TM30: The form getting expats in Thailand into a bureaucratic tangle

[Thaifriends]

12 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

So if the next new rule says that all foreign men will have to wear a bra, under your logic you would say its the law and I'm proud to wear it, or just get out?  

Childish question and aptitude. Grow up please

[Thaifriends]

9 hours ago, mania said:

Laugh till you cry ????

Not too worry I don't live in Thailand ????

I did for many years but left because many things corruption based.

 

But I will tell you something because you are bent on thinking expats are criminals & that is why these laws need compliance

 

I want to tell you I agree Thailand has many many criminals even monks are many times criminals but anyway

you want to talk about foreign/expat criminals?

 

Ok want to know why Thailand has so many? Because Thailand is a mostly corrupt mostly run by criminals country

 

Comply with laws ??....believe me all good expats do but they will catch no bad guys with laws...Why?

Because again Thailand is corrupt & money buys anything...ask the red bull heir ????

 

This is why Thailand is a magnet for less than good people

They know baht can buy anything

 

Baht Can buy an agent who WILL get them a visa... Law or no Law.. Because Immigration is full of corrupt workers backhander pay

 

They can buy a policeman who will get them out of any trouble... Law or no Law.... Because police department is full of corrupt police

 

They can kill a van load of tourist as many Thai have done while speeding & if they have baht no Law will hold them. Because courts are full of corruption.

 

So before you think your laws are worth anything realize laws are only as good as the people who enforce them.

 

In your country you have so much affordable corruption available to Thai & expat alike it is no wonder you attract

what you describe as "criminals among the so called expat community " ......Because Alike attracts Alike

 

So before you tell others they have something in their eye....maybe clear your own eye so you can see everything

 

 

Alike attracts alike

So dont worry about tm30 or anything dear and be happy. ????

[KenKadz]

2 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

There's a bit of a contradiction there. Since you're comfortable with any rules Thais want to set, why worry about them setting new ones. It's just for national security and your wellbeing, of course.

Not exactly, well maybe, sorta, kinda, I am not personally worried about more rules. What I was trying to point out is a warning that the self-serving complainers who may be embarrassing the Thai Gov.t could make it more difficult for every foreigner living in Thailand. I understand the purpose (national security) and if life in Thailand gets too difficult for me I will take my own advise.

[Thaifriends]

12 hours ago, lkv said:

Yeah. That's what they kept saying at that conference also, when they did not know how to answer questions.

 

"It's the law"

 

????

I think the people who represented expats did not take up the matter straight to point that if a tm30 registered person stays at hotel within the same city or outside province so then also must register again? This is key question

[Thaifriends]

9 hours ago, mania said:

Laugh till you cry ????

Not too worry I don't live in Thailand ????

I did for many years but left because many things corruption based.

 

But I will tell you something because you are bent on thinking expats are criminals & that is why these laws need compliance

 

I want to tell you I agree Thailand has many many criminals even monks are many times criminals but anyway

you want to talk about foreign/expat criminals?

 

Ok want to know why Thailand has so many? Because Thailand is a mostly corrupt mostly run by criminals country

 

Comply with laws ??....believe me all good expats do but they will catch no bad guys with laws...Why?

Because again Thailand is corrupt & money buys anything...ask the red bull heir ????

 

This is why Thailand is a magnet for less than good people

They know baht can buy anything

 

Baht Can buy an agent who WILL get them a visa... Law or no Law.. Because Immigration is full of corrupt workers backhander pay

 

They can buy a policeman who will get them out of any trouble... Law or no Law.... Because police department is full of corrupt police

 

They can kill a van load of tourist as many Thai have done while speeding & if they have baht no Law will hold them. Because courts are full of corruption.

 

So before you think your laws are worth anything realize laws are only as good as the people who enforce them.

 

In your country you have so much affordable corruption available to Thai & expat alike it is no wonder you attract

what you describe as "criminals among the so called expat community " ......Because Alike attracts Alike

 

So before you tell others they have something in their eye....maybe clear your own eye so you can see everything

 

 

Alike attracts alike

Dude I am not Thai just read the <deleted> written above. Relax and be happy

[lkv]

2 minutes ago, KenKadz said:

the self-serving complainers who may be embarrassing the Thai Gov.t could make it more difficult for every foreigner living in Thailand. 

The Government will make it more difficult, not the ones embarassing the Government.

 

Let's not fall into this mental trap.

[Thaifriends]

3 hours ago, jonclark said:

Fine, if you fail to see it as offensive, I respect you PoV.

 

But I find it offensive as a tax paying resident of this country to be expected to report myself whenever I leave the province under the excuse of 'national security'. If there was a genuine reason for it I might be less offended. If residents are viewed as a 'national security' issue, why the hell are they being given visa extensions and in my case being allowed to adopt a Thai child after passing numerous RTP & home country police checks? 

 

In a nutshell if foreign residents are granted the right to work and / or a long term visa in Thailand and have passed police checks then they clearly are not a 'national security' issue. 

 

The fact of reporting is not the issue, it is the reasoning behind the issue that is deeply offensive - or do you like being labelled national security issue due to the simple fact your passport is different? 

Same is being done by Western countries to have police check etc before allowing to stay. Yes because passport is different. Its not a new yard stick

[lkv]

14 minutes ago, Thaifriends said:

I think the people who represented expats did not take up the matter straight to point that if a tm30 registered person stays at hotel within the same city or outside province so then also must register again? This is key question

When you take things straight to the point, it makes them uncomfortable, because the "culture" is "different".

 

https://coconuts.co/bangkok/news/5-common-miscommunications-between-foreigners-and-thais/

 

When they deflect and avoid questions, the "cultural difference" is their best excuse. "Foreigner just does not understand".

 

They are "sensitive", you see.

 

Their English did not do them any favours also.

[jonclark]

26 minutes ago, Thaifriends said:

Same is being done by Western countries to have police check etc before allowing to stay. Yes because passport is different. Its not a new yard stick

Lol.. Classic whataboutism. You missed the point and your response is tepid. 

[nrasmussen]

About six or seven years ago, when I realized that it was possible for me to retire early if I left my home country and relocated to a country with lower living costs - for various reasons Thailand was at the top of my list.

Before I made my final decision I researched the requirements for staying here long term. Among the things I discovered were various forms: TM.6, TM.7, TM.8, TM.28, TM.30, TM.47. So before I moved here, I knew what was required of me.

I'm not claiming that it's been smooth sailing all the way. I've had my fill of Catch22s. And, anyway, who enjoys doing paperwork and dealing with government offices? - Fortunately this has become a little easier recently as more of the reporting can now be done online.

As for the TM.30 specifically, I don't know how useful this registration of aliens' whereabouts is for the Thai authorities with regard to apprehending undesirables. Many posters here argue that it has no effect whatsoever, but are they privy to what goes on behind the scenes? Taking into account the huge amount of resources that obviously goes into collecting all this information, I find it quite unlikely that it has no benefit.

[simon43]

Laugh till you cry 

Not too worry I don't live in Thailand 

I did for many years but left because many things corruption based....

 

This ^^^

 

I recently left Thailand after being based there for 18 years.  A primary reason for leaving was the high level of corruption.  In those 18 years I experienced:

 

- My successful little hotel in Phuket invaded by drug dealers who physically threw me out, supported by the local police.  Further physical threats caused me to leave Phuket, losing my $100k investment in that project.

- Briefly imprisoned in Pattaya on fake charges after an 'influential' foreigner persuaded the Pattaya police to charge me and blacklist me from leaving the country for 12 months.  It cost me about $25,000 to buy my way out of those charges.

- Defrauded of 2.6 million baht on a land purchase in my Thai GF's name in Phuket.  Every Thai lawyer who worked on this case was incompetent and she never got her land.

- Denied a WP on several occasions for my hotels because I refused to pay the 50,000 baht bribe to the Labour office.

-Despite working as a volunteer tourist police officer/Thai translator for many years in Phuket, Bangkok and Pattaya, I strangely found my Thai seniors unwilling to support me when requested. 

 

During my time living/working in both Myanmar and Laos (where I currently reside), I never (repeat NEVER!) experienced any levels of corruption similar to what I've experienced in Thailand.  I have never experienced physical threats against me in Myanmar and Laos, but these occurred on several occasions in Thailand.

 

I'm sure many forum members (including the many new members who seem to have recently joined up), will jump to the defence of squeaky-clean Thailand, and who have never experienced corruption such as I've experienced in Thailand.  Good on you, and all the best for your continued stay in Thailand.

 

Now I live in a communist country (Laos).  I'm not required to do any TM30, or 90 day report, and not required to pay any bribes.  I collect my business visa and work permit next week - no bribe requested or paid.  I collect my ham radio licence from the government next week also - no bribe requested or paid.

 

As a teacher and volunteer, I'm respected here in Luang Prabang (I was the international school Headmaster in 2013).  People offer genuine smiles and no one is trying to rip me off.  I won't be returning to Thailand ????

 

[maxcorrigan]

On 8/29/2019 at 2:18 PM, overherebc said:

16 weeks for a settlement visa for a Thai person to UK and when they arrive they dont have to report to anyone for 2 years and 6 months. Then they report once to confirm they are still married and stay for another 2 years and 6 months and then they get residency and a UK passport. In those years they will get medical and emergency accident treatment for free.

Can you explain what I would have to go through to get the same?

Just a query, you say 2yrs 6mths my wife has UK ILTR and we live in Thailand and as far as i'm aware she must show up in the UK every 2 years to keep her ILTR valid not 2 yrs 6 months, the rest of your post i agree with 100% you could be here 50yrs and you are still treated as a non-emigrant with zero extras!

[wgdanson]

4 hours ago, brianthainess said:

If you haven't left Thailand since 2013 then you can not. i can not use a "smart" phone either due to deformed fingers.

I don't understand. The Section 38 app is really for Thai people to register falangs staying at their house or hotel. It was introduced earlier this year. What has being in Thailand for past 6 years got to do with it please?

Sorry about your fingers. Get an Android tablet with bigger touch areas, or use voice commands.

[DPKANKAN]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

TM 30 has been the law for decades. How come so much uproar just because they are finally enforcing a long standing regulation?

Did so many people think it was their right to ignore the law of the land?

Exactly!!! A law from 40 years ago. Archaic in modern concepts. Technology has moved on leaps and bounds. But not here!!

[CLS]

TM 30 has been the law for decades. How come so much uproar just because they are finally enforcing a long standing regulation?
Did so many people think it was their right to ignore the law of the land?

But modern countries evolve.
What a retarded society.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[overherebc]

52 minutes ago, maxcorrigan said:

Just a query, you say 2yrs 6mths my wife has UK ILTR and we live in Thailand and as far as i'm aware she must show up in the UK every 2 years to keep her ILTR valid not 2 yrs 6 months, the rest of your post i agree with 100% you could be here 50yrs and you are still treated as a non-emigrant with zero extras!

The times I stated, I believe, are for the circumstances when both of you are staying full time in UK. I would imagine that going for a holiday for 3 or 4 weeks every year wouldn't interfere with the process. Open to correction on that one but I'm working on a logical way of thinking. ????

I don't know the circumstances on whether a Thai wife is allowed to work or not during those 5 years although if so allowed I don't think there would be a 'protected job' list.

[RogerAwad]

I recently visited Hua Hin for 4 days.  I departed from Pattaya where I own a condo.  Upon return, I visited the Chonburi immigration office in Jomtien to file a report that I had left the province and have returned.  I thought I was supposed to file a TM28 form.  The immigration officer asked me if I lived in Pattaya.  I replied I do and mentioned I own and live in a condo nearby.  He told me I didn’t need to file any paperwork unless I leave the country.  I’m very confused.  

[moontang]

Making people do it after overnite trips is just about the biggest shoot yourselves in the feet moves of the year by the Bib.  Maybe even worse the the 2-5 no beer rule.  The latter not requiring a trip across town to a place you want to go less than the doctor or dentist...The only place coming close would be Customs...and that is a faster punishment.

[Jumbo1968]

12 minutes ago, moontang said:

Making people do it after overnite trips is just about the biggest shoot yourselves in the feet moves of the year by the Bib.  Maybe even worse the the 2-5 no beer rule.  The latter not requiring a trip across town to a place you want to go less than the doctor or dentist...The only place coming close would be Customs...and that is a faster punishment.

The 7/11 near me also near a school go through phases, currently selling beer during the restricted hours even though there is a notice on the Fridges about restricted hours.

On other occasions not No Alcohol Days the covers are down and they don’t sell alcohol ?

 

[DrTuner]

3 hours ago, lkv said:

When you take things straight to the point, it makes them uncomfortable, because the "culture" is "different".

 

https://coconuts.co/bangkok/news/5-common-miscommunications-between-foreigners-and-thais/

 

When they deflect and avoid questions, the "cultural difference" is their best excuse. "Foreigner just does not understand".

 

They are "sensitive", you see.

 

Their English did not do them any favours also.

That article paints Thais as overly sensitive snowflakes. Sounds like some non-Thai speaking social studies undergrad's short essay. Or a Thai excuse to be a lazy slob that has no skills whatsoever. Caning I say, to toughen the hides.

[kfchugo]

I am Australian and been visiting Thailand for over 20 years. With the enforcement of this ludicrous requirement, a criminal released from prison on parole in Australia has less reporting obligations than I now do as a tourist in Thailand. If this reporting regime is so important to their national security, why are neighbouring countries not doing the same?

My tourist dollars will in future be spent in countries where I am welcome and not treated like a criminal.

[Sujo]

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

 

 

 

This ^^^

 

I recently left Thailand after being based there for 18 years.  A primary reason for leaving was the high level of corruption.  In those 18 years I experienced:

 

- My successful little hotel in Phuket invaded by drug dealers who physically threw me out, supported by the local police.  Further physical threats caused me to leave Phuket, losing my $100k investment in that project.

- Briefly imprisoned in Pattaya on fake charges after an 'influential' foreigner persuaded the Pattaya police to charge me and blacklist me from leaving the country for 12 months.  It cost me about $25,000 to buy my way out of those charges.

- Defrauded of 2.6 million baht on a land purchase in my Thai GF's name in Phuket.  Every Thai lawyer who worked on this case was incompetent and she never got her land.

- Denied a WP on several occasions for my hotels because I refused to pay the 50,000 baht bribe to the Labour office.

-Despite working as a volunteer tourist police officer/Thai translator for many years in Phuket, Bangkok and Pattaya, I strangely found my Thai seniors unwilling to support me when requested. 

 

During my time living/working in both Myanmar and Laos (where I currently reside), I never (repeat NEVER!) experienced any levels of corruption similar to what I've experienced in Thailand.  I have never experienced physical threats against me in Myanmar and Laos, but these occurred on several occasions in Thailand.

 

I'm sure many forum members (including the many new members who seem to have recently joined up), will jump to the defence of squeaky-clean Thailand, and who have never experienced corruption such as I've experienced in Thailand.  Good on you, and all the best for your continued stay in Thailand.

 

Now I live in a communist country (Laos).  I'm not required to do any TM30, or 90 day report, and not required to pay any bribes.  I collect my business visa and work permit next week - no bribe requested or paid.  I collect my ham radio licence from the government next week also - no bribe requested or paid.

 

As a teacher and volunteer, I'm respected here in Luang Prabang (I was the international school Headmaster in 2013).  People offer genuine smiles and no one is trying to rip me off.  I won't be returning to Thailand ????

 

You have been thru a lot. Im happy things are more rosy for you.

 

About 7 years ago I was tempted to retire in thailand. Even before the new reporting i decided malaysia was a better option as I would continue part time work more easily.

 

So i got an employment pass for a couple of years, then a talentcorp visa for 5 yeats, now residency pass.

 

On all of those visas was never any reporting of any kind, no restrictions. 

 

Since my time in malaysia i would travel to thailand every couple of months every year. But not now. Baht too high and a feeling of just being tolerated. So for now im done.

 

Hope it changes as have many friends i would like to visit. But as it stands they now visit me or we go to another country for something new.

 

At least something good came out of it, now have seen a lot more of asia that i would not really have bothered with before.

[moontang]

14 minutes ago, kfchugo said:

I am Australian and been visiting Thailand for over 20 years. With the enforcement of this ludicrous requirement, a criminal released from prison on parole in Australia has less reporting obligations than I now do as a tourist in Thailand. If this reporting regime is so important to their national security, why are neighbouring countries not doing the same?

My tourist dollars will in future be spent in countries where I am welcome and not treated like a criminal.

kind of explains the large number of Australian criminals in LOS.

[lkv]

42 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

That article paints Thais as overly sensitive snowflakes. Sounds like some non-Thai speaking social studies undergrad's short essay. Or a Thai excuse to be a lazy slob that has no skills whatsoever. Caning I say, to toughen the hides.

"We talked to Kasetsart University Professor Rachawit Photiyarach, who explained the five most common miscommunications between foreigners and Thais."

 

So that's what the Thai Professor from Kasetsart thinks. 

 

Now, fair enough, one person's words are not gospel, but I can see some things that do make sense in the article. And it obviously applies to people less educated / less travelled. That make up a very large proportion of Thais.

 

So he is suggesting that's how the average Thai would think. Of course some Thais will be more "westernised" than others in their thinking. Or more "logical" shall I say, the way we would understand the definition of "logical".

[justin case]

suddenly every farang is a possible terrorist, criminal, etc...

 

specially the one's that obeyed the rules for the last 5,10,20 years

 

while thai jails are full of ... THAIS

 

and criminals don't follow rules

 

RULEZ ARE FOR FOOLZ

[dallen52]

20 hours ago, Jumbo1968 said:

In the U.K. they can track you via your mobile phone, it would be interesting to know if they can in Thailand if that’s the case why do a TM30, they know exactly where you are ?

Of course they can..

If you recently obtained a sim card, its id recorded on the system plus passport photograph, plus happy snap, just to get a 49 baht sim card.

 

I'm all in favour of the microchip implant and do away with all the cards, and licenses and passports. 

 

As long as they don't do the castration at the chip implant, too.

[jamesmith]

only yesterday I went to Chiangmai immigration office to ask about the TM30 report. I said I am living in Chiangmai , if I go to Chiangrai , when I come back , do I need to report to the immigration? The officer said yes if the hotel does not report for you.  That is a strange answer, if the hotel does not report and I don,t also , who knows where I have been. There will be no record to tell anybody I was not at home. So what is the TM30 report for ?????????????

 

[Jumbo1968]

6 minutes ago, jamesmith said:

only yesterday I went to Chiangmai immigration office to ask about the TM30 report. I said I am living in Chiangmai , if I go to Chiangrai , when I come back , do I need to report to the immigration? The officer said yes if the hotel does not report for you.  That is a strange answer, if the hotel does not report and I don,t also , who knows where I have been. There will be no record to tell anybody I was not at home. So what is the TM30 report for ?????????????

 

Providing you were living in a hotel they should do the TM30.

There could also be an issue if for some reason even for a minor offence you got arrested but hopefully that’s not going too happen.

[metisdead]

An offensive post and a reply has been removed. 

[bentarm44]

pay to play, pay to stay, pay every day. ain't never been a paradise; just pick your compromise. the place has always been an open prison for most nationals; now it's increasingly farangs turn. most male thai's simply hate most farang males for loads of reasons. I was an occupier for 11 years up to 2017. Is there any fate worse than death ? I aint found one yet.