UK PM Johnson says 39 billion pound divorce bill not due in no-deal Brexit

[Sticky Wicket]

Just now, Nigel Garvie said:

I note pioneer has already addressed this, but just to give a helping hand:-

Banks have ALREADY left London, which planet were you on the last 2 years?

 

Try something simple like google "banks leave london brexit", you'll be able to find out where they have gone/ are going. I'll give you a start- Frankfurt, Paris, Dublin, Amsterdam.

or https://news.efinancialcareers.com/uk-en/3000398/brexit-banks-moving-out-of-london

Before someone tries to claim that it is all project fear, or MSM remainer bias please note:-

This site is a careers advisory service, providing advice to people working in the banking sector, not a political rag.

less than 1% WOW

[sandyf]

45 minutes ago, fishtank said:

Boris the clown is even more deluded than we all thought.

Not meeting our legal obligations will get us a long way when making deals with anybody in the future.

Exactly. Citizens rights, Irish border and Financial settlement were all supposed to be resolved before leaving the EU.

Trying to circumvent your responsibilities will never pay off.

[Sticky Wicket]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Exactly. Citizens rights, Irish border and Financial settlement were all supposed to be resolved before leaving the EU.

Trying to circumvent your responsibilities will never pay off.

So being completely spiteful is ok?

[Nigel Garvie]

5 minutes ago, Sticky Wicket said:

less than 1% WOW

Wow indeed, you did a lot of reading in 5 minutes to find something positive you could say. Please supply reference 1% of what. ????  ????  ????

[sandyf]

5 minutes ago, Nigel Garvie said:

I note pioneer has already addressed this, but just to give a helping hand:-

Banks have ALREADY left London, which planet were you on the last 2 years?

 

Not only banks, the EBA and EMA have also relocated.

Over 200 notified bodies are under notice, the BSI operation on medical devices has already relocated to the Netherlands.

[Sticky Wicket]

Just now, Nigel Garvie said:

Wow indeed, you did a lot of reading in 5 minutes to find something positive you could say. Please supply reference 1% of what. ????  ????  ????

I refer you to my reply on page 2

[Bluespunk]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

 

The EU has repeatedly said it will not start negotiating a new trade deal with Britain before the issues of money, the Irish border and citizens rights are settled

That chilly sensation running through your body, johnson, is a cold dose of reality.

[neeray]

2 hours ago, terryw said:

If the UK gets a reasonably good FTA with the USA then any future FTA with the EU becomes less important. Why pay for something when a rival will give you a dealfor nothing.

"Why pay for something when a rival will give you a dealfor nothing."

Why? Simply because default would leave a very bad taste in the mouths of the EU.

[neeray]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

How high do you think is the probability that that will happen?

I think the likelihood is high because Trump for one is very keen right now to snub his nose at China.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, Sticky Wicket said:

Everyone can see how intransigent & petty the EU are being in this deal.

It won't affect deals with other countries.

Really?

Boris: I will shoot my foot. I will really do it, do to die!

EU: We think that is not a good idea but if you absolutely want to do that then we can't hold you back.

Boris: You made me shoot my foot. You are to blame!

[Nigel Garvie]

14 minutes ago, St George said:

 

 

There is more to life than investment banking.

Speaking as an old hippy (No not the old hippy)  what a wonderful sentiment to express. Why tie ourselves down with gross considerations of mere material benefits. There are arts, music, literature, sports, theatre, etc to entertain us. The fact that London has lost $trillion worth of business (By 2018 from numerous sources) is not worth worrying about. Pour yourself a huge whisky, light up that spliff and take a deep toke ..........all will be well!!

[OneMoreFarang]

5 minutes ago, neeray said:

I think the likelihood is high because Trump for one is very keen right now to snub his nose at China.

And Trump has to make sure his farmers are happy. Now how will he do that?

The interests of the UK and the USA about a trade deal are very different.

Option 1: One party will give in early - and I can't imagine Trump will be the one

Option 2: It will take forever

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, fishtank said:

Boris the clown is even more deluded than we all thought.

Not meeting our legal obligations will get us a long way when making deals with anybody in the future.

From the OP:

 

"Prime Minister Boris Johnson said on Sunday that if Britain leaves the European Union without a deal, it will no longer legally owe the 39 billion pound ($47.88 billion) divorce bill agreed by his predecessor Theresa May."

"Sky News said the figure was 9 billion pounds, while the Sunday Times reported British government lawyers had concluded the amount Britain was legally obliged to pay could be as low as 7 billion pounds."

[stevenl]

3 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And Trump has to make sure his farmers are happy. Now how will he do that?

The interests of the UK and the USA about a trade deal are very different.

Option 1: One party will give in early - and I can't imagine Trump will be the one

Option 2: It will take forever

Problem for Trump is that the UK volume will be far, far from enough to make up for decrease in Chinese volume.

[ThePioneer]

3 hours ago, terryw said:

If the UK gets a reasonably good FTA with the USA

 

Yes Trump seems to be the hero of the FTA's worldwide.

 

Is there one of the existing ones that he hasn't canceled yet?

 

But of course on the TVF  my girl the UK is different.

[jonwilly]

The only thing the EU ever wanted from UK is money to fulfill it's Dream of a united Socialist Europe.

German has always been the biggest payer and France will never pay it's fair share. 

Up to about 1850 France was biggest most powerful nation in Europe, then Bismark started to unify the German speaking peoples.

This led first to the Franco-Prussian war then the 2 World Wars. Europe was trashed as a result and Britain all but bankrupted.

The EU was Europe's attempt to find a total peace and they need the UK's money to do it hence their attitude to a nation state wanting out.

 

john

[stevenl]

3 minutes ago, jonwilly said:

The only thing the EU ever wanted from UK is money to fulfill it's Dream of a united Socialist Europe.

German has always been the biggest payer and France will never pay it's fair share. 

Up to about 1850 France was biggest most powerful nation in Europe, then Bismark started to unify the German speaking peoples.

This led first to the Franco-Prussian war then the 2 World Wars. Europe was trashed as a result and Britain all but bankrupted.

The EU was Europe's attempt to find a total peace and they need the UK's money to do it hence their attitude to a nation state wanting out.

 

john

You're way, way overestimating the UK's importance.

[St George]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

You're way, way overestimating the UK's importance.

 

 

Unlike you, who always underestimates it.

 

 

Underestimate the UK at your peril.

[Baerboxer]

4 hours ago, brucec64 said:

Item one on agenda of eventual FTA discussions between UK and the EU after the UK crashes and burns out of the EU: Repayment of the 39 billion.
Item two: interest on the 39 billion.

Pay now or pay later. Doesn't really matter.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

The 39 billion doesn't appear to be based on logic. All sorts of numbers were banded about by various politicians from various member states before the negotiators seemingly settled on 39 Billion.

 

AFAIK, that 39 billion has never been fully itemized and audited. 

 

Nor has the EU detailed exactly how it will devolve Britain's share of EU assets which must become British property.

 

The EU used the threat of no trade deal, no agreement, to try an intimidate the UK into agreeing the 39 billion, and agreeing the Irish Backstop, on the premise of "trust us. We will endeavor to do out best to agree a mutually acceptable trade deal; and might conclude a deal so the backstop isn't necessary but until then you must accept our rules; we will give you your share of assets, maybe, somehow, someday; and we'll do out best to do this in a time that's reasonable (to us)".

 

May and her toss-pot negotiating team swallowed all this bull-<deleted>. Would you? Do you believe and trust all 27 EU member states to behave honorably, ethically and honestly?

 

I voted to remain for a number of reasons. It was obvious leaving would degenerate into a nasty break up with the EU likely, as we now see, trying to con and bully as it needs money and needs to frighten other potential leavers. That doesn't mean I will accept bull-<deleted> deals from the EU based on fanciful ideas and with them get their own way on everything and then smirking that they've punished Britain and will treat them live serfs evermore.

 

If the EU won't be open and fair, and wants a problem, so be it.

[david555]

13 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

Johnson certainly has a lot of flaws, but he's not an idiot.
He applies the good old method of the player who has no master card.
He bluffs.

People seems to forget that a newspaper he worked for long time ago sacked him for pure invented story's ….that's how he is , and how he build up his story's 

[Jip99]

1 minute ago, Baerboxer said:

 

The 39 billion doesn't appear to be based on logic. All sorts of numbers were banded about by various politicians from various member states before the negotiators seemingly settled on 39 Billion.

 

AFAIK, that 39 billion has never been fully itemized and audited. 

 

Nor has the EU detailed exactly how it will devolve Britain's share of EU assets which must become British property.

 

The EU used the threat of no trade deal, no agreement, to try an intimidate the UK into agreeing the 39 billion, and agreeing the Irish Backstop, on the premise of "trust us. We will endeavor to do out best to agree a mutually acceptable trade deal; and might conclude a deal so the backstop isn't necessary but until then you must accept our rules; we will give you your share of assets, maybe, somehow, someday; and we'll do out best to do this in a time that's reasonable (to us)".

 

May and her toss-pot negotiating team swallowed all this bull-<deleted>. Would you? Do you believe and trust all 27 EU member states to behave honorably, ethically and honestly?

 

I voted to remain for a number of reasons. It was obvious leaving would degenerate into a nasty break up with the EU likely, as we now see, trying to con and bully as it needs money and needs to frighten other potential leavers. That doesn't mean I will accept bull-<deleted> deals from the EU based on fanciful ideas and with them get their own way on everything and then smirking that they've punished Britain and will treat them live serfs evermore.

 

If the EU won't be open and fair, and wants a problem, so be it.

 

 

I wouldn't trust the b4stards at the EU as far as I could throw them; they give Europeans a bad name.

[Baerboxer]

10 minutes ago, stevenl said:

You're way, way overestimating the UK's importance.

 

No he isn't.

[Jip99]

1 hour ago, ThePioneer said:

So better informed sources think different

 

https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/banks-to-flee-london-even-if-brexit-is-cancelled-20190128

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-banks-factbox/factbox-impact-on-banks-from-britains-vote-to-leave-the-eu-idUSKBN1O31FE

 

 

I think I can trump your newspaper/secondary bank quotes:-

 

(Note, Deutsche bank is a proper bank and is in the EU)

 

London and the UK will remain Europe’s top financial centre over the next decade, according to Deutsche Bank’s chief executive John Cryan, despite fears in the City that the vote to leave the EU could be ruinous for the industry.

 

http://www.hansonlee.com/london-will-remain-the-top-financial-centre-post-brexit-says-deutsche-bank-chief/

[stevenl]

14 minutes ago, St George said:

 

 

Unlike you, who always underestimates it.

 

 

Underestimate the UK at your peril.

Interesting, how do I 'always underestimate the UK's importance'?

[Libai]

There has never been an agreement to pay the EU £39 Billion.  Only an intention that, after providing the UK with a mutually agreeable and sensible FTA agreement finance would be discussed.  The Lady who 'willy-nilly' offered tax Payers money has now thankfully gone.

[stephenterry]

All rhetoric by Johnson, who is using a 'frightener' to open up a deal that he can sell to parliament. I wouldn't pay much attention to the 'war of the words'. 

 

It is clear - or should be - that current UK financial commitments involving our agreements until December 2020 with the EU (and possibly amounting to around what the media says, 555) would be honoured by the government, but if a no-deal actually occurs, it is reasonable for the UK not to pay for a 'seat at the table'.

 

Even Tusk should understand that part of the equation - if it ever came to fruition. 

  

[evadgib]

Interesting article in yesterdays Telegraph:

 

[david555]

Just now, Libai said:

There has never been an agreement to pay the EU £39 Billion.  Only an intention that, after providing the UK with a mutually agreeable and sensible FTA agreement finance would be discussed.  The Lady who 'willy-nilly' offered tax Payers money has now thankfully gone.

But her signature as a P.M. of the U.K. on that document  never faded.....????

[stephenterry]

6 minutes ago, Libai said:

There has never been an agreement to pay the EU £39 Billion.  Only an intention that, after providing the UK with a mutually agreeable and sensible FTA agreement finance would be discussed.  The Lady who 'willy-nilly' offered tax Payers money has now thankfully gone.

Brexit, so far, is costing the taxpayer billions already. The whole concept of brexit is a busted flush, or an extreme folly, or a tory party political 'saving face' exercise.

 

 

[BritManToo]

5 hours ago, brucec64 said:

Item one on agenda of eventual FTA discussions between UK and the EU after the UK crashes and burns out of the EU: Repayment of the 39 billion.
Item two: interest on the 39 billion.
Pay now or pay later. Doesn't really matter.

How did that work out for Germany after WW2?

Did they ever pay?

 

I'd tell the EU (aka the 4th Reich, a united Europe under German rule) to take their 39B out of the money and interest Germany still owes.