Australian man critical after hit and run in Samui, family told no license invalidates insurance

[midas]

16 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

If you do not have a motorbike licence in Australia the insurance company will not pay out plus you would get heavy fines from the police for riding without a licence. Car licences do not cover motorbikes even in Australia

my confusion comes from not having any exposure to motorcycle licences. I do remember being told with a full UK licence for a car, you are legally entitled to ride a moped in the UK up to and including 49cc as your licence is a full moped licence and L plates do not have to be displayed. You are, as a full licence holder in the UK, also entiltled to ride a motor cycle up to 125cc as a provisional licence holder, whilst displaying L plates, without having to take the CBT. 

[thaiguzzi]

29 minutes ago, Zonka said:

Its not a sad story.  It's a story about a selfish guy who had no thought about renting a motorbike when he didn't have a licence. 

I wonder if the headline was ' No licence Aussie causes death of young child' people would be so forgiving.

Due to no licence his medical insurance is invalid and now his family are trying to sponge 300k to pay for his stupid and selfish act.

Go fund me is the new scroungers favourite site.

No. It is a sad story.

No. They are not trying to "sponge" 300k. It is a voluntary thing. Ya know - a bit of empathy, a few dollars here and there mounts up.

No. I would not describe Go Fund Me or whatever these sites are called as spongers sites. In principle I think they are a good idea when the cause is just as in this case.

 Now, you have a nice day too sir, and don't winge too much, it might spoil all your fun.... Oh, and don't worry about your fellow man either, because you're All Right Jack.

 To$$er.

[PoorSucker]

49 minutes ago, Jeremy50 said:

Nearly half a million baht a day, or the amount the average Thai person earns in 3 years. Just how is that possible?

Google "bangkok hospital" 

[Russell17au]

2 minutes ago, midas said:

my confusion comes from not having any exposure to motorcycle licences. I do remember being told with a full UK licence for a car, you are legally entitled to ride a moped in the UK up to and including 49cc as your licence is a full moped licence and L plates do not have to be displayed. You are, as a full licence holder in the UK, also entiltled to ride a motor cycle up to 125cc as a provisional licence holder, whilst displaying L plates, without having to take the CBT. 

Australia the same as Thailand a car licence for a car and a separate motorbike licence for a motorbike

[PoorSucker]

I live close to Bangkok hospital on samui, second ambulance for today just passed by. 

Sadly I don't take notice anymore 

 

Edit: two more just passed by. 

[Crash999]

People tend to think accidents will happen to someone else. 

 

Another unfortunate example here. 

[RigPig]

Yeah and the standards approved ice cream buckets everyone wears will help too!!  I imported ALL my helmets from the States (DOT approved) at $100 a pop I figured it was cheap insurance...

[Peterw42]

6 minutes ago, PoorSucker said:

Google "bangkok hospital" 

Bangkok hospitial website quotes a daily rate for ICU at 14,000 baht, $600 au. $1000 for a CT scan.

$2,000 a day sounds more realistic than $20,000

 

[APJ291]

18 minutes ago, midas said:

my confusion comes from not having any exposure to motorcycle licences. I do remember being told with a full UK licence for a car, you are legally entitled to ride a moped in the UK up to and including 49cc as your licence is a full moped licence and L plates do not have to be displayed. You are, as a full licence holder in the UK, also entiltled to ride a motor cycle up to 125cc as a provisional licence holder, whilst displaying L plates, without having to take the CBT. 

125cc still requires a CBT...

 

You still need to do a CBT with a provisional licence or full car licence in the UK to drive/ride a 125cc... once you pass the CBT you still need to display “L” plates for 2 years... unless you decide to upgrade and complete and pass to a full bike licence...

 

A CBT only lasts for 2 years, before renewal is required.

 

as for 50cc you can ride that with L plates and a provisional licence provided you have completed a CBT...

 

http://begin-motorcycling.co.uk/uk-motorcycle-laws/

 

you can also check via the following Direct Gov DVLA website in UK for rules and regulations.

 

https://www.gov.uk/browse/driving/driving-licences

 

 

 

[billsmart]

Is that $20,000 per day, or THB20,000 per day? 

[RigPig]

1 hour ago, PoorSucker said:

If they find him and if he has insurance. 

It's a bit like my old man used to say " If everyone else puts their hand in the fire would you do the same?"

[jonstarjon]

Who brought it to light about the license? Can't imagine why it would come up.. Police? Are they onto a kickback if no insurance can be claimed?

Just a question that occurred to me.

I know my wife could get anything she wanted in a report. Only about how much.

[Zonka]

9 minutes ago, thaiguzzi said:

No. It is a sad story.

No. They are not trying to "sponge" 300k. It is a voluntary thing. Ya know - a bit of empathy, a few dollars here and there mounts up.

No. I would not describe Go Fund Me or whatever these sites are called as spongers sites. In principle I think they are a good idea when the cause is just as in this case.

 Now, you have a nice day too sir, and don't winge too much, it might spoil all your fun.... Oh, and don't worry about your fellow man either, because you're All Right Jack.

 To$$er.

Yes I am all right Jack.  Thats mainly because I dont go out and do illegal things like renting a M/C without a licence. Thereby putting not only myself but more importantly innocent people at risk due to selfishness and stupidity.

4am in the morning? I am betting if this guy is so selfish and stupid to risk riding a bike without a license, he is also stupid enough to do it at 4am in the morning after a skinful of alcohol!

It doesnt even actually say it is a hit and run. Read the story. It says they presume it was a hit and run.  Maybe he crashed on his own due to his inexperience?

And before calling me a to$$er, ask any one who has lost a family member due to an unlicensed driver and see what reaction you get.

As to go fund me, how is the cause 'just in this case'

An unlicensed driver is in hospital due to being in charge of a vehicle he is not licensed to drive. As such his medical insurance is invalid.  So it is just that others pay for his stupid actions?

 

The only comforting thing about this story is that the only person injured was the selfish person who broke the law and not some innocent bystander.

 

[cyberfarang]

1 hour ago, midas said:

But it doesn't say he was driving without any license? Just that he didn't have a motorcycle license. Do insurance companies refuse to pay out if you have a licence to drive a car in Australia? But then rent a motorbike?

These people never learn.

 

Insurance companies only need the slightest excuse not to pay out. Even riding a motorbike without wearing a helmet or the vehicle is not taxed will render a policy null and void.

[jenny2017]

2 hours ago, transam said:

So did the shop rent out a bike to a bloke with no bike license from any country...?

Mate, you should know that by now. Too many of them do, money speaks.  

[totally thaied up]

Bangkok Hospital; that would explain the price. I have told my wife, any hospital in Chiang Mai but Bangkok Hospital or Chiang Mai Ram if I have an accident. I am covered up to 18 Million Baht, but at US$ 20,000 a day, even that money would not last long. Time to lift my premiums to a Million Dollars.

 

With the injuries he has had, his life is pretty much near over. Hard to say but as we all know, this is an ever-recurring theme in Thailand. Accident, insurance rejected and pain for the families. Should be printed on our passports in bright red about motorcycles and insurance. No license, no insurance.

[TonyPaul]

1 hour ago, PoorSucker said:

Every insurance is void if you don't have proper licence. 

Normal travel insurance does not cover MC driving even if you have licence. 

Only covers if the bike is less than 50cc, check the fine print. 

If you intend to drive a MC in Thailand you actually need an extra insurance for that. 

Only big bikers know this. 

Yes travel Insurance does not cover unless you have a local Licence. But  I am hoping that the 50cc is a typo for 500cc? Are there any bikes under 50cc?

[jenny2017]

"He is currently in a coma. He has all his ribs broken, he has punctured lungs, a broken spinal cord in four places, several brain injuries and he has already died twice," 

 

   I first read and thought it's an old story. Then I saw that it was posted 2 hours ago. I've done my part and donated to a guy who'd lost his leg. 

 

  I hope that he'll survive it and will fully recover, but it doesn't look good for him.

 

  It's getting a little too much now, there's not one story where the patient had an insurance. 

 

   

[stevenl]

29 minutes ago, midas said:

my confusion comes from not having any exposure to motorcycle licences. I do remember being told with a full UK licence for a car, you are legally entitled to ride a moped in the UK up to and including 49cc as your licence is a full moped licence and L plates do not have to be displayed. You are, as a full licence holder in the UK, also entiltled to ride a motor cycle up to 125cc as a provisional licence holder, whilst displaying L plates, without having to take the CBT. 

Yes, UK.

 

In Thailand for a motorbike over 50 cc, as is always the case with rented bikes, a full motorbike license is required. he doesn't have that, therefor he was riding without a license and is there no insurance coverage.

[aussienam]

1 hour ago, midas said:

But it doesn't say he was driving without any license? Just that he didn't have a motorcycle license. Do insurance companies refuse to pay out if you have a licence to drive a car in Australia? But then rent a motorbike?

100% - you need to have a motorcycle driving licence in the country you reside - and a full licence, not a learner or provisional licence.  That way when you apply for and receive an International Driving Permit (which you also need in most countries outside your own to be permitted to operate a vehicle) then you will have the appropriate section stamped for motorbike riding. 

In my case for e.g. I have a stamp for both cars and motorbikes in my IDP (yes it is a permit, not a licence).  In the Product Disclosure Statement (PDS) of nearly all travel insurance companies - despite whether or not a country may permit you to ride a motorbike there without requiring a motorbike licence equivalent, you will mostly realise that the insurer will not cover you unless you are a licensed rider from your own country. 

The skills needed to drive a car versus a motorbike are very different so of course insurance companies are not going to carte blanche cover unskilled people who have never ridden bikes before and riding in countries where the road rules are different and more dangerous.  

Also no helmet = no cover.  Intoxicated = no cover.  

Many insurers will also cap the CC capacity to 150cc or under in the PDS so no big bike riding as well.  I see the most foolhardy reckless tourists here feeling bulletproof and riding like maniacs racing and trying to match the risk taking manoeuvres of the Thai people here.  

Bottom line is READ THE PDS and if you are not sure then call the insurer.  And get a full bike licence in your own country before you even consider it.  It is not hard.  Otherwise catch taxis and walk.  

[wombat]

2 hours ago, petermik said:

Another sad story,it looks like the young fellow is going to need a miracle to survive.....best wishes

would i want to live with a spine broken in 4 places....i don't think so.

 

 

[jenny2017]

5 minutes ago, TonyPaul said:

Yes travel Insurance does not cover unless you have a local Licence. But  I am hoping that the 50cc is a typo for 500cc? Are there any bikes under 50cc?

No, it's not a typo. There are 49 cc bikes, also called mopeds. The 100, 110, 125 and 150 cc bikes here are basically motorcycles where you need a big bike license for. 

Maybe better to write 50 cc, or less. 

[stevenl]

7 minutes ago, cyberfarang said:

These people never learn.

 

Insurance companies only need the slightest excuse not to pay out. Even riding a motorbike without wearing a helmet or the vehicle is not taxed will render a policy null and void.

The latter (not taxed), no, not a reason for a claim to be rejected.

[Russell17au]

50cc scooter in Thailand

[scorecard]

1 minute ago, jenny2017 said:

Mate, you should know that by now. Too many of them do, money speaks.  

 

Very possible that many of these operators have no or very little real knowledge of insurance, nor international / local licensing.

 

It would be interesting to line up 10 owners / operators / managers of rental shops and check:

 

- Whether they personally hold valid and up to date vehicle insurance policies for vehicles they own and what knowledge they have about exclusions.

- Whether they know what insurances are in place and valid and up to date on the vehicles owned by the rental shop owner, and what knowledge they have about exclusions.

 

- Whether they know what insurances are in place and valid and up to date on vehicles they rent out put are actually owned by other people not involved with ownership of the rental shop, and what knowledge they have about exclusions. 

 

 

 

 

 

[colinneil]

1 minute ago, wombat said:

would i want to live with a spine broken in 4 places....i don't think so.

 

 

Why would you say that?

My spine is broken in 2 places, yes i am happy to be alive, even with my problems.

[bdenner]

2 hours ago, ThreeEyedRaven said:

If he was hit by someone else, then their insurance should be paying ----

Bara Bor Insurance (compulsory 3rd party insurance required before annual road taxes can be paid) maxes out at about 290K Baht. Not near enough to pay for this type of injury. Civil court action is the next step!!!! ----- Good luck with that

[totally thaied up]

14 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Bangkok hospitial website quotes a daily rate for ICU at 14,000 baht, $600 au. $1000 for a CT scan.

$2,000 a day sounds more realistic than $20,000

 

I had a friends colon polyp burst, and it cost him. 380,000 for three days in ICU. Nothing major like this accident.

[wombat]

8 minutes ago, TonyPaul said:

Yes travel Insurance does not cover unless you have a local Licence. But  I am hoping that the 50cc is a typo for 500cc? Are there any bikes under 50cc?

i doubt a typo... check the fine print.

 

[wombat]

Just now, colinneil said:

Why would you say that?

My spine is broken in 2 places, yes i am happy to be alive, even with my problems.

that would be my choice in a living will for that situation.