Do I have to give my ex employer my passport?

[Darren Powell]

Hi everybody,

 

Does anyone know if it is a legal requirement for me to hand my passport over to my employer after getting fired? I'm guessing not as my passport belongs to the British government. He says he wants it so he can cancel my type B non imm visa. But I only think he is doing it as he is still angry after firing me. It would obviously much better for me if it didn't get cancelled

 

Can I just keep my passport and keep my visa active even after my work permit has been cancelled?

 

Also does anybody know the law on what they have to pay you if they have unjustly sacked you at very short notice without any written warnings.  

 

I took the bank holiday of April 6th off because it was a national holiday but because it wasn't on the company's holiday list I got fired with no written warning. Also three employees took the action of taking the day off but only two of us got fired!!!!

 

I know in the west I could have them for unfair dismissal all day long, but I'm guessing It's a lot harder in Thailand

 

I was told when taking the job to take into consideration the fact "that there are a hell of a  lot of public holidays in this country,  something like 20/22 " when working out the money to ask for.  I then started the job and the company issued a list of 14 holidays and knocking 8 of them off and getting told we had to work the 8 public holidays not on the company list.

 

Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks

[Swimman]

You don't need to and should not hand over your passport. If you are aggrieved about the manner of your dismissal then seek advice from the local Labour Office.

[mstevens]

Do NOT give it to them.  There is no valid reason for them requesting it at all.

[lopburi3]

If you are on an extension of stay it ends when the reason for that extension of stay ends - so yes they may want to do that process if it is an extension rather than a 90 day visa entry.  But believe you should be doing this yourself.  

[clash]

Do not give them your passport. they may threaten etc but they can't do anything with your non b as far as i know. if you are on an extension then they could let the labour dept know you were sacked and your extension will be cancelled

[Swimman]

2 minutes ago, clash said:

Do not give them your passport. they may threaten etc but they can't do anything with your non b as far as i know. if you are on an extension then they could let the labour dept know you were sacked and your extension will be cancelled

It is unlikely that an extension would be canceled by immigration without the passport and its owner being present.  

[clash]

1 minute ago, Swimman said:

It is unlikely that an extension would be canceled by immigration without the passport and its owner being present.  

that is true but it did happen to me a few years back. depends on who the company know. some can get the extension cancelled

[clash]

6 minutes ago, Swimman said:

It is unlikely that an extension would be canceled by immigration without the passport and its owner being present.  

lets put it this way. if you are on an extension based on work and you no longer work for the firm then you are treading on thin ice IMO

[clash]

16 minutes ago, Swimman said:

It is unlikely that an extension would be canceled by immigration without the passport and its owner being present.  

 so what do you suggest swimman? i noticed you like to give people advice on visa issues. so you are suggesting the OP breaks the law (if he is on an extension) by breaking the terms of his extension. ie being employed? then end up locked up in a dump until sorted. not good advice whether likely or unlikely

[Rama]

DO NOT give them your passport. they can cancel your visa without it. If my memory serves me correctly you have 2 weeks to get your immigration status changed or leave the country. Go yourself to immigration if necessary but don't give them your  ex employer your passport.

[Prince77]

You should not Hand over your passport to anybody who is not authorized - and the compoany isn't. About your dismissal it is not smart taking an extra day off by yourself. The Company determines which of the public / bank Holidays they will observe - must be a Minimum of 13 days per year.

 

Regaridng your "unjustified" dismissal it depends on the company's rules and regulations, anyhow I presume you are entitled to a severance pay depending on how Long you were employed - check with your local labourt department.

[evadgib]

You could use the 'face' card to your advantage by saying that you'll gladly hand it over on production of written permission from your Embassy to your employer authorizing you to do so. Employers know full well such permission won't be forthcoming and wouldn't dare ask for fear of losing face; assuming said employer is Thai.

 

HTH 

Edited April 25, 2018 by evadgib

[PoorSucker]

Your extension of stay ends same day as your employment ends, better go yourself to immigration and cancel your extension and apply for seven days to leave. 

 

[overherebc]

9 minutes ago, Prince77 said:

You should not Hand over your passport to anybody who is not authorized - and the compoany isn't. About your dismissal it is not smart taking an extra day off by yourself. The Company determines which of the public / bank Holidays they will observe - must be a Minimum of 13 days per year.

 

Regaridng your "unjustified" dismissal it depends on the company's rules and regulations, anyhow I presume you are entitled to a severance pay depending on how Long you were employed - check with your local labourt department.

Important points to be sure.

How long were you employed

Did/do you have a visa or did you or the company do 90 day reports? ( extension of stay based on employment )

 

Don't hand over your passport. First thing is go to your local labour office and tell them what happened and follow their advice.

If you were on an extension of stay it should finish on the day your job finishes. 

If you do have a non B visa it will stay valid until it's use/enter by date.

[clash]

4 minutes ago, PoorSucker said:

Your extension of stay ends same day as your employment ends, better go yourself to immigration and cancel your extension and apply for seven days to leave. 

 

thats exactly what he should do

[jenny2017]

OP, there's no reason to hand over your passport, as it isn't even yours.

 

    As already mentioned, your last day at work is also the last day when your visa/extension of stay ends.

 

(Added) They (Immigration/ LB) can terminate your permission of stay without having the passport. 

 

   An employer usually has to issue a warning before they can dismiss you, but you've signed a contract where you signed that you've got to work on certain holidays. That could make a written warning unnecessary, others might be more knowledgeable about that.

 

   Each province has an office for employees with such problems, situated in the city hall. I'm sorry, but I forgot what it's called in Thai.

 They even give you a free lawyer if they believe that it was an unfair dismissal.

 

  Best of luck! 

 

   

Edited April 25, 2018 by jenny2017

[overherebc]

50 minutes ago, jenny2017 said:

OP, there's no reason to hand over your passport, as it isn't even yours.

 

    As already mentioned, your last day at work is also the last day when your visa/extension of stay ends.

 

(Added) They (Immigration/ LB) can terminate your permission of stay without having the passport. 

 

   An employer usually has to issue a warning before they can dismiss you, but you've signed a contract where you signed that you've got to work on certain holidays. That could make a written warning unnecessary, others might be more knowledgeable about that.

 

   Each province has an office for employees with such problems, situated in the city hall. I'm sorry, but I forgot what it's called in Thai.

 They even give you a free lawyer if they believe that it was an unfair dismissal.

 

  Best of luck! 

 

   

Many employers write into the contract things that illegal according to labour law thinking if you sign it then it puts them in clear. 

The labour court will dismiss those conditions out of hand.

Things like 'The employee agrees no severance will be paid at the end of the contract' etc etc.

Ask employees to re-sign ( not resign ) a new contract every year so after 3 or 4 years minimum severence if any is paid. The labour court will dismiss those as illegal.

The main points the labour courts decide on are the reasons for dismissal, were they according with their laws or not, not the employers contracts, and the length of continuous employment based on tax records.

[Expatthailover]

Never give your passport to anyone.

The country of origin is the rightful owner and you are entrusted with it.

You could be in trouble surrendering your passport to anyone other than a sovereign government and even then..

[clash]

7 minutes ago, Expatthailover said:

Never give your passport to anyone.

The country of origin is the rightful owner and you are entrusted with it.

You could be in trouble surrendering your passport to anyone other than a sovereign government and even then..

not even police or immo? what fairy land do you live in to think that way. that attitude will get you stuck behind bars

[nasa123]

No No No and then it's NOT your passport Mr Powell, it's your government in your home country's property.

[chrisinth]

I always thought that your extension of stay (based on your work permit) ends when the work permit is cancelled and not on your last day of work.

 

This is the reason that when leaving a job, on good terms, your employer can keep the WP active until your agreed date of departure.

 

Small point, but important.

[clash]

7 minutes ago, chrisinth said:

I always thought that your extension of stay (based on your work permit) ends when the work permit is cancelled and not on your last day of work.

 

This is the reason that when leaving a job, on good terms, your employer can keep the WP active until your agreed date of departure.

 

Small point, but important.

big point. if an employer asks for your WP back they are looking to cancel it thus ending the extension. if you don't give them the WP then i think they are stuck to a certain extent but wouldn't be worth getting in trouble over as i think they could cause problems if not on good terms. best to go to immigration, cancel the extension and go to a neighbouring country to get a new visa IMO. depending if he wants to stay here

some employers don't even let you have the WP. they keep them in their office

Edited April 26, 2018 by clash

[scorecard]

20 hours ago, Swimman said:

You don't need to and should not hand over your passport. If you are aggrieved about the manner of your dismissal then seek advice from the local Labour Office.

 

The Thai Labour ministry / offices have a pretty good track record of listening to and advising people clearly about relevant laws in an unbiased way, both for Thai and non-Thai staff and they will institute action in certain scenarios.

 

Are you sure you understand the relevant Thai labour laws about public holidays, it is somewhat different than western countries in that there is a fixed core and Thai employers can then select several more days from a 'flexible' list, to make up the total number of days. You mention this in your OP but do you really understand it?

 

Agree with other posters, do NOT give the employer your passport.

 

 

 

 

 

[NickJ]

Above all. Go to the Labor Board. Could give you a couple months salary. 

[NanLaew]

Despite handing over the passport being unnecessary, the OP says the ex-employer wants it to 'cancel his visa'. If he's still on a visa, it doesn't get canceled right? Only extensions grandfathered on employment and WP's get guillotined no?

[overherebc]

49 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Despite handing over the passport being unnecessary, the OP says the ex-employer wants it to 'cancel his visa'. If he's still on a visa, it doesn't get canceled right? Only extensions grandfathered on employment and WP's get guillotined no?

Yes true..

Worked for years on Non O visas, not extentions and at the end of each job handed back the WP and left with passport untouched by anyone.

Last job I did in Thailand the boss kept the WP in his desk and said if the new job doesn't work out let me know and you can come back.

Never had a 'visa' cancelled in many years.

[jacko45k]

23 hours ago, Swimman said:

It is unlikely that an extension would be canceled by immigration without the passport and its owner being present.  

You may be correct but, without personal  experience, I still feel sceptical wrt this. I would be more concerned about being without a passport in the country, waiting for them to feel ready to return it. Many rules are bent at immigration.

[DerekMarshall]

18 hours ago, clash said:

not even police or immo? what fairy land do you live in to think that way. that attitude will get you stuck behind bars

Police have no legal right to ask for a passport. Immigration officials do. Even at that, they are not allowed to separate you from your passport. Ever wondered why immigration offices are open planned? Or that when they take your passport away for any reason, even a minor one they ask you to follow them? 

[jackdd]

2 minutes ago, DerekMarshall said:

Police have no legal right to ask for a passport. Immigration officials do. Even at that, they are not allowed to separate you from your passport. Ever wondered why immigration offices are open planned? Or that when they take your passport away for any reason, even a minor one they ask you to follow them? 

Afaik when people get denied entry at the airport the IO gives the passport to the airline and you get it back when you board the plane leaving the country. How would you explain this?

[blackcab]

21 minutes ago, DerekMarshall said:

Police have no legal right to ask for a passport. Immigration officials do. Even at that, they are not allowed to separate you from your passport. Ever wondered why immigration offices are open planned? Or that when they take your passport away for any reason, even a minor one they ask you to follow them? 

 

Thai police have every right to ask for your passport, and to detain you until it is provided. This has happened to a number of people, as reported from time to time in the news section of this site.

 

The reasoning for this is that for everyone other than permanent residents and stateless people, your passport shows your permission to stay in the country. Without seeing your passport the police cannot validate your permission to stay. They will often accept a photocopy, but if you have nothing at all to show them then don't be surprised if you get a free trip to the police station while matters are resolved.

 

You don't get asked to follow the staff who have your passport at Chaeng Wattana. When I go to collect my extension of stay for business my passport goes from counter I to counter M and back again while I sit waiting. That's the entire length of the immigration office.

 

Do you actually live in Thailand?