Thailand previews difficult life without tourists

[hotchilli]

16 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Reuters estimates only 1% of the population has been fully jabbed.

Only another 69% to go then.

I'll go put the kettle on while I wait.

[Megasin1]

currently in the news in UK, Israel is preparing for a large influx of tourists this year from the UK. Vaccinated tourists arriving in a vaccinated country where only vaccinated are allowed. Keep up or die, the writing was always on the wall. As for the Chinese, I was recently in the Cotswolds and it was really nice to see no hoards of coaches spewing their cargo all over the place. The longer they stay away, the better ????

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, papa al said:

Ab-so-root-ree.

Her loud moaning is probably fake,

but papa don't care.

&c.

Nice to see someone with great sense o humor and not overly sensitive! ????????????

[retsdon]

13 hours ago, BenDeCosta said:

are going to have a hard time adjusting to living on 300 baht a day from a 12 hour shift at a factory in Chon Buri.

It's not 300 baht and hasn't been for a long time. And that's the problem. Thai cheap labour has priced itself out of the market and new production lines are being automated and made 'smart'. Nobody wants lines of girls putting bits into products anymore. My SiL, who worked shifts for 20 years for various Japanese technology companies, is now back on the family farm. There's no work and she's given up looking. In every new factory her old job is being done by a robot.

[retsdon]

15 hours ago, papa al said:

Thai people nice to papa.

100%. 

If you're happy being talked to like an infant and given the facile smile treatment, Thailand's probably a dream come true.

[Eric Loh]

16 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Thailand looks ill-prepared for life without tourists as a fresh wave of contagion hits. The Southeast Asian country needs to wean itself off this economic crutch,

Thailand will have to recognize the reality that tourism industry will not be back to normal until at least 2023. The government must have the courage and vision to face that reality, come up with strategy to re-deploy resources and lessen the impact from the losses in foreign tourism. With US, China and Europe opening up and pouring massive amount of stimulus, the manufacturing and export sectors will benefit. Export has been performing well with projection of 6-7% growth and need government help to tackle problems of port congestions & worker deficits. Government must need to work hard to attract more FDI and energized the domestic tourism industry. I honestly doubt Thailand has such visionary leaders in this government. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[SchuetzRob]

Gorgeous beaches, spicy food and temples draw a steady stream of tourists....... They must be describing the 'new', post-covid, tourist?????????????

[Megasin1]

45 minutes ago, retsdon said:

It's not 300 baht and hasn't been for a long time. And that's the problem. Thai cheap labour has priced itself out of the market and new production lines are being automated and made 'smart'. Nobody wants lines of girls putting bits into products anymore. My SiL, who worked shifts for 20 years for various Japanese technology companies, is now back on the family farm. There's no work and she's given up looking. In every new factory her old job is being done by a robot.

eventually the robots will be redundant too, not a great reassurance I know but it may not be that far into the future when human versatility will conquer robot efficiency ???? There are new laws coming in the UK that will force white goods manufacturers to produce goods which last longer with wearable parts replacable by the consumer. This will mean shorter production runs and many robot changes which could make robots uneconomic. Roll on the future ????

[TaoNow]

2 hours ago, HaoleBoy said:

Well said!

 

Most farangs don't realize the Thai red-light areas (outside of Pattaya) are more numerous than Nana, Patpong, Cowboy in BKK.  Go to any small town and you will see the Karaoke bars and massage shops all offering sex.  Thai hi-society just don't want to have their country "known" as a sex-capitol but the men all use these places. 

 

This thread is about tourists -- principally foreign tourists.

[Bangkok Barry]

17 hours ago, kimamey said:

17 hours ago, connda said:

Thailand is a very confused country.

First Thailand cries that it no longer has adequate tourist revenues, then its citizens vote to kick all foreigners out of their communities while Thai media is busy bashing foreigners for "misdeeds" (like failure to wear a mask) while ignoring the hundreds of Thais who fail to do the same.  (Foreigners = Bad; Thais = Good)

Then when tourists fail to return because they either have heard via word of mouth from friends that the Thai Smile is only around as long as there is money to be made, and that under that Thai rictus-grin lies a heart of xenophobia and a less than subtle dislike of all foreign outsiders - or - they encounter a fear-produced and sustained regulatory gauntlet of rules, regulations, requirements, and quarantines that simply makes vacationing in Thailand too much of a hassle to deal with and tourists opt to travel to destinations and spend their vacation dollars in countries which are more welcoming.

And Thailand will never understand, they will never make the connection, they will not "get it."  In the end, foreigners will take the brunt of the blame.  (Foreigner = Bad; Thai = Good)
They need to find a different math.

Expand  

I've never noticed this attitude from Thais in Isaan where I live or in general but I do think it may exist in government circles which means it has a greater effect.

 

I don't know about the Thai smile but Thai politeness exits but with limits. Anyone who claims Thais are always polite has never driven on Thai roads.

 

Tourists do not go to Issan. Tourists go to Phuket and Pattaya, both areas that are polluted with hustlers 'authorised' to operate by blind or involved local authority members and police, and both with outdated and inadequate infrastructure.
 

It would be interesting to know how many gullible people, after being taken in by photos of palm-tree surrounded beaches (some of which are not even in Thailand, but used by TAT anyway) ever return. And how many spread the word about what they've seen and how they've been treated. All but Chinese tourism was declining long before Covid.

[johnbarley]

33 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

Tourists do not go to Issan. Tourists go to Phuket and Pattaya, both areas that are polluted with hustlers 'authorised' to operate by blind or involved local authority members and police, and both with outdated and inadequate infrastructure.
 

It would be interesting to know how many gullible people, after being taken in by photos of palm-tree surrounded beaches (some of which are not even in Thailand, but used by TAT anyway) ever return. And how many spread the word about what they've seen and how they've been treated. All but Chinese tourism was declining long before Covid.

Interesting. Surely there is some false advertising and often reality doesn't match expectations. But I know many foreigners who visited Thailand and almost all where very happy with their visits and many return. 

I think the more interesting phenomenon is the almost universal bashing of Thailand on this forum by expats who apparently continue to stay in the country. Thailand is a middle income country with plenty of benefits and plenty of problems. It's hardly a warzone or a land of starving serfs.

 

But I am seeing this all over the world. For example, there is major political turmoil in 5 of the 10 major South American countries and USA is full of angry people. The year of the COVID has been tough on people's psyches. 

Edited May 7, 2021 by johnbarley

[The Cipher]

6 minutes ago, johnbarley said:

I think the more interesting phenomenon is the almost universal bashing of Thailand on this forum by expats who apparently continue to stay in the country

 

Yes. I am a little confused by this too.

[BenDeCosta]

2 minutes ago, The Cipher said:

 

Yes. I am a little confused by this too.

 

I suspect that many have a wife and kids in Thailand, so just leaving isn't an option. Others might have significant amounts of property, or a business or some other reason why they can't just leave.

[herfiehandbag]

17 hours ago, WineOh said:

Thailand doesn't deserve tourists.

The people who are running Thailand do not deserve tourists.

 

The Thais need tourists, if only because the government has the cubed root of <deleted> all intention of making any effort, or allocating their resources (because that is how they view them) to helping the people out of the pit which they (the government) have dug for them.

[WineOh]

10 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

The Thais need tourists

how about all those locals then who shouted at me and my family 'go back your country, farang' for refusing their services?

 

Do they deserve tourists when they treat them like this?

They have a funny way of showing that they 'need' us.

 

They all pee in the same pot. They deserve what they dish out, locals and government officials alike.

[herfiehandbag]

Just now, WineOh said:

how about all those locals then who shouted at me and my family 'go back your country, farang' for refusing their services?

 

Do they deserve tourists when they treat them like this?

They have a funny way of showing that they 'need' us.

 

They all pee in the same pot. They deserve what they dish out, locals and government officials alike.

I don't know. I've lived here seven years, and been coming here for oh, fifteen or so before that. I've never had a local shout at me like that...

[herfiehandbag]

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

Thailand will have to recognize the reality that tourism industry will not be back to normal until at least 2023. The government must have the courage and vision to face that reality, come up with strategy to re-deploy resources and lessen the impact from the losses in foreign tourism. With US, China and Europe opening up and pouring massive amount of stimulus, the manufacturing and export sectors will benefit. Export has been performing well with projection of 6-7% growth and need government help to tackle problems of port congestions & worker deficits. Government must need to work hard to attract more FDI and energized the domestic tourism industry. I honestly doubt Thailand has such visionary leaders in this government. 

 

  

Alternatively, they can just tell them to go back to their farms for a few years...

[rasmus5150]

16 hours ago, trainman34014 said:

Yep; Eskimo's are the next big thing !

Whoa...... Careful there.

 

Didn't you know that the E word is racist, and is not allowed anymore?

 

Now you can only say "Inuit".

[Dont confuse me]

They've had it too easy for too long, tourist were never really respected and in some cases treated badly, of course there are the high end resorts that cater for western families, but at a premium. 

What does Thailand really offer? Pristine beaches? Diverse culture? Museums,  art galleries? A clean capital city perhaps? Reasonably priced food prepared to an acceptable standard? A good exchange rate? Helpful immigration officials/police? One price for locals and tourists?  Good customer service?

Or how about prostitution?  That's the only thing that is on offer which is perhaps cheaper than in North America or Europe other than that Europe in particular offers everything that Thailand does not!

LoS has had its day time to start running the country properly. 

[herfiehandbag]

55 minutes ago, johnbarley said:

I think the more interesting phenomenon is the almost universal bashing of Thailand on this forum by expats who apparently continue to stay in the country. Thailand is a middle income country with plenty of benefits and plenty of problems. It's hardly a warzone or a land of starving serfs.

 

47 minutes ago, The Cipher said:

 

Yes. I am a little confused by this too.

 

43 minutes ago, BenDeCosta said:

 

I suspect that many have a wife and kids in Thailand, so just leaving isn't an option. Others might have significant amounts of property, or a business or some other reason why they can't just leave.

 

After coming here for 15 years, and acquiring a wife, child and house here, 7 years ago I made the decision to come and live here. I fully intend, God willing, to end my days here. When I die they can burn me, I don't mind as long as someone says a Requiem for me!

 

I like living here, in a comfortable if not lavish home, with my wife and teenage daughter, three dogs and two cats. I enjoy my part time job teaching English, and think that through it I contribute to the society in which I live. I like the country and the people of the country, much of their culture, the climate, and their often happy go lucky approach to life.

 

I am very critical of those who currently govern this country. I am critical of the way they seized power when it became clear that their favoured party was on the way to losing the last proper election, I am critical of the self serving, venal, xenophobic and cynically self perpetuating regime that they put in place. I am critical of the way in which they have institutionalised corruption, turned it into a political tool, and of how they casually plunder the country, caring not at all whether they are seen or not.

 

I am very critical at the moment of the utter shambles which they have made of facing the greatest challenge to this country in the last 50 years, a shambles which I believe is a direct result of the characteristics and behaviour which I outlined in the previous paragraph. A shambles, which with others, is adversely affecting the future prospects of this country and it's people.

 

My criticism does not mean that I wish to abandon my wife and child, home, job and life here to return to a lonely old age in the UK. I will continue to live here, and where appropriate voice my views on this forum.

 

By the way, if you think I am critical of this government and it's performance, you ought to hear what teenagers and young people are saying!

Edited May 7, 2021 by herfiehandbag

[hansnl]

Maybe, hopefully, the Thai authorities will not make life more difficult for the remaining expats, most of them bringing in an average of 50,000 baht every month, while many invest lots in houses, cars, motorbikes etc.

[hansnl]

29 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

 

 

 

After coming here for 15 years, and acquiring a wife, child and house here, 7 years ago I made the decision to come and live here. I fully intend, God willing, to end my days here. When I die they can burn me, I don't mind as long as someone says a Requiem for me!

 

I like living here, in a comfortable if not lavish home, with my wife and teenage daughter, three dogs and two cats. I enjoy my part time job teaching English, and think that through it I contribute to the society in which I live. I like the country and the people of the country, much of their culture, the climate, and their often happy go lucky approach to life.

 

I am very critical of those who currently govern this country. I am critical of the way they seized power when it became clear that their favoured party was on the way to losing the last proper election, I am critical of the self serving, venal, xenophobic and cynically self perpetuating regime that they put in place. I am critical of the way in which they have institutionalised corruption, turned it into a political tool, and of how they casually plunder the country, caring not at all whether they are seen or not.

 

I am very critical at the moment of the utter shambles which they have made of facing the greatest challenge to this country in the last 50 years, a shambles which I believe is a direct result of the characteristics and behaviour which I outlined in the previous paragraph. A shambles, which with others, is adversely affecting the future prospects of this country and it's people.

 

My criticism does not mean that I wish to abandon my wife and child, home, job and life here to return to a lonely old age in the UK. I will continue to live here, and where appropriate voice my views on this forum.

 

By the way, if you think I am critical of this government and it's performance, you ought to hear what teenagers and young people are saying!

You are here for some years now, but obviously you forgot the track record of governments lead by the Thaksin faction.

War against drugs, agreement that black money was good, the rice fiasco, threats of breaking up the country, threats of forming an army, rise of the xenophobic ideas fuelled by T's words, the complete grinding to a halt of the country, and the real threat if a civil war, etc, etc, etc.

No, I don't like coups, and I love what is left of democratic ideas.

But most certainly Thaksin c.s. used democratic means to reach his own goals.

Remember his shady land deals, his telecom deals costing the country a huge amount of money?

I do remember.

[tlandtday]

26 minutes ago, hansnl said:

You are here for some years now, but obviously you forgot the track record of governments lead by the Thaksin faction.

War against drugs, agreement that black money was good, the rice fiasco, threats of breaking up the country, threats of forming an army, rise of the xenophobic ideas fuelled by T's words, the complete grinding to a halt of the country, and the real threat if a civil war, etc, etc, etc.

No, I don't like coups, and I love what is left of democratic ideas.

But most certainly Thaksin c.s. used democratic means to reach his own goals.

Remember his shady land deals, his telecom deals costing the country a huge amount of money?

I do remember.

 

Ironic thing is that many I have spoken to who were formerly anti Thaksin said they would welcome him back with open arms after the past few years lol.

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

19 hours ago, BenDeCosta said:

What is it that irks so many visitors to Thailand?

 

The litter strewn beaches? They could sort that, if they wanted to.

The awkward visa requirements, especially for people that want to visit regularly? They could sort that, if they wanted to.

The poor standard of spoken English spoken by the majority of Thais, even within the hospitality industry? Again, that could be sorted, if the government was serious about it. But they prefer to pay rock bottom salaries to teachers from Nigeria or the Philippines.

The rip-offs and notorious taxi mafias? Well, that could be sorted, but it just keeps being allowed to continue year after year despite so many complaints about it. Why are those dodgy gem stores and tailors that will only post your clothes to your home country allowed to keep operating?

 

Covid has given Thailand a golden opportunity to look at some of these issues and get the tourism industry ready and raring to go once it is safe to do so. But alas I don't think any of the above issues will be addressed any time soon. Any money they spend fixing these things would surely come back to them many times over.

 

 

 

Bull's-eye. You've gotten to the nub of it. Basic adjustments and improvements to the visitor experience never get done. 

 

I can add more to your list that I'm sure tourists experience everywhere in Thailand: Being interrupted by a Thai customer while talking with a store clerk;  dealing with surprise requirements while applying for an extension at immigration; complete lack of knowledge of the store's stock; moto taxi drivers who drive like they have no passenger; moto drivers who brush back crosswalk pedestrians; a supermarket cashier who thrusts change into your face or drops an item onto your hand while you are bent over packing your own bags; stern-faced almost robotic service in supermarkets and convenience stores (even when I've been at my most entertaining and polite self); steep price gouging on alcohol and any import item a foreigner might buy; broken seats, arm rests, air con vents and bottle holders in intercity buses . . . anyway, I'll stop there, not expecting to remember so many things that I experience every day that could really irk a fresh tourist.

 

I won't even mention the treacherous sidewalks with broken paving stones, low-hung signs and roof drain pipes, and dangling wires.  It's the nightmare that keeps on giving, year after year.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Kaoboi Bebobp

[redneck]

20 hours ago, Mavideol said:

and that makes 2 of us

Make that 3

[BenDeCosta]

19 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

 

Bull's-eye. You've gotten to the nub of it. Basic adjustments and improvements to the visitor experience never get done. 

 

I can add more to your list that I'm sure tourists experience everywhere in Thailand: Being interrupted by a Thai customer while talking with a store clerk;  dealing with surprise requirements while applying for an extension at immigration; complete lack of knowledge of the store's stock; moto taxi drivers who drive like they have no passenger; moto drivers who brush back crosswalk pedestrians; a supermarket cashier who thrusts change into your face or drops an item onto your hand while you are bent over packing your own bags; stern-faced almost robotic service in supermarkets and convenience stores (even when I've been at my most entertaining and polite self); steep price gouging on alcohol and any import item a foreigner might buy; broken seats, arm rests, air con vents and bottle holders in intercity buses . . . anyway, I'll stop there, not expecting to remember so many things that I experience every day that could really irk a fresh tourist.

 

I won't even mention the treacherous sidewalks with broken paving stones, low-hung signs and roof drain pipes, and dangling wires.  It's the nightmare that keeps on giving, year after year.

 

I agree with your sentiment. However I knew very well what Thailand was like before I moved here, and things like dodgy hanging cables and broken paving slabs don't bother me at all, a small trade-off for Thailand's good points. Poor customer service is an annoyance, but I have just come to expect zero customer service here and consider it a bonus when I get good customer service.

 

The thing that I don't agree with is the Thai sentiment that tourists would "just keep coming", therefore the things that upset tourists don't need to be bothered with. Now that other countries are improving, Thailand should be taking a hard line against things like scams against tourists, more than once I have meet travelers who were almost in tears after having spent huge sums on worthless gem stones, I'm pretty sure that people who get scammed hard will never return and they'll probably tell their friends and families not to go either.

[mark131v]

1 hour ago, hansnl said:

You are here for some years now, but obviously you forgot the track record of governments lead by the Thaksin faction.

War against drugs, agreement that black money was good, the rice fiasco, threats of breaking up the country, threats of forming an army, rise of the xenophobic ideas fuelled by T's words, the complete grinding to a halt of the country, and the real threat if a civil war, etc, etc, etc.

No, I don't like coups, and I love what is left of democratic ideas.

But most certainly Thaksin c.s. used democratic means to reach his own goals.

Remember his shady land deals, his telecom deals costing the country a huge amount of money?

I do remember.

 

You completely and utterly miss the point, Thaksin and his sister were elected by he people and would have been elected again, for right or wrong that is all that matters, the peoples vote aka democracy  or at the very least the nearest Thailand has ever got to it

 

This lot who have stolen power have done nothing but line their pockets and destroy the country, all this 'but, but Thaksin' is pointless deflection from the real issues and destruction Prayut and co have brought to the country

[papa al]

1 hour ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

I won't even mention the treacherous sidewalks with broken paving stones, low-hung signs and roof drain pipes, and dangling wires. 

fibber

[Emdog]

Preview? Preview? No new tourists for a year or so, being conservative. A 'preview' of coming attraction at theater doesn't last longer than the main feature, ya think? It's now the "standard view".

[GrandPapillon]

Greece is open for business, just booked 2 weeks there for July in Mikonos ????

 

not going back to Thailand before October or even November, at least