Trump says arming teachers could prevent school massacres

[mtls2005]

1 minute ago, johnray said:

I'm amazed kid can just walk in to a school and have a look around with a machine gun.

Schools are quite varied and different in the U.S.? This Parkland H.S. was a vast, open, spread-out campus style. Gone are the days of yore with a single school-house.

 

Not sure which Thai schools you're referring to, but believe me there are plenty of 'back-doors, just ask any typical M6 student.

[smutcakes]

When bullets start flying people generally shit themselves, and a little bit of training on the range for a teacher is not going to change this. Teachers with guns would be a liability and just as likely to kill children than any attacker, that's if they have not completely frozen when the shooting starts.

 

Would be armed attackers are not going to be deterred by armed teachers, they know they are armed so they would either shoot them first as they have the element of surprise, or simply attach at a time when there are no teachers there, or at any opportune time. These people dont care if they die or not. Having teachers with guns is just insane and again completely missing the issues.

[gunderhill]

Knowing teachers  had  guns, the  would be attackers  would make them the first target before continuing the slaughter.

[boomerangutang]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

So we have armed guards to protect our money in banks, we have armed guards to protect our politicians, we have armed guards to protect us at airports, but somehow having armed trained teachers in schools to protect against these loonies is mutually assured destruction, or crazy.  Maybe all of the "civilized countries" that you speak of should disarm the security details of all your leading politicians? No wait we can't do that because it would be crazy.

 

2 hours ago, Boon Mee said:

Arming teachers only makes sense. Banks, airports, sporting events all have armed protection, what's wrong with school teachers being able to defend themselves? 

Both posts above assume that the workers at those venues carry guns at work.  They don't.  There are armed guards, but bank tellers don't carry guns.  Football players don't carry guns while they're running around the field.

 

Similarly, teachers shouldn't carry guns at school.  Ridiculous.   Yet that's what the dufus in chief is advocating because he thinks it will maintain his redneck base of gun-huggers - and he's probably right about that.   ....oh, and Trump loves $33 million he got from the NRA during the campaign.  Part of that was used to pay off the siliconed women he boom boomed without using condoms.

[canuckamuck]

26 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

Arming teachers is a dumb idea for many reasons.   Here are a few....

>>> teachers are people, therefore they're as likely to be mentally flawed as anyone else.  A teacher can get pissed off and start shooting innocents, as easily as a postal worker or a soldier, or anyone else.

>>>  a kid could steal a gun from the teacher

>>>   gun could go off accidentally.  Happens every day in the US

>>>  if someone wants to cause harm, then a teacher with a gun will offer more of a challenge.  

>>>  teacher with a gun contributes to students thinking about / dwelling upon guns.

>>>  if two teachers have conflict (perhaps one stole the g.f away from the other).  Soldiers have guns.  Sometimes soldiers have conflicts among their ranks.  People get shot. 

>>>  if there's an argument between student(s) and teacher, teacher can pull a gun to assert dominance.

>>>  Teacher may see something which bothers him/her (perhaps some kids smoking opium in the bathroom), teacher could start shooting.  Who's at fault?

 

 

By your logic they should take the guns away from the cops and soldiers too then. 

[boomerangutang]

1 hour ago, LennyW said:

Provided it was properly done i think it would at least be some sort of deterrent.

The teachers would obviously need psychological assessment and arms training first, done correctly i think it would work. Having a school shooting on an almost daily basis certainly needs something fixing.

There could be mandatory 2-hour gun-safety training every morning ad infinitum.  The cold hard facts are:  People are a flawed species.  We've got these big brains that complicate things.   Anyone is capable of going postal - some more than others, of course.  

 

Everyone get irrational at times.  Everyone does things they regret later.  Teachers, postal workers, military guys, politicians, Christian preachers, .....there is no person who is immune from going postal.   Giving loaded guns to teachers is the stupidest idea since .....giving Trump the power to start a nuclear war.

[transam]

Embroidery teacher being instructed after Trumps latest brainwave initiative....

 

 

 

[boomerangutang]

3 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

By your logic they should take the guns away from the cops and soldiers too then. 

First off, my missive is related to teachers and their students. 

 

For a long time, British cops didn't have firearms, and shooting deaths were rare during that time.  Bringing loaded guns into the equation changed things, not least: peoples' (including criminals') perceptions and awareness of guns.  I realize cops and soldiers should have loaded weapons (and training in how to use them), but arming teachers will exacerbate the dire problems afflicting US schools.    It's an NRA-type solution which, by definition, means it benefits makers/sellers of guns and ammo.  

 

 

[boomerangutang]

Trump elicits many stupid sounds out of his mouth. His 'arming teachers' mouth fart is just his latest.  It won't his last.  .....plus he's got little tweeting fingers to add to the mess he's making of the USA.

[boomerangutang]

On the other side of the coin, if Sally was pissed off at Clark for kicking her dog, Sally could write an anonymous note to the principal saying Clark has a bunch of automatic weapons hidden in his home.  Clark gets kicked out of school.  

[tonray]

Once you eliminate the gun free zone in schools would that also not give every student of legal age the legal right to carry a gun on campus ? The law of unintended consequences rears it's head..I can see the Supreme Court case where a student sues for his right to carry to school 

Edited February 22, 2018 by tonray

[simple1]

1 hour ago, LennyW said:

Provided it was properly done i think it would at least be some sort of deterrent.

 

The teachers would obviously need psychological assessment and arms training first, done correctly i think it would work.

 

Having a school shooting on an almost daily basis certainly needs something fixing.

Yep, banning  of owning large / multiple magazines would be a minimal step in the right direction, though probably waste of time just to type such a comment.

 

The school where the latest mass shooting occurred is 45 acres in size. If someone with murderous intent wanted to try and achieve mass murder elsewhere or at the same school, they could have a hide next to a playing field, school car park and so on. It would be insufficient just to have one teacher trained (maybe 4/5?) plus they would require active shooter training, regular refresher courses, likely a need to have sufficient fire power, insurance etc. Up to the Americans, but sounds like they are asking for really ugly unintended consequences with Trump's suggestion. No light at the end of the tunnel unless a unity of purpose beyond partisan politics can be achieved at State and Federal levels - impossible?

[Mattd]

The whole scenario just shows how out of control the lack of US gun control really is, rather than tackle the issue, then just provide more guns to protect against the guns, total madness.

There are many issues now, the first and biggest being just how powerful the pro gun lobby is, no matter how many incidents there are where innocent children and people are needlessly killed this doesn't change, they have managed to brainwash a lot of folks in to thinking that the country and its people are safer with guns, the more the better.

This in turn creates the next problem, there are millions of guns out there because of this, which makes firm gun control pretty useless, as they are already in circulation, it would take decades for it to have any affect.

My American friends post daily on FB etc. on why they should have guns and banning guns isn't effective, the fact remains and is indisputable, that the countries with stronger gun control have less incidents of mass shootings, the argument has always been that bad guys will get guns regardless, which is probably true in the case of an armed robber, terrorist etc. but the majority of the mass shootings are carried out by 'normal' people that lose the plot, in reality if guns were not so easily available, then they wouldn't have been able to get hold of one without a lot of effort, which most would not know how to do.

[samsensam]

 

all this talk about arming teachers is completely missing the point?

 

 

[freebyrd]

3 hours ago, Silurian said:

A man that can't even fake empathy without crib notes...so sad.

 

 

Pathetic! He and Palin would have made the perfect couple.

[Credo]

Armed teachers is not going to work.   First of all, even police miss their target more often than they hit it.   Teachers, as a group, are never going to be trained to the proficiency necessary to shoot at someone armed with a AR-15 or similar type weapon.   And in large schools, they are going to need a lot of trained teachers, probably one for each building and maybe one for each floor.  

 

They would have to be able to hear where the shooting is coming from, and in a building there are echos that make it very confusing.   They are going to have to make sure no student is in the way or no other teacher with a gun.   'Friendly fire' is a very real possibility.  

 

When the police or the SWAT team arrive, there is a good chance that an armed teacher would be immediately shot.  

 

Then there is the very serious concern of insurance.   There is probably no insurance company that is going to give coverage for any use of lethal force and the broader laws that protect police would not extend to teachers.   School districts could be held liable or some major pay outs for lethal force, accidental death and various other legal challenges.

 

 

[samran]

the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun....

 

Nothing more than an NRA sales tactic to make sure an extra gun is sold.

 

Arming teachers, yeah, that will work. Start watching at about 5.00 to see how this logic plays out.

 

 

Edited February 22, 2018 by samran

[jvs]

1 hour ago, Orac said:

I remember (guiltily) my schooldays when we would regularly get supply teachers and the class aim was how quickly we could destroy their confidence and self esteem and, indeed, we did manage tears often and one or two quivering wrecks - maybe arming them would have given them a bit more confidence?

 

 

 

Straight from Jim Jefferies

[mtls2005]

The porn industry needs to hire better lobbyists, paging Stormy Daniels.

 

 

Florida lawmakers refuse to debate assault rifles, but say porn is dangerous

 

What's more of a public health risk: assault weapons or porn?

 

After 17 students and teachers were gunned down at a Florida high school, the state Legislature voted 71-36 Tuesday against a measure to consider banning the sale of assault weapons.

But on the same day, it declared pornography to be a public health risk.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/02/21/health/florida-legislature-porn-dangerous-but-not-weapons/index.html

 

[soalbundy]

watch out for class punishment then, the cane is so 1950's, now it's a bullet in the butt.

[soalbundy]

24 minutes ago, freebyrd said:

Pathetic! He and Palin would have made the perfect couple.

Hey !!! he can read ????

[Tug]

Another one of trumps dumb ideas but watching the news today I was struck by the realization that every one of the high school speakers was by far more articulate than cadet bone spur btw I took my chop saw to my m1 carbine and cut it in half I certainly don't need a war weapon in my home you go kids work on those laws I'm behind you 100%

[Zyxel]

[attrayant]

Oh yeah?

 

[attrayant]

This is a great idea.  Wherever we have employees who are constantly stressed and on the edge, we should give them guns.  Next up: arming postal workers.

[jak2002003]

Just when I though I had heard it all....

 

Why stop are arming the teachers?

 

Every school child should have a gun fastened under their desks in case of attack, either by a crazed student or a crazed teacher.

 

And they should all wear bullet proof school uniforms too.

[The Theory]

I thought those who use guns for attacking innocent people are sickest, I guess I was wrong !! 

There is one Who is the master sick.

[Media1]

Assault rifles a pistol and throw in a hand grenade 

[Media1]

The real solution is post soldiers at schools security checks

[samran]

4 hours ago, LennyW said:

Provided it was properly done i think it would at least be some sort of deterrent.

 

The teachers would obviously need psychological assessment and arms training first, done correctly i think it would work.

 

Having a school shooting on an almost daily basis certainly needs something fixing.

 

 

Unfortunately your proposal has too many common sense barriers to a person owning a gun. The NRA would never go for it.

 

Better to hand them out like free candy given it is a right that must not be infringed according the NRA.