Entry denied Bangkok Airport

[Kohphanganlover]

I'm in the Deportation room and wondering how and where to appeal against my deportation. My entry was denied at Suvarnabhumi Airport because of to many Tourist Visas in the past. I had all the necessary paper with me. Onward flight back to Europe, Tourist Visa, booking confirmations and 25000 baht cash. 

How long could the appeal process take and are there some people did it before?

Or are there any other options? Call my embassy? If I sign the deportation paper, will I be able to entry in the future?

I just saw the stamp on my passport, it says entry refused because of Section 12 (3).

[tonray]

12(3) means they think you are working on  tour visas

[impulse]

Be helpful to know how many previous entries, and how much time you've actually spent in country recently.

 

[ubonjoe]

You file an appeal after paying 1900  baht for it and they have 7 days to respond to it. You apply using a TM11 form. Download here: https://www.immigration.go.th/download/1486548054958.pdf

From section 12 of the immigration act.

Quote

3. Having entered into the Kingdom to take occupation as a laborer or to take employment by
using physical without skills training or to work in violation of the Ministerial Regulations.

You will have to prove you have no intention of working here nor the need to. Proof of a income or financial proof from outside the country would be needed.

[ThailandYoda]

Are you sure you have a tourist visa?

 

Did you possibly try to enter on the 30 day visa exemption? 

 

Is this a single entry tourist visa or multi entry tourist visa? Which embassy did your obtain your tourist visa from?

 

 

[Kohphanganlover]

@Ubonjoe Does it make sense to appeal if I don't have a monthly income. I traveling more than 1,5 years in Asia with my savings. 

[perthperson]

1 minute ago, Kohphanganlover said:

@Ubonjoe Does it make sense to appeal if I don't have a monthly income. I traveling more than 1,5 years in Asia with my savings. 

If you can demonstrate - with bank statements or a Thai bank book that you are in receipt of a regular  adequate "income"  of say 65,000 Bht/month from overseas it matters not where that originates -------------

 

Whether to appeal or not is a personal decision. Remember that you are likely to remain in detention whilst any appeal is considered.

 

 

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, Kohphanganlover said:

@Ubonjoe Does it make sense to appeal if I don't have a monthly income. I traveling more than 1,5 years in Asia with my savings. 

Savings would be good enough to appeal. You would need bank statements showing transfers to here or ATM withdrawals.

Paragraph 3 is a catchall they use when they cannot come up with a better reason for denial of entry.

Even showing you have spent time outside the should be enough to overcome the denial. You having a ticket out of the country to Europe should be enough to prove you are not working here.

I think if more people were to appeal the denials given on baseless grounds it would help prevent such abuse.

[Essecola]

Was there a 60 day tourist visa in your passport or were you asking for a 30 day visa exempt stamp from them?

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, Essecola said:

Was there a 60 day tourist visa in your passport or were you asking for a 30 day visa exempt stamp from them?

It seems he had one. From the OP.

1 hour ago, Kohphanganlover said:

I had all the necessary paper with me. Onward flight back to Europe, Tourist Visa, booking confirmations and 25000 baht cash. 

 

[Essecola]

Isn't it there had been comments elsewhere that up to now no one with a SETV and money in hand + ticket etc had been refused entry? Maybe the "now" has arrived.

 

There are 1000s of people arrive at suwannapum every day. Surely lots of these ppl have SETVs, cash plus onward ticket and have spent time in the country before. But yet it seems like a little game of "just pick out a few people" each day to keep the deportation room occupied to whatever level. I heard they charge people 700 baht per day spent in there. SMH

 

 

[Lovethailandelite]

8 minutes ago, Essecola said:

Isn't it there had been comments elsewhere that up to now no one with a SETV and money in hand + ticket etc had been refused entry? Maybe the "now" has arrived.

 

There are 1000s of people arrive at suwannapum every day. Surely lots of these ppl have SETVs, cash plus onward ticket and have spent time in the country before. But yet it seems like a little game of "just pick out a few people" each day to keep the deportation room occupied to whatever level. I heard they charge people 700 baht per day spent in there. SMH

 

 

How much longer did you expect before Immigration finally started the clampdown on those living here more or less continuously on Tourist Visas? Do you think they don't know every scam people stupidly like to put on forums and Facebook because they like to look good regarding the swapping of passports, fake hotel and airline bookings etc?
You wouldn't get way with it in most country's. I've no idea why people are surprised it's going to be stopped here.

[JackThompson]

13 minutes ago, Essecola said:

Isn't it there had been comments elsewhere that up to now no one with a SETV and money in hand + ticket etc had been refused entry? Maybe the "now" has arrived.

 

There are 1000s of people arrive at suwannapum every day. Surely lots of these ppl have SETVs, cash plus onward ticket and have spent time in the country before. But yet it seems like a little game of "just pick out a few people" each day to keep the deportation room occupied to whatever level. I heard they charge people 700 baht per day spent in there. SMH

Yes, "now" has apparently arrived.  This would be the first confirmed case of someone with a Tourist Visa + 20K+ Baht being denied entry. 

He even had an outgoing ticket, which is not necessary if you enter with a Visa - still not good enough. 

As I have been saying for a long time, Airport Immigration is a game of roulette for those with a frequent and/or longer-stay history in Thailand.  The only question is when/if this will start happening at land-borders - but at least you aren't stuck in detention, if denied there.

 

1 minute ago, Lovethailandelite said:

... every scam people stupidly like to put on forums and Facebook because they like to look good regarding the swapping of passports, fake hotel and airline bookings etc?

Re: New passport - as the Thai Consulate personnel will tell you to do.
Re: Hotel and Airline bookings - he had a legit airline-booking, it would seem.  It made no difference.  I am not aware if hotel-booking was even discussed - he may have a rental-contract

 

But none of this was the reason for denial.  It is based on 'suspicion' of working.  If he was from a poor-nation, that might make sense.  He isn't.  This isn't about illegal workers or 'scams' - it is about 'removing longer-staying foreigners' from Thailand before they can put down roots, marry, etc.  There are other threads discussing the increasing set of hurdles for other visa-types, so I won't go OT here with the list.

[Lovethailandelite]

7 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, "now" has apparently arrived.  This would be the first confirmed case of someone with a Tourist Visa + 20K+ Baht being denied entry. 

He even had an outgoing ticket, which is not necessary if you enter with a Visa - still not good enough. 

As I have been saying for a long time, Airport Immigration is a game of roulette for those with a frequent and/or longer-stay history in Thailand.  The only question is when/if this will start happening at land-borders - but at least you aren't stuck in detention, if denied there.

 

Re: New passport - as the Thai Consulate personnel will tell you to do.
Re: Hotel and Airline bookings - he had a legit airline-booking, it would seem.  It made no difference.  I am not aware if hotel-booking was even discussed - he may have a rental-contract

 

But none of this was the reason for denial.  It is based on 'suspicion' of working.  If he was from a poor-nation, that might make sense.  He isn't.  This isn't about illegal workers or 'scams' - it is about 'removing longer-staying foreigners' from Thailand before they can put down roots, marry, etc.  There are other threads discussing the increasing set of hurdles for other visa-types, so I won't go OT here with the list.

Regarding swapping passports, Thai consulates are not Immigration.It's based on the fact of living here on Tourist visas, plain and simple. As there is nothing written in Law against it, they will use the law of suspicion of working, every time if you have everything else in order. Immigration have to prove nothing. Just the suspicion is enough. Expect more of it. If you think he's the only one this week, you may be surprised. 

Edited July 12, 2017 by Lovethailandelite

[ubonjoe]

4 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

As there is nothing written in Law against it, they will use the law of suspicion of working, every time if you have everything else in order. Immigration have to prove nothing. Just the suspicion is enough.

Suspicion is not mentioned in the immigration act.

Quote

3. Having entered into the Kingdom to take occupation as a laborer or to take employment by
using physical without skills training or to work in violation of the Ministerial Regulations.

 

[Lovethailandelite]

3 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Suspicion is not mentioned in the immigration act.

 

Try telling that to immigration. I know what the result will be.

[humqdpf]

8 hours ago, perthperson said:

If you can demonstrate - with bank statements or a Thai bank book that you are in receipt of a regular  adequate "income"  of say 65,000 Bht/month from overseas it matters not where that originates -------------

 

Whether to appeal or not is a personal decision. Remember that you are likely to remain in detention whilst any appeal is considered.

 

 

You can be sendiing the money to yourself from another bank account - all they need to see is the "income" in the form of a monthly amount.

[Suradit69]

32 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, "now" has apparently arrived.  This would be the first confirmed case of someone with a Tourist Visa + 20K+ Baht being denied entry. 

I doubt this is the first or last case. Not sure if posting or not posting on TV is a confirmation of anything since the information provided by posters is often confusing or selectively edited.

 

Whether or not the denial is successfully appealed, immigrations obviously felt they had grounds for it. Referring to it as a game of roulette is nonsense as is saying that they want to keep the deportation room filled. It should be obvious from reading TV that many people game the system. Some of them are bound to do it too often and suffer the consequences. 

 

Despite all the talk of "crack downs," Thailand still has to be one of the least restrictive countries in terms of immigrations policy and implementation.

[tubby johnson]

The OP's age might be a factor. Younger tourists receive more suspicion of working here illegally.

Or his nationality.

... The OP could clarify here.

 

Does the OP have any history of previous denials at Thai immigration? Any red stamps in his passport from consulates or border officials?

 

Looking forward, will getting a new passport in his home country allow him to enter Thailand unhindered?

Airports are best avoided. Which land borders are best for him to cross?

[Lovethailandelite]

25 minutes ago, humqdpf said:

You can be sendiing the money to yourself from another bank account - all they need to see is the "income" in the form of a monthly amount.

Read his post. He was denied entry for too many Tourist visas AND on suspicion of working. How you would actually prove your not working, i'm not sure.

Edited July 12, 2017 by Lovethailandelite

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Read his post. He was denied entry for too many Tourist visas AND on suspicion of working. How you would actually prove your not working, i'm not sure.

He was only denied entry for intending to work. To many tourist visas is not a reason for denial of entry under the immigration act.

[Essecola]

5 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Read his post. He was denied entry for too many Tourist visas AND on suspicion of working. How you would actually prove your not working, i'm not sure.

Too many tourist visas is not mentioned in the immigration act. 

[tomacht8]

This is harsh.
Someone who has all the necessary papers like  onward flight ticket, Tourist Visa, booking confirmations and 25000 baht cash,
to take immediately in deportation.
They could also have grant him a shorter stay, and could issue a warning for his next entry.
So everything seems quite arbitrary.
This is going to talk around and many Thailand enthusiasts will be unsettling.

 

[yellowboat]

Glad Thailand is a place I occasionally spend time. 

 

Hope your situation turns out okay. 

 

@UdornJoe : If somebody found themselves in a similar situation, but had a one year permit from Cambodia or a work permit from a neighboring country, what options do you have the event Thailand wishes to deport you ?  Can they try to put you on a flight back to your country of citizenship ?

[perthperson]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Suspicion is not mentioned in the immigration act.

 

 

Maybe not but faced with someone who lives in Thailand using TVs etc who is unable to demonstrate an adequate income from overseas could well be "suspected" of working illegally. It would be for the individual to prove they are not. 

[seancbk]

Has the law changed that says there is no limit to the amount of time one can spend in Thailand, so long as you have a tourist visa for each entry?

 

[gamini]

A lot of people seem to think they can just stay in Thailand as long as they like by getting multiple visas. Most countries restrict to a period of six months in a calendar year so why should Thailand be any different. For instance you cannot stay in Australia or New Zealand for  more than six months. If you want to stay longer you have to become a permanent resident, which incidentally is very costly.

[ubonjoe]

4 minutes ago, yellowboat said:

If somebody found themselves in a similar situation, but had a one year permit from Cambodia or a work permit from a neighboring country, what options do you have the event Thailand wishes to deport you ?  Can they try to put you on a flight back to your country of citizenship ?

You cannot be deported if you never were allowed to enter the country. It is simply a denial of entry not deportation.

You can fly to anywhere with a denial of entry.

[kingstonkid]

I can tell you that Canadian customs looks at a person's PP and from the recent activity can decide yes or NO the only recourse is to talk to a supervisor.  The issue they usually look at is the frequency, length of each stay and time in between.

 

That is all they need to make a decision to bar you from entry and send you home.

 

This is not just a Thai thing but a lot of other countries re doing it to cut down on the illegal immigrant sit

[yellowboat]

Just now, ubonjoe said:

You cannot be deported if you never were allowed to enter the country. It is simply a denial of entry not deportation.

You can fly to anywhere with a denial of entry.

Wasn't there some ASEAN rule where if you get rejected by one country you could not go to another country unless you had current visa is use like a work permit or perhaps the Cambodian long term visas ?