot god can return and carry on his crime spree.

[yellowboat]

I would have rejected the red nutters requests purely on the basis that had it been up to them we would at present be in a state of pure anarchy, with all prisons emptied of all criminals, no laws left on the books, absolute mayhem on the streets, just so their little tin pot god can return and carry on his crime spree.

Please, your hysterics are embarrassing. No such thing was going to happen.

For all her faults, this was not the case with Yingluck anyway. The simple fact is she was voted in fairly, and this coup will end up being a far greater trespass on the Thai people than anything she did.

[Fat Haggis]

I would have rejected the red nutters requests purely on the basis that had it been up to them we would at present be in a state of pure anarchy, with all prisons emptied of all criminals, no laws left on the books, absolute mayhem on the streets, just so their little tin pot god can return and carry on his crime spree.

But the yellow nutter's request was fine ? Presuming he actually sought permission to hold a press conference in the first place, and once again flouting the rules for one, and not for all by holding a political gathering.

Bottom line, all those stating Thailand will never be a democracy are correct, as long as there's a certain group constantly trying to force their version of democracy on the people, they don't wear red ether!!

[MZurf]

I would have rejected the red nutters requests purely on the basis that had it been up to them we would at present be in a state of pure anarchy, with all prisons emptied of all criminals, no laws left on the books, absolute mayhem on the streets, just so their little tin pot god can return and carry on his crime spree.

Please, your hysterics are embarrassing. No such thing was going to happen.

For all her faults, this was not the case with Yingluck anyway. The simple fact is she was voted in fairly, and this coup will end up being a far greater trespass on the Thai people than anything she did.

Unfortunately this type of hysterical attitude is very common among the junta lovers, where everything and anything the junta does is excused by the mere existence of the Great Satan in Dubai.

[rubl]

Democratically of course. Shoot at 'the others', drop the odd grenade. Perfectly acceptable, to some that seems.

exactly, the reds track record on democracy and the methods they use is obvious to most, IMO they are an organisation that borderline terrorism, it is clear that Thaksins crowd can voice their opposition through PTP

Don't recall Thaksin had attitude adjustment camps.

He had his 'inappropriate question' sign and of course suing a journy for a few billions after publishing 'unnecessary' details also helped in attitude adjustment.

[rubl]

So you mean the population should apathetically just bend over and lift up the skirt??

Your tilt, not mine. Don't try to twist my words like you usually do when replying to someone's comment.

And it must really hurt you to know this but that is generally what the population has done over the years, whenever a coup comes along.

You can agitate and stir all the shit you like from the safety of your computer room, but a counter-coup is probably not going to happen soon.

Unless of course you are going to raise an army of smurfs and take over the government. Let us know how you get on.

a counter-coup is probably not going to happen soon.

Firstly the reds do not have a majority to enact a counter coup which was shown when the dozen or so hard red leaders and supporters meekly retreated when accountability came marching in (without a single bullet being fired)

Also going by the red leaders track record of broken promises when Jatuporn promised that any coup would result in an immediate and harsh reaction one can be assured that it would never eventuate....And guess what...It didn't.

Another broken promise. Surprise surprise.

In case didn't get it, a counter coup is performed by an army regiment, not by a political opposition group.

It is known since the 2006 coup that the army is split into 2 camps.

A counter-coup would lead to serious headache here on TVF. When is a coup a good coup, when is a coup a bad coup ?

[rubl]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Ah, nooo, they're not. Or did you miss the point that they had an ILLEGAL COUP, then installed themselves into power, then "elected" (if you want to call it that) a new PM who, by the way, was the same man who lead the coup. There is absolutely nothing legal about the present government in any way, shape or form.

The current government is a legal government, endorsed, sworn in, etc., etc. You disliking them doesn't make them illegal.

Now of course if you want to tell me that recently Western democracies offered help to this 'allegedly' illegal government thereby breaking their own laws, that's up to you.

[AGareth2]

do you mean contrecoup?

[rubl]

If anyone is still confused about the double standards thing, let this disavow you of that puzzlement.

If you recall, anti-democrat Suthep Thaugsuban calling a very public press conference to trumpet his support for the democracy crippling draft constitution. Good enough he declared! Support it he demanded!

Suthep is not restricted, but those from the other side of the equation are. Suthep is a supporter. It seems only critical voices are to be silenced. Anyone else can line up to speak.

In reality however, some objectives have been reached. It will simply propel those who were denied, go to plan 'B".

This is an affront to them. This idiocy is getting huge circulation, and in some way exceeds what a Press Conference could. The details of the thing are well known anyway and doesn't need reiteration in a Press Conference. Also the notion that Suthep influenced anyone who wasn't already disposed to his version of things is mistaken. He probably incited more people against this thing than the other way around.

Wow, interesting times to observe all of this from the sidelines for us inconsequential Farangs.

"democracy crippling draft"

That's like saying we're against, 'nuff said. Missing is the 'obvious', or 'clearly for all to see'.

My understanding is that politicians are against as it restricts them in their previous almost unrestricted position to 'be someone' and even date to mention 'responsibility', 'accountability' and such.

Then it should be debated in an open forum, and the junta should not spend so much time trying to protect itself.

'open forum' ? I though everyone wanted a constitution quickly, not next decade.

Last year the NCPO was asking for help and input for reforms, constitution. How much help did they get? Apart from 'good' input from TVF members of course.

[rubl]

Has anybody read the final draft of the 2015 constitution, at least any one here on TVF?

AS far as I know it has not been made available yet, certainly not in an English translation

[rubl]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Only by force of arms and loads of sleight of hand. In all honesty, do you really believe the "legal" bit?

Just as legal as a previous government led by a criminal fugitive

[smutcakes]

Has anybody read the final draft of the 2015 constitution, at least any one here on TVF?

AS far as I know it has not been made available yet, certainly not in an English translation

Seems you are a professor on it before reading it, but i would expect nothing less from Rubl.

[rubl]

Has anybody read the final draft of the 2015 constitution, at least any one here on TVF?

AS far as I know it has not been made available yet, certainly not in an English translation

Seems you are a professor on it before reading it, but i would expect nothing less from Rubl.

Nice one-liner, smutcakes, but pray tell where do I state to know about the new final draft of the charter? I've read the April draft, did you? Lots of posters must have read the April draft being so vocal in rejection.

[yellowboat]

If anyone is still confused about the double standards thing, let this disavow you of that puzzlement.

If you recall, anti-democrat Suthep Thaugsuban calling a very public press conference to trumpet his support for the democracy crippling draft constitution. Good enough he declared! Support it he demanded!

Suthep is not restricted, but those from the other side of the equation are. Suthep is a supporter. It seems only critical voices are to be silenced. Anyone else can line up to speak.

In reality however, some objectives have been reached. It will simply propel those who were denied, go to plan 'B".

This is an affront to them. This idiocy is getting huge circulation, and in some way exceeds what a Press Conference could. The details of the thing are well known anyway and doesn't need reiteration in a Press Conference. Also the notion that Suthep influenced anyone who wasn't already disposed to his version of things is mistaken. He probably incited more people against this thing than the other way around.

Wow, interesting times to observe all of this from the sidelines for us inconsequential Farangs.

"democracy crippling draft"

That's like saying we're against, 'nuff said. Missing is the 'obvious', or 'clearly for all to see'.

My understanding is that politicians are against as it restricts them in their previous almost unrestricted position to 'be someone' and even date to mention 'responsibility', 'accountability' and such.

Then it should be debated in an open forum, and the junta should not spend so much time trying to protect itself.

'open forum' ? I though everyone wanted a constitution quickly, not next decade.

Last year the NCPO was asking for help and input for reforms, constitution. How much help did they get? Apart from 'good' input from TVF members of course.

Maybe the new constitution is being rammed down everyones throat by a military strong man who thinks it a good idea. Those who did not want to participate perhaps liked things the way they were. Regardless it needs a public forum and the cowardice of the army is in full view.

So it looks like you are in a hurry for get this done regardless of its quality and are afraid of public scrutiny as well. Cut mroe corners and constitution 34 will be right around the corner.

[baboon]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Only by force of arms and loads of sleight of hand. In all honesty, do you really believe the "legal" bit?

Has the silence answered your question?

[rubl]

"democracy crippling draft"

That's like saying we're against, 'nuff said. Missing is the 'obvious', or 'clearly for all to see'.

My understanding is that politicians are against as it restricts them in their previous almost unrestricted position to 'be someone' and even date to mention 'responsibility', 'accountability' and such.

Then it should be debated in an open forum, and the junta should not spend so much time trying to protect itself.

'open forum' ? I though everyone wanted a constitution quickly, not next decade.

Last year the NCPO was asking for help and input for reforms, constitution. How much help did they get? Apart from 'good' input from TVF members of course.

Maybe the new constitution is being rammed down everyones throat by a military strong man who thinks it a good idea. Those who did not want to participate perhaps liked things the way they were. Regardless it needs a public forum and the cowardice of the army is in full view.

So it looks like you are in a hurry for get this done regardless of its quality and are afraid of public scrutiny as well. Cut mroe corners and constitution 34 will be right around the corner.

Oh, I'm not in a hurry, some posters here only it would seem.

BTW even the previous government used their party led committees to turn draft bills into something completely different before trying to ram it through parliament. The blanket amnesty bill comes to mind, as well as 'voting' for constitution amendments. Seem the current government behave as good as the previous government.

As for 'liked things they were' assuming we're still on the topic of charter, the Yingluck government tried to modify the constitution to be more to their liking.

[metisdead]

Inflammatory posts have been removed.

[tajtom]

This guy is funny and I wonder how much he paid for his medals

The draft is a paper that not many will ever understand hence its meaning

[rubl]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Only by force of arms and loads of sleight of hand. In all honesty, do you really believe the "legal" bit?

Has the silence answered your question?

Did the poster honestly want an answer to continue dragging the discussion off topic ?

[tajtom]

Why would they give you there names... So you can try intimidate them to speak your tongue.. the speach of Thai baht

[yellowboat]

Then it should be debated in an open forum, and the junta should not spend so much time trying to protect itself.

'open forum' ? I though everyone wanted a constitution quickly, not next decade.

Last year the NCPO was asking for help and input for reforms, constitution. How much help did they get? Apart from 'good' input from TVF members of course.

Maybe the new constitution is being rammed down everyones throat by a military strong man who thinks it a good idea. Those who did not want to participate perhaps liked things the way they were. Regardless it needs a public forum and the cowardice of the army is in full view.

So it looks like you are in a hurry for get this done regardless of its quality and are afraid of public scrutiny as well. Cut mroe corners and constitution 34 will be right around the corner.

Oh, I'm not in a hurry, some posters here only it would seem.

BTW even the previous government used their party led committees to turn draft bills into something completely different before trying to ram it through parliament. The blanket amnesty bill comes to mind, as well as 'voting' for constitution amendments. Seem the current government behave as good as the previous government.

As for 'liked things they were' assuming we're still on the topic of charter, the Yingluck government tried to modify the constitution to be more to their liking.

Many elected governments try to pass laws that are to their liking. They do so at the risk of losing an election.. An unelected, armed contingent doing it then quashing its debate is sacrilege.

[rubl]

'open forum' ? I though everyone wanted a constitution quickly, not next decade.

Last year the NCPO was asking for help and input for reforms, constitution. How much help did they get? Apart from 'good' input from TVF members of course.

Maybe the new constitution is being rammed down everyones throat by a military strong man who thinks it a good idea. Those who did not want to participate perhaps liked things the way they were. Regardless it needs a public forum and the cowardice of the army is in full view.

So it looks like you are in a hurry for get this done regardless of its quality and are afraid of public scrutiny as well. Cut mroe corners and constitution 34 will be right around the corner.

Oh, I'm not in a hurry, some posters here only it would seem.

BTW even the previous government used their party led committees to turn draft bills into something completely different before trying to ram it through parliament. The blanket amnesty bill comes to mind, as well as 'voting' for constitution amendments. Seem the current government behave as good as the previous government.

As for 'liked things they were' assuming we're still on the topic of charter, the Yingluck government tried to modify the constitution to be more to their liking.

Many elected governments try to pass laws that are to their liking. They do so at the risk of losing an election.. An unelected, armed contingent doing it then quashing its debate is sacrilege.

Sacrilege?

Anyway, the election bit is just the usual distraction. Let's have an election and all Thailand's problems will go away.

So, NCPO explains, TVF members complain and somehow it would seem Thai couldn't really care less. I wonder how many had read the 2007 version or have even bothered to read the April draft the NRC made available?

[metisdead]

Inflammatory posts and replies have been removed.

[Jon Wetherall]

Every day this non-elected, illegal government digs their hole deeper and deeper.

"...the NCPO had to stick to its original guideline to seek cooperation from all sectors to refrain from holding activities which may cause public confusion, may affect efforts to promote unity or may affect the political roadmap..."

No one with half a brain would believe the drivel that comes out of their mouths.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

They may not be elected by some former police Lieutenant-Colonel, but they are legal.

Ah, nooo, they're not. Or did you miss the point that they had an ILLEGAL COUP, then installed themselves into power, then "elected" (if you want to call it that) a new PM who, by the way, was the same man who lead the coup. There is absolutely nothing legal about the present government in any way, shape or form.

The current government is a legal government, endorsed, sworn in, etc., etc. You disliking them doesn't make them illegal.

Now of course if you want to tell me that recently Western democracies offered help to this 'allegedly' illegal government thereby breaking their own laws, that's up to you.

And what/who made an illegal government legal? The Thai people (the repository of all power according to the last military constitution)? The abbot of the local wat? A friend of the PM? His wife? A magic spell?