Thailand aims to lower road fatality rates by 80%

[rijit]

1) fix potholes / mark them before that

enforce :

2) no more then 2 people on a bike

3) no underaged driving

4) everybody wearing a helmet on a bike

5) a proper driving and theory test before getting a licence

6) less u-turns on the road

7) more lights on the roads

8) better checks on quality of vehicles

should get them in there in a couple of years

And a crackdown on drink driving. A television campaign would really help.

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[thailand49]

CarolZ,

Like you I have a number of qualification, one been driving for near 50 years, within those years I have obtained a license to drive, teach and certify commercial drivers, obtain my Motorbike training and license from the California Highway Patrol unit, also have a number of endorsement to operate and teach heavy equipment including moving Aircrafts for a number of US Airlines for their employees. Includes years of seminars with Department of Transportation.

As you noted with all the cultural aspect of Thailand but it should have no baring on operating a vehicle. Motor vehicles were invented in the West, all the rules they place in their system test all come from the West. But big problem like many things they took the laws and no one actually explain to the proper application. If they were, some how through the years the laws/rule have been transform to what they are doing today by the share lack of enforcement. Today driver have been so condition and disensatize to their own method it is killing the greatest resource in their country and that is Thai lives! If you confronted a Thai to their reckless driving they as you say lose face because they have nothing to compare it with so saying they are wrong would only set up a confrontation. How do the leaders of this country solve the problem, how do school teach, when the leaders and teachers are doing the same thing everyone drives in the same manner. You just can't apply rules and test on paper it takes a number of things. Enforcement, Education, Penalty. It does not work if you have nothing to lose. When Thais view driving as a Privilege and Not a Right that is a problem. A vehicle is no different than Gun it is a weapon! You abuse the right you lose it plain and simple. And when their leaders throw out the culture stuff and all the excuses including deciding how much are they willing to give up in money to reduce the problem only then will they be able to make headwave. The first thing W.H.O. is stop giving them or make them accountable where the money is going every baht of it

It is not Thai can't drive they are just so condition that the way they are doing it is the right way! Well, This is Thailand doesn't mean you got to kill yourself needlessly. Driving is a luxury, should be pleasant not pedal to the metal! When Thais, do not fully understand what a Stop means, A solid yellow or double solid line, proper use of Both mirrors, unable to make a proper right or left turn, definition of Righ of way, Stop and proceed with caution, adjust your driving to the condition of the road, allow right way for Emergency vehicles, do not park your vehicle on the train tracks, do not block a intersection with or with a X MARKING. The answer has always been at the Thai leader finger tips and it starts with Enforcement. What is lacking is fortitude to do the right thing instead they make excuses using first their culture!

For a country who so prides itself on " Mai Pen Rai " once behind the wheel , they show no patients, no courtous or consideration for other drivers there is a thing call sharing the road, not using your larger vehicle to intimated smaller vehicles, not using a larger vehicle and speed to determine who has the right way in a intersection. And motorbike drivers need to learn right or wrong you can't win against a Kilo of steel.

The fix is easy but what isn't there is the will to do it. Meantime majority of the accidents and traffic problems are self created! When the car and the rules and laws were invented there is nothing about culture in the equation. Working with the Thais would be great but it is their culture and the lost of face preventing them from asking for outside advice but have no problem accepting the millions USD year after year from the W.H.O. That is the reason year after year there is no progress.

True:But when you say "they show no patients" you should have said they often become patients because they show no patience ......

You got me there, took me a while to get it! Thanks, I'm just getting off the floor now.

[GinBoy2]

I know I'm sounding like a broken record, but...

When you are starting from such a low base, forget about suddenly turning the whole country into a beacon of driving excellence. There are all the laws on the books, but it's not in the popular physi.

Start small, enforce a few simple things, and build. The big bang approach so often typical of proclamations in this country is doomed to fail.

[Artisi]

Thailand could certainly work towards reducing the number of deaths but as some have already posted, there is no will to do it. And, there seems to be no will to do things better even when things are being done. Example: A new U Turn lane is now being constructed on Sukumvit Road in the Jomtien area. It looks like it is replacing a U Turn lane already there as it is being built nearby. Already, I can see that the new turn lane is not wide enough for good safety and buses and cars making U turns will not be far enough out of the high speed lane. There was plenty of room to make it wider and safer but it looks like they didn't want to remove a few trees in the median--even though there are thousands of palms on Sukumvit and a few could be lost for better safety. As an aside, the old U turn lane should have been left open while the new one was being built as it adds congestion at the next available U turn. So many small things could be done to improve safety like improving intersections but just no will to do it.

Those U turns are death traps, least they could do is stagger the U turns not have them both together so your view isnt blocked by oncoming traffic U turning also when trying to do one.................to simple for them to figure out I guess

Unless the driving ENVIRONMENT is attended to, it really doesn't matter how much "eduction or Enforcement you have it won't make a huge difference - deaths occur AFTER the collision as a result of the poor roads and car construction...etc etc.....

i the end almost every road, junction etc in Thailand needs to be re-built and redesigned.

Do you really believe that improving driver education and enforcement of the road rules will do little to reduce the road toll?

[thailand49]

Like people say much has to be desired when it comes to the roads design but as far as cars construction they are better built today than yesterday I think we can all agree to that.

If you been outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, the roads are really not bad. Again it is more the people than the roads. Here is a good example.. in Pattaya just outside Soi 9, the police station while back the police decided to built a Bump to slow down speeding vehicles.. The Bump was around 3 feet long and across Beach Road, it was painted with yellow strips so it was a nice slow rolling over. Within the first week it was dismantle and rebuild because a motorbike bike traveling 90 Kilo/H in the middle of the night went over it and the guy went flying like superman. He was lucky to live, he blamed it on the Bump and because of one guy they changed it. Who's fault do you really think it was? Same thing happen on Second road just outside Soi Diana. Guy going 70Km/H lost control when he hit a uneven pot hole, if he was traveling 30-40 as the Soi indicates no problem who fault was it.

Another Commericail driving rule in the West, If you put yourself in a position for something to happen the % it will happen. In these cases excessive speed was the cause. In the West,, basic driving test question. True or False? Do you adjust your driving and speed to the condition. In commercial driving and a excellent rule for anyone driving here in Thailand? Do not provide more than 3CM, on the left side of your vehicle when making a right turn and always check your mirror first before turning. The distance noted prevents any vehicle especially a motorbike from trying to squeeze throuigh. In Commerical driving in Cities this is a major cause of accidents since Bicycles alway try to squeeze in, and if they try normally they are sucked and pull under the vehicle. Sure if the road is the cause and you were driving within the law, one could clearly identify the source of the problem. Instead here, they pad the guy who was speeding and say sorry. This would never be done in the West, Regardless of his excuse the police in the West are trained to determine how fast you were traveling based on how fast the bike and the driver flew. If the speed limit is 30-40, and that is exceeded. You be honest with him and let him know why and provide a citation ( speeding ) and if there are any damages he is cited and to pay for such damages.

I remember in California when the helmet law was suggested, you could hear all the excuses from the motorcycles groups and dealers. Millions were spent to try to vote it down. White collar business were sleeping with the Hells Angel on this one. They are trying to take your freedom away? it is too hot. etc.. etc... But all the medical stats were all on the side of the Proposition Billion were being lost on head injuries and brain damage. The Law passed and today everyone wears a helmet even the Hells Angel, for Bike riders not wearing a helmet is like forgetting your underwear. Today, there is a Billion dollar industry for helmets.

Someone posted that the PM, got to do something. The beginning of this year the PM, after the a report from W.H.O. came out that Thailand was number #2, he declare something got to be done. Two months later he was caught promoting a Haley riding around without! No one said anything and that is the story of what is going to happen with trying to reduce it by 80%. All and All I hope I am wrong! But I go by History, which is a great indicator of what is going to happen in the future.

[cumgranosalum]

Thailand could certainly work towards reducing the number of deaths but as some have already posted, there is no will to do it. And, there seems to be no will to do things better even when things are being done. Example: A new U Turn lane is now being constructed on Sukumvit Road in the Jomtien area. It looks like it is replacing a U Turn lane already there as it is being built nearby. Already, I can see that the new turn lane is not wide enough for good safety and buses and cars making U turns will not be far enough out of the high speed lane. There was plenty of room to make it wider and safer but it looks like they didn't want to remove a few trees in the median--even though there are thousands of palms on Sukumvit and a few could be lost for better safety. As an aside, the old U turn lane should have been left open while the new one was being built as it adds congestion at the next available U turn. So many small things could be done to improve safety like improving intersections but just no will to do it.

Those U turns are death traps, least they could do is stagger the U turns not have them both together so your view isnt blocked by oncoming traffic U turning also when trying to do one.................to simple for them to figure out I guess

Unless the driving ENVIRONMENT is attended to, it really doesn't matter how much "eduction or Enforcement you have it won't make a huge difference - deaths occur AFTER the collision as a result of the poor roads and car construction...etc etc.....

i the end almost every road, junction etc in Thailand needs to be re-built and redesigned.

Do you really believe that improving driver education and enforcement of the road rules will do little to reduce the road toll?

Read my argument - it is perfectly clear -

[cumgranosalum]

Like people say much has to be desired when it comes to the roads design but as far as cars construction they are better built today than yesterday I think we can all agree to that.

If you been outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, the roads are really not bad. Again it is more the people than the roads. Here is a good example.. in Pattaya just outside Soi 9, the police station while back the police decided to built a Bump to slow down speeding vehicles.. The Bump was around 3 feet long and across Beach Road, it was painted with yellow strips so it was a nice slow rolling over. Within the first week it was dismantle and rebuild because a motorbike bike traveling 90 Kilo/H in the middle of the night went over it and the guy went flying like superman. He was lucky to live, he blamed it on the Bump and because of one guy they changed it. Who's fault do you really think it was? Same thing happen on Second road just outside Soi Diana. Guy going 70Km/H lost control when he hit a uneven pot hole, if he was traveling 30-40 as the Soi indicates no problem who fault was it.

Another Commericail driving rule in the West, If you put yourself in a position for something to happen the % it will happen. In these cases excessive speed was the cause. In the West,, basic driving test question. True or False? Do you adjust your driving and speed to the condition. In commercial driving and a excellent rule for anyone driving here in Thailand? Do not provide more than 3CM, on the left side of your vehicle when making a right turn and always check your mirror first before turning. The distance noted prevents any vehicle especially a motorbike from trying to squeeze throuigh. In Commerical driving in Cities this is a major cause of accidents since Bicycles alway try to squeeze in, and if they try normally they are sucked and pull under the vehicle. Sure if the road is the cause and you were driving within the law, one could clearly identify the source of the problem. Instead here, they pad the guy who was speeding and say sorry. This would never be done in the West, Regardless of his excuse the police in the West are trained to determine how fast you were traveling based on how fast the bike and the driver flew. If the speed limit is 30-40, and that is exceeded. You be honest with him and let him know why and provide a citation ( speeding ) and if there are any damages he is cited and to pay for such damages.

I remember in California when the helmet law was suggested, you could hear all the excuses from the motorcycles groups and dealers. Millions were spent to try to vote it down. White collar business were sleeping with the Hells Angel on this one. They are trying to take your freedom away? it is too hot. etc.. etc... But all the medical stats were all on the side of the Proposition Billion were being lost on head injuries and brain damage. The Law passed and today everyone wears a helmet even the Hells Angel, for Bike riders not wearing a helmet is like forgetting your underwear. Today, there is a Billion dollar industry for helmets.

Someone posted that the PM, got to do something. The beginning of this year the PM, after the a report from W.H.O. came out that Thailand was number #2, he declare something got to be done. Two months later he was caught promoting a Haley riding around without! No one said anything and that is the story of what is going to happen with trying to reduce it by 80%. All and All I hope I am wrong! But I go by History, which is a great indicator of what is going to happen in the future.

"If you been outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, the roads are really not bad" - what criteria are you using? The roads in Thailand are dreadful....poorly designed from the outset they are badly constructed with junctions and furniture added without any forethought at all.

if a UK council biult speed bumps like in Thailand, they would be sued.

In fact how many speed bumps do you see in UK these days? Not many - there are far better ways of "traffic calming" ....and far safer too.

[FritsSikkink]

Like people say much has to be desired when it comes to the roads design but as far as cars construction they are better built today than yesterday I think we can all agree to that.

If you been outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, the roads are really not bad. Again it is more the people than the roads. Here is a good example.. in Pattaya just outside Soi 9, the police station while back the police decided to built a Bump to slow down speeding vehicles.. The Bump was around 3 feet long and across Beach Road, it was painted with yellow strips so it was a nice slow rolling over. Within the first week it was dismantle and rebuild because a motorbike bike traveling 90 Kilo/H in the middle of the night went over it and the guy went flying like superman. He was lucky to live, he blamed it on the Bump and because of one guy they changed it. Who's fault do you really think it was? Same thing happen on Second road just outside Soi Diana. Guy going 70Km/H lost control when he hit a uneven pot hole, if he was traveling 30-40 as the Soi indicates no problem who fault was it.

Another Commericail driving rule in the West, If you put yourself in a position for something to happen the % it will happen. In these cases excessive speed was the cause. In the West,, basic driving test question. True or False? Do you adjust your driving and speed to the condition. In commercial driving and a excellent rule for anyone driving here in Thailand? Do not provide more than 3CM, on the left side of your vehicle when making a right turn and always check your mirror first before turning. The distance noted prevents any vehicle especially a motorbike from trying to squeeze throuigh. In Commerical driving in Cities this is a major cause of accidents since Bicycles alway try to squeeze in, and if they try normally they are sucked and pull under the vehicle. Sure if the road is the cause and you were driving within the law, one could clearly identify the source of the problem. Instead here, they pad the guy who was speeding and say sorry. This would never be done in the West, Regardless of his excuse the police in the West are trained to determine how fast you were traveling based on how fast the bike and the driver flew. If the speed limit is 30-40, and that is exceeded. You be honest with him and let him know why and provide a citation ( speeding ) and if there are any damages he is cited and to pay for such damages.

I remember in California when the helmet law was suggested, you could hear all the excuses from the motorcycles groups and dealers. Millions were spent to try to vote it down. White collar business were sleeping with the Hells Angel on this one. They are trying to take your freedom away? it is too hot. etc.. etc... But all the medical stats were all on the side of the Proposition Billion were being lost on head injuries and brain damage. The Law passed and today everyone wears a helmet even the Hells Angel, for Bike riders not wearing a helmet is like forgetting your underwear. Today, there is a Billion dollar industry for helmets.

Someone posted that the PM, got to do something. The beginning of this year the PM, after the a report from W.H.O. came out that Thailand was number #2, he declare something got to be done. Two months later he was caught promoting a Haley riding around without! No one said anything and that is the story of what is going to happen with trying to reduce it by 80%. All and All I hope I am wrong! But I go by History, which is a great indicator of what is going to happen in the future.

roads outside bangkok and pattaya not bad? you should travel more

[thailand49]

A Clarification when I say " roads not bad " it is not reference to design. It is more the condition to the road and surface of the Highway compare to all the pot holes in the Soi's. As for traveling outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, I've driven over two dozen of times in the last ten years up to Sukhothai ( twice a year, 565 KM ) Chiang Mai, Tak, Sura Buri, Korat, Mai Sai, Laos, etc...

I've never been to the U.K. and I agree speed bumps is not the proper way to reduce speed except in neighborhoodwhich proves my point about how they do things here. In reference to the accident with the speed bump.. whether it should or shouldn't be there is not the point it was clearly marked and I like many had no problem seeing it at a safe speed. When you fly down reckless at speeds 50 KM/H beyond safe you deserve what you get. You do not tear it apart and remove it because of one idiot, if left as is.. the idiot I say wouldn't be doing it again at that junction.

When people speak of U-Turns, they are poorly design without a proper merging lane, because proper merging into traftic is not mentioned in their test nor taught. They sit and wait and proceed out to the middle of the road to on coming traffic. Not understand what and how to merge they hold up all the traffic. This is the same for drivers who make left turns out into the middle of the road when there is plenty of room on the left because no one ever train them to use the left mirror properly.

[CarolJadzia]

Thailand49, your point about stopping at a junction proves the 'No Surprise' 'Safety II' approach over the old enforcement method. When I say 'the whole picture' I am not referring to what a driver can see out of his window. I am referring to the fact that currently bullies will force their way through junctions and riders will ride through red lights oblivious to the dangers.

How many years have there been traffic lights at junctions in Thailand? Even if the PM comes down really heavy on law enforcement do you think everybody is suddenly going to change and obey the law?

My son was nearly killed when a vehicle came through two sets of red lights and hit him in the side while he was riding his motorbike. That was in the UK not Thailand.

I do not trust others to do what they are expected to do or legally obliged to do when riding on UK roads yet you assume that is the answer to Thai roads. Good luck.

[FritsSikkink]

A Clarification when I say " roads not bad " it is not reference to design. It is more the condition to the road and surface of the Highway compare to all the pot holes in the Soi's. As for traveling outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, I've driven over two dozen of times in the last ten years up to Sukhothai ( twice a year, 565 KM ) Chiang Mai, Tak, Sura Buri, Korat, Mai Sai, Laos, etc...

I've never been to the U.K. and I agree speed bumps is not the proper way to reduce speed except in neighborhoodwhich proves my point about how they do things here. In reference to the accident with the speed bump.. whether it should or shouldn't be there is not the point it was clearly marked and I like many had no problem seeing it at a safe speed. When you fly down reckless at speeds 50 KM/H beyond safe you deserve what you get. You do not tear it apart and remove it because of one idiot, if left as is.. the idiot I say wouldn't be doing it again at that junction.

When people speak of U-Turns, they are poorly design without a proper merging lane, because proper merging into traftic is not mentioned in their test nor taught. They sit and wait and proceed out to the middle of the road to on coming traffic. Not understand what and how to merge they hold up all the traffic. This is the same for drivers who make left turns out into the middle of the road when there is plenty of room on the left because no one ever train them to use the left mirror properly.

loads of potholes in any village

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

When the average driver has around 100 IQ when it comes to safety and common sense then the only real solution are self driving vehicles.

As AI is still a long way from human intelligence and self driving cars are still having issues, although possibly at some point in the distant future it may be the case, it is far from reality at the moment.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/02/technology/personaltech/google-says-its-not-the-driverless-cars-fault-its-other-drivers.html?_r=0

and you probably thought the internet was a fad in the early days?

It's not all or nothing with self driving.

Modern cars like Audi's, Mercedes etc already have safety systems that alert for dangers and automatically brake if the driver is not paying enough attention.

[CarolJadzia]

When the average driver has around 100 IQ when it comes to safety and common sense then the only real solution are self driving vehicles.

As AI is still a long way from human intelligence and self driving cars are still having issues, although possibly at some point in the distant future it may be the case, it is far from reality at the moment.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/02/technology/personaltech/google-says-its-not-the-driverless-cars-fault-its-other-drivers.html?_r=0

and you probably thought the internet was a fad in the early days?

It's not all or nothing with self driving.

Modern cars like Audi's, Mercedes etc already have safety systems that alert for dangers and automatically brake if the driver is not paying enough attention.

Well actually I am what is normally termed an 'early adopter' I like technology. But that does not change the facts.

If you were to put a google car on the road in Bangkok it would not go anywhere, it's sensors would be overwhelmed by the data and lack of rule adherence. How can something that only goes when the road ahead is clear when it is constantly having it's safety margins compromised by other road users?

You mention some modern cars, this thread is in relation to Thailand where the majority of road users use motorcycles. Yes your driving aids are fitted to cars that the rich elite will use and I am sure that will really be a major contribution to improving Thailand's road safety! Making a minority feel safer when driving around in safety cells when the major problem is 70% related to Motorcycle Deaths? People become reliant on driver aids and then complacency sets in and leads to risk compensation.

[Briggsy]

"Thailand aims to lower road fatality rates by 80%"

They will fail. This is a nailed-on certainty. They will not even get remotely close to their target. They will institute very few, if any at all, of the reforms necessary to achieve this.

The stated goal will be completely forgotten within 2 weeks of being publicly stated. No member of the press will be able to actually recall who stated it, many will not be able to actually recall the goal itself.

Almost every aspect of this story exposes severe failings in areas such as road safety, law enforcement, driver training, governance, duty of care to the road user (even the safe ones), etc.

[bunnydrops]

I don't want to give them any help, but since Thailand only counts the ones that die at the accident, make sure they are not "dead" until they get to the hospital.

[tom21]

I don't want to give them any help, but since Thailand only counts the ones that die at the accident, make sure they are not "dead" until they get to the hospital.

yes, have it so that only a doctor can pronounce someone dead so no matter how injured someone is they are not classed as dead till they are seen by a doctor. that should cut the road deaths down by at least 99%

[metisdead]

Off topic posts have been removed, this isn't about gun control in the US.

[shirtless]

They could do this easily but they would need to confiscate 80% of vehicles.

[thailand49]

Thailand49, your point about stopping at a junction proves the 'No Surprise' 'Safety II' approach over the old enforcement method. When I say 'the whole picture' I am not referring to what a driver can see out of his window. I am referring to the fact that currently bullies will force their way through junctions and riders will ride through red lights oblivious to the dangers.

How many years have there been traffic lights at junctions in Thailand? Even if the PM comes down really heavy on law enforcement do you think everybody is suddenly going to change and obey the law?

My son was nearly killed when a vehicle came through two sets of red lights and hit him in the side while he was riding his motorbike. That was in the UK not Thailand.

I do not trust others to do what they are expected to do or legally obliged to do when riding on UK roads yet you assume that is the answer to Thai roads. Good luck.

I think we agree on the same thing but both of us are on different pages somehow. Based on everything I've said which was to express my opinion as to what is wrong in Thailand and what is necessary to correct the problem. In both our training... I mentioned getting the "Big Picture " and getting the picture is being defensive, which I think is what you are saying here? Defensive driving getting the big picture is expecting the unexpected thus learing the habits of Thais. In your son situation, one that is applied in the States at a Intersection ( Light control ) is once the light changes, wait a few seconds before proceeding or as long as it takes to allow all the red lights runners to go by. And here in Thailand, there is plenty of them because as I noted, the % change of getting caught is slim and none?

You can never change things 100%, not here, not in the U.S., or even the U.K. it is about containing the problem! As you have been saying curtailing to their culture isn't going to do it? Allowing and aware of red lights runner is a good defensive mindset but in the end you got to have enforcement, something to lose (penalty) before a person will think twice. Look at it this way... if you are a bully and been doing this for sometime, no one of authority has said anything to you so you continue it. One day, you try to bully a guy but this guy is much bigger than you. You are not sure about bullying him and whether you can take him. The second of hesitation is because you he thinks he is going to get his butt kicked and if he does get his butt kicked, that is a lost (penalty) it will next time think twice. That thinking twice might save a live or his the next time he decides to run a light.

A example... the government need to promote on National a compaign that they are going to do something about all the red light runners, so films nightly of what happens and the results, the stats of injuries and death, the hardship it creats for family. Then out to major Intersections like Sukhumvit and net those drivers. They also need to start investing into Technology so they can track every driver history and vehicle. There are hundreds of little things they can do. I fully understand what you are saying.. being aware and defensive is very important because as I noted, if you are not aware you are putting yourself in a situation for something to happen and if one does that the % is it will. Did you understand when I said that?

Good luck... and best of luck yourself

It is not

[Artisi]

So many on a completely wrong track about the majority of road deaths. The majority of deaths, something like 75% are not about motor vehicles, road design, U-turns, traffic lights or even rules problems, it is the deaths caused by motor cycle riders and their passengers, in the main caused by the bike riders themselves - you can probably extrapolate some of the deaths in car accidents as being the result of motor bikes and of course many bike deaths are caused by car drivers.

It is blatantly clear that the effort in reducing road deaths should be concentrated on education and control of motor bike users while making car drivers more fully aware their responsibility around motorbikes.

[thailand49]

A Clarification when I say " roads not bad " it is not reference to design. It is more the condition to the road and surface of the Highway compare to all the pot holes in the Soi's. As for traveling outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, I've driven over two dozen of times in the last ten years up to Sukhothai ( twice a year, 565 KM ) Chiang Mai, Tak, Sura Buri, Korat, Mai Sai, Laos, etc...

I've never been to the U.K. and I agree speed bumps is not the proper way to reduce speed except in neighborhoodwhich proves my point about how they do things here. In reference to the accident with the speed bump.. whether it should or shouldn't be there is not the point it was clearly marked and I like many had no problem seeing it at a safe speed. When you fly down reckless at speeds 50 KM/H beyond safe you deserve what you get. You do not tear it apart and remove it because of one idiot, if left as is.. the idiot I say wouldn't be doing it again at that junction.

When people speak of U-Turns, they are poorly design without a proper merging lane, because proper merging into traftic is not mentioned in their test nor taught. They sit and wait and proceed out to the middle of the road to on coming traffic. Not understand what and how to merge they hold up all the traffic. This is the same for drivers who make left turns out into the middle of the road when there is plenty of room on the left because no one ever train them to use the left mirror properly.

loads of potholes in any village

Read again! I made a clarification and a response... Not talking about roads in villages! Talking about in general major highways to these villages. And I again will note to you and others, if someone like yourself know there are potholes everywhere and you are riding a motorbikes? Do you adjust your driving/speed to the weather and condition of the road or do you continue to drive 50 Km/H above the speed limit. If it was raining or snowing would you slow down or continue to drive 50KM/H? If you do then as I noted, you place yourself with a greater % for something to happen and usually it will happen.

[CarolJadzia]

So many on a completely wrong track about the majority of road deaths. The majority of deaths, something like 75% are not about motor vehicles, road design, U-turns, traffic lights or even rules problems, it is the deaths caused by motor cycle riders and their passengers, in the main caused by the bike riders themselves - you can probably extrapolate some of the deaths in car accidents as being the result of motor bikes and of course many bike deaths are caused by car drivers.

It is blatantly clear that the effort in reducing road deaths should be concentrated on education and control of motor bike users while making car drivers more fully aware their responsibility around motorbikes.

You are right on most of what you say and I agree with you about education. but to blame the riders is wrong.

It is not the motorcyclists all killing themselves. It is far more complex than that. Like you say, the statistics show that 75% or road fatalities in Thailand are motorcyclists, that is very different to assuming that they all were responsible for their own deaths.

It is unfortunate that in collisions the motorcyclist will probably come off worse, but that is not evidence that they caused the accident.

Many if not the majority of motorcycle accidents are caused by other vehicles turning across or into the path of the rider.

I am not suggesting all riders are innocent, as you point out - speed, correct safety clothing and lack of basic riding skills are all contributing factors.

There are an estimated 19 169 418 motorcycles on Thai roads, thats 15 times the amount of motorcycles compared to the UK with a similar sized population.

Of course road fatalities for motorcyclists are high. But the recorded amount is only ten times worse than the UK. You could argue on that score that Thai Riders are safer than UK riders. But we know that not to be the case as well. But to accuse riders of causing their own deaths is grossly wrong. Do you actually think someone would go out intentionally cause their own deaths? Many Thais do not consider that death is something they should not be worrying about because of their beliefs in rebirth and life being a transitional journey. But that's not the same as cause.

[jerojero]

After 5 years, no improvement. And no surprise. The good general will fix it with a directive. Because he believes demanding results guarantees them. Look forward to the safest streets and roadways on Asia!

[jjablonsky]

My unsolicited opinion;

Now I am living in the Norther Country so this may not be relivant to everyone. But Thailand already has many laws on the books to help prevent traffic fatalities. By the way Thailand has the 4^th highest death rate in traffic fatalities in the world according to the World Health Organization 2012 data. So some things to consider in reducing those numbers.

1. Traffic signs and lights. Again this may not pertain to you but where I live they are almost non existand and where there is one they seem to be optional to obey just like the one way signs.

2. Enforce the traffic laws

3. Stop letting 8,9,10,11, and 12 year olds to operate motor vehicles

4. Enforce helmet laws

5. Stop letting people ride in the back of open trucks

6. Stop letting 4 and 5 people ride on a scooter, they are ideally designed for 2 riders 3 at most

7. Stop letting infants ride on motorcycles, it is inherently dangerous

8. Stop letting school children to ride on top of buses.

Look at the images below and see if you see anything wrong.

[Artisi]

So many on a completely wrong track about the majority of road deaths. The majority of deaths, something like 75% are not about motor vehicles, road design, U-turns, traffic lights or even rules problems, it is the deaths caused by motor cycle riders and their passengers, in the main caused by the bike riders themselves - you can probably extrapolate some of the deaths in car accidents as being the result of motor bikes and of course many bike deaths are caused by car drivers.

It is blatantly clear that the effort in reducing road deaths should be concentrated on education and control of motor bike users while making car drivers more fully aware their responsibility around motorbikes.

You are right on most of what you say and I agree with you about education. but to blame the riders is wrong.

It is not the motorcyclists all killing themselves. It is far more complex than that. Like you say, the statistics show that 75% or road fatalities in Thailand are motorcyclists, that is very different to assuming that they all were responsible for their own deaths.

It is unfortunate that in collisions the motorcyclist will probably come off worse, but that is not evidence that they caused the accident.

Many if not the majority of motorcycle accidents are caused by other vehicles turning across or into the path of the rider.

I am not suggesting all riders are innocent, as you point out - speed, correct safety clothing and lack of basic riding skills are all contributing factors.

There are an estimated 19 169 418 motorcycles on Thai roads, thats 15 times the amount of motorcycles compared to the UK with a similar sized population.

Of course road fatalities for motorcyclists are high. But the recorded amount is only ten times worse than the UK. You could argue on that score that Thai Riders are safer than UK riders. But we know that not to be the case as well. But to accuse riders of causing their own deaths is grossly wrong. Do you actually think someone would go out intentionally cause their own deaths? Many Thais do not consider that death is something they should not be worrying about because of their beliefs in rebirth and life being a transitional journey. But that's not the same as cause.

I don't have numbers to back this up back seen on a few occasions that a large number of bike rider's deaths are attributed to booze etc. Of course that's not allowing for reckless stupid acts like weaving in and out of the traffic, running red lights, no head or tail lights during the night, wrong side of the road, turning left from side streets without looking, etc etc.

If riding like a lunatic, disregarding lights, rules isn't causing their own deaths - what would you call it?

[thailand49]

So many on a completely wrong track about the majority of road deaths. The majority of deaths, something like 75% are not about motor vehicles, road design, U-turns, traffic lights or even rules problems, it is the deaths caused by motor cycle riders and their passengers, in the main caused by the bike riders themselves - you can probably extrapolate some of the deaths in car accidents as being the result of motor bikes and of course many bike deaths are caused by car drivers.

It is blatantly clear that the effort in reducing road deaths should be concentrated on education and control of motor bike users while making car drivers more fully aware their responsibility around motorbikes.

I agree, it is like Guns ownership which I had own many in the States. It is not the gun that is doing the killing but the people who own them. It is not the car/motorbike, it is the operator.

[cromagnon]

Taking a look at what most who've posted have to say here on this forum about the article, I can only hope that Thailand ignores 90% of you. You bring western ways of thinking into Thailand and pollute it.

The most useless thing you can do with regard to safety is to talk about it. It's plain stupid. To think that people make careers out of being "safety officers" is all politics. Pathetic. Safety is a common sense issue, and you either practice it or you don't. If you are an imbecile, all the safety lectures in the world won't save you. Safety briefings, seminars, drives, government involvement......all of this winds up doing nothing. In fact, unintended consequences are the order of the day when organizations take outlandish measures in the name of "safety". The cure winds up being worse than the disease. The vast majority of maniacal youngsters on motorbikes wind up killing themselves and becoming part of the statistics anyway. I say let them do it. Darwinism.

If the Thai authorities want to start enforcement regarding people who run red lights after they've been red for 10 seconds, I'm all for that and similar measures. Maybe they can also step up helmet enforcement. That alone would be a good start. But I cringe at the thought of what the authorities have in mind for cutting fatalities. Remember, they don't think logically. Their solutions are bound to be ill-conceived. Then again, I'm sure a lot of the readers here don't care much, as from my observations, most farangs are sedentary creatures. Your "good ideas" wind up creating negative impact for those who actually do get out there and enjoy life, but you could not care less.

The roads in the south are treacherous, I won't deny that. But the roads of Lanna are just fine. I can only hope that whatever the Thais have in mind to reduce fatalities does not involve corruption and harassment and ticketing for ridiculous violations, like riding your big bike in the right lane. Some guys have cycles bigger than some cars, for heaven sake. Some of the regulations are so antiquated, they are pathetic. That regulation alone, if followed, probably contributes to deaths in and of itself. Get rid of it and large cycles will be less prone to running into those who pull out from their left without first checking oncoming traffic. Cheers to any readers out there with common sense......all two of you.

[newnative]

Yes, it may be true that the majority of the motorcycle accidents are caused by "other vehicles turning across or into the path of the rider." But, I suspect in the vast majority of the cases: the PATH OF THE RIDER was turning onto a street without even glancing to see if any vehicles were coming. the PATH OF THE RIDER was weaving in and out of traffic on the right and left side of vehicles. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving the wrong way on the street. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving straight thru a red light. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving on the middle yellow line. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving at night with no headlight or taillight--and wearing dark clothing. the PATH OF THE RIDER was making an illegal U-turn--often thru a barrier set up in the road. the PATH OF THE RIDER was to try to speed past a vehicle making a turn instead of waiting for the vehicle to turn. the PATH OF THE RIDER was making a turn into a road without waiting for the vehicle ahead to also make the same turn. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving on the sidewalk. the PATH OF THE RIDER was to try to squeeze between 2 stopped vehicles in bumper to bumper traffic. Well, you get the picture. The other day my partner and I were on Sukhumvit and we both cringed when we saw three young boys around 13 years old, all helmetless and just out of school, riding on a ratty old motorcycle and the one driving was weaving in and out of heavy traffic going way too fast and nearly being hit several times while we watched. That's an accident waiting to happen--and likely will be due to the path of the motorcycle.

[FritsSikkink]

A Clarification when I say " roads not bad " it is not reference to design. It is more the condition to the road and surface of the Highway compare to all the pot holes in the Soi's. As for traveling outside of Bangkok and Pattaya, I've driven over two dozen of times in the last ten years up to Sukhothai ( twice a year, 565 KM ) Chiang Mai, Tak, Sura Buri, Korat, Mai Sai, Laos, etc...

I've never been to the U.K. and I agree speed bumps is not the proper way to reduce speed except in neighborhoodwhich proves my point about how they do things here. In reference to the accident with the speed bump.. whether it should or shouldn't be there is not the point it was clearly marked and I like many had no problem seeing it at a safe speed. When you fly down reckless at speeds 50 KM/H beyond safe you deserve what you get. You do not tear it apart and remove it because of one idiot, if left as is.. the idiot I say wouldn't be doing it again at that junction.

When people speak of U-Turns, they are poorly design without a proper merging lane, because proper merging into traftic is not mentioned in their test nor taught. They sit and wait and proceed out to the middle of the road to on coming traffic. Not understand what and how to merge they hold up all the traffic. This is the same for drivers who make left turns out into the middle of the road when there is plenty of room on the left because no one ever train them to use the left mirror properly.

loads of potholes in any village

Read again! I made a clarification and a response... Not talking about roads in villages! Talking about in general major highways to these villages. And I again will note to you and others, if someone like yourself know there are potholes everywhere and you are riding a motorbikes? Do you adjust your driving/speed to the weather and condition of the road or do you continue to drive 50 Km/H above the speed limit. If it was raining or snowing would you slow down or continue to drive 50KM/H? If you do then as I noted, you place yourself with a greater % for something to happen and usually it will happen.

the problem is that if it rains and you don't know the road, the potholes are an unwelcome surprise

[cumgranosalum]

Yes, it may be true that the majority of the motorcycle accidents are caused by "other vehicles turning across or into the path of the rider." But, I suspect in the vast majority of the cases: the PATH OF THE RIDER was turning onto a street without even glancing to see if any vehicles were coming. the PATH OF THE RIDER was weaving in and out of traffic on the right and left side of vehicles. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving the wrong way on the street. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving straight thru a red light. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving on the middle yellow line. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving at night with no headlight or taillight--and wearing dark clothing. the PATH OF THE RIDER was making an illegal U-turn--often thru a barrier set up in the road. the PATH OF THE RIDER was to try to speed past a vehicle making a turn instead of waiting for the vehicle to turn. the PATH OF THE RIDER was making a turn into a road without waiting for the vehicle ahead to also make the same turn. the PATH OF THE RIDER was driving on the sidewalk. the PATH OF THE RIDER was to try to squeeze between 2 stopped vehicles in bumper to bumper traffic. Well, you get the picture. The other day my partner and I were on Sukhumvit and we both cringed when we saw three young boys around 13 years old, all helmetless and just out of school, riding on a ratty old motorcycle and the one driving was weaving in and out of heavy traffic going way too fast and nearly being hit several times while we watched. That's an accident waiting to happen--and likely will be due to the path of the motorcycle.

Absolute nonsense...this is pure speculation and wildly inaccurate.....you don't even need to research to find your answer..just Google and ye shall find!