Why are wines produced in Thailand so expensive?

[Disparate Dan]

Don't underestimate the amount of wine drunk by Thais. I shop in a Foodland where I'm usually the only farang and they sell a lot.

But Thais know nothing about what is good or what it tastes like (hence the stupid pretties trying to 'help' me choose). It's all about looking rich – like the [deleted] minister with the watches; or the pr@ts that buy the B15m cars.

Same principle as in China. Expensive is good. As in China in recent years, there's a little extra kudos for serving local stuff as well (and some Chinese wines are really quite good nowadays), so if it's Thai AND pricey, good face in front of the visitors.

Plus, if the taste quality was any kind of a factor, how would they get away with adding “forest fruits” to the stuff which is already pretty rock-bottom swilling? My guess is that is to soften the taste for the locals. Might as well sell them Janola.

 

I doubt this regime taxes wine heavily just to protect beer brewers, because there is scant likelihood of the masses swapping to Sauv Blanc. But then it's wise not to underestimate the sheer stupidity there…..

[DJ54]

Couple weeks back in the Import store and wifey decided to venture in... oh we want to try wine... huh?? .. her,her sister and mom and some other stragglers (I don’t go there) drinking at the farm.. I call it the farm bar.

 

i like a good Cab but for those that haven’t drank much wine..nah So picked a couple of good Australia red wines..

I said listen to me.. do not knock it back like it beer .. 

 

she didn’t listen the basically pounded two bottles and she knew when she was sick should’ve listened. There’s an upside 

they decided they don’t wind... Thank you Thank You

 

Mad Dog 20 20 is what they should drink...  I had 100+ bottles in US before I moved to Asia gave them all away.. and a TV 

 

[Surelynot]

Does anyone know why these wine sections have those poor girls stood there all day, every day?

 

It has got to mind numbingly boring for them.....in Foodland they are stood there even during the hours you can't buy alcohol.

[Captor]

3 hours ago, Bredbury Blue said:

 

I guess that really was my question (not why they are so expensive but why are so more expensive than imported wines). The government should be backing the local wine producers, local coffee and tea producers, etc, to allow them to not only compete with imports but be more appealing costwise.

And maybe also be able to export!

[digbeth]

If alcohol is taxed sensibly like... by alcohol volume (%) sales of Lao Khao would tank, but the biggest producer of Lao Khao also owns the beer breweries as well, so it won't be much of a loss to them.

 

The current taxation system for alcohol is very arbitrary, they look at the final price and charge one rate for 'premium' products for Hi-Sos and other rates for cheap charlies... and the import duties difference from various treaties is another can of worms,

 

but yes, Thai wine producer are very small and isn't likely able to affect change to their advantage compared to the big beer breweries from the 2 families that control everything. Exception being the Redbull family that owns the concerns that produces MontClair and other brands of imported grape juice turned to 'wine'  in Thailand

[Bundooman]

16 hours ago, Henryford said:

Why does the Government want to kill the Thai wine industry. I can understand them stopping imports with high taxes. Is it the beer lobby that doesn't want any competition.

Is it the beer lobby that doesn't want any competition?

 

Yes!

[Henryford]

15 hours ago, from the home of CC said:

because they know if you have real money you'll pay?

 

How many people have real money. I am reasonably well off but i refuse to pay the stupid high taxes on wine.

[lopburi3]

Quote

locally produced whines

Good - then my first read of the topic title today was:

 

Why are wives produced in Thailand so expensive?

[unblocktheplanet]

19 hours ago, Henryford said:

Why does the Government want to kill the Thai wine industry. I can understand them stopping imports with high taxes. Is it the beer lobby that doesn't want any competition.

Everyone, rightly, is moaning about lack of money from tourism. But not a thought is given to diversification and, with it, new jobs. In agriculture in particular, there is enormous potential for development of a major export hub for (real, verified) organic produce, including rice. Ganja--bring back Thai sticks! And Thai wines. The Chinese have started to produce very drinkable, and expensive, wines.

 

Govt is shooting itself, and all of us, in the foot, by high excise taxes. We really don't need to depend wholly on tourism. Take a breath and realise the heydays may be over, maybe forever.

[elgenon]

On 3/20/2021 at 6:28 AM, tgw said:

maybe you had too much whine already

There's so much whine on TV it is cheap!

[Moo 2]

Just under 2 years ago I was buying 4 L cask of wine at Aldi store for $ 10.00 (Aust.) At that time the Baht was 22.00 for a dollar. Now, without being an accountant this is roughly 220.00 baht for 4 L of Cabernet Merlot, which is an all around 12% table wine. Can anyone in Thailand tell me where I can buy 4 L of wine for, say plus 100% tax, 440.00 baht? Why Australia is not putting a 100% tax on imported rice, prawns, cans of tuna, instant noodles and the likes, and if these items are not classified luxury yet, they would be after the 100% tax on them! 

[Beckham Beach]

The alcohol industry in Thailand is a farce protected by ridiculous import duties. Beer is a monopoly, setting up a micro brewery is almost impossible. The aim here is to protect Chang and Singha. spirits are dominated by beer Chang, Hong Thong, Sang Som etc. I likke a Thai whisky tipply with thai food. Great with lime and soda. But for some odd reason the excise duty on spirits is ridiculously low which encourages Thai makes in particular to get slammed on it, or its horrific cousin, Lao Kao. But the government doesn''t care.

 

Re wine, import duties are ridiculous...

 

Duty and Tax Burden for Wine

Countries	Tariff Rate	Effective Duty and Tax Burden
USA, France, Italy, Chile and other countries under WTO agreement	54%	390.46%
Australia	24%	294.92%
New Zealand	18%	275.81%   So from the above, it seems that we should be buying wines from Aus and NZ as they are subject to less tax because of a trade agreement signed in 2004. The Tahi government, by taxing wine in this way is shooting itself in the foot because wine is easier on the body and were it to be cheaper, more people would buy it, especially tourists, making more money for the government. But according to the Thai government, wine is a drink for rich people and therefore they should be soaked. As a result of the silly duties, we have a nascent wine industry that would never have started were it not for the idiotic duties which will never produce the quality of wine demanded as the weather is too hot. It is totally unable to compete internationally although you see Thai wines in Thai Restaurants overseas. Some of the local wine is drinkable, but it is ridiculously expensive. Generally avoid.

[Leaver]

It's Thai Business 101.

 

Better to rip off a few, than to sell to many for more profit.  Go figure.  

[dbrenn]

Thais do lots of things well, but winemaking isn't one of them. Besides, the climate is too hot.

[moontang]

On 3/22/2021 at 12:03 PM, Moo 2 said:

Just under 2 years ago I was buying 4 L cask of wine at Aldi store for $ 10.00 (Aust.) At that time the Baht was 22.00 for a dollar. Now, without being an accountant this is roughly 220.00 baht for 4 L of Cabernet Merlot, which is an all around 12% table wine. Can anyone in Thailand tell me where I can buy 4 L of wine for, say plus 100% tax, 440.00 baht? Why Australia is not putting a 100% tax on imported rice, prawns, cans of tuna, instant noodles and the likes, and if these items are not classified luxury yet, they would be after the 100% tax on them! 

Same for Thai shrimp or cashew nuts in the US...can easily be found at Costco or Trader Joe's for less than they cost in Thailand.  But, there is a laundry list of US items that are multiples more expensive here, due to unfair taxes.  Any you can hate Donald Trump all you want, but everything he said about trade and lack of reciprocity was true.  BTW, we Americans enjoy Autralian wine and many others in the US, readily available for less than an hours work at minimum wage, and hope you folks enjoy our diverse wines, too.

[xylophone]

On 3/21/2021 at 8:30 PM, Disparate Dan said:

Plus, if the taste quality was any kind of a factor, how would they get away with adding “forest fruits” to the stuff which is already pretty rock-bottom swilling? My guess is that is to soften the taste for the locals.

I notice you didn't reply to my post on another wine thread when you were extolling the virtues of certain box/cask wines, and I posted that most of them were fruit wines, and I even listed those bottled and produced in Australia that contained fruit juice or the like. 

 

This in reply to your post that my assertion of the fruit wines "did not match the information from your shipper in Sydney" – – to which I replied you should get another shipper, because he obviously doesn't know what he is shipping.

 

It's been a big thing for quite a while that Australian wine producers, mostly from south-east Australia where the bulk wines are made, add the fruit juice and get round tax/duties, and many folk here buy it, so the Thais are doing exactly what the Aussies are doing with their exported cask wine.

 

 

[Leaver]

On 3/27/2021 at 10:57 AM, dbrenn said:

Thais do lots of things well,

 

Any examples?  

[lopburi3]

4 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

Any examples?  

[Leaver]

2 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

 

Are you suggesting there are no attractive women in The Philippines and Vietnam?   

[lopburi3]

2 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

Are you suggesting there are no attractive women in The Philippines and Vietnam?   

That was not the question.

 

[dbrenn]

7 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

Any examples?  

How about the food, or do you hang around McDonald's? Then there's the manageable current account deficit, the export driven economy, car manufacturing, customer service, agriculture, health care, respect for one's elders, patriotism, cohesive families, community spirit. The list goes on.

 

And of course the women, as Lopburi pointed out. 

Edited March 28, 2021 by dbrenn

[dbrenn]

7 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

Are you suggesting there are no attractive women in The Philippines and Vietnam?   

But you hang around TV. There must be some reason for that. 

[Leaver]

On 3/28/2021 at 8:00 PM, lopburi3 said:

That was not the question.

 

 

It is now.

[Leaver]

On 3/29/2021 at 3:19 AM, dbrenn said:

How about the food, or do you hang around McDonald's? Then there's the manageable current account deficit, the export driven economy, car manufacturing, customer service, agriculture, health care, respect for one's elders, patriotism, cohesive families, community spirit. The list goes on.

 

And of course the women, as Lopburi pointed out. 

 

Vietnam has great food, without the worry of how much chilli has been added.

 

As for manageable current account deficit, Thailand has record household debt.

 

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/economy/thai-household-debt-hits-all-time-high-of-340k-baht-per-house

 

Household debt at 80% of GDP, highest in 4 years and Thailand's economy set to shrink a record 8% 

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-thailand-economy-household-debt/thai-first-quarter-household-debt-at-80-of-gdp-highest-in-four-years-idUSKBN2481HX

 

As for manufacturing in Thailand, Panasonic cut 800 jobs in Thailand and moved to Vietnam.  Other companies are leaving Thailand as well.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-panasonic-thailand/japans-panasonic-to-cut-800-jobs-in-thailand-move-some-production-to-vietnam-next-year-idUSKBN22X0R5

 

As for agriculture, Vietnam overtook Thailand for rice exports.

 

https://www.spglobal.com/platts/en/market-insights/latest-news/agriculture/080320-vietnam-widens-rice-export-lead-over-thailand-in-june-trade-data

 

As for health care, I would accept that is better in Thailand, but as more and more expats retire to Vietnam in the future, there will be international hospitals there on par with Thailand's.

 

As for respect or one's elders, Vietnam has the extended family model, so the respect is always there, but I am not sure how you are gauging that.  

 

As for patriotism, the Vietnamese have won wars against the Chinese, French, and Americans, all on their own soil.  What has Thailand done?

 

As for cohesive families, maybe you can comment on all the young Thai ladies sent to southern tourist areas to work in the sex trade.

 

if the list goes one, post some more examples of how well Thailand has been doing under a military dictatorship posing as a democracy.  

[Leaver]

On 3/29/2021 at 3:21 AM, dbrenn said:

But you hang around TV. There must be some reason for that. 

 

I live in Pattaya.  I freely admit I am here mainly for the nightlife.  I have also stated on TV that Vietnam is my Plan B. 

 

Have you ever been to Vietnam, or anywhere else in South East Asia, for that matter?  

[dbrenn]

12 hours ago, Leaver said:

Have you ever been to Vietnam, or anywhere else in South East Asia, for that matter? 

Yes, lots of times.

[dbrenn]

12 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

Vietnam has great food, without the worry of how much chilli has been added.

 

As for manageable current account deficit, Thailand has record household debt.

 

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/economy/thai-household-debt-hits-all-time-high-of-340k-baht-per-house

 

Household debt at 80% of GDP, highest in 4 years and Thailand's economy set to shrink a record 8% 

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-thailand-economy-household-debt/thai-first-quarter-household-debt-at-80-of-gdp-highest-in-four-years-idUSKBN2481HX

 

As for manufacturing in Thailand, Panasonic cut 800 jobs in Thailand and moved to Vietnam.  Other companies are leaving Thailand as well.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-panasonic-thailand/japans-panasonic-to-cut-800-jobs-in-thailand-move-some-production-to-vietnam-next-year-idUSKBN22X0R5

 

As for agriculture, Vietnam overtook Thailand for rice exports.

 

https://www.spglobal.com/platts/en/market-insights/latest-news/agriculture/080320-vietnam-widens-rice-export-lead-over-thailand-in-june-trade-data

 

As for health care, I would accept that is better in Thailand, but as more and more expats retire to Vietnam in the future, there will be international hospitals there on par with Thailand's.

 

As for respect or one's elders, Vietnam has the extended family model, so the respect is always there, but I am not sure how you are gauging that.  

 

As for patriotism, the Vietnamese have won wars against the Chinese, French, and Americans, all on their own soil.  What has Thailand done?

 

As for cohesive families, maybe you can comment on all the young Thai ladies sent to southern tourist areas to work in the sex trade.

 

if the list goes one, post some more examples of how well Thailand has been doing under a military dictatorship posing as a democracy.  

So go and live in Vietnam then. Are you a masochist? What's stopping you?

[Leaver]

15 hours ago, dbrenn said:

Yes, lots of times.

 

What is your opinion of Vietnam?

[Leaver]

15 hours ago, dbrenn said:

So go and live in Vietnam then. Are you a masochist? What's stopping you?

 

I am in Pattaya for the nightlife. There is no other place in the world like it.  There's a reason why they call it, "the world's brothel." 

 

Vietnam is my Plan B. 

 

It Thailand make hoops that I do not want to jump through, I will leave. No problem for me.    

[dbrenn]

3 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

I am in Pattaya for the nightlife. There is no other place in the world like it.  There's a reason why they call it, "the world's brothel." 

 

Vietnam is my Plan B. 

 

It Thailand make hoops that I do not want to jump through, I will leave. No problem for me.    

Huh? You can't find hookers in Vietnam, so that's the only reason you stay in Thailand, even though you hate the place, to such an extent that a while back you were looking down on poverty stricken Thai families for allowing their daughters to do that kind of work?