Another change for U.S. Citizens.

[idman]

Leave it up to Immigration here in Chiang Mai to make it harder for a U.S. Citizen to get or re-apply for a retirement visa.  Yesterday afternoon they up and changed the rules for showing proof of income.  How besides that $50 rip off form from the U.S. Consulate you have to show where the money came from.  You must provide poof of that money.  In typical Thai fashion there was no prior notice to anyone.  On Monday it was the normal procedure and those at Immigration early on Tuesday had no problem but then, Bam, the rules changed.  Guys were caught at Promenada without that proof and were turned away.  Needless to say there was quite a lot of really piss..ed off people.  I found about this only two hours ago when I went to Assist Thai Visa to begin my renewal process.  They never received any prior warning from Immigration and could only tell me what was now required.  In my case I have to provide bank statements showing money deposited monthly into to account.  Yeah, it's great to be a Falang trying to live here.  Sod these <deleted> Thai Immigration people and their bull...<deleted> rules they make up to frustrate us.  My lease is up in March 2019 and unless things change I am on my way to Phnom Penh.  Newly listed as the 5th. best place to retire in the world.

[Shoeless Joe]

Many ex-pat retirees (apart from Americans) have to provide evidence of their incomes every year in order to renew their retirement visa. It seems that Thai immigration have finally worked out that there are Americans rolling up to their Embassy, raising their right hand and swearing that they have sufficient funds when in fact, they don't. Now that loophole has been closed and it seems they have to provide "hard" evidence. Yes, it's a bit of a nuisance but really, not that onerous. Welcome to the ex-pat world of everyone else...

 

Regards,

 

Joe

[watcharacters]

 

Wasn't this arrangement  for showing an "income letter" some sort of treaty or agreement between Thailand 's government and the USA?

 

Chaing Mai  immigration just up and unilaterally changes it?

 

 

[sfokevin]

My bank (Bangkok Bank) only seems to keep 6 months balance records... I usually get this printout certified from the bank and have it with me when do my extension and have my US Consul letter of income...

 

Agree the last few years my agent looks at the bank statement but does not take it to submit to immigration...

 

My question is a 6 months certified bank record showing regular monthly transfers in sufficient or do they require a full year?... If so how does one get a full year when the bank only keeps the last 6 months on file?

 

The bank book seems unless for me as I never use it and when asked to have it updated the update seems to only add one or two previous entries and the present balance...

Edited July 11, 2018 by sfokevin

[Captain_Bob]

Non-O retirement visa based on affidavit pretending to have fake money was doomed sooner or later. Just a matter of time until the next "crackdown". 

[55Jay]

Just now, sfokevin said:

My bank (Bangkok Bank) only seems to keep 6 months balance records... I usually get this printout certified from the bank and have it with me when do my extension and have my US Consul letter of income...

 

Agree the last few years my agent looks at the bank statement but does not take it to submit to immigration...

 

My question is a 6 months certified bank record showing regular monthly transfers in sufficient or do they require a full year?... If so how does one get a full year when the bank only keeps the last 6 months on file?

Print the monthly statement each month or greater interval, but not exceeding 6 months. Keep them on file at home because you have foresight and know you'll need them later.

Edited July 11, 2018 by 55Jay

[sfokevin]

6 minutes ago, 55Jay said:

Print the monthly statement each month or great interval not exceeding 6 months. Keep on file at home because you have foresight and know you'll need them later.

I have been keeping my own quarterly printouts from online banking but worry that the printout may not meet muster as it is not "certified" by the bank ?

Edited July 11, 2018 by sfokevin

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, idman said:

you have to show where the money came from.  You must provide poof of that money.

 

Are you saying they want proof that you're receiving that income in general such as pension or Social Security receipts, OR, proof that that income is being received into Thailand, such as, deposits into a Thai bank account only?

 

[meechai]

1 hour ago, idman said:

besides that $50 rip off form from the U.S. Consulate you have to show where the money came from.  You must provide poof of that money. 

This was a long time coming....It was only a matter of time.

It was a given half the claims of income were BS

 

I always thought it would be funny if CM Consulate forwarded all the sworn to have XXX income per month to the IRS for their confirmation ??

 

Would have had a few surprised barstools around town

[JLCrab]

1. I have often (but not always) been asked by the US Consular official prior to my affidavit swearing whether I am aware that Thai IMM can and at their discretion ask for corroborating info.

 

2. Thai bank ATM slips showing the 220 baht int'l transfer fee should suffice to show source of funds. Bring a stack of them.

[The Deerhunter]

23 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

1. I have often (but not always) been asked by the US Consular official prior to my affidavit swearing whether I am aware that Thai IMM can and at their discretion ask for corroborating info.

 

2. Thai bank ATM slips showing the 220 baht int'l transfer fee should suffice to show source of funds. Bring a stack of them.

Yes my Consulate have always told me every year to have bank statements from back home with me to prove the INCOME actually exists in the home country as some thai Immigration offices no longer accept just the statutory declaration form on it's own. Note that the wording is that you have got the correct amount of INCOME every year in your other country, not that you merely HAVE THAT AMOUNT OF SAVINGS MONEY in an account in another country. They obviously know some people lie on their declaration form which is easy to do until you are found out and then you are also  in trouble with your own home country authorities as well.

Edited July 11, 2018 by The Deerhunter

[elektrified]

This has been discussed on FB for a few days now. "Don't have the proof? Then come back when you do."

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, elektrified said:

This has been discussed on FB for a few days now. "Don't have the proof? Then come back when you do."

 

The question I asked above, and no one has answered thus far, is what exact kind of proof are they demanding/willing to accept.

 

Proof of income in one's home country is one thing. Proof of all that income coming into Thailand as bank deposits is an entirely different thing.

 

Needless to say, every dollar someone spends via a credit card or debit card from home never shows up on one's Thai bank registers.

 

[metisdead]

Inflammatory posts and the replies have been removed. 

[grin]

About a month ago I was asked for documents at Promenada to supplement my US affidavit of income for my retirement extension. I just printed copies of US bank statements and circled the deposits. The officer accepted that but did not inspect them closely.


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[sqwakvfr]

What is "acceptable proof of income"?  My income is direct deposited to my US Bank Account.  Will these monthly statements have to be "certified"?  Maybe the best solution is to have the US Embassy/Consul Income Affidavit state "The Affiant has demonstrated that he/she has xxxx income per month"?  

Edited July 11, 2018 by sqwakvfr
Grammar

[JLCrab]

NB the exact wording on the US Embassy - Bangkok income affidavit is:

 

I also affirm that I receive a monthly income of XXX $ from sources in the United States.

 

It is the policy of  the US State Department at over 200 countries worldwide that no Embassy or Consulate will attest to the veracity of any document presented to it 

Edited July 11, 2018 by JLCrab

[Jeffrey346]

I just got my Income Affidavit at the US Embassy Reach Out meeting in Khon Kaen on June 20th.

There was no mention of any rule change requiring income verification.  One would think they would have said something like they did when the no cash rule was announced.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

13 minutes ago, grin said:

About a month ago I was asked for documents at Promenada to supplement my US affidavit of income for my retirement extension. I just printed copies of US bank statements and circled the deposits. The officer accepted that but did not inspect them closely.
 

 

Did you get any feel for whether the same request was being made of everyone else/others?

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, Jeffrey346 said:

I just got my Income Affidavit at the US Embassy Reach Out meeting in Khon Kaen on June 20th.

There was no mention of any rule change requiring income verification.  One would think they would have said something like they did when the no cash rule was announced.

 

 

CM Immigration has some history of operating on their own rules and procedures that are not necessarily indicative of what's done in BKK or elsewhere.  I wouldn't automatically assume that something that may be occurring in CM is also going to be done everywhere else.

 

[JLCrab]

2 minutes ago, Jeffrey346 said:

I just got my Income Affidavit at the US Embassy Reach Out meeting in Khon Kaen on June 20th.

There was no mention of any rule change requiring income verification.  One would think they would have said something like they did when the no cash rule was announced.

 

The no cash is a US rule -- the income verification as now mentioned for Chiang Mai is a Thai IMM (new?) rule.

[George Bowman]

I will find out what is required in a couple of weeks  when my retirement visa needs to be renewed. Initially here in Phitsanulok, I was told that they preferred the embassy letter (because it was official) instead of a bank document.

[Jeffrey346]

There is no announcement on the BKK Embassy website regarding any income affidavit changes. This what is posted.

 

The Thai government requires all U.S. citizens with Thai retirement visas to verify their income when they renew their retirement visa annually. Please fill in and print out this income affidavit online for Bangkok (PDF 79KB) or for Chiang Mai (PDF 178KB).  Please remember not to sign the form before you come to the American Citizen Services Unit.  You will need to sign it in front of a designated officer.

[Jeffrey346]

3 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

The no cash is a US rule -- the income verification as now mentioned for Chiang Mai is a Thai IMM (new?) rule.

The cash rule was a reference to an announcement. 

[Jeffrey346]

6 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

CM Immigration has some history of operating on their own rules and procedures that are not necessarily indicative of what's done in BKK or elsewhere.  I wouldn't automatically assume that something that may be occurring in CM is also going to be done everywhere else.

 

Looks to me that this just may be a CM thing.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

32 minutes ago, grin said:

About a month ago I was asked for documents at Promenada to supplement my US affidavit of income for my retirement extension. I just printed copies of US bank statements and circled the deposits. The officer accepted that but did not inspect them closely.
 

 

How many past months of statements did they ask for and/or did you present?

 

That's exactly the kind of backup documents I've been carrying with me to Bangkok CW Immigration for many years in connections with my retirement extensions based on U.S. Consulate income affidavits. I've usually brought the prior three months, just in case. But at least thru last year, never once asked to show any of them.

 

Edited July 11, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Formaleins]

I heard they are soon going to provide all foreigners with a bankers draft at the airport, you basically just enter the country at immigration desks as normal. Then you fill in the bank draft formafter clearing immigration, this signs over all of your bank cash to the Thai aurhorities. After fillingin that form you go through a gate marked "EXIT" This leads youinto the departure gate for your next available flight back home.

[George Bowman]

From the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. http://www.mfa.go.th/main/en/services/4908/15385-Non-Immigrant-Visa-"O-A"-(Long-Stay).html

 

 A copy of bank statement showing a deposit of the amount equal to and not less than 800,000 Baht or an income certificate (an original copy) with a monthly income of not less than 65,000 Baht, or a deposit account plus a monthly income totalling not less than 800,000 Baht.

 

I had always assumed that this money had to come from America. But there is no mention of this requirement. So deposits in a Thai bank made from within Thailand should be ok. If this right or am I way off base? I'm trying to save spending $50 bucks at the embassy.

[JLCrab]

If you have 800K baht in your Thai bank account then no problem -- the only way to do the 65K baht per month is with an affidavit fro your respective country's embassy.

[johnmcc6]

I wrote on this forum several months ago that C M immigration wanted proof of income. Some posters thought maybe my agent made a mistake. Had to hand over all bank books for them to check on amount coming in against my declaration letter from consulate. Glad I was truthful!! I have Australian passport so not just U S A

Edited July 11, 2018 by johnmcc6