Thaksin planning new party "Pheu Dharma", says source

[dcnx]

Jesus Christ leave it alone already.

[scorecard]

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

"...Thaksin is much needed to impede militarism authoritarianism ..."

 

If you are suggesting that thakins' goal is to stop miltiarism / authororitarianism then you get the annual award for silliest / most inaccurate / most divisive  / most ironic comment.

 

In terms of democracy he's commented several times that democracy was not his goal etc.  

I add... you say stop authoritarianism, so having the police under his control, doing his bidding, and making the police frightened, and using chalerm to frighten society in many ways him is stopping authoritarianism?  

[from the home of CC]

11 hours ago, TooBigToFit said:

He should just enjoy life as he's old and will never get a fair chance in Thailand. Thai politics is not fair. Unless he's doing this as a way to inform, educate and harass or make fools of those with power, he's just wasting his time. If he wrote a tell-all book that described all the corruption and individuals holding back Thailand, he'd have more impact. Of course, like anything truthful it would be banned in Thailand for whatever reasons but it would be out there. Instead of people speculating, the truth could be available. I guess that won't happen as his family is still in Thailand and history shows that they would be a target of the people who don't like the truth to be told.

if he wrote a tell all book he'd cut his own throat..

[from the home of CC]

6 hours ago, BobBKK said:

Most Thais will say he was the greatest of any PM's here (and that's not saying much) but his time is gone. He should relax, he and his sister have done so much for Thailand and should let it go they could not beat the Ammart, the dinosaurs and the lackey Establishment and Thais don't seem to care too much. Time will pass, people will die and the young will have a chance.

probably one of the greediest..

[Eric Loh]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

I add... you say stop authoritarianism, so having the police under his control, doing his bidding, and making the police frightened, and using chalerm to frighten society in many ways him is stopping authoritarianism?  

There are 2 faces of authoritarianism. Thaksin was an electoral authoritarian while the military staged a coup and imposed harsh authoritarian methods to subdue the populace and laid out legislative activities to ensure that power is prolonged and entrenched with the military. This is a deepening of authoritarianism with no end in sight as long as the constitution remain unchallenged. You can make up your mind which is more damaging and dangerous to Thai society, image and possibly economics. 

[GalaxyMan]

11 hours ago, TooBigToFit said:

He should just enjoy life as he's old and will never get a fair chance in Thailand. Thai politics is not fair. Unless he's doing this as a way to inform, educate and harass or make fools of those with power, he's just wasting his time. If he wrote a tell-all book that described all the corruption and individuals holding back Thailand, he'd have more impact. Of course, like anything truthful it would be banned in Thailand for whatever reasons but it would be out there. Instead of people speculating, the truth could be available. I guess that won't happen as his family is still in Thailand and history shows that they would be a target of the people who don't like the truth to be told.

Truth and Thai government are mutually exclusive ideations.

[Cashboy]

I would suggest that people read the book "Thaksin" by Pasuk Phongpaichit and Chris Baker for a better understanding of Thaksin and how he became rich.

 

Maybe Thaksin's famous quote:

"A company is a country.  A country is a company.  They're the same.  The management is the same."

 

We have seen, in the west, the massive increase in salaries and bonuses that directors receive; the share options; the share buy backs and the reduction in employee wages in real terms.

 

Living in Thailand; I think the Junta is doing a reasonably good job (better than Thaksin or Yingluck) for the majority and certainly less priviliged in Thailand.

In my opinion Thailand needs a leader like the Junta at this time.

Some countries need certain types of leader:

Libya was doing well under Gadaffi

Iraq did well under Sadam

Russia is doing well under Putin

 

So called "democracy" doesn't work everywhere; even the Uk where Brexit hasn't happened.

 

 

 

 

[Eric Loh]

8 minutes ago, Cashboy said:

Living in Thailand; I think the Junta is doing a reasonably good job (better than Thaksin or Yingluck) for the majority and certainly less priviliged in Thailand.

Yet the income equality widen, corruption perception index worsen and competitive ranking dive. Let’s not even start with the increase human right abuses and number of people held for committing 112. 

[GarryP]

9 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Yet the income equality widen, corruption perception index worsen and competitive ranking dive. Let’s not even start with the increase human right abuses and number of people held for committing 112. 

I think Cashboy needs to interview the people upcountry to see how they have been doing under the junta. I know people like to complain, but they really are suffering.  

[pornprong]

12 hours ago, bangkokfrog said:

Actually, I think that in this case they probably do. If it wasn't for the miscalculation in getting a member of the Royal Family involved, the indications were that Thaksin's Thai Raksa Chart party would have polled well in the last election in many seats not traditionally aligned with Phue Thai. FFP took up the slack, and Thaksin and his cronies are running scared at the likelihood of becoming irrelevant in the Thai political scene. This is a last ditch effort to reverse the trend.

Was it a miscalculation though?

Sure, he lost the battle, but the lines have been very clearly drawn as to who supports who.

To win the war, sometimes setbacks are necessary.

Much like WW2, there can be no negotiated truce here.

Victory will only come when one side or the other is utterly routed and ceases to exist.

This of course means only one side can win, the only remaining question.......how long?

[Myran]

5 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

Love or hate him; he is the only person who can seriously challenge the elites and military bloc. They will be losing sleep to know that he has not given up after 2 coups, much indoctrination and intimidation of his supporters, buying up his politicians and countless legal charges of his family to keep him silent. His party still win big in previous election and could have form the government if not for some skullduggery by the junta and the betrayal of the usual political party suspects. FFP seem to be a revelation but on their own, they may not have the political incumbency and grassroots support to go against the junta. In my view, Thaksin is much needed to impede militarism authoritarianism disguised as democracy from dominating Thailand for a long period.  

Haha, what an amusing prospect that the Shinawatra family – the elite of the elite – is here to save Thailand from the elite, despite having proven time and time again that they'll take every chance they can get to loot the country.

 

I'm no junta lover and certainly don't agree with neither red shirts or yellow shirts. You don't have to take an extreme side and try to whitewash and justify all the crap they've done. They're equally bad for the country, and the best case would be that all these old, corrupted families step aside to let a new generation actually try to do something that's good for the country instead of lining their pockets.

[Cashboy]

 

36 minutes ago, GarryP said:

I think Cashboy needs to interview the people upcountry to see how they have been doing under the junta. I know people like to complain, but they really are suffering.  

 

I live in Udon Thani province and I get the impression that nothing has changed; most are still poor.

 

A lot of the poorness with regard to the farmers is because the prices paid (e.g. sugar cane) by the large companies (cartel type that the likes of Thaksin associated himself with) has fallen.

 

When we look at the Yingluck rice subsidies/buy; that helped the large farmers and fraud supplying rice that wasn't even grown in Thailand and it was the middle men (agents) that made the money on those deals.

The Junta's policy was better with paying farmers ( I recall 1,000 bt per rai) for the land they had dedicated to growing rice with a fixed limit to the number of rai.  The policy also saved the government being involved in storage and sale of the rice.

 

I also find that people put themselves into more debt, but not from day to day living, but from living the American Dream:

Buying trash they don't need

With money they don't have ( debt )

To impress people they don't like

 

[pornprong]

12 hours ago, Smiles said:

He can enjoy many cycle of lifespans of luxury if he chooses based on the money he has. However, ego and too much free time at hand makes him plot and work out things which he thinks can bring him home as a hero should.

........or perhaps he wants to see the lives of everyday Thais improved.

[scorecard]

2 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

There are 2 faces of authoritarianism. Thaksin was an electoral authoritarian while the military staged a coup and imposed harsh authoritarian methods to subdue the populace and laid out legislative activities to ensure that power is prolonged and entrenched with the military. This is a deepening of authoritarianism with no end in sight as long as the constitution remain unchallenged. You can make up your mind which is more damaging and dangerous to Thai society, image and possibly economics. 

So what is an electoral authoritarian?

[pornprong]

7 hours ago, scorecard said:

OIC you suddenly add red and try to make it look 'everybody'.

TV members are not as dumb as you seem to think.

You're right.

Many are much, much dumber.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

So what is an electoral authoritarian?

No answer...

[FarFlungFalang]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

So what is an electoral authoritarian?

Phrayuth would qualify as both one would suspect.

[GarryP]

2 hours ago, Cashboy said:

 

 

I live in Udon Thani province and I get the impression that nothing has changed; most are still poor.

 

A lot of the poorness with regard to the farmers is because the prices paid (e.g. sugar cane) by the large companies (cartel type that the likes of Thaksin associated himself with) has fallen.

 

When we look at the Yingluck rice subsidies/buy; that helped the large farmers and fraud supplying rice that wasn't even grown in Thailand and it was the middle men (agents) that made the money on those deals.

The Junta's policy was better with paying farmers ( I recall 1,000 bt per rai) for the land they had dedicated to growing rice with a fixed limit to the number of rai.  The policy also saved the government being involved in storage and sale of the rice.

 

I also find that people put themselves into more debt, but not from day to day living, but from living the American Dream:

Buying trash they don't need

With money they don't have ( debt )

To impress people they don't like

 

Falling agriculture prices is definitely a problem. Two of my sisters in law run shops out in a small northeastern town and they are clearly suffering from reduced sales. Not many years ago, after harvest season the farmers would come into town to spend their money. In the past few years this has stopped happening. The farming families no longer have as much money.

 

As to people unnecessarily putting themselves into debt buying stuff they do not need, it certainly seems to be a problem here.   

[pornprong]

2 hours ago, Cashboy said:

 

 

I live in Udon Thani province and I get the impression that nothing has changed; most are still poor.

 

A lot of the poorness with regard to the farmers is because the prices paid (e.g. sugar cane) by the large companies (cartel type that the likes of Thaksin associated himself with) has fallen.

 

When we look at the Yingluck rice subsidies/buy; that helped the large farmers and fraud supplying rice that wasn't even grown in Thailand and it was the middle men (agents) that made the money on those deals.

The Junta's policy was better with paying farmers ( I recall 1,000 bt per rai) for the land they had dedicated to growing rice with a fixed limit to the number of rai.  The policy also saved the government being involved in storage and sale of the rice.

 

I also find that people put themselves into more debt, but not from day to day living, but from living the American Dream:

Buying trash they don't need

With money they don't have ( debt )

To impress people they don't like

 

Either through ignorance or deviousness, you have misrepresented the rice subsidy.

 

"Interestingly, Yingluck was targeting the landless tenant rice growers, not the medium to larger landowning farmers—many of these absentee owners—whom the Democrat Party had generously assisted with earlier subsidies."

 

"They feel that the whole drama against Yingluck was because these wealthy middlemen, normal Democrat Party supporters in alliance with the politically motivated amaat regime, missed out on their historic practice of exploiting the peasants. Essentially, middlemen wanted to regain control of the rice marketing so they could continue buying cheap paddy from small, mostly tenanted rice farmers as usual."

[FarFlungFalang]

2 hours ago, Cashboy said:

I also find that people put themselves into more debt, but not from day to day living,

I'm sure that maybe the case for some or even many but I can certainly say that there are many cases where I live that people are going further and further into debt just to seed and harvest crops and paying workers to help.Since the Junta seized power the has been a marked decline in living standards and people cannot keep up.

[gamini]

16 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Today he is a dinosaur, that do not have anything do do with Thailand, more than sitting of his sentence. After that he could be up for consideration. All he does now, is making things worse by interfering with things he at the moment to not own legal right to engage in.

 

yes, of course he should do a book about everybody else, because him and his familt is probably totally clean from all he would write about.

Quite true. He was the most corrupt politician in Thailands history

[Jip99]

12 hours ago, BobBKK said:

Wrong. He dragged Thailand into advancement and challenged the Status Quo and was brought down for doing it. 

 

 

... and there was me thinking that greed and corruption was his downfall....

[pornprong]

9 minutes ago, gamini said:

Quite true. He was the most corrupt politician in Thailands history

Says who?

Those who couldn't beat him in an election and a few self loathing TV closet fascists.

(notice the absence of a question mark appending the latter sentence)

[pornprong]

2 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

... and there was me thinking that greed and corruption was his downfall....

Perhaps a quick look at what has happened to the level of inequality in Thailand since Thaksin's departure may throw some light on what actually caused his downfall.

The rich have got richer and the poor poorer, so much so that just last year Thailand finally managed to become the most unequal nation on the planet with the top 1% controlling 67% of the countries wealth.

 

Sadly for you, despite your avid consumption of the right wing propaganda, Thaksin is not actually the devil.

[Jip99]

1 hour ago, pornprong said:

Perhaps a quick look at what has happened to the level of inequality in Thailand since Thaksin's departure may throw some light on what actually caused his downfall.

The rich have got richer and the poor poorer, so much so that just last year Thailand finally managed to become the most unequal nation on the planet with the top 1% controlling 67% of the countries wealth.

 

Sadly for you, despite your avid consumption of the right wing propaganda, Thaksin is not actually the devil.

 

 

I consume nothing from the right....

 

 

Note.... South Africa is the "most unequal nation" you quoted some historic Swiss bank "survey"...

 

Maybe you are consuming too much from the left wing propaganda.

 

 

https://www.activesustainability.com/sustainable-development/top-countries-economic-inequality/#5

 

[Cashboy]

2 hours ago, pornprong said:

Perhaps a quick look at what has happened to the level of inequality in Thailand since Thaksin's departure may throw some light on what actually caused his downfall.

The rich have got richer and the poor poorer, so much so that just last year Thailand finally managed to become the most unequal nation on the planet with the top 1% controlling 67% of the countries wealth.

The divide between rich and poor has got bigger everywhere in the world, especially since 2008.

And most people are getting themselves into more and more debt.

[Chazar]

22 hours ago, webfact said:

He is seen as sharing similar political ideas with FFP but does not have control over it.

putting  the country first eh!

[Chazar]

24 minutes ago, Cashboy said:

And most people are getting themselves into more and more debt.

golly  perhaps some "self control" is  in order............oh  no, must have the latest (insert i  phone /pick up/designer bag/s)  not their fault etc

[pornprong]

8 hours ago, Jip99 said:

I consume nothing from the right....

Note.... South Africa is the "most unequal nation" you quoted some historic Swiss bank "survey"...

Maybe you are consuming too much from the left wing propaganda.

https://www.activesustainability.com/sustainable-development/top-countries-economic-inequality/#5

Hmmm.

The Nation newspaper leans just a touch to the right.

https://www.nationthailand.com/Economy/30360144

[pornprong]

7 hours ago, Cashboy said:

The divide between rich and poor has got bigger everywhere in the world, especially since 2008.

The fact that Thailand managed to still climb to the top of the ranks in such an environment just makes it all the more damning.

 

7 hours ago, Cashboy said:

And most people are getting themselves into more and more debt.

People aren't borrowing money from loansharks to buy iPhones.

Mortgage, medical and grocery bills are not optional.