Indonesia. What a contrast!

[ianezy0]

Bali is not for everyone, including me....congested, narrow streets, hawkers more than here. Also been to Bintang, Karimun, Banda Lampung, Jakarta. Not the safest of places. Although I am sure thee are some nice places I don’t know of ????

[jgarbo]

23 hours ago, Rimmer said:

The Language is also much easier to learn in Indonsia

The Balinese can speak Bahasa but prefer Balinese, a different language. 

[CH1961]

8 hours ago, uhuh said:

the biggest differences between Indonesians and Thais are the people

Indonesia has the largest Muslim population in the world, with approximately 225 million Muslim. 

 

The OP like it ... I prefer Thailand ????

[NanLaew]

22 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I too love Indonesia. The people are amazing, and the government beats this inept junta 100 times over. But, Bali is not my favorite. Found it to be way too crowded and the traffic is stupid. Sure, once you get north of Ubud, or up to the northern coast, it is great. Just avoid the lower SW corner of the island, and Denpasar. 

 

Indonesia has thousands of islands to explore. And most of the people are really cool, easy to talk to. And the local men, totally unlike Thai men, are curious, engaging and interested. Nice place!

If it really matters, I'm not to keen on French men either.

[fhickson]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

How many Thai male friends do you have? I am friendly, warm, engaging and have a light heart, and a good sense of humor. I have made friends wherever I have lived. Frankly, I do not think it is about me, as you insinuate. I think it is about the Thai culture, a very conventional and relatively closed minded attitude toward the world, and the perception that we have little in common. Granted, if I was fluent in Thai, that would help. But, I am not.

 

I lived and worked in India many years ago. Alot of the men had vibrant intellects, and insatiable curiousity about life, people, and the world. We would engage in wonderful conversations, and I developed many friendships there. Not so here. There seems to be little to no curiosity here.

Agree. Not one Male friend local to the country have I made in years

Anywhere in thailand. Vietnam or cambodia. Interactions a with local women everywhere and other foreigners have been great.

 

One of the things gs which have always seemed very strange. There's an invisible le wall there.

[Bournville]

no mention of climate?
 
if its 40+ here surely its even hotter right on the equator...?

You would think! For this past month... Never above 33!

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[Bournville]

Wonder how much it has changed in the twenty or so years since I was there? Is Muni's restaurant (on the bridge) still there and serving delicious red and white rice wine with meals? 
 
I gather the traditional, inexpensive Balinese-style hotel right opposite, where I stayed during Nyepi, has been turned into a swanky, upmarket joint that costs several arms and legs. I used to eat my breakfast of tropical fruits and omelette served by a houseboy on a rickety balcony overlooking a river where local women would troop each morning to bathe and wash their luxuriant hair, as no doubt they had for centuries. Garden of Eden stuff.
 
My dominent memories of Ubud are the endless art galleries and exhibitions, and of the friendliness, good humour and innate curiosity of the mostly-Hindu inhabitants, and their seemingly endless and immensely colourful parades to and from  the town's tranquil semi-subterranean temple. Wonderful, safe walking for visitors, too, on footpaths across the surrounding hills.
 
Just recalling the sights, smells and sounds of the place, I'm tempted . . but they say never go back. And usually, in my experience, with good reason.

You've just described Ubud today. More expensive.. More crowded and probably dirtier... but... Doesn't this apply to 99% of all the places we've all visited?

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[rodentwarrior]

The real value of topics like this, is that it clearly demonstrates to ThaiVisa readers, that there are other local Countries that are far more welcoming than LOS.  I lived in Bangkok for nearly 7 years, decided to leave (many reasons) and visited most other SE Asia Countries.  Finally settled in Cebu, where I have lived for the last 6/7 years.

 

Totally different experience to Thailand.  But all experience is a learning curve.  I guess the message is, get out there and explore.  I remember meeting long term residents in Thailand who had not visited neighbouring Countries, other than quick VISA runs.

[Knee Jerk Reaction]

5 hours ago, GreenerGrass said:

Both South & Central America are extremely dangerous especially if you have a fair complexion with blue eyes. If latin complexion you can make an effort to blend in but you will need street smarts. Columbia which was already bad has recently had a spike in violent crime/kidnappings  due to the problems, illegals/ refugees etc from Venezuela. Brazil is another hot spot and has been for many years for violent crime. Personally I would recommend staying far away from both Central/South America unless you very very good street smarts! I spent 5 years in South America and feel secure I have a good idea what I'm talking about with regards to this area. 

I went to Uruguay in 2015 to visit a friend who'd transplanted there from southern Africa in 2000. He's ranching outside of Montevideo. Very very safe and populated by friendly people. More expensive than Thailand but still good value. It is probably the gem on that continent. 

[grifbel]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I am friendly, warm, engaging and have a light heart, and a good sense of humor. I have made friends wherever I have lived. Frankly, I do not think it is about me, as you insinuate

You seem to be rather fixated on the "I" and the "me".  Could this be the source of the problem? 

Edited May 9, 2019 by grifbel

[VocalNeal]

14 minutes ago, Knee Jerk Reaction said:

It is probably the gem on that continent. 

 

I went there once in days of yore. I will agree on the supposition.

[Khaeng Mak]

I speak fluent bahasa Indonesian and have spent a good deal of my life in that country.

 

The elephant in the room here is that no one has mentioned that if you marry an Indonesian national you are entitled to a 25 YEAR visa. No annual renewals, no money locked in the bank, no TM30s and no ridiculous 90 day reports.  

 

My other 10 cents worth:

 

• The airport at Bali is world class. Spacious, modern, and a breeze to navigate through even if you have 5 surfboards
• On my last trip I booked a taxi via my hotel (on Agoda). The driver was well dressed, had perfect English, and met me inside the terminal and lugged 4 of my 5 boards out to his van. The total fare was about $10. No BS scams, no (sorry not have change) and no asking for tips.
• Accommodation in Bali is much cheaper than Thailand. Just have a look at the rooms available on Agoda.com.
• Another poster on this topic has commented that Bali is floating on a sea of sewage.  That is entirely untrue.  A number of environmental initiatives (mostly driven by surfing groups and individuals, Kelly Slater is a relative example) have vastly improved the pollution situation.  I recently stayed at Pantai Sanur and I found the beach (and reef offshore) much cleaner and well managed than when I first stayed there about 4 decades ago. The same applies to roadside trash.  In Thailand it is a monumental problem.  But, in stark comparison, if you hire a bike and ride around Bali you will see that roadside trash has all but been eliminated.
• Yet another poster has identified that you need a local sponsor to apply for the 6 month Social visa.  That is a non issue because any of the agents in Singapore will provide a sponsors letter for a small extra fee.

[madmen]

7 minutes ago, Khaeng Mak said:

I speak fluent bahasa Indonesian and have spent a good deal of my life in that country.

 

The elephant in the room here is that no one has mentioned that if you marry an Indonesian national you are entitled to a 25 YEAR visa. No annual renewals, no money locked in the bank, no TM30s and no ridiculous 90 day reports.  

 

My other 10 cents worth:

 

• The airport at Bali is world class. Spacious, modern, and a breeze to navigate through even if you have 5 surfboards
• On my last trip I booked a taxi via my hotel (on Agoda). The driver was well dressed, had perfect English, and met me inside the terminal and lugged 4 of my 5 boards out to his van. The total fare was about $10. No BS scams, no (sorry not have change) and no asking for tips.
• Accommodation in Bali is much cheaper than Thailand. Just have a look at the rooms available on Agoda.com.
• Another poster on this topic has commented that Bali is floating on a sea of sewage.  That is entirely untrue.  A number of environmental initiatives (mostly driven by surfing groups and individuals, Kelly Slater is a relative example) have vastly improved the pollution situation.  I recently stayed at Pantai Sanur and I found the beach (and reef offshore) much cleaner and well managed than when I first stayed there about 4 decades ago. The same applies to roadside trash.  In Thailand it is a monumental problem.  But, in stark comparison, if you hire a bike and ride around Bali you will see that roadside trash has all but been eliminated.
• Yet another poster has identified that you need a local sponsor to apply for the 6 month Social visa.  That is a non issue because any of the agents in Singapore will provide a sponsors letter for a small extra fee.

The other elephant is you will need to convert to islam before marriage...no thanks !

[spidermike007]

10 minutes ago, Khaeng Mak said:

I speak fluent bahasa Indonesian and have spent a good deal of my life in that country.

 

The elephant in the room here is that no one has mentioned that if you marry an Indonesian national you are entitled to a 25 YEAR visa. No annual renewals, no money locked in the bank, no TM30s and no ridiculous 90 day reports.  

 

My other 10 cents worth:

 

• The airport at Bali is world class. Spacious, modern, and a breeze to navigate through even if you have 5 surfboards
• On my last trip I booked a taxi via my hotel (on Agoda). The driver was well dressed, had perfect English, and met me inside the terminal and lugged 4 of my 5 boards out to his van. The total fare was about $10. No BS scams, no (sorry not have change) and no asking for tips.
• Accommodation in Bali is much cheaper than Thailand. Just have a look at the rooms available on Agoda.com.
• Another poster on this topic has commented that Bali is floating on a sea of sewage.  That is entirely untrue.  A number of environmental initiatives (mostly driven by surfing groups and individuals, Kelly Slater is a relative example) have vastly improved the pollution situation.  I recently stayed at Pantai Sanur and I found the beach (and reef offshore) much cleaner and well managed than when I first stayed there about 4 decades ago. The same applies to roadside trash.  In Thailand it is a monumental problem.  But, in stark comparison, if you hire a bike and ride around Bali you will see that roadside trash has all but been eliminated.
• Yet another poster has identified that you need a local sponsor to apply for the 6 month Social visa.  That is a non issue because any of the agents in Singapore will provide a sponsors letter for a small extra fee.

I think what you are referring to is progress, and a progressive, visionary, open minded, intelligent, preservationist mindset. None of that exists here. Not one iota. Thailand is one of the most backward nations on earth, when it comes to the direction it is moving in. It is always either standing still, or moving backwards. This place never, ever seems to be moving forward, when it comes to anything progressive, or visionary. The army now insures a complete lack of vision and understanding of anything good or important to the people, at least for the next five years.

Edited May 9, 2019 by spidermike007

[Khaeng Mak]

7 minutes ago, madmen said:

The other elephant is you will need to convert to islam before marriage...no thanks !

Absolute Piffle!  

There are literally millions of nubile young Indonesian girls who are not muslim.

[VocalNeal]

2 minutes ago, Khaeng Mak said:

Absolute Piffle!  

There are literally millions of nubile young Indonesian girls who are not muslim.

 

Ahmen. To that.  

[Khaeng Mak]

14 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I think what you are referring to is progress, and a progressive, visionary, open minded, intelligent, preservationist mindset. None of that exists here. Not one iota. Thailand is one of the most backward nations on earth, when it comes to the direction it is moving in. It is always either standing still, or moving backwards. This place never, ever seems to be moving forward, when it comes to anything progressive, or visionary. The army now insures a complete lack of vision and understanding of anything good or important to the people, at least for the next five years.

A key point here is that the Balinese invite and are willing to learn from the input provided by other nationalities.  Their pollution issues are now very well managed due to their open acceptance of foreign assistance, education and guidance.  Thailand, as you have very correctly observed, is moving steadily back into the dark ages on any single issue one cares to highlight.

[losworld]

It really depends who you roll with... if you are in the isaan rice farmer's daughter/bargirl brigade you will be hard pressed for any intellectual stimulation outside of sick buffalo, candy crush, sang som and selfies.  I dated a couple thai doctors and and these girls were absolutely marvelous with interesting conversation, curiosity and lovely friends.  Maybe I got lucky or maybe there is a connection.  Sure there are diamonds in the rough but there are also a lot of rough diamonds:)

[Rimmer]

Some off topic posts and replies have been removed

[malibukid]

i spend 4 months in Ubud every year and just love it.  the restaurants are better than what i find here in CM.  seafood in Bali is fantastic.  great surfing, diving.  woman friendly and engaging and not as xenophobic. not a lot of red tape in getting a long term visa. and more important clean air.

[malibukid]

On 5/8/2019 at 1:54 PM, madmen said:

You better start learning Australian slang Cobber, Bali is basically another Australian state. Thousands of them roaming around pissed out of their brains. I avoid Bali and Im Australian

true if you stay in Kuta Beach only

[malibukid]

1 hour ago, Khaeng Mak said:

A key point here is that the Balinese invite and are willing to learn from the input provided by other nationalities.  Their pollution issues are now very well managed due to their open acceptance of foreign assistance, education and guidance.  Thailand, as you have very correctly observed, is moving steadily back into the dark ages on any single issue one cares to highlight.

one more thing.  you can discuss politics openly with the Indonesians and they have opinions.

[Ireland32]

4 hours ago, Knee Jerk Reaction said:

I went to Uruguay in 2015 to visit a friend who'd transplanted there from southern Africa in 2000. He's ranching outside of Montevideo. Very very safe and populated by friendly people. More expensive than Thailand but still good value. It is probably the gem on that continent. 

They rob tourist busses, but Pot is Legal

Edited May 9, 2019 by Ireland32

[moe666]

Well maybe he has found his paradise, good luck. I avoid the unhappy people in Thailand

[Bournville]

one more thing.  you can discuss politics openly with the Indonesians and they have opinions.

Yesssss! Local male and female often engage in conversation from a simple "where are you from" to what do I think of the Brexit situation. In all my years in Thailand this never happened and I made zero Thai male freinds.

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[Bournville]

i spend 4 months in Ubud every year and just love it.  the restaurants are better than what i find here in CM.  seafood in Bali is fantastic.  great surfing, diving.  woman friendly and engaging and not as xenophobic. not a lot of red tape in getting a long term visa. and more important clean air.

Plus finding a comfortable seat is easy! Cheap food in Bali can be had sitting in an upholstered wicker chair.. the same cheap food in Thailand was ALWAYS eaten while sitting on a plastic or metal stool at a rickety card table!

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[Bournville]

The other elephant is you will need to convert to islam before marriage...no thanks !

Rubbish.

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[Bournville]

I speak fluent bahasa Indonesian and have spent a good deal of my life in that country.
 
The elephant in the room here is that no one has mentioned that if you marry an Indonesian national you are entitled to a 25 YEAR visa. No annual renewals, no money locked in the bank, no TM30s and no ridiculous 90 day reports.  
 
My other 10 cents worth:
 

• The airport at Bali is world class. Spacious, modern, and a breeze to navigate through even if you have 5 surfboards
• On my last trip I booked a taxi via my hotel (on Agoda). The driver was well dressed, had perfect English, and met me inside the terminal and lugged 4 of my 5 boards out to his van. The total fare was about $10. No BS scams, no (sorry not have change) and no asking for tips.
• Accommodation in Bali is much cheaper than Thailand. Just have a look at the rooms available on Agoda.com.
• Another poster on this topic has commented that Bali is floating on a sea of sewage.  That is entirely untrue.  A number of environmental initiatives (mostly driven by surfing groups and individuals, Kelly Slater is a relative example) have vastly improved the pollution situation.  I recently stayed at Pantai Sanur and I found the beach (and reef offshore) much cleaner and well managed than when I first stayed there about 4 decades ago. The same applies to roadside trash.  In Thailand it is a monumental problem.  But, in stark comparison, if you hire a bike and ride around Bali you will see that roadside trash has all but been eliminated.
• Yet another poster has identified that you need a local sponsor to apply for the 6 month Social visa.  That is a non issue because any of the agents in Singapore will provide a sponsors letter for a small extra fee.

I'm in Singapore at the moment..handed in my Indonesian sponsor letter (Bali agent) . Just got my 60 day visa... Letter cost me 14 usd and visa plus same day service via an agent was 130 usd. I never knew about the marriage thingy and 25 years. I'll wait :)

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[metisdead]

Inflammatory troll posts and the replies have been removed.

 

The closure of this topic has been reconsidered. 

 

Topic is now moved to the Southeast Asia forum and re-opened.

[LukKrueng]

Been to Bali September last year. Rented a bike both in Kuta and in Amed and was never even asked if I had a license let alone ask to see an IDP or local one...

Hotels are over-priced for what you get, most of them look nothing like the pix and description on the web booking sites.

Local dishes are very much similar to Thai food but not comparable taste wise. In this regard Ubud was a pleasant surprise (not so much for local dishes, but food in general)

And - they run the same scams and tricks on foreigners Thais topped using about 20 years ago. Exchanging money can be tricky. I was at an exchange when another person walked in - he was Asian but not local - and he was really pi***d off and argued with the guy behind the counter, counting money on the counter. That lead to an exchange of words between the counter guy and another employee behind a glass wall. After which they gave the Asian more money and demanded he counted the money in front of them before he leaves the shop as there will not be another fixing... Before he left (by now he was more relaxed) I asked him what happened and he said he was shorted by about $100...

Oh, yes, one more thing - The only place I tried to get money out of and ATM, got nothing yet my bank account was charged was in Bali....