Is solar cells a good idea?

[AlfHuy]

38 minutes ago, bluesofa said:

Am I subsidising your electric bill?
 

Our average bill is 1,500 Baht around 400Kw. Mind you, we use A/C sometimes (and only at night set at 30C), hot water jug for tea on 24 hours a day. Washing machine used everyday, etc.

aircon at 30° ??

Are you heating of cooling down your place.

Mine fires at 18, max 20° at night.

[eisfeld]

28 minutes ago, colinneil said:

Only thing is you are very wasteful with your electric.

How many people in your home?

How BIG is your home?

Hint: sum over 10 months, not average

[bluesofa]

2 minutes ago, AlfHuy said:

aircon at 30° ??

Are you heating of cooling down your place.

Mine fires at 18, max 20° at night.

Sure 30C.

Why live in Thailand if you don't like the heat. Perhaps you should move to Iceland.

 

We only have it on usually if my wife's three year-old niece stays with us - don't ask me though why a Thai needs AC at that age.

I'm quite happy with the fan.

When I go to visit my American friend locally I have to remember to take a coat. He has his AC at 22C. It's like a fridge to me.

[rwill]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2020/04/21/new-michael-moore-backed-documentary-on-youtube-reveals-massive-ecological-impacts-of-renewables/#2dfa3dfc6c96

[KhunKenAP]

It lowers you electric bill. Have had 15 panels for the past 2 years. Before they changed the meter, I could make it roll backwards on a sunny day without my air con on.

[AgMech Cowboy]

On 9/22/2020 at 7:55 PM, Misab said:

It will certainly help the climate.

Will it? 

There is the climate to consider as they mine and process the rare earth minerals to make the batteries, the effect to the climate as they manufacture the batteries, the effect to the climate when your batteries are worn out and you replace them, the effect to the climate when they're sent to be recycled and who even knows what the effect to the climate will be to recycle or dispose....

 

All I see is a new revenue stream, which big companies like virgin, amazon, tesla, microsoft, google and Al Gore will profit from. 

[BritManToo]

Just now, AgMech Cowboy said:

Will it? 

There is the climate to consider as they mine and process the rare earth minerals to make the batteries, the effect to the climate as they manufacture the batteries, the effect to the climate when your batteries are worn out and you replace them, the effect to the climate when they're sent to be recycled and who even knows what the effect to the climate will be to recycle or dispose....

 

All I see is a new revenue stream, which big companies like virgin, amazon, tesla, microsoft, google and Al Gore will profit from. 

Would point out most of us don't use batteries.

We're grid tied.

 

[AlfHuy]

I would go for batteries as well.

[AlfHuy]

[eisfeld]

21 minutes ago, AgMech Cowboy said:

Will it? 

There is the climate to consider as they mine and process the rare earth minerals to make the batteries, the effect to the climate as they manufacture the batteries, the effect to the climate when your batteries are worn out and you replace them, the effect to the climate when they're sent to be recycled and who even knows what the effect to the climate will be to recycle or dispose....

 

All I see is a new revenue stream, which big companies like virgin, amazon, tesla, microsoft, google and Al Gore will profit from. 

At least there are not many chem trails in Thailand! Also tinfoil hats help reflecting the heat from the sun.

 

Anyways, back to burning some fossile fuels, that surely can't affect the climate as much and won't enrich big companies. Hope they get that new coal power plant that they spoke about up soon. Where did I leave the keys to my diesel pickup hmm...

Edited September 25, 2020 by eisfeld

[Dazinoz]

1 hour ago, AlfHuy said:

I would go for batteries as well.

IMHO power per unit is relatively cheap here and solar panels can help reduce costs at a relatively cheap outlay. Solar batteries are expensive and need to be replaced more times than the panels.

[Peterphuket]

2 hours ago, AlfHuy said:

546, that is mega cheap.

I am on around 1700 a month in a small condo.

Aircon in bedroom on all night.

He don't tell you, but he was on holiday during that month.

[Peterphuket]

But, I consider for long time solar, especially when I look to my bills the recent months, it go's up from 557 units in October last year until now 616.

I wonder, January last, I mount the 20kVA avr, do it use so much by it self?

[Peterphuket]

To answer my own question, I think Indeed the AVR use a lot of KWH:

Jan. 504 units

Feb. 579

Mar. 624

Apr. 697  of course the hottest month of the year

May 740

Jun. 668

Jul. 660

Aug. 623

Is everybody aware who has such a device at home?

[Crossy]

40 minutes ago, Peterphuket said:

Is everybody aware who has such a device at home?

 

Ours certainly has a power consumption, I did measure it at idle and it was in the order of 10W, certainly not zero. It also gets fairly warm when working hard and someone has to pay for that energy.

 

I do have meters both ends, but they are cheapo and the inaccuracies swamp any actual power losses ???? 

 

How does August 2020 compare with August 2019? (like for like).

 

[BritManToo]

13 minutes ago, Crossy said:

How does August 2020 compare with August 2019? (like for like).

Consumption ........

August 2019 2x 330w panels = 56 units. + 240 from the grid

August 2020 2x 330w panels = 43 units. +360 from the grid

Edited September 25, 2020 by BritManToo

[LukKrueng]

4 hours ago, colinneil said:

Only thing is you are very wasteful with your electric.

How many people in your home?

How BIG is your home?

Mostly 2, sometimes 3.

150 sqm

[Crossy]

1 hour ago, LukKrueng said:

Mostly 2, sometimes 3.

150 sqm

 

Something is very wrong if you are getting bills that size with a small home and no A/C. We got to that level once earlier this year when I was working from home and using the 24,000 BTU A/C in the lounge (office) all day.

 

How many units are you using? Are you paying a landlord or direct to MEA/PEA?

 

EDIT You do mean 6000 Baht a month don't you? Or was that a total of 1818 units over 10 months?

[Peterphuket]

2 hours ago, Crossy said:

 

Ours certainly has a power consumption, I did measure it at idle and it was in the order of 10W, certainly not zero. It also gets fairly warm when working hard and someone has to pay for that energy.

 

I do have meters both ends, but they are cheapo and the inaccuracies swamp any actual power losses ???? 

 

How does August 2020 compare with August 2019? (like for like).

 

 Aug 2019 was 599 not so big difference, with now I see.

[eisfeld]

40 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

Something is very wrong if you are getting bills that size with a small home and no A/C. We got to that level once earlier this year when I was working from home and using the 24,000 BTU A/C in the lounge (office) all day.

 

How many units are you using? Are you paying a landlord or direct to MEA/PEA?

 

EDIT You do mean 6000 Baht a month don't you? Or was that a total of 1818 units over 10 months?

I am pretty sure that he gave the sum over 10 months, not average per month. So a bit over 600thb per month which makes total sense if he has no aircons.

[Crossy]

3 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

I am pretty sure that he gave the sum over 10 months, not average per month. So a bit over 600thb per month which makes total sense if he has no aircons.

 

I agree after re-reading the original post, but no attempt to clarify after a number of responses implying a 6k per month bill.

[LukKrueng]

58 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

Something is very wrong if you are getting bills that size with a small home and no A/C. We got to that level once earlier this year when I was working from home and using the 24,000 BTU A/C in the lounge (office) all day.

 

How many units are you using? Are you paying a landlord or direct to MEA/PEA?

 

EDIT You do mean 6000 Baht a month don't you? Or was that a total of 1818 units over 10 months?

Total over 10 months

[itsallmine68]

Misab and others

Pls watch the fiollow video and in the end I say that Solar and wind power in the long run hurt our enviroment MORE.

 

https://youtu.be/RqppRC37OgI

[AlfHuy]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Consumption ........

August 2019 2x 330w panels = 56 units. + 240 from the grid

August 2020 2x 330w panels = 43 units. +360 from the grid

If you would cut a bit your jungle, the sun could actually see the panels 555

[AlfHuy]

Wondering is this is enough to power my 2 bed/2 bath bungalow.

[Muhendis]

7 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

AFAIK batteries don't last much longer than 5 years, and i don't know how long the panels are good for in best conditions. 

Battery life is dependent on many variables. Ambient temperature is the big killer for lead acid. For every 10 degree C higher than 25, battery life will be halved. Depth of discharge is the other contributor to early demise. 30% DoD (depth of discharge) at 25 deg C will generally give around 5 years useful life for example. Lithium will give a similar life span but at a DoD of 80%. If you are super rich, you could go for flow batteries which will generally be good for 20 years and then only need relatively minor repairs for another 20 years.

Solar panels are, like batteries, dependent on ambient temperature for their longevity. I haven't checked the figures for the latest designs but about a year ago the life expectancy of a panel would be reduced by 1%/year at 25 deg C ambient. So after 20 years you would only expect to get 80% of the output when new.

Don't expect too much from your panels. Maximum power can only be achieved when the rays of the sun are perpendicular to the panel. This is where MPPT (Maximum Peak Power Transfer) charge controllers become the must have item.

[LukKrueng]

1 hour ago, Muhendis said:

Battery life is dependent on many variables. Ambient temperature is the big killer for lead acid. For every 10 degree C higher than 25, battery life will be halved. Depth of discharge is the other contributor to early demise. 30% DoD (depth of discharge) at 25 deg C will generally give around 5 years useful life for example. Lithium will give a similar life span but at a DoD of 80%. If you are super rich, you could go for flow batteries which will generally be good for 20 years and then only need relatively minor repairs for another 20 years.

Solar panels are, like batteries, dependent on ambient temperature for their longevity. I haven't checked the figures for the latest designs but about a year ago the life expectancy of a panel would be reduced by 1%/year at 25 deg C ambient. So after 20 years you would only expect to get 80% of the output when new.

Don't expect too much from your panels. Maximum power can only be achieved when the rays of the sun are perpendicular to the panel. This is where MPPT (Maximum Peak Power Transfer) charge controllers become the must have item.

So basically you agree with what I said, right? 

[Muhendis]

49 minutes ago, LukKrueng said:

So basically you agree with what I said, right? 

Absolutely and with some technical reasons and limitations thrown in for good measure.

[Misab]

On 9/25/2020 at 9:48 AM, LukKrueng said:

My bills in the last 10 months amounted to 1818 units / 6235 baht (un explanable pick during June- July).

I don't have air cons. Most of the usage is for lights and ceiling fans. I guess the hungriest appliance is the oven, but it's not like I bake everyday for hours...

A medium size fridge, 6000w water heater, notebook, table top with TV a screen, water pump. That's more or less the list of regularly electric equipment used. There is the odd usage of power tools. 

So for me most of the usage is during the evenings, must have batteries as well which of course makes the system more expensive. AFAIK batteries don't last much longer than 5 years, and i don't know how long the panels are good for in best conditions. 

I think that by the time I break even I'll probably have to spend again on renewing parts of the system. 

Another con is putting a large sum of money upfront vs paying the monthly bill...

The panels last between 25 to 30 years, but they do need regular cleaning  

[Misab]

18 hours ago, itsallmine68 said:

Misab and others

Pls watch the fiollow video and in the end I say that Solar and wind power in the long run hurt our enviroment MORE.

 

https://youtu.be/RqppRC37OgI

Do you know who produce the video?  It's produced by PragerU an organization that creates videos on various political, economic and philosophical topics from a conservative or right-wing perspective. PragerU is not an academic institution. It is strictly a conservative Youtube video channel and news website. I wouldn't be surprised if they have the oil companies as their customers.