Smoke, Smog, Dust 2016-2017 Chiang Mai

[LolaS]

honestly, this pollution is not caused by slash and burn, or any other agricultural technique.

I honestly doubt that there is any health implication, as a person with asthma in last 3 years I just fee much better compared to Europe.

[tyznd]

3 hours ago, LolaS said:

honestly, this pollution is not caused by slash and burn, or any other agricultural technique.

I honestly doubt that there is any health implication, as a person with asthma in last 3 years I just fee much better compared to Europe.

You can't be serious If you doubt there is any health implication and you've got asthma.  Really no way to reply to someone who makes a statement like that as the evidence of what high levels of PM 2.5 can do to the body are easy to obtain. 

 

If you're not considered about your health stay put.  If you are I strongly suggest you move to a less polluted area. 

[tyznd]

4 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

 

I appreciate the realistic assessment but very discouraging and disappointing.

 

Will this be true of other northern areas as well such as Loei, Pai, etc.?

Those are 2 other cities I was interested in.

 

Here is some other areas with high PM 2.5 http://www.khaosodenglish.com/featured/2017/05/18/chiang-mai-worst-small-particle-pollution-thailand-greenpeace/   but I'm sure there are more such as Chiang Rai that wasn't listed.  I would think anywhere nearby to Chiang Mai and up in the mountains is going to have problems with pollution.

[canopy]

10 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

 

Will this be true of other northern areas as well such as Loei, Pai, etc.?

 

Afraid so. Maybe the levels won't be as bad, but the air is sub-standard much of the year.

 

[LolaS]

3 years I am here, I dont use pump anymore, I dont use powder Turbuhaler as I did in Europe, only monteklukast, but that is nothing unusual since it is also good prevention of contraception side-effects.

PM_2.5 are tiny particles in the air that reduce visibility and cause the air to appear hazy when levels are elevated. I m sorry but in 3 years in chiang mai I never saw hazy air

 

[CNXBKKMAN]

On 23/05/2017 at 8:56 AM, LolaS said:

3 years I am here, I dont use pump anymore, I dont use powder Turbuhaler as I did in Europe, only monteklukast, but that is nothing unusual since it is also good prevention of contraception side-effects.

PM_2.5 are tiny particles in the air that reduce visibility and cause the air to appear hazy when levels are elevated. I m sorry but in 3 years in chiang mai I never saw hazy air

 

I assume you are being serious when you say you have never seen hazy air in CM. When I look at the house across the street 10m away,  even on bad day it looks clear. The trees in the garden all look green and healthy. If I go upstairs and look at Chedi Luang temple about 1km away it is totally greyed out and faded. Central Festival will disappear on a bad day. Doi Suthep mountain will disappear but may faintly reappear by the end of the day. After heavy rain like we have had in the last couple of weeks the mountain stands out so much in the early morning light it looks like you could reach out and touch it. If I look towards Doi Saket , Mae On I can see the mountains clearly and mountains beyond the mountains maybe 60km away. At night street lights , brake lights far into the distance look clear and vibrant. 

        If you haven't noticed anything like this in 3 years I can only imagine you have a restricted view where you live, you go about the city looking down all the time, you drive looking only at the road immediately in front of your vehicle. You never go out. You only go out at night. You are possibly the only resident of CM local or foreign who has never seen hazy air. If you are not trolling this should be prompt you to get your eyesight checked. Maybe you have some kind of colour blindness? 

[tyznd]

On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 8:56 AM, LolaS said:

3 years I am here, I dont use pump anymore, I dont use powder Turbuhaler as I did in Europe, only monteklukast, but that is nothing unusual since it is also good prevention of contraception side-effects.

PM_2.5 are tiny particles in the air that reduce visibility and cause the air to appear hazy when levels are elevated. I m sorry but in 3 years in chiang mai I never saw hazy air

 

Not only do you have asthma but you must also be blind.  Second thought, even a blind person would be able to detect the amount of haze and air pollution there is in Chiang Mai. 

 

Stay here a little longer and they will probably be putting on your grave marker "In Chiang Mai I never saw hazy air"  RIP

 

 

[LolaS]

Honestly, ne or two days when there is burning from hills, but that is all. any other example is an exaggeration.

Yes I have asthma but by living in Chiang Mai condition got better and I never used inhalator (pump) or any strong medication, I only used montek because I m on contraceptions and being 35, maybe you are all older person and this can cause some problems if you have underlying conditions. I dont know.

my familly lives in Germany, Poland, and Russia, coutry that have longer winter and more smoke due to the burning of coal and wood, trust me that air is far far far more worst.

I live around robinson, and I work around CMU; 

I usually walk or take a red car or now uber, and I never NEVer had problem with air. of course there are few days smoky, but still !! nothing. i dont deny that there are few days, but comapring to those places that I been , visited or lived, chiang mai is heaven. Of course i dont deny that older ppl should take care of themselves and move somewhere appropriate

[Ruffian Dick]

"Chiang Mai is heaven"?! Please keep that a secret, what are you thinking???

Terrible smog, followed by deadly floods and roasting hot temperatures! That's the mantra.

[LolaS]

again, deadly floods. Where?

I raised 2 children, one born here, and all of as are coping quite well with health and we are not dead yet. I will let you know if some issue appears I will let you know. but again I never experienced anything serious. 

[Ruffian Dick]

8 hours ago, LolaS said:

again, deadly floods. Where?

I raised 2 children, one born here, and all of as are coping quite well with health and we are not dead yet. I will let you know if some issue appears I will let you know. but again I never experienced anything serious. 

I believe you're missing my irony. -->

Nice places like CM get "discovered" too often; it's getting crowded enough as it is.

[metisdead]

Troll posts of an accusatory nature have been removed as well as the replies.  

[EnlightenedAtheist]

On 5/25/2017 at 9:06 PM, LolaS said:

again, deadly floods. Where?

I raised 2 children, one born here, and all of as are coping quite well with health and we are not dead yet. I will let you know if some issue appears I will let you know. but again I never experienced anything serious. 

Ya! Ya! but, if they die at 50, I don't want to find out!

 

My brain says that cigarette smokes gives cancer. Of course, it is not cigarette smoking, but it is smoke. There are lots of research showing the link between exhausts of vehicles and respiratory problems. Of course, your two children have --so far-- no problem. Have them smoke cigarettes to see if the other research is crazy too. Do it and report to us in 20 years. That is what you are missing. Smoke is not a bullet to the heart.

 

If you want to take a chance with your children, up to you. But, my brain says ... and it seems many agree.

[LolaS]

On 5/26/2017 at 5:43 AM, Ruffian Dick said:

I believe you're missing my irony. -->

Nice places like CM get "discovered" too often; it's getting crowded enough as it is.

oh I see, actually there is decline of population in thailand and in north, I would like to see some data backing this claim.

[Jai Dee]

Yet another troll post has been removed from this thread.

 

Accusing another member of being a troll is trolling as it is deliberately antagonizing and baiting another member.

 

From the Forum Rules:

 

9) You will not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants, or trolling. Trolling can be defined as the act of purposefully antagonizing other people on the internet by posting controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

 

 

[EnlightenedAtheist]

On 5/27/2017 at 2:36 PM, LolaS said:

oh I see, actually there is decline of population in thailand and in north, I would like to see some data backing this claim.

There is a decline in population! Do you have some data to back your claim? Any stats on lung cancers?

[LolaS]

Yes you can google it, you will see clear trend of declining population and childbirth, 1.51 births per woman (2014)

 

 

Quote

 

Thailand's birth rate dropped to 760,000 births per year from more ...

www.hiso.or.th/hiso5/report/download.php?name=eng2012_3

1.  
2.  

and death rates has shrunk very quickly.” 12 Thai Health 2012. Birth. “Fewer babies are ... Thisaverage number of children also has quickly declined. Today the ...

 

you are interchanging emotions and heart. If you dont live in thailand, there is no need to tell us how we live or what kind of heath we have

[EnlightenedAtheist]

1 hour ago, LolaS said:

Yes you can google it, you will see clear trend of declining population and childbirth, 1.51 births per woman (2014)

 

 

you are interchanging emotions and heart. If you dont live in thailand, there is no need to tell us how we live or what kind of heath we have

But, the topic was actually Chiang Mai, not even Northern Thailand, nor the whole of Thailand. 

 

Edited May 28, 2017 by EnlightenedAtheist

[LolaS]

yes @EnlightenedAtheist Chiang Mai is even worst since I follow statistic of one of the biggest university in North, they see a decline over last decade in students enrolling at all levels, they try to stimulate more ppl but it is hopeless because there are not so much children!!!

My  MooBan is half empty, 

there is no Population growth in my opinion,

of course if you refer to foreigners coming to Thailand as tourists, than yes

[Ruffian Dick]

LolaS if that is your real name, you've been out in the orchard, picking cherries, haven't you?

The growth RATE is going down, but the number of actual people is going up.

Total of 62,693,322 in 2000 and 68,297,547 in 2017.

http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/thailand-population/

 

[EnlightenedAtheist]

On 5/29/2017 at 3:37 PM, LolaS said:

yes @EnlightenedAtheist Chiang Mai is even worst since I follow statistic of one of the biggest university in North, they see a decline over last decade in students enrolling at all levels, they try to stimulate more ppl but it is hopeless because there are not so much children!!!

My  MooBan is half empty, 

there is no Population growth in my opinion,

of course if you refer to foreigners coming to Thailand as tourists, than yes

Maybe the explanation is simple: the air is so bad many are all dying or are getting sick so much the ones procreating cannot keep up.

[tyznd]

Here we are into June and today at noon there have already been 4 hourly readings of PM2.5 over 30.  WHO considers a reading under 10 to be safe so once the readings hit 25 and over you're breathing in toxic air of fine particles at the 2.5 level. 

 

This year I started tracking PM2.5 at the 36t Sripoom station and from 16 January there has been a total of 2151 hours where PM2.5 was 25+ along with another 335 hours with readings between 20 and 24.  March was the worst month with 702 hours PM2.5 at 25+, however, May still  came in at 305 hours PM 2.5 25+ with another 112 hours between 20 - 24.

 

Bottom line, you can't just take off for a couple of weeks or a month to get past this toxic air.  You really need to be able and willing to live half the year somewhere else and for most, including myself, this is not a realistic option.  Unless you think you are immune to this air pollution, you probably should consider finding another destination to hang your hat.  That's what I am going to do as breathing is not an option. 

[JimmyJ]

2 hours ago, tyznd said:

Here we are into June and today at noon there have already been 4 hourly readings of PM2.5 over 30.  WHO considers a reading under 10 to be safe so once the readings hit 25 and over you're breathing in toxic air of fine particles at the 2.5 level. 

 

This year I started tracking PM2.5 at the 36t Sripoom station and from 16 January there has been a total of 2151 hours where PM2.5 was 25+ along with another 335 hours with readings between 20 and 24.  March was the worst month with 702 hours PM2.5 at 25+, however, May still  came in at 305 hours PM 2.5 25+ with another 112 hours between 20 - 24.

 

Bottom line, you can't just take off for a couple of weeks or a month to get past this toxic air.  You really need to be able and willing to live half the year somewhere else and for most, including myself, this is not a realistic option.  Unless you think you are immune to this air pollution, you probably should consider finding another destination to hang your hat.  That's what I am going to do as breathing is not an option. 

 

Sad. But realistic.

The north of Thailand had several cities I was looking forward to visiting and liking enough to move there.

 

Now I guess it's the south of Thailand. Or a neighboring country perhaps.

Edited June 1, 2017 by JimmyJ

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed. 

[Ruffian Dick]

On 5/31/2017 at 11:28 PM, tyznd said:

Bottom line, you can't just take off for a couple of weeks or a month to get past this toxic air.  You really need to be able and willing to live half the year somewhere else and for most, including myself, this is not a realistic option.  Unless you think you are immune to this air pollution, you probably should consider finding another destination to hang your hat.  That's what I am going to do as breathing is not an option. 

Adíos amigo. Mai is getting crowded enough as it is.

[tyznd]

On ‎6‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 11:40 PM, Ruffian Dick said:

Adíos amigo. Mai is getting crowded enough as it is.

I don't think they speak Spanish where I am headed but you are right.  Chiang Mai is too crowded and with the unhealthy air that you still get into June, I am making the big move.  Adios.

[canthai55]

Spend a summer in Northern Canada or Alaska during a bad year for forest fires.

Smoke in CNX - Pfffttt !

[canopy]

Interesting article. I've spent time in both. It's like comparing the earth to the moon. One needs to put in perspective just how bad the air in Thailand actually is. The air in California where I stayed was bliss every day of the year. The air in northern Thailand is so horrendous that during peak the sun is blotted out, the hospitals fill with people suffering from respiratory problems, advisories are made to stay indoors with windows and doors tightly closed, no exercise, and breathing masks handed out by the government. Northern Thailand ranks among one of the most polluted places in the entire world. 100% of the population there is impacted. Just think, in not too many months from now the people in the north will be merrily burning down the countryside again creating this self inflicted hazard all over again. Give me California any day.

 

[LolaS]

I am still waiting for those government handout and the time when the sun cannot be seen due to smog. soon be 4th year.

[canopy]

10 hours ago, Berkshire said:

It just says "unhealthy air."

The article is vague but maybe we can surmise 90% of Californians get at least a blip over an AQI of 50 on one day of the year. And surely places like LA go much higher and longer than that. Whatever the exact numbers and time periods are, it's plainly visible to anyone from California that the air in northern Thailand is miserably bad for a miserably long time. Trying to tie this extreme situation to California is nonsense. It really is. Being in a northern thai hotel and choking a sleepless night with no way out of the smoke is a miserable experience.

 

Do you see Chiang Mai in any of these lists?

 

Good question, I'm glad you asked. The first thing you need to understand is the north not only has a wet and dry season, but it also has a smokey and non-smokey time period. These two periods are very closely related. If you were to plug in Chiang Mai air quality during the smokey time frame into the links you provided on the most polluted cities in the world, you would notice it is up with the worst of them. The air in the north can be sub-standard for 6 or 8 consecutive months or however long the dry time of year lasts. It also spends significant time with the AQI soaring above 200, 300, and has even gone over 400. And studies have shown the air in northern thailand is worsening. The other concern is it has been discovered and discussed in this thread more than once that Thailand hides how bad the air really is by not including the dangerous PM 2.5, a measurement a lot of your links show prominently.

 

Maybe then, you'll stop with the hyperbole and untruths...Doesn't do your credibility much good...As for some of your more exaggerated remarks

 

Let's stick to the facts, this is an interesting thread and I have learned a lot and hope to learn more from people such as you. I don't believe anything I stated is exaggerated. Not one bit. Is there anything in particular that I can help fill in for you? Do you need links to gas masks being handed out? Hospitals overrun with those suffering from respiratory problems? Government warnings to stay indoors, etc? Planes not being able to take off due to smog? Just let me know if there is even a hint of exaggeration in anything I have said and I'll see what I can do.