Which country to apply for a visa ,Spain or Portugal ???

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

I and my Thai gf are planning for a month holiday in Portugal and Greece next july , for economical reasons we will be landing in Spain as our first border with EU, and flying to Lisbon ,with a different ticket and different flight air cia. , a few hours later.I am braziliam so I will be OK at spain or Portugal border. As all our reservations for hotels and tickets will be mainly for Portugal , but we will need to cross EU border in Spain , where does SHE  need to apply for the visa , Spain Embassy or Portugal embassy ??? Thanks for your advice. Isac

[Mavideol]

have to apply at the first country of arrival Spain. When you fly/drive or walk from Spain to Portugal no need visa, there is no border, thus the only border is the first one when you arrive in Spain

[theoldgit]

The rules state that she should apply for her visa at the Consulate of the Member State with jurisdiction for the country where she intends to spend the longest time.

If an applicant is touring and intends to spend an equal amount of time in more than Member State, they should apply at the Consulate with jurisdiction for their entry point into Schengen.

[varun]

Since the two of you will be spending most of your time in Portugal and using Spain purely as a transit point, 

she should apply at the Portugal consulate.

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

Thanks for you all , but some conflicting information , Mavideol said she needs to apply at Spain embassy because we are arriving in Spain , which is true , and Varun and Theoldgit say that should apply at Portugal embassy  since we are going to spend most of our time in Portugal , which is true as well , but then , when we arrive in Spain we only will have the visa from Portugal and we will need to cross immigration in Spain in order to catch the flight to Lisbon....I am confuse , need help,sorry thank you.

[theoldgit]

 

[theoldgit]

1 hour ago, Mavideol said:

have to apply at the first country of arrival Spain. When you fly/drive or walk from Spain to Portugal no need visa, there is no border, thus the only border is the first one when you arrive in Spain

That's not correct, you should apply at the Consulate with juristiction for the member state where the applicant intends to spend the longest time, if the applicant is intending to spend an equal amount of time in more than one member state, only then should the application be made via the Consulate with juristiction for the entry point into Schengen.
I'm aware of a number of applications that have been, correctly, refused where an applicant has flown into one country, and declared that they were spending longer in another member state. 

[Mavideol]

6 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

That's not correct, you should apply at the Consulate with juristiction for the member state where the applicant intends to spend the longest time, if the applicant is intending to spend an equal amount of time in more than one member state, only then should the application be made via the Consulate with juristiction for the entry point into Schengen.
I'm aware of a number of applications that have been, correctly, refused where an applicant has flown into one country, and declared that they were spending longer in another member state. 

how can she clear customs in Spain without a visa.....

[Mavideol]

17 minutes ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

Thanks for you all , but some conflicting information , Mavideol said she needs to apply at Spain embassy because we are arriving in Spain , which is true , and Varun and Theoldgit say that should apply at Portugal embassy  since we are going to spend most of our time in Portugal , which is true as well , but then , when we arrive in Spain we only will have the visa from Portugal and we will need to cross immigration in Spain in order to catch the flight to Lisbon....I am confuse , need help,sorry thank you.

to avoid misunderstandings and conflicting information, please feel free to contact this people, they are very helpful  https://www.banguecoque.embaixadaportugal.mne.pt/pt/

[theoldgit]

1 minute ago, Mavideol said:

how can she clear customs in Spain without a visa.....

Why would he need to?

 

Schengen Visas are issued by the member state where the applicant intends to spend the longest time.

[theoldgit]

28 minutes ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

Thanks for you all , but some conflicting information , Mavideol said she needs to apply at Spain embassy because we are arriving in Spain , which is true , and Varun and Theoldgit say that should apply at Portugal embassy  since we are going to spend most of our time in Portugal , which is true as well , but then , when we arrive in Spain we only will have the visa from Portugal and we will need to cross immigration in Spain in order to catch the flight to Lisbon....I am confuse , need help,sorry thank you.

For the avoidance of doubt, the Schengen rules are very clear, you should apply via the Portugese Consulate, if they issue your gf with a visa it will also be valid for entry into Spain.

 

2.1.2. If the travel destination includes more than one Member State, the application must be dealt with by the consulate of the main destination. The main destination is understood to be the destination where the applicant intends to spend the longest time or where the main purpose of the intended journey is carried out.

 

https://ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/sites/homeaffairs/files/policies/borders/docs/c_2010_1620_en.pdf

[Mavideol]

4 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

For the avoidance of doubt, the Schengen rules are very clear, you should apply via the Portugese Consulate, if they issue your gf with a visa it will also be valid for entry into Spain.

 

2.1.2. If the travel destination includes more than one Member State, the application must be dealt with by the consulate of the main destination. The main destination is understood to be the destination where the applicant intends to spend the longest time or where the main purpose of the intended journey is carried out.

 

https://ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/sites/homeaffairs/files/policies/borders/docs/c_2010_1620_en.pdf

just contacted my friend at the embassy, let's wait for his confirmation

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

16 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

how can she clear customs in Spain without a visa.....

Very good point , I have no idea...that is why I am confuse....

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

just contacted my friend at the embassy, let's wait for his confirmation

Thank you very much...

[Mavideol]

20 minutes ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

Thank you very much...

I send you a email with a contact information, good luck

[thonglorjimmy]

Whilst you're waiting for Movideol's friend to confirm the rules as outlined in the Schengen Handbook, you might wish to read the advice which is obtained by following the link that he suggested you read, that link leads you to the Embassy's Visa Application Centre, which confirms:

 

• If you intend to visit only one Schengen country, you must apply at the Embassy or Consulate of this country.
• If you intend to visit several Schengen countries, you must apply for a visa at the Embassy or Consulate of the country of your longest stay or the one who is, in relation to others, the main destination due to purpose of your trip (professional reasons, in a Schengen country, outweigh its jurisdiction in relation to tourist motives, family or private visit, in another state)
• If you intend to visit several Schengen countries but do not have a main destination (i.e. the duration of your stay is very similar in all the different countries), you should apply for a visa at the Embassy or Consulate of the country that is your first point of entry.

https://pt.tlscontact.com/th/bkk/page.php?pid=FAQ

 

If your girlfriend is planning to visit Portugal as her main destination, which you seem to be saying, then that's where she should apply for her visa from, that visa will allow her entry into Schengen via Spain, or any other entry point, it's something my partner has done many times over the years.

 

varun and theoldgit have given you the correct information to the question you've asked.

 

I will give you an example of how it can go wrong, many years ago my partner and I were visiting Paris for three days and then were travelling to Italy to tour for a week, we thought we should apply to the French Embassy as that's where we entering Schengen, as Italy was our main destination the French refused her visa application and she had to apply again, and pay again, at the Italian Consulate, that visa allowed us to enter via Paris. 

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

48 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

Why would he need to?

 

Schengen Visas are issued by the member state where the applicant intends to spend the longest time.

Because we are arriving first in Spain , cross immigration and will 2 hours latter board a flight to Lisbon

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

5 minutes ago, thonglorjimmy said:

Whilst you're waiting for Movideol's friend to confirm the rules as outlined in the Schengen Handbook, which details the relevent rules, you might wish to read the advice which is obtained by following the link that he suggested to read, that link leads you to the Embassy's Visa Application Centre, which confirms:

 

• If you intend to visit only one Schengen country, you must apply at the Embassy or Consulate of this country.
• If you intend to visit several Schengen countries, you must apply for a visa at the Embassy or Consulate of the country of your longest stay or the one who is, in relation to others, the main destination due to purpose of your trip (professional reasons, in a Schengen country, outweigh its jurisdiction in relation to tourist motives, family or private visit, in another state)
• If you intend to visit several Schengen countries but do not have a main destination (i.e. the duration of your stay is very similar in all the different countries), you should apply for a visa at the Embassy or Consulate of the country that is your first point of entry.

https://pt.tlscontact.com/th/bkk/page.php?pid=FAQ

 

If your girlfriend is planning to visit Portugal as her main destination, which you seem to be saying, then that's where she should apply for her visa from, that visa will allow her entry into Schengen via Spain, or any other entry point, it's something my partner has done many times over the years.

 

varun and theoldgit have given you the correct information to the question you've asked.

 

I will give you an example of how it can go wrong, many years ago my partner and I were visiting Paris for three days and then were travelling to Italy to tour for a week, we thought we should apply to the French Embassy as that's where we entering Schengen, as Italy was our main destination the French refused her visa application and she had to apply again, and pay again, at the Italian Consulate, that visa allowed us to enter via Paris. 

Thank you very much , from what I understood , the Portuguese visa will allow her to enter EU in Spain , I hope this is correct and the IO in Spai will obey to that.

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

20 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

I send you a email with a contact information, good luck

Thank you

 

[theoldgit]

2 minutes ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

Because we are arriving first in Spain , cross immigration and will 2 hours latter board a flight to Lisbon

She doesn't need a visa for Spain, she needs a Schengen Visa to enter the Schengen Area, as Portugal is the main destination, it's from them she should she should apply for her visa.

 

That visa will allow her to fly into Spain and then travel onto Portugal for her holiday.

 

What I've told you is detailed in the Schengen Handbook, which is a compilation of the laws and regulations regarding Schengen, as well as an instruction to decision makers, it's also outlined by following the link provided by the other poster who seems to disagree with everyone else.

 

I'll leave it up to you now.

[thonglorjimmy]

31 minutes ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

Thank you very much , from what I understood , the Portuguese visa will allow her to enter EU in Spain , I hope this is correct and the IO in Spai will obey to that.

It's not a Portugese Visa, as I've already said, it's a Schengen Visa issued by the Portugese Visa Section, but yes it will allow her to enter the Schengen Area via Spain.

 

Without being pedantic it's not a visa that allows entry into the EU, some countries are in the EU but are not in Schengen, so require seperate visas, like UK and Ireland, whilst some countries are in Schengen but not the EU, like Iceland and Switzerland

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

14 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

She doesn't need a visa for Spain, she needs a Schengen Visa to enter the Schengen Area, as Portugal is the main destination, it's from them she should she should apply for her visa.

 

That visa will allow her to fly into Spain and then travel onto Portugal for her holiday.

 

What I've told you is detailed in the Schengen Handbook, which is a compilation of the laws and regulations regarding Schengen, as well as an instruction to decision makers, it's also outlined by following the link provided by the other poster who seems to disagree with everyone else.

 

I'll leave it up to you now.

Thank you very much , your post clarifies everything for me ....she needs a SCHENGEN VISA ,so it really does not mater your port of entry...thanks.

[Donutz]

Indeed, she needs a Schengen visa. A Schengen visa will give access to all countries in the Schengen area (with very rare exceptions).  Both Portugal and Spain are in the Schengen area so she can visit both countries.

 

Because Portugal is the main destination she needs to ask for a visa at the Portuguese embassy (or use their optional  appointed external service provider if you wish). With a Schengen  visa in her passport she can enter via Spain (and any other Schengen nation) and then travel to Portugal. All on a Portuguese issued Schengen visa.

 

(As is also explained in the Schengen visa FAQ topic pinned near the top of this forum plus the official  EU websites linked to)

 

Good luck with the application. You may wish to read some other Frequently Asked Questions from the FAQ. ????

[varun]

Some points to add:

Those who are refuting the fact that she needs to apply for a Schengen visa in PT,

clearly have not actually travelled into the Schengen area or are not aware of the rules.

The official rules are very clear:

https://ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/what-we-do/policies/borders-and-visas/visa-policy/how_to_apply_en

 

Quote

Where and how to apply

You must lodge the application for a Schengen visa at the Consulate of the country that you intend to visit, or – if you intend to visit more than one Schengen State, the Consulate of the country where you will spend the longest period.

 

If you intend to visit several Schengen States and the stays will be of equal length, you must apply at the Consulate of the country whose external borders you will cross first when entering the Schengen area.

Also, make sure that you GF carries a travel itinerary incl. confirmation of hotel bookings at the places you will stay in PT & ES.

If you have booked train or bus tickets ahead of time, even better if you can provide copies of this - although not required.

 

If this is her first trip to Schengen, the immigration officers in Spain may question her why she is arriving into ES with a PT visa.

Even those this is perfectly acceptable and legal, they randomly probe travellers about their travel plans (& intentions) from time-to-time.

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2019 by varun

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

On 2/20/2019 at 12:30 AM, Donutz said:

Indeed, she needs a Schengen visa. A Schengen visa will give access to all countries in the Schengen area (with very rare exceptions).  Both Portugal and Spain are in the Schengen area so she can visit both countries.

 

Because Portugal is the main destination she needs to ask for a visa at the Portuguese embassy (or use their optional  appointed external service provider if you wish). With a Schengen  visa in her passport she can enter via Spain (and any other Schengen nation) and then travel to Portugal. All on a Portuguese issued Schengen visa.

 

(As is also explained in the Schengen visa FAQ topic pinned near the top of this forum plus the official  EU websites linked to)

 

Good luck with the application. You may wish to read some other Frequently Asked Questions from the FAQ. ????

Thank you

[Isac Szwarc Brasil]

On 2/20/2019 at 8:29 AM, varun said:

Some points to add:

Those who are refuting the fact that she needs to apply for a Schengen visa in PT,

clearly have not actually travelled into the Schengen area or are not aware of the rules.

The official rules are very clear:

https://ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/what-we-do/policies/borders-and-visas/visa-policy/how_to_apply_en

 

Also, make sure that you GF carries a travel itinerary incl. confirmation of hotel bookings at the places you will stay in PT & ES.

If you have booked train or bus tickets ahead of time, even better if you can provide copies of this - although not required.

 

If this is her first trip to Schengen, the immigration officers in Spain may question her why she is arriving into ES with a PT visa.

Even those this is perfectly acceptable and legal, they randomly probe travellers about their travel plans (& intentions) from time-to-time.

 

 

 

Thank you very much

[thonglorjimmy]

We're still waiting to hear back from the poster who thinks we're all wrong, as is the guidance contained in the Schengen Handbook and the information given by following the link supplied by the Portugese Embassy, he promised he would seek clarification from his friend at the Embassy and get back to us.

 

Any feedback yet? 

[peterpop]

I have just completed the visa application for my Thai wife to travel with me [British] to Spain.  Avoid this visa if possible.  Better to enter via UK or Germany.  The visa application for those places is straightforward.  The police letters were expensive and time consuming.  The Spanish were so picky and wanted so much information.  Even then they were not happy with the insurance and inbound out bound tickets.  Pain in the a....  I know the Schengen rules but travel plans can change when you get to Europe !!

[theoldgit]

If your, or anyone else’s, wife lives in Thailand then that’s where they need to apply for their visa to visit Spain, she can of course fly there from the UK but she can’t get a visa from the UK.

If Spain is her main destination in Schengen, then it’s their Consulate who must issue the visa, not the Germans.

Your wife should have been able to have her Schengen Visa issued without the things you mention, apart from evidence that you’re traveling together, I suspect you’re aware of that.

The Spanish have a pretty poor reputation for ignoring EU rules in respect of the Free Movement Directive, I wonder if they are treating spouses of Brits as if we had already crashed out of the EU as thus no longer able to benefit from the relevant directive.

 

 

[7by7]

1 hour ago, peterpop said:

Better to enter via UK or Germany.

You cannot enter the Schengen area via the UK.

 

The UK is not, and never has been, in the Schengen area. A UK visa has never been valid for any Schengen state and a Schengen visa has never been valid valid for the UK.

 

Ditto for the Republic of Ireland, which is also not in the Schengen area