Limited possibility of Covid-19 patients' lungs regaining full capacity

[robblok]

35 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

The WHO estimates 10% of the world's population has been infected with Sars Cov 2 which gives the IFR of 0.14% which is equal to the flu.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-06/1-in-10-worldwide-may-have-caught-covid-19,-says-who/12733992

Yet in the US 34,200 people died from the flu and now over 200k die from it. Not sure why people compare the two while its clear its far more deadly then the flu. Either its more contagious or the mortality rate is higher.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2018-2019.html#:~:text=vaccination uptake11.-,Conclusion,the 2018–2019 influenza season.

 

Anyway same goes for UK 9000 deaths from the flue 42k plus deaths from covid. 

 

The deniers are just crazy. 

[FarFlungFalang]

30 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

It's an estimate and the virus isn't done with us yet.  You should treat these numbers as such.  Without proper testing, the real numbers will never be known.  And as we know, many countries are seriously under counting the rates.  They just don't have the resources to test.  India is estimated to have numbers 10x what's being reported.

 

Not sure why you want to downplay this pandemic.  One of the biggest problems we have today, not taking this seriously.  Some 300k new cases daily, with 5-10k daily deaths globally, plus plus.  It's serious.

If the numbers will never be known why are you saying that Covid numbers are higher than the flu?You say my numbers are estimates then you use estimates of India's numbers being 10x the numbers being reported.I'm not downplaying the pandemic I'm just quoting the numbers from the WHO.The daily numbers have been below 5000 daily deaths for some time now so why are you trying to exaggerate this pandemic?I agree that it's serious and so is the flu a serious disease.As I've posted above many more children die from the flu than Sars Cov 2.If you don't think this pandemic is being taken seriously I think you should have a look around and you will see this pandemic is indeed being taken seriously. 

[FarFlungFalang]

46 minutes ago, robblok said:

Yet in the US 34,200 people died from the flu and now over 200k die from it. Not sure why people compare the two while its clear its far more deadly then the flu. Either its more contagious or the mortality rate is higher.

If you want to pick out a single year to show which is more deadly then I choose 1918 when 30-50 million died of the flu,so which is more deadly the flu or covid?Maybe we should use total numbers,what is the total number of flu deaths and what is the total number of covid deaths now which is more deadly?Also what do you class as a denier?Is it someone who quotes numbers from the World Health Organisation or one who denies that covid exists?I'm not afraid of covid because many more children die from the flu than covid but if you think that old people are more important to try and save than children then that's your choice,me I'd try and save the children first.

You say you don't understand why people compare covid with the flu then you go and do precisely that.

Edited October 12, 2020 by FarFlungFalang

[robblok]

10 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

If you want to pick out a single year to show which is more deadly then I choose 1918 when 30-50 million died of the flu,so which is more deadly the flu or covid?Maybe we should use total numbers,what is the total number of flu deaths and what is the total number of covid deaths now which is more deadly?Also what do you class as a denier?Is it someone who quotes numbers from the World Health Organisation or one who denies that covid exists?I'm not afraid of covid because many more children die from the flu than covid but if you think that old people are more important to try and save than children then that's your choice,me I'd try and save the children first.

You say you don't understand why people compare covid with the flu the you go and do precisely that.

Im doing it because many deniers do it. The numbers dont lie. in the USA its like 7 times more deadly then the flu. in The UK around 5 times. So I am not sure why they are downplaying it so much. It certainly is far more serious then a normal flu. 

[Jeffr2]

34 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

If the numbers will never be known why are you saying that Covid numbers are higher than the flu?You say my numbers are estimates then you use estimates of India's numbers being 10x the numbers being reported.I'm not downplaying the pandemic I'm just quoting the numbers from the WHO.The daily numbers have been below 5000 daily deaths for some time now so why are you trying to exaggerate this pandemic?I agree that it's serious and so is the flu a serious disease.As I've posted above many more children die from the flu than Sars Cov 2.If you don't think this pandemic is being taken seriously I think you should have a look around and you will see this pandemic is indeed being taken seriously. 

Come on.  The CV19 numbers are under reported. Every expert has said this.  CV19 is now the #3 cause of death in the US.  And trying to compare it to the annual flu, or motorcycle deaths is like comparing apples to oranges.  Just can't be done.  Though many deniers try.

 

WHO reports numbers with the caveat they are low, and won't be fully known for years.  If ever.

 

5k daily deaths isn't serious?  Really?  Come on.

[FarFlungFalang]

3 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

Come on.  The CV19 numbers are under reported. Every expert has said this.  CV19 is now the #3 cause of death in the US.  And trying to compare it to the annual flu, or motorcycle deaths is like comparing apples to oranges.  Just can't be done.  Though many deniers try.

 

WHO reports numbers with the caveat they are low, and won't be fully known for years.  If ever.

 

5k daily deaths isn't serious?  Really?  Come on.

Just wondering what you class as a denier?It's a serious question as I would like to know if I fall into your category of a denier.To me a denier would be someone who denies the existence of C19.What I'm comparing is the IFR of the flu and C19 which according to WHO estimates is similar.You are of course right that the numbers are estimates but at this stage and probably forever they are all we have to base our arguments on other than calling people names of course which to me indicates the name caller is worried their arguments are failing.Is C19 serious?Bloody oath it's serious.Is the annual flu serious?Bloody oath it's serious.Is the annual flu more deadly?It's on record of having killed way more people than C19,it's also got more of a head start on C19 it's been killing people a lot longer.You seem to have it in your head that because I call you out on your claim of 5000-10000 daily deaths that I'm not taking it serious so I'l repeat "C19 is serious".Apples and oranges have things in common, they're both fruit and are good for you, as well as differences.

[Jeffr2]

4 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Just wondering what you class as a denier?It's a serious question as I would like to know if I fall into your category of a denier.To me a denier would be someone who denies the existence of C19.What I'm comparing is the IFR of the flu and C19 which according to WHO estimates is similar.You are of course right that the numbers are estimates but at this stage and probably forever they are all we have to base our arguments on other than calling people names of course which to me indicates the name caller is worried their arguments are failing.Is C19 serious?Bloody oath it's serious.Is the annual flu serious?Bloody oath it's serious.Is the annual flu more deadly?It's on record of having killed way more people than C19,it's also got more of a head start on C19 it's been killing people a lot longer.You seem to have it in your head that because I call you out on your claim of 5000-10000 daily deaths that I'm not taking it serious so I'l repeat "C19 is serious".Apples and oranges have things in common, they're both fruit and are good for you, as well as differences.

You can't compare CV19 with the flu.  Doesn't make sense and that's what deniers try to do.  Apples and oranges.  Sad some don't understand this.

 

https://www.contagionlive.com/view/why-comparing-flu-covid-19-severity-not-equivalent

 

They said that public officials continually draw comparisons between the 2 infections, “often in an attempt to minimize the effects of the unfolding pandemic.”

[RocketDog]

15 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

Yet meanwhile around 9,000 people have died IN BANGKOK ALONE this year due to air pollution, and no-one cares or does anything about it. Something very strange is going on here regarding relativity ????

Relatively speaking, it could be one of those 'mini-black holes' the physicists talk about. 

Presumably walking into one of them would suck brains out. 

That would explain a lot of the bizzare behavior we've been seeing lately. ????

[mommysboy]

This is one person who suffered the more severe form of the disease known as 'long covid'. Most sufferers make a complete recovery as they would with any other respiratory infection.

[DrTuner]

And what percentage does each claim mean? I'm still to see the time vs recovery to base health graph. Just gloomy comments without data.

[Jeffr2]

1 hour ago, mommysboy said:

This is one person who suffered the more severe form of the disease known as 'long covid'. Most sufferers make a complete recovery as they would with any other respiratory infection.

Actually, that's not true.  Many, many are suffering from severe consequences of the virus months later.  And since we've only know about CV19 for a few months, the long term effects are unknown.

 

There may be no complete recovery.  We just don't know.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/28/us/coronavirus-long-term-effects.html?campaign_id=2&emc=edit_th_20200929&instance_id=22606&nl=todaysheadlines&regi_id=80027960&segment_id=39282&user_id=1298cdda864738dcf5f5cb52747197da

 

By some estimates, as many as one in three Covid-19 patients will develop symptoms that linger. The symptoms can span a wide range — piercing chest pain, deep exhaustion, a racing heart. Those affected include young and otherwise healthy people. One theory is that an overzealous immune system plays a role.

[FarFlungFalang]

6 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

You can't compare CV19 with the flu.  Doesn't make sense and that's what deniers try to do.  Apples and oranges.  Sad some don't understand this.

 

https://www.contagionlive.com/view/why-comparing-flu-covid-19-severity-not-equivalent

 

They said that public officials continually draw comparisons between the 2 infections, “often in an attempt to minimize the effects of the unfolding pandemic.”

9 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

Mortality rate for the seasonal fly is .1 to .2%.  CV19 is higher, but still being studied and the actual number isn't known yet, if it ever will be due to lack of testing. 

So by your own definition you yourself are a denier.

[Jeffr2]

3 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

So by your own definition you yourself are a denier.

What? Ummm...that's what some here are calling you.  Man up!  Admit it.

[FarFlungFalang]

2 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

What? Ummm...that's what some here are calling you.  Man up!  Admit it.

Can you quote anyone that has called me a denier?You've defined a denier as someone that compares the flu with C19 and I've defined a denier as someone that denies the existence of C19,so by your definition we are both deniers as we both have compared C19 with the flu as you can see in the previous post of mine.By my definition I'm a comparer not a denier.I do deny that C19 is more deadly than the flu,there I go again comparing C19 with the flu. 

[Jeffr2]

4 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Can you quote anyone that has called me a denier?You've defined a denier as someone that compares the flu with C19 and I've defined a denier as someone that denies the existence of C19,so by your definition we are both deniers as we both have compared C19 with the flu as you can see in the previous post of mine.By my definition I'm a comparer not a denier.I do deny that C19 is more deadly than the flu,there I go again comparing C19 with the flu. 

Show me a post where I've denied CV19.  I've got several friends who've become infected and are still suffering months later, I'll wait for your reply. 

 

But yes, you do deny the severity of the virus by trying to compare it to the flu.  But that's already been pointed out.  Again, trying to deny.

[FarFlungFalang]

11 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

Mortality rate for the seasonal fly is .1 to .2%.  CV19 is higher, but still being studied and the actual number isn't known yet, if it ever will be due to lack of testing. 

Here you are comparing the flu with C19 then later you say this.

 

8 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

You can't compare CV19 with the flu.  Doesn't make sense and that's what deniers try to do.

Having compared C19 with the flu and then saying that's what deniers do makes you a denier.This is the second time I've pointed this out so hopefully you can see how you've called yourself a denier because I haven't called you a denier I've only stated that you've labelled yourself a denier.

Edited October 12, 2020 by FarFlungFalang

[Jeffr2]

13 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Here you are comparing the flu with C19 then later you say this.

 

Having compared C19 with the flu and then saying that's what deniers do makes you a denier.This is the second time I've pointed this out so hopefully you can see how you've called yourself a denier because I haven't called you a denier I've only stated that you've labelled yourself a denier.

Stop trolling.

[DrTuner]

On 10/11/2020 at 9:12 PM, PremiumLane said:

But, what about those people who have lung damage prior, other health problems, or for some reason can't get their lung capacity back? 

Yes, what about them. Is it 50%, 10%, 1% or 0.00000001% of those that were infected? We live in a world that is constantly trying to kill us and has a 100% success rate. The way to delay that fate a bit is to count the probabilities of things and take your chances based on that.

 

So let's say there's a 50% probability of catching covid, 10% probability of hospitalization, 10% of that requiring ICU, 5% of that having long term effect. 0.5 x 0.1 x 0.1 x 0.05 = 0.025% chance of long term complications and that's when you are in a risk group. Compared to, say, Thai traffic, I'll take those chances any time without going insane from fear.

[rickudon]

On 10/11/2020 at 7:56 PM, DavisH said:

How many have died from the flu THIS YEAR? Once cannot compare deaths from covid this year to flu deaths in previous years - because of the increase in mask wearing, social disntancing etc. To date, I've had very few students absent in my school this year. Absenteeism to do 'sickness' is only 1-2%. This is much lower than last year. Reports from Australia also flu infectiion and death rates are muck lower than previous years and indeel much lower than that due to covid. 

In the UK, i believe it is in the hundreds this year. Obviously the 10,000 figure is the typical annual death rate for flu, not the 2020 one. How many die each year from flu varies a lot and different sources give quite a range of fatalities - because cause of death not an exact science.

[Lacessit]

Smokers can have their lung capacity reduced by 50-60%, in extreme cases by 80%. So when coronavirus comes along, they are way behind the eight ball. Same with obese people, poorer immune systems.

The lesson for everyone is quite clear. Don't smoke, eat healthy, exercise. Especially older people.

It might not stop one from getting the virus, but statistically their chances of recovery are way better.

[Jeffr2]

On 10/13/2020 at 7:50 PM, Lacessit said:

Smokers can have their lung capacity reduced by 50-60%, in extreme cases by 80%. So when coronavirus comes along, they are way behind the eight ball. Same with obese people, poorer immune systems.

The lesson for everyone is quite clear. Don't smoke, eat healthy, exercise. Especially older people.

It might not stop one from getting the virus, but statistically their chances of recovery are way better.

Staying healthy is always a good idea.  But not possible with everybody (hereditary issues, etc).  The latest is brain fog.  We still don't fully understand this virus.

 

https://www.uclahealth.org/brain-fog-following-covid-19-recovery-may-indicate-ptsd

 

A new report suggests that lingering "brain fog" and other neurological symptoms after COVID -19 recovery may be due to post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), an effect observed in past human coronavirus outbreaks such as SARS and MERS.

 

People who have recovered from COVID-19 sometimes experience lingering difficulties in concentration, as well as headaches, anxiety, fatigue or sleep disruptions. Patients may fear that the infection has permanently damaged their brains, but researchers say that’s not necessarily the case.