Income Affidavit Denied in Phuket

[ubonjoe]

14 hours ago, JakeR said:

Unless you have some kind of government pension or work for your home government, forget about it in Phuket! Your only safe route is to use the 400,000/800,000 THB "seasoning" method to let it sit in your account for 2 months before you can go apply.

Since you were applying based upon marriage that was completely wrong and goes against the police order. For many applying based upon marriage they would not be on a pension since they are to young to be getting one.

This what clause 2.18 of police order 138/2557 states.

"5. Only for Criteria (5) paragraph 1 and (6), the applicant must attach a funds deposit certificate issued by a bank in Thailand and a copy of a bankbook, or attach documents proving that the parents or alien husband earns an average monthly income of no less than Baht 40,000 throughout the year, such as any particular individual income tax return together with payment receipt, evidence of receiving retirement pension, evidence of receiving interest from funds deposit, or evidence of having other funds issued by the relevant agency."

Edit: And in 2.22 for retirement it states this as an example not a requirement.

"3. Evidence of income such as a retirement pension, interest or dividends;"

[merijn]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Since you were applying based upon marriage that was completely wrong and goes against the police order. For many applying based upon marriage they would not be on a pension since they are to young to be getting one.

This what clause 2.18 of police order 138/2557 states.

"5. Only for Criteria (5) paragraph 1 and (6), the applicant must attach a funds deposit certificate issued by a bank in Thailand and a copy of a bankbook, or attach documents proving that the parents or alien husband earns an average monthly income of no less than Baht 40,000 throughout the year, such as any particular individual income tax return together with payment receipt, evidence of receiving retirement pension, evidence of receiving interest from funds deposit, or evidence of having other funds issued by the relevant agency."

Edit: And in 2.22 for retirement it states this as an example not a requirement.

"3. Evidence of income such as a retirement pension, interest or dividends;"

It's nice to quote a police order but you know as well that the immigration office can and will interpret the ruling their own way unfortunately.

Unless you want to correct them and tell them that they are wrong there is not much you can do about it.

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, merijn said:

It's nice to quote a police order but you know as well that the immigration office can and will interpret the ruling their own way unfortunately.

Unless you want to correct them and tell them that they are wrong there is not much you can do about it.

There is no ruling for them to interpret. It is in clearly written in a police order.

I thankfully do not have to deal with the Phuket immigration office that has a history of making up their own rules.

Somebody should show them the police order.

[merijn]

6 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no ruling for them to interpret. It is in clearly written in a police order.

I thankfully do not have to deal with the Phuket immigration office that has a history of making up their own rules.

Somebody should show them the police order.

I think that they are fully aware what the police order says but acting to it is a different story.

[dick dasterdly]

2 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Since you were applying based upon marriage that was completely wrong and goes against the police order. For many applying based upon marriage they would not be on a pension since they are to young to be getting one.

This what clause 2.18 of police order 138/2557 states.

"5. Only for Criteria (5) paragraph 1 and (6), the applicant must attach a funds deposit certificate issued by a bank in Thailand and a copy of a bankbook, or attach documents proving that the parents or alien husband earns an average monthly income of no less than Baht 40,000 throughout the year, such as any particular individual income tax return together with payment receipt, evidence of receiving retirement pension, evidence of receiving interest from funds deposit, or evidence of having other funds issued by the relevant agency."

Edit: And in 2.22 for retirement it states this as an example not a requirement.

"3. Evidence of income such as a retirement pension, interest or dividends;"

I think you're missing the point.

 

Apparently Phuket Immigration have decided that they aren't prepared to accept income from any source other than a pension from the applicant's govt.!

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no ruling for them to interpret. It is in clearly written in a police order.

I thankfully do not have to deal with the Phuket immigration office that has a history of making up their own rules.

Somebody should show them the police order.

Your second para. explains why your last para. is irrelevant....

Edited November 3, 2018 by dick dasterdly

[sometimewoodworker]

6 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no 30 day extension for a non immigrant visa entry or a long stay extension of one. There is only a 60 day extension to visit a Thai wife or child.

Thanks for the correction, sorry to have given incorrect information.

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no ruling for them to interpret. It is in clearly written in a police order.

I thankfully do not have to deal with the Phuket immigration office that has a history of making up their own rules.

Somebody should show them the police order.

We all know they make it up as they go in some places.

 

Why it's allowed is the question

[Mansell]

Most of my experiences with Phuket IO were pretty good and civil. In fact one time I had travelled from Cambodia through the dreaded Poipet immigration point. When I went to Phuket for 90 day the officer pointed out Poipet had stamped my passport incorrectly....he proceeded to make it good.

but when I went in to do my annual extension switching over to marriage and then returning the next day for my passport they had kept me on retirement extension.....when I asked why? They responded with some nonsense about it being my first extension.....weird. 

I wonder how many of the thousands of expats on Phuket know about all this nonsense going on there? We have yet to hear from anybody else being given the run around.....yet!

[pontious]

That's what I find strange - without refuting the OP in any way there has not been any other report I have seen - no hue and cry in local papers at all - and I assume no notice posted at Phuket Immigration. Nothing in Phuket Forum either.

[Ebumbu]

22 hours ago, pontious said:

That's what I find strange - without refuting the OP in any way there has not been any other report I have seen - no hue and cry in local papers at all - and I assume no notice posted at Phuket Immigration. Nothing in Phuket Forum either.

 

I'll find out later this week what is going on. I think more reports of denials based on income will be forthcoming from Phuket. 

[dick dasterdly]

On 11/4/2018 at 3:48 PM, Ebumbu said:

 

I'll find out later this week what is going on. I think more reports of denials based on income will be forthcoming from Phuket. 

Please keep us updated, as this is very important to some of us living on Phuket.

[JackThompson]

On 11/3/2018 at 5:08 PM, Mansell said:

but when I went in to do my annual extension switching over to marriage and then returning the next day for my passport they had kept me on retirement extension.....when I asked why? They responded with some nonsense about it being my first extension.....weird. 

Not uncommon in the past - less work for them.  At one office, one who needed to work, and now couldn't because the extension was based on retirement, was told they would have to leave the country (voiding their extension) and start over from the beginning-steps.

 

More recently, some of those asking to switch to retirement (easier-process) from marriage (harder-process) are being treated as though it is a big-deal / pita.

Edited November 5, 2018 by JackThompson

[kannot]

On 11/1/2018 at 11:00 AM, ubonjoe said:

Mine in my Bangkok Bank book has FTT (foreign telex transfer) in the code column.

Just transferred in a  million baht from UK using  Transferwise mine just says  TRN? Kasikorn Bank 

[soalbundy]

6 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Not uncommon in the past - less work for them.  At one office, one who needed to work, and now couldn't because the extension was based on retirement, was told they would have to leave the country (voiding their extension) and start over from the beginning-steps.

 

More recently, some of those asking to switch to retirement (easier-process) from marriage (harder-process) are being treated as though it is a big-deal / pita.

happened to me too, 13 years ago in CM,I went to get an extension for my marriage visa and found they had automatically switched it to a retirement visa, ''easier for you sir''

[OJAS]

10 hours ago, JackThompson said:

More recently, some of those asking to switch to retirement (easier-process) from marriage (harder-process) are being treated as though it is a big-deal / pita.

 

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

happened to me too, 13 years ago in CM,I went to get an extension for my marriage visa and found they had automatically switched it to a retirement visa, ''easier for you sir''

The irony, of course, is that many of us (myself included) could be forced to switch from retirement extensions based on 65k monthly income to marriage extensions based on 400k in the bank, thanks to Embassy decisions to withdraw their income confirmation services.

 

Seeing as these decisions appear to have stemmed from a new verification requirement imposed by Immigration, I, for one, would regard any consequential increase in their workload as poetic justice!

Edited November 6, 2018 by OJAS

[Tanoshi]

11 minutes ago, OJAS said:

The irony, of course, is that many of us (myself included) could be forced to switch from retirement extensions based on 65k monthly income to marriage extensions based on 400k in the bank, thanks to Embassy decisions to withdraw their income confirmation services.

What's wrong with being on a marriage extension if your married?

[OJAS]

3 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

What's wrong with being on a marriage extension if your married?

Well, how about the extra hassle involved in obtaining a marriage extension at my local immigration office (based on the experience of someone who has recently been through this process) when compared to a retirement extension, for starters? And not just for the first year either!

Edited November 6, 2018 by OJAS

[moontang]

3 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

What's wrong with being on a marriage extension if your married?

Nothing at all, but I have met a number of people, who were married, but stated it was just simpler to do the 800k method..and that was mostly several years ago.  Visits to the house, etc..  Up to you.

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Well, the extra hassle involved in obtaining a marriage extension at my local immigration office (based on the experience of someone who has recently been through this process) when compared to a retirement extension for starters!

What extra hassle!

 

I've done both. The only extra requirement for the marriage extension are 4 photos, marriage certificate (Kor Ror 3) Kor Ror 2, copy of wife's TB and ID card + 2 copies and of course the wife must attend.

 

That may be considered a hardship or hassle for some who struggle to get up off the barstool.

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, moontang said:

Nothing at all, but I have met a number of people, who were married, but stated it was just simpler to do the 800k method..and that was mostly several years ago.  Visits to the house, etc..  Up to you.

Visits to the house are becoming more commonplace even on retirement extensions now.

It saves a second visit to Immigration, but anyone suggesting it's 'hassle' must be lazy.

[OJAS]

10 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

What extra hassle!

 

I've done both. The only extra requirement for the marriage extension are 4 photos, marriage certificate (Kor Ror 3) Kor Ror 2, copy of wife's TB and ID card + 2 copies and of course the wife must attend.

 

That may be considered a hardship or hassle for some who struggle to get up off the barstool.

Maptaput's extra requirements include having to find a witness to accompany us to the immigration office at application time, and also be around when they do their home visit. And their witness and home visit requirements apply to each and every annual application, not just to the first one as I gather is generally the practice elsewhere. They have never required witnesses nor home visits for retirement extensions in my experience.

Edited November 6, 2018 by OJAS

[moontang]

Also, marriage fraud is a big business, and quite a few Thais have been victimized..marriages foreigners are very suspect in the US, too, as a marriage can represent the keys to the kindom....doing an internal upgrade to retirement extension likely sets off a lot of flags, too, and weren't those the people getting g visits?

[Sheryl]

Just transferred in a  million baht from UK using  Transferwise mine just says  TRN? Kasikorn Bank 

What I was saying. Kasikirn bankbook does not indicate whether international or domestic transfer so your bank would have no way of stating that in a letter should you need them to do so. Call the main number and ask for credit advice to be sent to your branch.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Maptaput's extra requirements include having to find a witness to accompany us to the immigration office at application time, and also be around when they do their home visit. And their witness and home visit requirements apply to each and every annual application, not just to the first one as I gather is generally the practice elsewhere.

Sorry for your situation, we of course have neighbours and friends.

We never find it a problem to find a witness to accompany us to Immigration or be at the house if they visit.

 

I find Thais to be very helpful and amenable in this respect.

 

[Sheryl]

Just transferred in a  million baht from UK using  Transferwise mine just says  TRN? Kasikorn Bank 

Can I ask what fee you paid? I am looking at Transferwise because it has been mentioned as lower fee than bank transfer but their website quotes over $200 fee to transfer $25k. ?????

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Tanoshi]

7 minutes ago, moontang said:

Also, marriage fraud is a big business, and quite a few Thais have been victimized..marriages foreigners are very suspect in the US, too, as a marriage can represent the keys to the kindom....doing an internal upgrade to retirement extension likely sets off a lot of flags, too, and weren't those the people getting g visits?

Africans, Pakistanis, Indians, yes, very few arranged or forced marriages with westerners.

[Tanoshi]

5 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Can I ask what fee you paid? I am looking at Transferwise because it has been mentioned as lower fee than bank transfer but their website quotes over $200 fee to transfer $25k. ?????

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

The fees appear higher than banks, but the exchange rate is so much better it outweighs the fees.

 

I used to do transfers through BKK London to my Thai branch.

I've calculated transfers from as little £1,000 up to £50,000K and still get more baht through TW.

 

$25,000 transfer, fee of $212, exchange rate of 32.960. Recipient receives 816,989 baht.

Edited November 6, 2018 by Tanoshi

[mercman24]

i just done my 90 day, the officer had seen that my yearly extension is due in November, he did not bat an eyelid, I CAN DO FOR YOU 16,000  BAHT,  i am good to go until Nov 2019 (hopefully after reading this) embassy letter + money in bank) which is on their OFFICIAL SITE , and i can see no mention of them changing this ruling, (OK it will change in the new years as to the embassy letter) oh a friend just got his yearly for 12,000 baht, and he has got jack shit money in the bank lol

Edited November 6, 2018 by mercman24

[moontang]

59 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

The fees appear higher than banks, but the exchange rate is so much better it outweighs the fees.

 

I used to do transfers through BKK London to my Thai branch.

I've calculated transfers from as little £1,000 up to £50,000K and still get more baht through TW.

 

$25,000 transfer, fee of $212, exchange rate of 32.960. Recipient receives 816,989 baht.

I am showing current TT Buy rate at BBL as 32.82...so if you sent 25000 through NYC, you would lose 10 bucks up front, and 500 THB on arrival..giving you..819,671.80....and your bank book would state FET.    Would have been 815,923 at the worst rate this week for TT.  I just checked tranferwise...you would get less than 818,000....32.975 with TW or 32.82 with BBL...BBL wins...

Edited November 6, 2018 by moontang