200 Bhat ATM Fee ?

[theguyfromanotherforum]

I can't believe what people

Complain about....less than

$6???? Get a life!!

This is a ridiculous reply.

Perhaps you are old and already amassed a significant amount of cash which is fine if you can't be bothered to worry about $6 (actually it's $8 if you are an Aussie or Canadian). Apparently the fee is going up to 250 baht in August.

I am in the process of still accumulating money, so I try to save on ridiculous and exaggerated fees such as ATM.

I have already stated that I use my rewards credit card wherever possible. Giving 200 baht (and soon 250 baht) to ATM machine is absolutely unnecessary. It's like dumping money down the toilet. Rich people don't do this, so why should I?

Of course, there are some "establishments" that don't accept card payments. Fortunately for me and my wife I don't frequent those.

[sloperating]

I use and recommend a Citibank account - fee free withdrawals at any ATM and excellent internet banking.

[little mary sunshine]

Worked in a semi professional field for more

Than 40 years...amassed money, but never

Bogged myself down with trite amounts of

Funds. Retired 7 years, I will never outlive

My funds...not lucky, worked hard and smart

Planning...Off to Tokyo next month!

Edited July 21, 2016 by little mary sunshine

[ClutchClark]

Totally stupid on YOUR part. complaining a Public forum. Everyone's

Open to respond.

There have really been some outstandingly informative and knowledgable responses in this thread...and then there is yours.

Reading your message I am only left with the thought of what an odd little sociallyunfit man you are.

I find one of the most disheartening aspects to the internet is that it allows a forum where anyone can join a conversation when in the old days someone with a contribution like yours would not even be allowed to sit at the table and participate in the discussion.

cheers

Edited July 21, 2016 by ClutchClark

[williamgeorgeallen]

i dont know why people complain about this. if my income in thailand drops some months i use my nz ATM card to top it up. i take 30 000thb out in one go. what is 200thb for the convenience? its almost nothing.

[Pib]

Yes 200 baht is too much, but less than what my UK bank charge for fees and give a terrible rate. Yes I could change bank and possibly avoid paying UK fees but its hardly worth the hastle

Good post.

Is the rate determined by the Thai Bank who owns the ATM or my local US Bank? I am guessing the Thai Bank.

Cheers

I'm going to assume based on 54321's statement of "...and give a terrible rate..." that the ATM offered him a Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) which provides around a 4% lower exchange rate than the Visa/Mastercard exchange rate....and he accepted that DCC offer by pushing the wrong button. That rate is offered by the ATM owner such as the Thai bank. And the pisser about it is his home country card-issuing bank probably still charged him a foreign transaction fee of around 3% not because they were involved in the currency conversion but simply because it was a foreign transaction in any currency.

Now when an ATM offers you a DCC conversion highly unlikey they will call it DCC but something along the lines of "Bank's Rate, We Converted to Your Home Country Currency for Your Convience, etc." Basically some warm & fuzzy and vague name. That is a DCC transaction--DO NOT accept it. Instead select the option to not accept the conversion and continue on continue without conversion which will then get you the higher/better Visa/Mastercard exchange rate. See this post for more info and a snapshot of how Krungsri Bank ATMs offer a DCC transaction (or at least use to).

And it seems Mastercard cards are more subceptible to triggering a DCC offer, especially European bank issued Mastercard cards. All my debit cards are U.S. Visa debit cards and I've never been offerred a DCC transaction at a Thai bank ATM (including AEON ATMs).

But if 54321 was not offered a DCC, I expect what he sees as bad rates is just the effect of the Thai bank Bt200 fee and his card-issuing bank foreign transaction fee (3% is common) effectively lowering the exchange rate he got...a lot depends on how his bank displays the fees on his statement/ibanking...whether breaking it out separately or just lumping it into the total cash withdrawal amount. With a no foreign transaction fee card he would have been hit with only the Bt200 Thai bank fee only...and some debit cards even reimburse ATM use fees such as the Bt200 fee...most don't, but some do.

If a person disregards the Thai bank ATM Use Fee all other fees are coming from the person's home country card-issuing bank in the foreign transaction fee charged (the approx 1% Visa/Mastercard currency exchange fee is usually included in the bank's foreign transaction fee). If you bank only charges 1% foreign transaction fee they are simply passing along the Visa/Mastercard 1% fee and not heaping on an additional fee. If they charge 3%, 1% of that is the Visa/Mastercard fee and 2% purely for the card-issuing bank to pay the interchange fee with some left over for pure profit.

Four sources of ATM fees to the Card-Holder

1. The Local ATM Use Fee, like the Bt200 Thai bank fee.

2. The Visa/Mastercard Currency Conversion Fee, which ranges from approx 0.2 to 1% depending on contract with your bank...usually 1%.

3. Effect of accepting an DCC Transaction which is usually around 4% lower exchange rate

4. Your Card-issuing bank Foreign Transaction Fee where 1 to 3% is common and sometimes more if they include an additional flat fee.

DCC bad, very bad for the card-holder; DCC good, very good for the banks.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Pib

[Gillyflower]

Because of the 200 business, I got myself an Amex card. Until this year I didn't pay any ATM charges. Now it is 50 baht.

At home, I can use any bank ATM 4 times, after that my bank charges me 1 euro each withdrawal. It is to make me use their ATM.

[Pib]

Because of the 200 business, I got myself an Amex card. Until this year I didn't pay any ATM charges. Now it is 50 baht.

At home, I can use any bank ATM 4 times, after that my bank charges me 1 euro each withdrawal. It is to make me use their ATM.

Yea, for some reason, Thai banks only charge Bt50 ATM Use Fee for American Express and UnionPay cards, but Bt200 for Visa/Mastercard.

[ClutchClark]

Pib,

I have used up my daily allotment of "likes" so I will just say thanks for sharing your knowledge.

I have learned much on this topic.

Since I am just the rare visitor here to LOS, I don't get gouged too bad during my short stays but its still great to learn so much from your posts.

Thanks for taking the time.

[Pib]

And for you U.S. folks who don't what to get a no foreign transaction fee by switching to a bank that offers such, the American Express BlueBird card may be just what you need. No foreign transaction fee and only a $2.50 fee if not using one of their network ATMs like a Thai bank ATM. They do not reimburse ATM Use Fees and their exchange rate is plus or minus a little bit of the Visa/Mastercard rate...call it the same). You can withdraw up to $750/day (approx Bt26K)

So, say you go use the AmEx Bluebird card at a Bangkok Bank ATM, you pull Bt25K, you get hit with the non-reimbursed Thai bank Bt50 ATM Use Fee for AmEx cards plus the AmEx $2.50 non-network use fee (approx Bt87) for a total of Bt137 (approx $3.90) which equates to total fees of 0.55%. This half-percent in fees is approx the same amount in fees if you did the U.S. bank to Bangkok Bank "ACH" transfer transfer for $2,000....and you know how using this ACH transfer method to Bangkok Bank is often talked about on ThaiVisa as the cheapest way for a U.S. person to transfer funds to Thailand...heck of a lot cheaper than SWIFT.

[IAMHERE]

I am forced to use ATM by my bank I flew back to Canada to set up regular transfers to my Thai account. I spoke to 2 bank managers and 2 finance officers and none of them knew what I was talking about they all told me they could not do it.So I flew half way across the world to set up bank to bank transfer to be told they would not do it. I was given a new ATM card and wished good luck. Such is the new world huh. I told the bank I know many foreigners from England,America,Sweden etc who can do . they replied while this is Canada we will not do it

How about a brokerage firm instead where you can open an account in Canada and transfer money to Thailand online or by calling? For example Charles Schwab may be?

I wish people would STOP mentioning Charles Schwab; I use the and when too many people start using them the free train ride will cease. Do not use Charles Schwab, please.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

Totally stupid on YOUR part. complaining a Public forum. Everyone's

Open to respond.

I'm at a loss to understand as to why OMGImInPattaya 'liked' this unintelligible rubbish.

[Pib]

There is others who offer the free train ride which I will leave unmentioned....but some simple googling can find out which ones they are or referring to ThaiVisa past posts. But yea, don't kill the Golden Fee Reimbursement Goose by over-using any card that reimburses ATM fees. Instead, do a counter withdrawal/cash advance where the Bt200 fee is not charged if the Thai bank branch you use allows it versus just pointing you to their ATM.

[elgenon]

When the banks started charging 150THB+stamp per Travelers Check (largest is $100 so is 5%) I went to cash.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

i dont know why people complain about this. if my income in thailand drops some months i use my nz ATM card to top it up. i take 30 000thb out in one go. what is 200thb for the convenience? its almost nothing.

People are unhappy at the usurious fee the Thai banks have colluded into taking. Not everyone wants to take 20000 to 30000 baht from an ATM each time and the suggestion is patently ridiculous.

If I'm going to walk around with 30000 baht each time, then I might as well walk around with thousands of Pounds in my pocket.

ATM machines were meant to create new efficiencies, reducing staff costs. But some unscrupulous people have decided to use it as a tax on a captive audience.

I and many others avoid paying it as a point of principle.

You are welcome to pay it. But to state that you don't understand why others choose to avoid it, only serves to illustrate your paucity of mind.

I'd prefer to hand the 200 baht to someone who needs it. rather than to be forced to hand it over in a form of daylight robbery.

Some people like to bend over and take it. I don't and many here choose not to either,

[masuk]

I am forced to use ATM by my bank I flew back to Canada to set up regular transfers to my Thai account. I spoke to 2 bank managers and 2 finance officers and none of them knew what I was talking about they all told me they could not do it.So I flew half way across the world to set up bank to bank transfer to be told they would not do it. I was given a new ATM card and wished good luck. Such is the new world huh. I told the bank I know many foreigners from England,America,Sweden etc who can do . they replied while this is Canada we will not do it

Don't they have International Telegraphic Transfer? There is such a thing as a SWIFT CODE, you give your bank account number and branch and it's done in a few hours.

My bank in Australia charges me AU$30 to make a transfer, and the BKK bank here makes the dollar to Baht conversion at around 1%.(or more).

[Jiu-Jitsu]

Worked in a semi professional field for more

Than 40 years...amassed money, but never

Bogged myself down with trite amounts of

Funds. Retired 7 years, I will never outlive

My funds...not lucky, worked hard and smart

Planning...Off to Tokyo next month!

What's your point? That everyone should work in a "semi professional field" and "amass money".

I retired from work in my twenties and am not short of cash....but I still wont give the banks that 200 baht...because it's my money, not theirs.

It's just a form of daylight robbery.

As long as I have a choice to not give them the money, I will exercise that choice.

All you have succeeding in doing, is make yourself look a selfish twit. Many work hard for their money and don't want to be treated unfairly. But you appear to only see life from a blinkered point of view.

I'm sure that you won't mind when a street hobo demands US$6 for not scratching your car when your park it. After all, it's only six bucks....

I also don't like that an attraction that charged 100 baht for foreigners and 75 baht for Thais, suddenly began to charge 300 baht to foreigners.

Again, 'just' 200 baht. Of course I can still afford it...but I don't want to give it to them.

[Poppadom]

They would need to make a wire transfer or SWIFT transfer using a Bank that has connections with the Thai bank. They would not be able to do directly.

A SWIFT TT initiated from Singapore is flat SGD 30...

[steve73]

Cash rates at the Thai banks are normally a lot lower than TT rates.

Currently Kasikorn are giving 44.87914 per GBP Cash, vs 45.63813 for a Telegraphic Transfer. That's 0.76 bt less. or 1.7%.

The SWIFT fee for most UK banks is around 20-25 GBP, so you're better off changing cash for less than around 1200 GBP. More than that you're better making a bank transfer.

Of course when using a TT you can choose when you want to move/convert the money. With cash you're restricted to when you're actually here ... at least as a tourist.

As a frequent visitor or long term expat, TT into a local account is the sensible choice.

I recently found xendpay.com - excellent transfer rates & low fees make this even better than a SWIFT TT, especially for smaller payments.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Because of the 200 business, I got myself an Amex card. Until this year I didn't pay any ATM charges. Now it is 50 baht.

At home, I can use any bank ATM 4 times, after that my bank charges me 1 euro each withdrawal. It is to make me use their ATM.

Yea, for some reason, Thai banks only charge Bt50 ATM Use Fee for American Express and UnionPay cards, but Bt200 for Visa/Mastercard.

However, many/most of the AMEX cards from the U.S. charge a foreign currency conversion fee of 2-3% on all purchases and fund withdrawals made abroad. So, an Amex card user might be saving some on the Thai bank ATM withdrawal fee, but they're paying more on the other side. A 2% FCF on a 30,000 baht withdrawal is 600 baht.

And when I've looked periodically at U.S. AMEX cards, they often seem to have a 2.7% foreign currency conversion fee, which would become 810 baht on a 30,000 baht withdrawal.

Anytime you get into these shark-invested waters, you need to look at and evaluate the TOTALITY of your transaction -- which is going to vary by method, card, country, etc etc. -- not just one part of it.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I use and recommend a Citibank account - fee free withdrawals at any ATM and excellent internet banking.

That doesn't apply to all Citibank accounts, only to certain accounts and Citi cards issued in some countries.

For example, last time I checked, if you were keeping $500,000 or so worth of a relationship with Citibank, you could quality for a Citigold account that waives a lot of different Citi fees. But Citi doesn't necessarily waive those same fees for their regular (below Citi Gold) accounts.

In the case of Thailand, Citi cards issued in SOME other countries apparently can be used at Thai Citi ATMs without incurring the Thai Citi ATM fee. But for example, that fee waiver doesn't apply to regular Citi debit cards issued in the U.S. For regular U.S. Citi accountholders, they'll get charged a foreign currency fee by Citi U.S. and then a Thai Citi ATM fee for the withdrawal here. No bargain there to be sure.

Citi debit cards issued in some European and other Asian countries apparently have different fee policies from the U.S. ones as relates to Thailand transactions. So a lot depends on the particular foreign country where one's Citi card has been issued.

Edited July 21, 2016 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[little mary sunshine]

Amazing: How can anyone of normal

Intelligence get so upset over so little.

...perhaps off their meds today!!

[Nick ZepTepi]

Use a wire transfer service, I use Xendpay or wirepay.

Your pay a minimal fee compared to backs and SWIFT.

And it can be charged to your debit card so no credit card fees.

Suspect you will find such a service will also use an exchange rate to make up the difference. SWIFT charge can vary by the bank you use and for higher amounts will not be that great a percentage as it is a set fee. But if you are only taking a few thousand baht - then yes - it would be expensive.

They tell u the rate before u transfer and guarantee ir.

Use remitfinder app and u will see the exchange rate on offer, it is very very close to the official rate and much better than Bangkok banks rate and any other exchange in Thailand.

The only better rate I found was fx remit but there minimum rate and notarised ID requirements make to much hassle for the small amount saved.

Sent from my mobile, please forgive the autocorrect.

[Thunderbirds20]

I remember when the fee was 30 baht, ..in 2008. In one day it went to 150 baht where it stayed for several years then went up to 180 baht a year or two ago and recently went up to 200 baht. Banks! The only business that gives zero service and charges for everything it does.

I use a coin operated washing machine that only takes 10 baht coins. Try getting a roll from a bank! No such thing as a roll ...... they seldom have 100 bahts worth of 10 baht coins. Makes me go "Hhhhmmm?" Only in Thailand!

[natway09]

Open a Thai bank A/C if you visit on a regular basis.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Open a Thai bank A/C if you visit on a regular basis.

That's kind of missing the point, if a person's income/funds are originating outside of Thailand --- as they typically do for most tourists and many expats as well, who receive pensions and other income from their home country.

You can have all the Thai bank accounts in the world, and many of us do. But if one's funds are originating outside of Thailand, you still have to get those non-Thai based funds into Thailand for local access in one way or another. Using Thai ATMs with one's home country bank cards is a typical way of accomplishing that, especially for those who don't feel very comfortable carrying around/traveling with large wads of cash.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Just came back after shopping for some groceries. Organic chicken 2 days worth, some veggies, oatmeal and salad bar - 350 baht. Paid by credit card with 2% back (equivalent of a forex charge). Take that Thai ATM!

[thaiboss]

my experience last month chiang rai .... master card french.......atm kasikorn bank charge 250 baht exchange to be accepted 37.20 when the normal exchange rate was 38.40 ....euro...... thai baht ....

international swift by internet to my bank account in thailand from french bank.... ...french bank charge 8.9 euro kasi charge around 1% on total amount....

so for regular withdraw from .....atm is no more a good option to expensive .....master card is charging a lot from exchange rate.... more then 2% ...

another option credit card by western union by online tranfer ...you can transfer to yourself...... IN MINUTE..... but here again exchange rate low 37.80 to normal swift 38.60....in urgency western union is a good option.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Open a Thai bank A/C if you visit on a regular basis.

That's kind of missing the point, if a person's income/funds are originating outside of Thailand --- as they typically do for most tourists and many expats as well, who receive pensions and other income from their home country.

You can have all the Thai bank accounts in the world, and many of us do. But if one's funds are originating outside of Thailand, you still have to get those non-Thai based funds into Thailand for local access in one way or another. Using Thai ATMs with one's home country bank cards is a typical way of accomplishing that, especially for those who don't feel very comfortable carrying around/traveling with large wads of cash.

So you feel it's incumbent on Thai banks to allow you to access their money transfer networks for free because you have elected to live in Thailand and maintain your banking relationships outside of Thailand. I don't understand this logic that I hear in all these "ATM fee" threads that regularly pop-up on T-V. The hundreds of millions or billions of bant that Thai banks have spent to set-up, maintain, and administer their ATM and other cash handling channels are supposed to be offered to people who don't maintain deposits at these banks for free...WTH!

[Pib]

Open a Thai bank A/C if you visit on a regular basis.

That's kind of missing the point, if a person's income/funds are originating outside of Thailand --- as they typically do for most tourists and many expats as well, who receive pensions and other income from their home country.

You can have all the Thai bank accounts in the world, and many of us do. But if one's funds are originating outside of Thailand, you still have to get those non-Thai based funds into Thailand for local access in one way or another. Using Thai ATMs with one's home country bank cards is a typical way of accomplishing that, especially for those who don't feel very comfortable carrying around/traveling with large wads of cash.

So you feel it's incumbent on Thai banks to allow you to access their money transfer networks for free because you have elected to live in Thailand and maintain your banking relationships outside of Thailand. I don't understand this logic that I hear in all these "ATM fee" threads that regularly pop-up on T-V. The hundreds of millions or billions of bant that Thai banks have spent to set-up, maintain, and administer their ATM and other cash handling channels are supposed to be offered to people who don't maintain deposits at these banks for free...WTH!

No, I don't think anyone said they shouldn't charge an ATM Use Fee....the people have said not such a "High" fee of Bt200. And that fee is a front end fee even before Visa/Mastercard/AmEx and your Card-issuing bank charge their fees.

Keep in mind if you want to review/or read for the first time my earlier post in the "interchange" fee the Thai bank gets for each ATM withdrawal (not talking the ATM Use Fee of Bt200) that they are already compensated. All banks with ATMs get compensation through the interchange fee.

It's the Thai banks ATM Use Fee of Bt200 that is too high. If the fee was say Bt100 or less I don't think many would feel that they are getting ripped too much....and obviously some folks don't mind paying the poor banks an ATM Bt200 Use Fee on top of the interchange fee the bank already gets for maintenance, cash refill, profit, etc. Obviously some banks want a lot more. Almost like have airlines charging you for almost everything now days....even your peanuts snack.

It's now a slippery slope regarding bank fees....many banksters just can't get enough.....they love the taste of fees.