How did shooter get weapons used in deadly Korat shooting?

[kensisaket]

I'm thinking a lot of people are lucky his weapon(s) of choice were guns. I'm sure there were things readily available that could have done a lot more damage; especially, in a mall full of people.

[KhaoNiaw]

23 minutes ago, Redline said:

If the timeline is correct, he killed a few when he picked up the hummer, and didn’t get to the mall until nearly 2 hours later.  It seems he should have been stopped on the base where soldiers were killed?  Or at least close.

Wasn't there a temple on the way where some police tried to stop him and were also killed, as well as some others, including a young lad on a motorcycle?

[Redline]

2 minutes ago, KhaoNiaw said:

Wasn't there a temple on the way where some police tried to stop him and were also killed, as well as some others, including a young lad on a motorcycle?

The guy was all over there he place before the mall in a very large military vehicle 

[saminoz]

With the number of weapons so freely available (and largely untraceabe) in Thailand, a better question might be: how come no-one else in the mall had a weapon and could shoot back?  Of course, the answer is that they can only use them when there is no chance of anyone  shooting back, or when they use the weapons on kids or family.

God help Thailand if they ever actually have to engage in a real shooting war.  They do not have sufficient self nor collective discipline to be anywhere near effective.

Follow the silly little general, you morons!!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

There are bound to be questions as to how even an experienced soldier could arm himself with so much weaponry. 

Uhhh.... he TOOK it from the Thai military... as many have done before...

 

Red Shirts, Southern militants, various others.... have all feasted on Thai military weapons in the past.

 

It's not like taken/stolen military weapons here are a NEW thing....  And if those groups can't manage to take/find some on their own, there's probably folks out there who are perfectly happy to sell them to the highest bidder.

 

[misterphil]

Wheres the M60?

 

Those 2 are a bolt action rifle and the other is a pump action shot gun.  

[SiSePuede419]

Shot his commander, an old lady, shot at a Wat, killed 10 people on the way to the mall.

 

But the only thing I have read is he "stole" the weapons needed to do all that.

 

What.  We have here.  Is an.

 

Inventory management problem. ????

Edited February 10, 2020 by SiSePuede419

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just a few... there are many more....

 

 

And:

 

 

Quote

 

The problem of the illicit sale of small arms in Thailand should not be taken lightly. Since the end of the Cold War, many Thais connected to high places have benefited handsomely from conflicts in neighbouring countries, be it Burma, Cambodia or Indonesia.
 

When the civil war in Cambodia ended, some of our country's finest became brokers overseeing the sale and transport of weapons from the killing fields to the notorious Golden Triangle. For some reason, the Thai merchants of death have always been happy to deal with rebels and insurgent groups of whatever hue. Is this because we Thais love freedom fighters so much? After all, "Thai" does mean "free".
 

As in the past, the named suspects in this case are low-ranking personnel. Again, typically for Thailand, and for as long as anybody can remember, the highest ranking officers to be arrested in connection with these incidents are always sergeants, never generals.

 

 

 

[johnarth]

I would not jump the gun here, first he knew where everything was, and he killed his would be friends to get what he wanted, well planned over a period of time

[ben2talk]

17 minutes ago, SiSePuede419 said:

Shot his commander, an old lady, shot at a Wat, killed 10 people on the way to the mall.

 

But the only thing I have read is he "stole" the weapons needed to do all that.

 

What. We have here. Is an.

 

Inventory management problem. ????

Lolz no, what they do is put a padlock on the shed, then they tie the big brass key around the neck of a conscript and tell him to sit outside on a plastic chair to guard the shed.

[tandor]

6 hours ago, petermik said:

Total ineptitude on the Army,s so called security sorry......

...agreed...and the Police and the Government, particularly hot on the heels of the last tragedy at the gold shop heist..wouldn't you think ALL public malls for starters would have doubled/trebled their security presences..Im quite sure the public would have appreciated it if the Army had have been deployed around the country, after all it is still a military regime here...these mass shootings are steadily on the increase and all the crazed offenders are choosing areas where the public are easy targets..all to make some point in their twisted minds..whatever happened to annual assessments and ratings of all military and police personnel..Im stunned and flabbergasted..and may i had qualified to say these things...RIP all those victims and may the injured recover quickly.

[ChaiyaTH]

Not that difficult to obtain weapons if one is a soldier in the first place, secondly willing to kill the people trying to avoid him doing so.
Kind of a pointless question if you ask me. When I was in the Dutch army, I could have done the same too.

Doesn't matter if security is tight, you are trusted and you can kill the person handing the weapons out / collecting them at the safe rooms.
He could also have gone to a shooting range and kill the ones stopping him. So actually something that can not be avoided if he/she really wants to do like this.

[JUAinBKK]

6 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

I'm not following the purpose of posing the question "How did".

Its been reported he went to the armory, shot the guys guarding the armory, he supposedly had worked at the armory and was familiar with the security, knew where the keys were, the code to the safe etc. At that point, he probably skipped the paperwork and signing etc.

 

Security only works to a point, ie: while the guys providing the security are still alive. 

 

Even security at a bank will fail if its the bank security guy doing the robbery

Which only proves... Laws and Rules do not apply to criminals.  If they are going to do it, they will figure it out before or during execution, depending on their level of knowledge. 

[Artisi]

6 hours ago, Assurancetourix said:

And? What excuse?
WE or not WE, security must always be the same: maximum ..
This was absolutely not the case;
Besides it is nowhere in Thailand, the country of very large anything.

And what do you think will happen /
questioning of procedures?
shutdown of the failing hierarchy?

As usual, a wai and everything will be forgiven ..

 

What I see, because I have not spent my life in front of the TV or facebook (which I do not have), is that it will give ideas to the next "sore in his head" who has seen what point it's easy to make a carnage ...

Whooooosh, that certainly went over the top 

 

[Cake Monster]

This Lunatic managed to get weapons from 3 seperate Armouries.

Being an Officer, he probably just walked in and " demanded " the Weapons from some poor young Grunts, who dare not refuse him for fear of being thrown in the pokey.

These are the kind of things that will happen in an " us and them " situation. And I just dont mean the Army situation.

 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

There are bound to be questions as to how even an experienced soldier could arm himself with so much weaponry. 

Correct.

So maybe we should wait what the investigators find in the next days.

 

What's the point of speculating here how it might have happened?

[Artisi]

5 hours ago, Oziex1 said:

I'm sure the asking of such embarrassing questions is to be labeled as causing confusion to Thai people of deemed to be troublemakers fake news.

Yep, Napolean will be along shortly to law down the law about causing disunity among  the Thai people 

[HHTel]

7 hours ago, MikeN said:

Reading between the lines of the story in the “unquotable paper”, he was able to steal the weapons because they were stored complete, and with ammunition, in an insecure facility.

 As I mentioned in another thread, standard practice during my military career was to store the bolt mechanisms in one strong room, the body of the weapon in another, and ammunition in a completely separate location. All were kept locked and required 2 sets of keys, which were kept in 2 separate safes. So virtually impossible for anybody to gain access to the weapons illegally.

 Obviously the RTA don’t have the same sense of security.

Makes perfect sense.  My sister belongs to a gun club in the UK.  The gun remains on the premises and she has to take the bolt home with her making the gun inoperable.

 

I must say though, that when I was involved in the Indonesian confrontation back in the 60's, there were no such checks.  Weapons and ammunition were there for the taking.

[Sergeant]

 I have come from a City in America whose violence  is not somethings Thai people know about. I was so happy about the land of Smiles which it is against the law to own a weapon?  Now I feel there are more weapons inside the Public than the Military and Police force. I am sadden the educations of Thailand to understand money in the world. The govt. not arrested both Takskins to justice, so just maybe its okay to commit a crime? If certain policy were if effect this crime might not been so bad?

Armory, Lock door Silly, Just one man guarding the weapons? Silly It should of had  at least one company of men guarding! No one gets inside

Military truck on civilian roads? Why? NO one should be allow to drive!

Someone must know where you are at all times! Maybe recall all weapons from every where Clubs, Army security and retirees!

Military should never be working in civilian  and military life together.

 

Lastly, Where was the police? Why not the police attack once call made? Army takes care on Post and Police on civilian grounds? Bad man not attack Army, but the public of the Thailand.  It would be wrong to report a crime at the Bank by going to the Army? 

 

I am very sadden for all the families who will lay their love one to rest.

Thank you

 

[Cake Monster]

19 minutes ago, Artisi said:

Learn what, Thailand the hub of all thing's already knows all there is to know about all thing's. 

Many Thais think they know more than " Google "

[hotchilli]

7 hours ago, Cake Monster said:

Long ago, I, like you was a member of a Shooting Club. And I proudly did own an Anschutz Super Match 54 Competition Rifle.

Also, the same as you, the Action, and the actual Rifle were never carried or stored together, and had seperate security cabinets, as did the Ammunition when kept at my home.

I was also a NSRA Club register Instructor, and I am absolutely astounded that this malicious individual was able to get his hands on all these Guns and Ammunition from an Army Camp Armoury.

Procedures should have been in place that only allows Firearms out of the Armoury for Shooting practice and Manouvers. And then only under the strictest supervision with all Guns Etc and Ammunition accounted for after the Exercise is completed.

The Weapons and Ammunition should then be returned to the Armoury for safe storage / repair.

Should be, should be, should be, should be you can "should be" till the cows come home.

In Thailand reality is "should be" and "what is" are two entirely different things!
 

[jspill]

There have been famous cases of US and UK soldiers stealing tanks from their bases, the Brit even went back to steal a second one after crashing

[jesimps]

8 hours ago, MikeN said:

Reading between the lines of the story in the “unquotable paper”, he was able to steal the weapons because they were stored complete, and with ammunition, in an insecure facility.

 As I mentioned in another thread, standard practice during my military career was to store the bolt mechanisms in one strong room, the body of the weapon in another, and ammunition in a completely separate location. All were kept locked and required 2 sets of keys, which were kept in 2 separate safes. So virtually impossible for anybody to gain access to the weapons illegally.

 Obviously the RTA don’t have the same sense of security.

When I was in the army many years ago, our armoury was behind a steel door, with a barred window through which the guns were issued. The guns were stored in racks with a chain (locked to the end of the rack) running through each trigger-guard. You had to have an incredibly good reason to sign out your weapon outside of normal parades, troop range classifications etc. If going to take part in shooting competitions, it had to appear on company orders so that the armourers knew it was ok to issue you the weapon. Amunition was kept in a sepaerate dump and had to be drawn by an officer or senior NCO. 

[Artisi]

Rather than dwell on and beat to death why/how, the question should be - how to ensure it can not happen again? 

Edited February 10, 2020 by Artisi

[NanLaew]

9 hours ago, MikeN said:

Reading between the lines of the story in the “unquotable paper”, he was able to steal the weapons because they were stored complete, and with ammunition, in an insecure facility.

 As I mentioned in another thread, standard practice during my military career was to store the bolt mechanisms in one strong room, the body of the weapon in another, and ammunition in a completely separate location. All were kept locked and required 2 sets of keys, which were kept in 2 separate safes. So virtually impossible for anybody to gain access to the weapons illegally.

 Obviously the RTA don’t have the same sense of security.

No need to read anything 'between the lines' that isn't there. The answer to your question is already in the Naew Na's own headlining article.

 

9 hours ago, webfact said:

Naew Na mentioned that the soldier - who was shot dead on Sunday morning after killing dozens of innocent people - managed to get the weapons from three separate armories.

He hit three different armories, one for the guns, the second for the 'bolt mechanisms' and the third for the ammunition. He was a career soldier and he knew where these three separate items were to be found. He appeared to be a specialist sharpshooter so may even have been of sufficient rank or assignment to have access to any keys or safes.

 

They may be guilty of poor security, but don't let it change the narrative about the RTA guns are 'stored complete'.

[JMSIII]

I was a Sgt with the Fed Gov't security forces at a major government installation for many years, with the responsibility of running the armory.  

 

My responsibilities besides my regular shift, was all of the weapons and ammunition issued on my shift, all of the weapons and ammunition turned in by the off going shift, every single weapon and every single round for all of the weapons (.40, 5.56 and 12 gauge) in the armory itself, plus every vehicle issued for the shift and in the parking lot.  

 

My name was on the paperwork for each shift I worked.  I made damn sure every weapon and every single round, was accounted for.  

 

Very few of us had access to the armory, no one other than us who where officially approved, could be in the weapon and ammunition storage side of the armory.

 

I'm going to state the obvious here....some how, some way, the shooter had access to the armory and it should be an easy thing to prove.  Do they have CCTV cameras inside and outside of the armory?  Who was the last armory official that had control of the armory?  When was his last shift that he worked?  Does the paperwork show everything being turned back in?  Or....was he on duty when he went crazy?  That would maybe explain why he had what he had....  

 

I was always very careful when I was in charge of the armory, because I knew that I could be held liable both criminally and civilly if something like this happened under my watch. 

 

Our weapons were stored complete, but unloaded.  We do not store different parts of weapons in different locations, that's not a smart thing to do in case of an emergency.  The ammunition stored in the armory was the exact amount for duty issue for each weapon.  We just kept a very tight control over them.  The armory had alarms on the doors, CCTV cameras on the inside and the outside.  The bulk ammo was kept in a highly guarded area of military ammo magazines/bunkers.

 

But then again, I know where we are here in LOS...

 

 

Edited February 10, 2020 by JMSIII
add

[observer90210]

Now it's time for the army, the authorities, the government to shell out substantial amount of money to each of the survivors. And a decent anount, not the disgraceful compensation of THB 50'000,- or similar.

Edited February 10, 2020 by observer90210

[RickBradford]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

He appeared to be a specialist sharpshooter so may even have been of sufficient rank or assignment to have access to any keys or safes.

 

They may be guilty of poor security, but don't let it change the narrative about the RTA guns are 'stored complete'.

At the very least, the Thai people deserve to know how one individual -- however well credentialed -- could get access to the means to make complete weapons plus ammo, and drive out of the base in a stolen vehicle apparently unimpeded.

 

And they deserve to know what measures will be put in place to make it harder for such an incident to happen again.

 

In other words, transparency and accountability.

 

Will they get it? Probably not, but secrecy will only further damage a military government which is already far from popular.

[tomauasia]

Two words. Thai military 

[metisdead]

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