Low-income households struggle under rapidly mounting debt

[mommysboy]

12 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Yes it was. I have never been into fashion or showy possessions. I buy things to serve a purpose.

I wouldn't say I live on little. I live as well as I want to.

My father taught me to avoid debt, and his teaching has served me well for many years. My son has taught me the most valuable thing anyone can possess is time.

It's not a narrative I am keen on believing. I live by it, and enjoy life as a result.

Actually, Charles Dickens' character Mr. Micawber put it best.

By nature I am a minimalist and have also never been in debt. But I also accept that I come from a country, where, for a while anyway, it was possible even for blue collar workers to establish some sort of financial security in life. Also, nobody speaks of our consumerist society, which relies on poor people spending more than they've got just to live.  Most people don't stand a chance currently, frugal or otherwise, because life has changed dramatically from 30 years ago.

[rott]

3 hours ago, Cadbury said:

 

Having clueless military economists running the country only helps the 67% extremely wealthy. The old money moguls and the well heeled nouveau riche are their advisers and since the generals know little about economics they take their advice about almost everything. The two together are effectively a self serving mutual partnership working for the betterment and enrichment of each; and stuff the rest.

One day the junta house of cards will come tumbling down.

 

 

I doubt that you meant 67%, so what should it be??

[djayz]

10 hours ago, webfact said:

or increase the daily minimum wage

Increasing the daily minimum wage, while on the one hand helpful, doesn't come close to solving the problem if that additional income is squandered, er, sorry spent, immediately on materialistic things just to keep up with the Somchais next door. 

[mommysboy]

29 minutes ago, djayz said:

Increasing the daily minimum wage, while on the one hand helpful, doesn't come close to solving the problem if that additional income is squandered, er, sorry spent, immediately on materialistic things just to keep up with the Somchais next door. 

Some will some won't; you seem to have made your mind up though.

[djayz]

1 hour ago, mommysboy said:

Some will some won't; you seem to have made your mind up though.

"Around 95 per cent of workers surveyed had household debts". If they were dumb enough to allow this to happen, then no amount of  money on God's green earth is going to change that. Yes, I've made my mind up based on those 95%. If you believe that they can/will spend any additional income wisely, that's okay too.

[ocddave]

Hey if you can buy a Mercedes/BMW and prove to rest of your family that you are a HI-SO, then its worth it in the end, Thai's live their whole lives in the hopes of showing everyone they are Elite material. In America you see a family that owns a $500,000 house driving a $30,000 vehicle, in Thailand you see a Thai living in a 1,500,000 baht condo with a 2,000,000-3,000,000 baht car, and debt up to his eyebrows, but hey, he sure makes the rest of the family jealous.

[BritManToo]

4 hours ago, mommysboy said:

By nature I am a minimalist and have also never been in debt.

I'm in debt, I owe 1.2M on my house.

[Lacessit]

4 hours ago, mommysboy said:

By nature I am a minimalist and have also never been in debt. But I also accept that I come from a country, where, for a while anyway, it was possible even for blue collar workers to establish some sort of financial security in life. Also, nobody speaks of our consumerist society, which relies on poor people spending more than they've got just to live.  Most people don't stand a chance currently, frugal or otherwise, because life has changed dramatically from 30 years ago.

The last time I was in debt was 1974, when I bought a new Honda Civic for travel to work. No public transport. My other assets were not readily cashed out.

Traditionally, cars are a bad investment due to depreciation. After 100,000 km, I sold it for $200 more than I paid for it new. Could not have done that with a larger vehicle.

I agree opportunity for young people has declined quite markedly. However, I ensured my financial security by going to work in a remote area of Australia. If one wants to get ahead, one has to be prepared to sacrifice personal comfort. The place had no TV,  and only one hour of radio in the evening. I made my own entertainment. Fishing, golfing and reading.

[Eligius]

10 hours ago, edwinchester said:

Because most people are not earning 15k a month.

We live in rural Kanchanaburi, village wages are between 4k and 10k a month.

It's so easy for people who are very comfortably off - thank you very much - to lambast poor Thais for being in debt.

All I can say is there is no way I myself could live on 10 or 15,000 baht per month.

I feel great pity for the many, many people in this country who are forced to do so. They have to be in debt in order to survive at all. If you are not paid a living wage (and many Thais are NOT), then you cannot live.

 

What an indictment this all is of the callous rich and powerful (less than 1%) who rule this land with the compassion of a psychopath.

 

Enough said.

[Khaeng Mak]

5 hours ago, mommysboy said:

I got out of teaching because the salary was the same as 20 years ago, and you'll hear much the same refrain from the common Thai. Meanwhile costs have escalated. You read so many comments that blame Thais, but the truth is the modern economy is failing fast- throughout the world. 

 

Businesses aren't making money. My brother in law's for example has failed completely because big firm's didn't pay him.  There is GDP as calculated by the Government, and that which is lived by ordinary people. The latter isn't the 3.8 quoted, unless you prefix that with a minus.

It's brother in law's fault that he failed completely.  I had some of the biggest companies in the world as clients.  I would never proceed with a project unless they provided me with a purchase order.  My proposals always included a sizeable mobilization payment and then scheduled payments throughout the course of the project as each documented deliverable was met.

[Khaeng Mak]

23 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The last time I was in debt was 1974, when I bought a new Honda Civic for travel to work. No public transport. My other assets were not readily cashed out.

Traditionally, cars are a bad investment due to depreciation. After 100,000 km, I sold it for $200 more than I paid for it new. Could not have done that with a larger vehicle.

I agree opportunity for young people has declined quite markedly. However, I ensured my financial security by going to work in a remote area of Australia. If one wants to get ahead, one has to be prepared to sacrifice personal comfort. The place had no TV,  and only one hour of radio in the evening. I made my own entertainment. Fishing, golfing and reading.

Gove?

[CGW]

12 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

99% of the people have less than a third of the nations wealth, the largest disparity in the world, what are they doing about it? not a lot.

How many times have we been told "mega rich" person is giving all his wealth away, a week later we will read how many more billions they have added to their already obscene wealth! Not very good at giving it away are they, generating positive publicity they are good at! 

[JAG]

11 hours ago, BestB said:

The bs of this surveys is when you read workers are afraid of changing jobs when staff turnover in reality is incredibly high. 

 

I wonder how much of this turnover is due to people "doing a runner" from their debts?

[BritManToo]

28 minutes ago, Eligius said:

All I can say is there is no way I myself could live on 10 or 15,000 baht per month.

If I were living alone I could do it on 15k/month.

But if I wasn't retired in Thailand, and prohibited from working, I'd probably be able to earn much more than that.

[mommysboy]

35 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The last time I was in debt was 1974, when I bought a new Honda Civic for travel to work. No public transport. My other assets were not readily cashed out.

Traditionally, cars are a bad investment due to depreciation. After 100,000 km, I sold it for $200 more than I paid for it new. Could not have done that with a larger vehicle.

I agree opportunity for young people has declined quite markedly. However, I ensured my financial security by going to work in a remote area of Australia. If one wants to get ahead, one has to be prepared to sacrifice personal comfort. The place had no TV,  and only one hour of radio in the evening. I made my own entertainment. Fishing, golfing and reading.

I had an opportunity to make a few bob in earlier times on the net. It really hurt working all hours.  I'd do it again with this, or something else, but in all honesty the opportunities are simply not there to make that sort of money, in fact I'm not sure I wouldn't end up losing capital.

 

Where does dad come in to this?  Well, he was a grafter for sure.  I think a good father teaches you about that side of life- the things that most of us would prefer to avoid.

[mommysboy]

59 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I'm in debt, I owe 1.2M on my house.

Not wasted debt though if you are paying down a mortgage.

[mommysboy]

36 minutes ago, Khaeng Mak said:

It's brother in law's fault that he failed completely.  I had some of the biggest companies in the world as clients.  I would never proceed with a project unless they provided me with a purchase order.  My proposals always included a sizeable mobilization payment and then scheduled payments throughout the course of the project as each documented deliverable was met.

For some people, it generally is the victim's fault, isn't it!

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, Khaeng Mak said:

Gove?

Port Hedland 1966. Population 500 when I arrived.

[Lacessit]

52 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

Not wasted debt though if you are paying down a mortgage.

Good debt and bad debt. Good debt is on an asset which will appreciate in value over time. Bad debt is a depreciating asset.

While I've taught my GF debt is bad, I draw the line at trying to explain asset appreciation and depreciation.

[Thongkorn]

16 hours ago, sammieuk1 said:

Left holding a dire Brexit pound I know how they feel right now????

The fall in the pound is nothing to do with brexit, its becasue of the EU the pound is so low.

[Sir Dude]

As has been mentioned, peoples' expectations and entitlement is way too high now. There used to be a time when people avoided debt and saved to buy things ... now long gone sadly. I went to the local mall the other day and you can go credit on a 700 baht toaster at 50 baht a month for so long, haha, no way. People are now living in La La Land on some many topics and being goaded by predatory lending which they are too uninformed to resist. Not sustainable how it is now and only trouble will ensue eventually. Only thing you should really do credit on is a house or car.

[mikebell]

17 hours ago, mommysboy said:

Kids cost.  Not many people can live on rice and water.  If you are, say 5000 baht short every month, then that alone is 60,000 baht a year debt.

My point was who would lend them 60,000 a year, if they only earn 15K a month.

[Mitkof Island]

22 hours ago, rott said:

What are the bankeuptcy laws here?

 

Are they published anywhere in English?

As the Thais go more and more into debt more so with new homes and cars they can not afford from bank loans. Sooner than later a huge crash is coming. Personally i can,t wait. They will be homeless and hopefully learn something from lack of future thought. The baht will soar to 50 baht to the American dollar.

[cooked]

The bs of this surveys is when you read workers are afraid of changing jobs when staff turnover in reality is incredibly high. 
 

In my admittedly not comprehensive experience, workers for example will get fired if they are late for work a couple of times, especially when they are approaching a point where they may be expecting to get a wage increase soon.
A lot of the turnover is frivolous and comes from the employers.
If they leave their job and are older than 35 or so, they will have difficulties finding a new job, especially if they are unskilled.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Moo 2]

In the past 5 years, since the General took over Thailand, the cost of living has increased by

between 70 to 100%.

As a wine drinker the price of imported wine has doubled since only a year ago.

Just before Songkran last year, a 10litre cask of wine was 1500 baht, today a 5litre cask is 1500 baht,

that 10litre cask is no longer available, they are too ashamed to put a 3000 baht of ordinary wine on

the shelves.

The strength of the baht is an absolute disaster compare to up 5 years ago.

[Bugsy777]

Worldwide fiancial collapse approaches. If your money is in a bank, kiss it goodbye. If it's in cash under the bed, you're going to need a wheel barrow load of it just buy your food.

 

It's going to get very messy.  Desperate people will do desperate things and we will have to be prepared to fight for what we have.  A grocery shopping trip will become an outing fraught with physical danger.

[champers]

15 hours ago, Thongkorn said:

The fall in the pound is nothing to do with brexit, its becasue of the EU the pound is so low.

The value of the £ v Baht fell 20% the day after the referendum.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, Moo 2 said:

In the past 5 years, since the General took over Thailand, the cost of living has increased by

between 70 to 100%.

As a wine drinker the price of imported wine has doubled since only a year ago.

Just before Songkran last year, a 10litre cask of wine was 1500 baht, today a 5litre cask is 1500 baht,

that 10litre cask is no longer available, they are too ashamed to put a 3000 baht of ordinary wine on

the shelves.

The strength of the baht is an absolute disaster compare to up 5 years ago.

How many Thais, let alone poor ones go out and buy 5 litres let alone 10 litres at a time?

 

That sounds like a farang cry to me.

[djayz]

1 hour ago, Moo 2 said:

In the past 5 years, since the General took over Thailand, the cost of living has increased by

between 70 to 100%.

As a wine drinker the price of imported wine has doubled since only a year ago.

Just before Songkran last year, a 10litre cask of wine was 1500 baht, today a 5litre cask is 1500 baht,

that 10litre cask is no longer available, they are too ashamed to put a 3000 baht of ordinary wine on

the shelves.

The strength of the baht is an absolute disaster compare to up 5 years ago.

Being able to afford wine or a plate of rice isn't quite the same thing. 

[DrTuner]

They numero uno in the gini figures yet? Making real good progress at least. Burgeoning middle class my arse.