After the White House, Trump faces uncertain future and legal threats

[ChouDoufu]

6 hours ago, cmarshall said:

 

It can hardly be doubted that Trump and McConnell have changed the direction of the Court through their hammering Gorsuch and Barrett onto the Court by violating the norms of the Senate.  That fact is not contradicted by the fact that accepting the Texas AG's petition to overturn the votes in four other states was just a bridge too far.

 

Your thinking is too simplistic if you believe that there is no element of degree in the actions of political figures like Supreme Court justices, none of whom, despite their extreme conservatism, are out and out fascists of the Mike Flynn ilk.  Had a case with as much wiggle room as Bush v. Gore come to the current SC I am confident that they would indeed have executed another judicial coup as in 2000.  The problem was that the election wasn't close.

 

But in the case at hand, the term you need to learn is "prosecutorial discretion."  There is no crime of "failure to indict" in the US Code.  There is often a greater or lesser degree of politics, which is why, by the way, the Attorney General is always a politician and never a prosecutor promoted directly from a US Attorney job.  That explains why Preet Bharara never made the short list for the AG job, but Andrew Cuomo apparently has.

 

this seems to be laying the groundwork for claiming any future investigation is a witch-hunt because the doj has been "rigged" by biden.  same-same as trump complaining about voter fraud due to mail-in ballots before his landslide loss to biden, setting the stage for his supporters to deny reality.

 

if he isn't investigated and/or prosecuted, it's because he's innocent of any wrongdoing.  but if he is investigated/prosecuted, then it's rigged. 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 16, 2020 by ChouDoufu

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, Thingamabob said:

Back to the swamp.

Well, if so, at least it's up from the cesspool that is the Trump administration.

[billd766]

4 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Fair enough. In any case he's technically not allowed to live there as his primary residence and that is legally binding. Something has got to give on that or he won't be able to live there.

He could always put up some tents on the golf course for himself and his secret service guards. Alternatively he could also live with his children, but I am not sure if they would like that.

[Skeptic7]

9 hours ago, Srikcir said:

Prosecution for state criminal offensives other than Florida (ie., NY) may face a difficult path to extradite Trump from Florida. 

Where he has been since 2019 a permanent resident with Trump-loyal Republican governor, Secretary of State and Senator. 

There are only four grounds upon which the governor of the asylum state may deny another state’s request for extradition:

 

1. the extradition documents are not in order;
2. the person has not been charged with a crime in the demanding state;
3.the person is not the person named in the extradition documents; or
4. the person is not a fugitive. (this is the only one which seems vague and possibly prove tricky) 

There appears to be another additional exception: if the fugitive is under sentence in the asylum state, he need not be extradited until his punishment in the asylum state is completed.

[Albert Zweistein]

14 hours ago, harada said:

Back to TV ?, ladies and gentlemen it’s “DONALD TRUMP LIVE FROM RIKERS ISLAND” 

 

Sorry, Alcatraz.

[Albert Zweistein]

12 hours ago, cmarshall said:

 

My prediction is that Trump will indeed resign as president in order to get a bona-fide presidential pardon from Pence.  Alternatively, he could invoke the 25th Amendment for a few hours to get the pardon from Acting President Pence.  Trump has a history of quitting when it was to his advantage, such as when he agreed to a settlement of claims against his Trump University scam after insisting he would never settle.  

 

I also expect Trump to flee the country to escape prosecution in NY State.

Putin is waiting for him.

[polpott]

5 hours ago, Albert Zweistein said:

Sorry, Alcatraz.

Sing Sing is favourite. Most likely to be tried in NY.

[GrandPapillon]

20 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Says a lot about your own values if you think Trump was the best. Troll post?

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

[Eric Loh]

3 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

Majority of voters say you are dead wrong. 

[Sujo]

7 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

You dont see anything wrong with trump except he is abusive, vulgar and a pig?

 

Not very presidential traits. 

 

Add to that a gold medal liar, purveyor of porn stars, a bit of unsolicited grabbing, walking into dressing rooms of under age girls unnanounced.

 

Oh the list goes on, but you think its nothing.

[placeholder]

5 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

I think that the best part of your post was all the stuff that you left out. Like that no president before has ever lied and told falsehoods as Trump did. The problem is that people like you see being abrasive and vulgar as somehow signifying honesty. It's possible to be consistently abrasive, vulgar and dishonest. What exactly did Trump do to disrupt the status quo in Washington. He loosened restriction on Wall Street and the banks, and allowed polluters to run the Environmental Protection Agency.  What right thing did he try to do?

While you think you might be subscribing to some ideal of truth, it's really truthiness: 

"Truthiness is the belief or assertion that a particular statement is true based on the intuition or perceptions of some individual or individuals, without regard to evidence, logic, intellectual examination, or facts.[1][2] Truthiness can range from ignorant assertions of falsehoods to deliberate duplicity or propaganda intended to sway opinions.[3][4]

The concept of truthiness has emerged as a major subject of discussion surrounding U.S. politics during the 1990s and 2000s because of the perception among some observers of a rise in propaganda and a growing hostility toward factual reporting and fact-based discussion.[3]"

Truthiness - Wikipedia

[GrandPapillon]

3 minutes ago, Sujo said:

You dont see anything wrong with trump except he is abusive, vulgar and a pig?

 

Not very presidential traits. 

 

Add to that a gold medal liar, purveyor of porn stars, a bit of unsolicited grabbing, walking into dressing rooms of under age girls unnanounced.

 

Oh the list goes on, but you think its nothing.

and the problem is what exactly?

 

so you wouldn't mind someone who looks good as POTUS, yet privately engaged in frauds, pursuing personal interests, selling out voters, engaging in pointless wars, and sell dreams to the public he knows he can't achieve etc...

 

what does it say then because I just described Nixon, Reagan, GW Bush 1, GW Bush 2, and Obama

[GrandPapillon]

7 minutes ago, placeholder said:

I think that the best part of your post was all the stuff that you left out. Like that no president before has ever lied and told falsehoods as Trump did. The problem is that people like you see being abrasive and vulgar as somehow signifying honesty. It's possible to be consistently abrasive, vulgar and dishonest. What exactly did Trump do to disrupt the status quo in Washington. He loosened restriction on Wall Street and the banks, and allowed polluters to run the Environmental Protection Agency.  What right thing did he try to do?

Truthiness - Wikipedia

I think his qualities was to say out loud what everyone was thinking quietly. Is he 100% honest? of course not, he is in real estate, but we knew that before he got elected, there was no surprise of what he was. He was a pig and still got elected.

 

TBH, I didn't expect him to be that vulgar and abrasive, and I think that's what got him at the end, with the crazy twitters. He did push the "entertainment" value too far, and like a good standup comedian (POTUS are public comedians by definition) that took a joke too far, it backfired eventually.

 

The funny thing is I think he is going to be more vocal for the next 4 years, and Biden will be exposed for the fraud that he is, no matter how good or presidential he looks.

[placeholder]

5 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

I think his qualities was to say out loud what everyone was thinking quietly. Is he 100% honest? of course not, he is in real estate, but we knew that before he got elected, there was no surprise of what he was. He was a pig and still got elected.

 

TBH, I didn't expect him to be that vulgar and abrasive, and I think that's what got him at the end, with the crazy twitters. He did push the "entertainment" value too far, and like a good standup comedian (POTUS are public comedians by definition) that took a joke too far, it backfired eventually.

 

The funny thing is I think he is going to be more vocal for the next 4 years, and Biden will be exposed for the fraud that he is, no matter how good or presidential he looks.

Cool it with the mentalist act. Speak for yourself about what you think but not about what everybody else thinks quietly. That's kind of statement is obviously valueless since it's impossible to disprove.  It really an attempt to validate what you think by claiming everybody else thinks the same way. And what about the status quo was Trump trying to disrupt?"

Edited December 17, 2020 by placeholder

[GrandPapillon]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Cool it with the mentalist act. Speak for yourself about what you think but not about what everybody else thinks quietly. That's kind of statement is obviously valueless since it's impossible to disprove.  It really an attempt to validate what you think by claiming everybody else thinks the same way. And what about the status quo was Trump trying to disrupt?"

and you are?

 

the figure of speech definitely got lost on you. Yes, the votes that mattered went for him, and if you had to talk to his voters, they would have said the same thing as I just described above. The Hillary voters chose to ignore those reasons, and she paid for it.

 

[onthedarkside]

A post claiming rampant voter fraud in U.S. elections -- without any credible source, proof or evidence -- has been removed, along with numerous replies. And a personal flame post as well.

 

[Jeffr2]

1 hour ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

So you are OK with a leader who lies to you?  Denies the virus so tens of thousands die needlessly?  Seriously?  Wow....

 

None in recent times have been as bad as Trump.  None.

[Tie Dye Samurai]

On 12/15/2020 at 9:01 PM, spidermike007 said:

To the people who are buying into his conspiracies about fraud, I say man up. Grow up. Deal with it. Trump lost again. Plain and simple. He lost 17 businesses. He lost 19 merchandising deals while in office. He lost all his clout, when it comes to management deals with his name on them. He lost the trade war with China, and the negotiations with Kim. Now, he lost the election. What part of him being a loser do these people not understand? 
 

Now Now....Lets Give Trump a little credit....he did win "The Battle Of The Billionaires" vs Vince McMahon at Wrestlemania 23 in Detroit...oh wait...he had a guy wrestling for him that actually won it for him....and it was fake....pretty much a synapsis of Donald Trump's adult life....his achievements were fake, lies and other people did the heavy lifting and dirty work.

 

[RocketDog]

On 12/16/2020 at 10:53 AM, herfiehandbag said:

I don't know whether extradition is needed if someone is charged with crimes in one state whilst permanently resident in another, in US law?

 

If it is, then we should be in for an entertaining 2021!

Good point. What was tyranny for the last four years may well become entertainment for the next four. 

An Evil Clown with power is a threat. Same clown without power is only good for a laugh. 

Personally I'd prefer seeing him simply go to jail for a decade ; I can find better ways to be entertained. 

[Albert Zweistein]

11 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

the POTUS has limited power thanks to Congress, so the country was never near a dictatorship, even though Trump was acting eratically

 

a few POTUS in the past were far worst than Trump, and the press back then then was mute and complicit. Trump tried to do the right thing, and "disrupt" the status quo in Washington. That alone was a good thing.

The way Trump was running the show turned the US into a dictatorship and made the rest of the world laughing.

[Jingthing]

9 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

So you are OK with a leader who lies to you?  Denies the virus so tens of thousands die needlessly?  Seriously?  Wow....

 

None in recent times have been as bad as Trump.  None.

None ever as bad among American presidents.

[GrandPapillon]

9 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

So you are OK with a leader who lies to you?  Denies the virus so tens of thousands die needlessly?  Seriously?  Wow....

 

None in recent times have been as bad as Trump.  None.

all leaders lie anyway, there is nothing that can stop that. They need to sell dreams.

 

Trump saved the US economy by not imposing a complete shutdown of the country for too long, unlike Europe

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

all leaders lie anyway, there is nothing that can stop that. They need to sell dreams.

 

Trump saved the US economy by not imposing a complete shutdown of the country for too long, unlike Europe

No.

All politicians lie at normal levels. 

That's actually their job. It's part of politics and indeed diplomacy.

 

Mr Trump lies at a spectacular accelerated level that is completely unprecedented. He has tried and largely succeeded among his base to make facts and reality unimportant. He does more gaslighting than the power company.

 

He will soon be out of the white house, not soon enough, but his destructive toxic movement is still with us. Probably that makes you happy. 

 

From a prominent group of conservatives, generally republicans, the Lincoln Project.

 

Opinion | Reed Galen: The fight against Trumpism is only beginning - The Washington Post

 

Quote

The fight against Trumpism is only beginning

 

Defeating Trumpism must happen or American democracy is finished. The first step, getting Mr. Trump out, may prove the easier one. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Jingthing

[candide]

55 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

all leaders lie anyway, there is nothing that can stop that. They need to sell dreams.

 

Trump saved the US economy by not imposing a complete shutdown of the country for too long, unlike Europe

Are you kidding? Other leaders (in democratic countries) don't lie like Trump. The recent news are showing obvious evidence. Did other leaders, when they lost elections, claim imaginary fraud  and ridiculous conspiracy theories, i.e. officials affiliated to their own party conspiring with Iran, China and Hugo Chavez in order to get their political opponent elected? Really? Did they claim a purely domestic company listed on the domestic stock exchange (in the case of Trump: Crowdstrike) was an Ukrainian company?  Did they tell their army that they never had any wage increase during ten years? Really? Did they claim they have made a law the previous administration actually made? Really? Did they claim the covid pandemic was a hoax by the opposition and MSM? Really?

And these are only a few examples.

Edited December 17, 2020 by candide

[bendejo]

13 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

I really don't see what's really wrong with Trump, ok he is abrasive and vulgar, and you can call him a pig, but he is far better than the rest of the fools that was running for POTUS

 

I'm going to say something positive about the guy on television with the orange face.  (hear ye hear ye!)

DT is not an idealist.  Outside of the interests of himself (wealth and vanity), and sometimes some of his family members, he has no set of ideals or goals.  There is no "MAGA agenda" though his fans may use that term.  He had no knowledge of the way to get things done in DC, and couldn't be bothered learning.  The term "intellectually incurious" gained popularity in the Bush 43 years, but became a gross understatement these past four.  The first critique of his foreign relations style I heard was a benign comment by the king of Jordan about a month after the inauguration: "his approach to diplomacy is horse trading."  His entire tenure was like a Marx Brothers movie but a tragedy, not comedy.  But even Putin could tell you any of those Marx brothers is smarter than DT.  (Waiting for the day DT's treachery sees the light of day.)

But it could have been worse, someone like Marco Rubio, with knowledge of gov't workings and a political credo ("we have to do the Conservative thing!") could have been much more damaging to the US; would he have betrayed his orthodoxy if convenient?  ABSOLUTELY!.  Ted Cruz has the potential to be a true menace.  Jeb would have been just as much of an empty suit as his brother was while the party runs the country.  The rest of the 2016 GOP hopefuls were just clown-car passengers. 

So yes, the avarice, egotism and arrogance is what saved DT from being worse than he could have been.

 

You have the option of believing this

Anthony Scaramucci Claims Trump Told Him He's a 'Total Act'

 

 

Edited December 17, 2020 by bendejo

[spidermike007]

17 hours ago, Tie Dye Samurai said:

Now Now....Lets Give Trump a little credit....he did win "The Battle Of The Billionaires" vs Vince McMahon at Wrestlemania 23 in Detroit...oh wait...he had a guy wrestling for him that actually won it for him....and it was fake....pretty much a synapsis of Donald Trump's adult life....his achievements were fake, lies and other people did the heavy lifting and dirty work.

 

 

I would give alot to see how Trump would do in any ring, against anyone. He is such a coward, on every level, I think he would wet this pants. He always does anything in his power, to avoid direct confrontation, of this sort. Remember the five draft deferments? 

[ballpoint]

On 12/16/2020 at 8:05 PM, Skeptic7 said:

...There appears to be another additional exception: if the fugitive is under sentence in the asylum state, he need not be extradited until his punishment in the asylum state is completed.

What's the bet that Trump gets a parking ticket in Florida, refuses to pay it, receives a 10 year suspended sentence, and so can't be extradited because of it?

[Lacessit]

4 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

What's the bet that Trump gets a parking ticket in Florida, refuses to pay it, receives a 10 year suspended sentence, and so can't be extradited because of it?

I'll give you credit for an imaginative scenario, but a 10 year suspended sentence for a parking infringement sounds pretty rough, even for the American justice system.

What do you do with shoplifters? I seem to remember there was a website that showed how female offenders were dealt with.

[ballpoint]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I'll give you credit for an imaginative scenario, but a 10 year suspended sentence for a parking infringement sounds pretty rough, even for the American justice system.

What do you do with shoplifters? I seem to remember there was a website that showed how female offenders were dealt with.

He'll initially receive the standard punishment, but will appeal to his buddy the governor for a more serious sentence in order to avoid extradition.

[onthedarkside]

Several posts by one member using a derogatory term have been removed, along with multiple replies.