When Ragu first opened, I went with a group for a friend's birthday and all the dishes were heavily over-salted. Not to cause a fuss on this special day, we just nibbled what we could and paid and left. 

That was a few years ago and I thought I might stop in there today to see what the place was like. 

 

A family was just finishing and as they left, I was the only one in the restaurant, even though it was lunchtime. I saw a special menu item on the blackboard and decided on the corned beef sandwich. 

I motioned someone over to order and, in English (I figured this place, like The Duke's, must be English friendly, so decided to not use Thai), asked the wait person if the sandwich came with anything. 

She didn't speak a word of the language and so over came a stout ladyboy. 

 

Me: "What comes with the corned beef sandwich?"
Wait staff: "Order corned beef..."
Me: "No. What comes with the corned beef sandwich?"

Wait staff: "Okay. Order corn beef." 

Me: "No. The corned beef sandwich comes with what?"

Wait staff: "Soup. Have tomato soup and (unintelligible) soup." 

Me: "Tomato soup and what?"

Wait staff: "Tomato soup and (unintelligible) soup." 

Me: "Sorry, tomato and what soup?"

 

So then some girl comes over, and I ask the same question and she says, "Soup or salad."

Me: "So...tomato soup and ...?"

Girl: (Points to the menu that says, Italian sausage and tomato soup -- that's one soup, by the way.)

Me: "Ah...I'll have a salad." 

 

So everything comes really fast (there are at least eight people working for me; four seem to have chef costumes on), and I take a bite and find that the meat is stone cold -- that cold just before freezing. Cold beef has little flavor and I call the girl over again and say, "This meat is cold." She looks at me with the blankest of looks. "Can you heat the meat up for me, please?"

 

Away goes the dish and it's back pretty fast, meat barely warm. Maybe one the dukes in the chef costume put it under his arm for a few seconds...

The meat actually looks on the dry side. It barely has any flavor at all and it's inside a heel of French bread that's both tough and chewy. It wasn't very pleasant but the mitigating circumstance being that there wasn't much flavor to begin with. 

I had asked for Caesar dressing with the salad and what came in a little dish was an oddly brackish, brownish color thin liquid which tasted strongly of vinegar. It didn't look anything like Caesar dressing and tasted like that strange brown stuff you see in the supermarket in the Japanese section that has sesame in it and when you buy some to try it think, "What on earth would you ever put this on?"

The salad was some rocket leaves and a small couple of rings of onion and some thinly sliced red bell pepper. The whole thing had a weird bitter aftertaste, like eating the root stalk of a head of lettuce. 

 

That alone without a beverage, with all the taxes they like to put on, was 299 baht. 

 

On a scale of one to 100 I'd probably give the food a 20 and the service about a 40. Trying to get someone's attention to bring condiments with the meal was like trying to signal a deaf person looking the other way. 

 

It was a very enlightening experience, all in all. The place looks good and clean and full of people dressed up as chefs, and lots of staff...but in the end it was a total bait and switch. 

 

If food courts served sandwiches, they could give master classes to the Ragu crowd. 

 

thank goodness you didn't order the cod

"so decided not to use Thai"

 

Once you determined that their English was not good why didn't you "use Thai" ?

 

7 hours ago, HungDonger said:

"so decided not to use Thai"

 

Once you determined that their English was not good why didn't you "use Thai" ?

 

That is what I was wondering. ?

The OP's post reeks of things anti-Ragu and anti-Dukes, Ragu has consistently proved to be very good or better in our book for more than a few years, I am not aware of any of their staff who don't speak at least decent level English.

15 hours ago, HungDonger said:

"so decided not to use Thai"

 

Once you determined that their English was not good why didn't you "use Thai" ?

 

Because he wouldn't have so much to moan about !

Interesting you focus on a minor thing and not about the bland, weird tasting food. 

 

I thought, well, as a customer in a restaurant that is known to cater to non-Thai speaking folks, I should be able to navigate in English. Cut out the dialog part if you want; the food was still pathetic. 

 

I like Duke's. I go there regularly. They make the best burgers in town, that I know of. Pizzas can be good to, depending on the branch and the day.

Ah and as usual, rather than comment on the review of quality of the food or the service,  there's an attack on the OP for telling of his experience, by claiming (for no reason at all) that his post  "reeks of things anti-Ragu and anti-Dukes". Really? How, Simoh1490 did you jump to that unwarranted conclusion? Can I take a guess that you're a pro-Ragu and Dukes cafe brown-noser?

 

I've eaten in Dukes cafe a few times. It's OK, but not exceptional. I've also eaten in Ragu a couple of times. The first time was in the evening the food (when it finally arrived) was OK but only warm  and the staff were slow and largely useless. However, after a passage of time and overlooking the original poor experience we returned one lunchtime when our experience reflected that of the OP, Trujillo. The place was deserted, with the staff congregated around a table with the cooks. Unfortunately (for them and us), we decided we'd stay and eat (despite their attempts to ignore us) and although we ordered only 2 dishes from the menu, they got one of them wrong and this depsite the fact that we ordered the meal (via my Thai wife) in faultless Thai. An attempt to speak to the manager was met by the claim that he / she wasn't there and so, speaking to the "chef" instead he just said the waitress misunderstood! Ragu is in my opinion very much all show and no substance.

 

Anyway, I guess if we all liked or disliked the same things, the TV trolls would have nothing to whinge about!

 

Regards,

 

Joe

I wonder how Joe knew his wife spoke 'faultless' Thai?  He apparently does not so i guess she told him of her 'perfection'.  Perfectly normal!

But i digress. 

 

I have noticed in many foods shops that western style service and environmental qualities are very lacking; broken chairs, dirty floors, poor service, etc. I presume all this due to the superstitions that the minor spirits that run life dictate the success or failure of the venture.  The efforts of the owner and staff make little difference, so why care?

1 hour ago, chingmai331 said:

I wonder how Joe knew his wife spoke 'faultless' Thai?  He apparently does not so i guess she told him of her 'perfection'.  Perfectly normal!

But i digress. 

 

I have noticed in many foods shops that western style service and environmental qualities are very lacking; broken chairs, dirty floors, poor service, etc. I presume all this due to the superstitions that the minor spirits that run life dictate the success or failure of the venture.  The efforts of the owner and staff make little difference, so why care?

"I wonder how Joe knew his wife spoke 'faultless' Thai?" 

Hmm, yep ya got me wow, that's a tough one. No wait! I DO know...it's because she's Thai (and perfect)!

 

But I digress - I'm curious to know why you think your comment below is in any way relevant to the original post (which maybe you might not have read, or fully understood?)

"I have noticed in many foods shops that western style service and environmental qualities are very lacking; broken chairs, dirty floors, poor service, etc. I presume all this due to the superstitions that the minor spirits that run life dictate the success or failure of the venture.  The efforts of the owner and staff make little difference, so why care?"

 

Regards,

 

Joe

 

"Interesting you focus on a minor thing" (the inability of the staff to speak fluent English).

 If you found it a 'minor thing' why did you write 150 words+ about it in your original post ?

The dialog was for color. And to show how the event transpired. The nature of the post was mostly about the food. Sorry, I will try to make it clearer for you should there be a next time...

And as I said: "The place looks good and clean."

 

I don't expect this place to be open much longer. They may be just sitting out the lease. The location is bad, even if the mall weren't dead and dying, so it's a wonder they do any business at all. 

2 hours ago, HungDonger said:

"Interesting you focus on a minor thing" (the inability of the staff to speak fluent English).

 If you found it a 'minor thing' why did you write 150 words+ about it in your original post ?

It may have been a "minor thing" but whatever, important enough for you to count the words!!??

4 hours ago, Shoeless Joe said:

"I wonder how Joe knew his wife spoke 'faultless' Thai?" 

Hmm, yep ya got me wow, that's a tough one. No wait! I DO know...it's because she's Thai (and perfect)!

 

In no way am I speaking of specifically anyone nor of anyone's wife, girlfriend or server ?

 

BUT if someone isn't listening it doesn't matter how well the person speaking to them speaks.  

1 hour ago, Trujillo said:

The dialog was for color. And to show how the event transpired. The nature of the post was mostly about the food. Sorry, I will try to make it clearer for you should there be a next time...

And as I said: "The place looks good and clean."

 

I don't expect this place to be open much longer. They may be just sitting out the lease. The location is bad, even if the mall weren't dead and dying, so it's a wonder they do any business at all. 

Admittedly some days it is empty but other times the car parks are full, so i'm not sure that constitutes being dead and dying !

To be fair, people have been saying since it opened that it wouldn't last long and after 5 years it is still going.

Just now, Trujillo said:

Interesting you focus on a minor thing and not about the bland, weird tasting food. 

 

I thought, well, as a customer in a restaurant that is known to cater to non-Thai speaking folks, I should be able to navigate in English. Cut out the dialog part if you want; the food was still pathetic. 

 

I like Duke's. I go there regularly. They make the best burgers in town, that I know of. Pizzas can be good to, depending on the branch and the day.

I will take your word for it.  I will stick to Duke's.  But curious who makes a better Pizza than Duke's ?

10 minutes ago, Shouldhaveknownbetter said:

I will take your word for it.  I will stick to Duke's.  But curious who makes a better Pizza than Duke's ?

A highly subjective question ?

 

But to my taste Pizza By Hand in the Old City is better - your taste may differ

Just now, narkeddiver said:

A highly subjective question ?

 

But to my taste Pizza By Hand in the Old City is better - your taste may differ

Thanks,  I just looked it up, will have to give it a try.  I like Duke's extra cheese pizza but their Italiano lacking.

Quote

...after 5 years it is still going.

Still on immigration life support. Watch what happens when they pull out....

20 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

The OP's post reeks of things anti-Ragu and anti-Dukes, Ragu has consistently proved to be very good or better in our book for more than a few years, I am not aware of any of their staff who don't speak at least decent level English.

Its not "Anti Dukes", its the fact that all of the "Dukes Empire" ( Dukes, Ragu, River Market) are over priced, most add sleight of hand taxes on top and the food at the whole lot is bang average at best. There you go, Dukes Lovers, you can spend all day tomorrow keyboard warrioring!

2 hours ago, Trujillo said:

Still on immigration life support. Watch what happens when they pull out....

So you know how much Immigration is paying them do you ?

1 hour ago, EL159 said:

Its not "Anti Dukes", its the fact that all of the "Dukes Empire" ( Dukes, Ragu, River Market) are over priced, most add sleight of hand taxes on top and the food at the whole lot is bang average at best. There you go, Dukes Lovers, you can spend all day tomorrow keyboard warrioring!

If you can't afford to eat at Dukes/Rago, say so, don't waffle and make up pathetic excuses!

Years of data lead to only one conclusion: the Duke's chain rates a solid 5/10. That encompasses the good-- Duke's pizza by the river, some tacos, the view at the River Market, the comfy booths at Ragu-- as well as the bad, including a forlorn leather shoe served as a Reuben sandwich, anything involving food at the River Market, and the I-can't-believe-you-are-dumb-enough-to-pay-a-thousand-baht-for-that look on the face of the staff at Ragu. Lovers love with passion, haters hate vehemently. 5/10

8 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

If you can't afford to eat at Dukes/Rago, say so, don't waffle and make up pathetic excuses!

Ah Yes, Typical reaction from someone who cant read every word! Now where in my post did I say "cant afford". Of course I can afford. I frequently eat at more expensive restaurants than Mr Dukes establishments, but in those cases the food is both better quality and therefore better value for money!

I've lived in Chiang Mai for over 10 years, visited Dukes a total of two times, both times was extremely disappointing and over-priced, and I have no interest to return. I've been to Ragu several times, and it definitely used to be better when they first opened when they had the young farang manager running the place. Last few times has been disappointing and it's unlikely I would return.

 

I enjoy "farang" food as much as anyone, and perhaps for a relatively small market like Chiang Mai Dukes can stand out as the "best", but it would certainly be struggling in any larger, more sophisticated, market.

Quote

So you know how much Immigration is paying them do you ?

You forgot a comma....

 

Since you are such a rube, I will explain the obvious: People come to the mall because they have business at immigration. Most have to hang around for a while, and this benefits the existing shops. It has nothing to do with how much (or how little) immigration pays Promenada. 

When immigration moves back to its original location, watch what happens at Promenada. 

1 hour ago, Trujillo said:

You forgot a comma....

 

Since you are such a rube, I will explain the obvious: People come to the mall because they have business at immigration. Most have to hang around for a while, and this benefits the existing shops. It has nothing to do with how much (or how little) immigration pays Promenada. 

When immigration moves back to its original location, watch what happens at Promenada. 

We are trying to have a civilized conversation so why are you trying to belittle me by mentioning a comma ?  perhaps we can continue the conversation in Promenanda one day and then we will see who does the belittling !!!

 

Well that is strange because when i said "but other times the car parks are full" i meant with Thai's and mostly at weekends and early evenings now when i last checked Thai's don't need to go to Immigration and certainly not at weekends !

 

There is indeed a small but hardy anti-Dukes group of posters who post such nonsense from time to time but it's never quite clear who all the members are. Most people it seems have very strong feelings about David's restaurants, they are either very good or very bad, few seem to be in the, "they're OK" group. Americans posters will of course have seen much better examples of that style of food since the range and availability of such restaurants in the US is vast, ditto Ragu vs native Italians and so on. But this is Chiang Mai and competition and the market is what it is, in that regard, Davids restaurants are near the top of the league tables, like it or not. It does seem though that most complainers focus on cost so for them the quality of the food is secondary and perhaps interferes with any objective assessment of food quality - 800 baht for two people is not expensive by any of my measures, if it is for others they perhaps won't have a great range against which to compare the Dukes/Ragu food quality!  But really though, to assess a restaurant and to negatively critique it based on the reviewers interaction with a waitress and her less than perfect understanding of English, in Thailand, reeks of something very odd and not nice.

Quote

perhaps we can continue the conversation in Promenanda one day and then we will see who does the belittling !!!

Meaning what, exactly? 

 

Is this a threat? How are you proposing to do "the belittling!!!"?

I'm all ears. Are you a tough guy? Gonna teach me a lesson? Give me what for? 

 

Or are you upset because you slipped and fell and now can't find your gerbil? 

 

Quote

But really though, to assess a restaurant and to negatively critique it based on the reviewers interaction with a waitress and her less than perfect understanding of English, in Thailand, reeks of something very odd and not nice.

Oi!

That was only part of the experience; I didn't make it up. 

But the reason I posted at all was because the food was, well, not good. There is nothing "very odd and not nice" going on here. No one expects service in Thailand to be stellar. But we do expect the food to be of reasonable quality. I have nothing against Ragu or whoever owns it; in fact, I'd like the place to be great. A decent Italian meal is worth having now and then. 

My aim is not to sully; rather, I hope that this little debate, what of it is actually on-topic, filters to the manager or owner and something is done to improve the situation. I'd go back if there if the situation was addressed in a meaningful way. 

1 hour ago, simoh1490 said:

There is indeed a small but hardy anti-Dukes group of posters who post such nonsense from time to time but it's never quite clear who all the members are. Most people it seems have very strong feelings about David's restaurants, they are either very good or very bad, few seem to be in the, "they're OK" group. Americans posters will of course have seen much better examples of that style of food since the range and availability of such restaurants in the US is vast, ditto Ragu vs native Italians and so on. But this is Chiang Mai and competition and the market is what it is, in that regard, Davids restaurants are near the top of the league tables, like it or not. It does seem though that most complainers focus on cost so for them the quality of the food is secondary and perhaps interferes with any objective assessment of food quality - 800 baht for two people is not expensive by any of my measures, if it is for others they perhaps won't have a great range against which to compare the Dukes/Ragu food quality!  But really though, to assess a restaurant and to negatively critique it based on the reviewers interaction with a waitress and her less than perfect understanding of English, in Thailand, reeks of something very odd and not nice.

Agree.  I've been to all the Dukes, as well as Ragu, River Market.  I'm rarely disappointed.  The price may seem high to some, but based on the quality, ambience, etc., it's quite reasonable.  I was at the River Market about a month ago (evening) and the place was packed.  It's tough running a successful business and I'd say the Dukes restaurants are doing better than most.  As for the OP's experiences...all I can say is I've never had a problem ordering/receiving what I ordered. 

 

I just wonder if the anti-Dukes brigade would prefer not to have the Dukes around?  Surely it's better to have such an option when looking for international cuisine.  I don't get these guys.