EU plans tougher gun rules

[Nomyai]

I hear French are being taugh to throw CHEESe Blocks @ terrorists. Kind of like how some usa skoolkids are being taught to throw their pencilboxes as campus hooligans................

[Nomyai]

It is true that no matter how tough a country's gun laws are, illegal weapons will still be available and used.

Terrorist groups such as that responsible for the Paris atrocity will almost certainly be able to smuggle illegal weapons into Europe.

The experience of the UK with the IRA in the 1970's shows that (and we all know who supplied them with their guns).

However, tougher gun laws will make it far more difficult for individuals and small groups to obtain and use guns and so will save lives; the tougher gun laws in the UK introduced since Dunblane shows that.

The argument that had people inside the crowded Paris theatre been armed they could have killed the terrorists before the terrorists killed so many is ridiculous. The terrorists would simply have placed people between themselves and those shooting at them, resulting in even more innocent victims.

Did the terrorist have tickets to enter the venue? Where were the ushers?

[bangon04]

Totally STUPID idea for the EU countries to do ... The Paris terrorist attack was successful in killing 129 and wounding hundreds more BECAUSE the trapped people had to wait for the police to arrive. Had 30-40% of the people been bearing concealed weapons -- the terrorist would have been shot before killing anywhere near 129 people ...

I admit that I haven't been to many rock concerts in US city centres, but the few I did experience I seem to remember that they had a ban on weapons at the door, so legal owners of firearms either had to go home and not see the concert, or leave their firearm in a car outside where it might be stolen and add to the supply of illegal guns in circulation.

The fact that a terrorist with an assault rifle might not be deterred by this policy is a truism, but does not really help your case in a civil society. A heavily armed guard outside the venue might help, and we might end up with such a society soon.

Edited November 21, 2015 by bangon04

[overherebc]

Long time ago in UK it was very easy to get a licence. Now very difficult, but, as it will be in Europe with new gun laws no matter how strict; the people who want guns for terrorist reasons will get guns.

No laws will ever prevent it happening.

Where there is a demand there will be a supply.

The UK over the years has had success in hugely limiting the availability / supply of stealable firearms within its borders. No system is perfect.

Do you honestly think that if the UK police decided it needed forearms, then the government would deny them?

The UK police still feels that except in specific circumstances, they are still better off without raising the stakes.

Not quite sure where I mentioned denying forearms or firearms to the police. Police with firearms I have no problems with.

Brainless idiots with firearms I do have a problem with.

If Terrorists and idiot criminals want to get firearms and explosives they will get them no matter how many laws are in place in any country.

[Nomyai]

It should be French law that anyone that can vote should mandatorily be armed with a Kalishnakov and 4 Hand Grenades.

[NeverSure]

How did we come to believe that only our government could protect us when it's so obvious that they won't and they don't? They are constantly putting us in danger while trying to take away our ability to defend ourselves. We have dangerous immigration issues do we? Well, take away more guns from the law abiding citizens. Huh?

How did we come to believe that an armed guard or policeman would shoot more accurately than a citizen?

My experience is the opposite. I see guys who've never handled a gun before joining the military and the police and many have no interest in guns. At our local range the guys who are lifelong hunters and even competitive shooters can out-shoot any police or military who are there for their obligatory practice and "qualifying".

A problem arises when recruits for the police and military have never handled a gun before their basic training. These guys are never going to be any good because it takes years to become proficient.

Europe is going to get overrun and probably in my lifetime. At what point do the traditional citizens start wanting to defend themselves and their countries? It will happen, but what will it take to trigger that?

Cheers.

[thaibeachlovers]

So europeans have no right to protect themselves.

Correct. In the UK you have to allow the criminals to kill or main you, then the police will file a report and maybe the bad person will be tried for the crime. At least that is the reality. Actually standing up to a criminal is likely to end up with the victim being penalised, especially if the scum thug is a minor.

As pointed out countless times, criminals will never have a problem obtaining weapons, but the politicians don't care, as the whole justice ( there's a lie right there ) system industry depends on criminals being able to do their thing. If bad people were actually locked up for very long times ( ie life means life and not a few years ) the crime rate would fall significantly. This was proven in the US with the 3 strikes and you are out system.

[thaibeachlovers]

How did we come to believe that only our government could protect us when it's so obvious that they won't and they don't? They are constantly putting us in danger while trying to take away our ability to defend ourselves. We have dangerous immigration issues do we? Well, take away more guns from the law abiding citizens. Huh?

How did we come to believe that an armed guard or policeman would shoot more accurately than a citizen?

My experience is the opposite. I see guys who've never handled a gun before joining the military and the police and many have no interest in guns. At our local range the guys who are lifelong hunters and even competitive shooters can out-shoot any police or military who are there for their obligatory practice and "qualifying".

A problem arises when recruits for the police and military have never handled a gun before their basic training. These guys are never going to be any good because it takes years to become proficient.

Europe is going to get overrun and probably in my lifetime. At what point do the traditional citizens start wanting to defend themselves and their countries? It will happen, but what will it take to trigger that?

Cheers.

Europe is going to get overrun and probably in my lifetime.

Not just Europe. The continuing overpopulation of poor countries that can no longer provide jobs within their own borders will ensure that the movement of illegal economic migrants increases, and to most western countries. When they become a subclass in their new countries the problems will really begin.

I don't know the eventual outcome, but it won't be what the present populations want, and won't be pretty.

Just arming the population won't be much use anyway, as most people have no clue about using weapons, and wouldn't be able to kill anyone anyway.

Personally, I expect to have passed on by that time, or at least I hope so, but I pity the citizens of the future, caught up in a terrible conflict not of their making, other than by not getting involved.

[Nomyai]

Poor people dont go killing people at concerts. Fruitcake islamist do. They need to be killed 1 by 1 in their home country.

No rules of engagement for usa military and give them bounties for each one killed. Problem solved in 3 months!

I hear French wimmin news chicks and their answer is MORE gun kontrol!

Now we know why Hollande wanted to raise taxes-he saw this coming. The French need to defend themselves. Obama has no interest!

Edited November 25, 2015 by Nomyai

[MrTee]

In the US more people get shot by children than by terrorists.

In the UK one person has been killed by terrorist since 2010
In the UK the last time a policeman was shot was in 2012..
If a UK Policeman draws a firearm it makes front page national news.

Most of Europe is similar statistically..

lol people the UK don't need guns to protect ourselves.

Thanks for your concern.
If you have so much fear and want to carry firearms then go to a different country where folk do carry guns and do shoot each other on a daily basis.
Not in my country thank you ..

[7by7]

^^^^^

Indeed.

If an armed citizenry is as effective in preventing crime as some claim, how come crime rates, especially violent crime rates, in the USA are so high?

How come we regularly see reports from the USA of armed nutters going on a shooting spree and killing numerous people, or events such as the recent gun fight in a New Orleans park which killed 17 people?

It is a sad fact that the traditional unarmed British bobby walking the beat, although still having an important role, is not enough for effective policing in the 21st century. We do need armed police, and in the UK you will regularly see them at airports, rail terminals, outside embassies etc.

I'd rather have armed police who are properly trained in the use of their weapon, including when to use it, as we do in the UK than a police force where every rookie is issued a gun with their badge.