Thai woman dies hours after receiving AstraZeneca vaccine

[metisdead]

Some offensive posts and replies have been removed. 

[Stupooey]

19 minutes ago, BenDeCosta said:

No need to be rude, perhaps you can enlighten us with some advanced statistics about how many people have died from covid, and what percentage that is of all people who have died during the same period?  

 

And then try to justify how that small percentage of deaths warranted a complete worldwide shutdown and economic disaster?

 

 

 

Maybe if there hadn't been a worldwide shutdown, the small percentage of deaths might have become a large percentage.

[mommysboy]

33 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

Vaccines do matter. From a recent, in depth medical summary:   https://www.uptodate.com/contents/covid-19-vaccine-induced-immune-thrombotic-thrombocytopenia-vitt

 

Implicated vaccines — Two adenoviral vector-based vaccines have been implicated in causing VITT:

• ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 (AstraZeneca, University of Oxford, and Serum Institute of India)
• Ad26.COV2.S (Janssen; Johnson & Johnson)

 

VITT has not been reported after mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines such as the BNT162b2 (Pfizer-BioNTech) or the mRNA-1273 (Moderna) vaccines despite administration and safety data collection from hundreds of millions of recipients.  (emphasis from article)

 

 

The vector vaccines have a clear identifiable problem. It really is a shame.  But that is not to say other vaccines are not implicated in deaths.  The Pfizer vaccine is involved in an uncomfortably high number of cardiac and other issues. I'm not completely sure but reported fatalities are about the same across all vaccines.

 

Fortunately, VITT is a very treatable condition and can be averted if the patient presents quickly.  In order to prevent unnecessary panic it should be noted that most cases are mild and are often resolved quickly. Serious blood clots are more in the order of 1 per 300,000.  If we take Australia, for example, when I last checked it was around 32 cases in 3 million vaccines, resulting in a handful of very serious cases, and I think 1 (possibly 2) vaccines.

 

 

 

 

[jack71]

7 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

Would this be classified as a COVID-19 death?

 

I'm guessing no.

 

 

My neighbor, healthy, fit 30 - 35 YO Thai male, vaxxed Monday morning with AZ, had a mild fever, groggy/dizzy, body ache/joint pain. He's nearly back to normal today.

 

Others, six people, I know with AZ over the last month, zero side effects.

 

 

come on dr. Dont you think its a bit of a co-incidence that she dies a short time after having the AZ jab.....    Its pretty dam obvious that she had an adverse reaction. May she RIP

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

How safe would we like them to be? 

 

That's a silly question!  Completely safe of course, ie, no VITT, no DVT, no serious allergic reactions, no cardiac issues, strokes, etc.

 

But as a workable goal- about as safe as the others, eg, flu vaccine.

[BenDeCosta]

31 minutes ago, Stupooey said:

 

Maybe if there hadn't been a worldwide shutdown, the small percentage of deaths might have become a large percentage.

 

Read these articles:

 

 

https://academic.oup.com/cesifo/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cesifo/ifab003/6199605

 

https://voxeu.org/article/declining-effectiveness-lockdowns

 

"This suggests that the heavy reliance on lockdowns as in the early stages of the pandemic may not be advised."

 

"Using two indices from the Blavatnik Centre’s COVID-19 policy measures and comparing weekly mortality rates from 24 European countries in the first halves of 2017–2020, addressing policy endogeneity in two different ways, and taking timing into account, I find no clear association between lockdown policies and mortality development."

 

Lockdowns were not required and did not affect mortality. They have, however, destroyed the livelihoods of millions of people, and have certainly contributed towards issues with suicides, mental health issues and bankruptcies.

 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by BenDeCosta

[jack71]

4 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

and the fact that this disease is not as serious as they have made out from the start

Come on mate what are you saying?????? Its a global pandemic. How many global deaths have there been. Economies shut down etc etc. Not as serious..... thanks for the first laugh of the day

[jack71]

6 hours ago, AlexRich said:

I got the AZN jab mid May, in Europe. My second jab is early July. I felt nothing with the initial jab, but 9 hours later I felt sensation on my arms and body, difficult to describe other than you know something is going on. A bit later I felt my body temperature lower and my jaw began chattering (as if I was standing outside on a very cold day) and my muscles in my body started to spasm a little. I went to bed and woke up 4 hours later, feeling fine. I guess that was the vaccine doing it’s work? I’m looking forward to getting the second and then travelling again in 2022. 

were you not tempted to go to ER?

[blackcab]

A comment on moderation has been removed.

[wadman]

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

You mean like the 1 in 4 people world wide who die from a conditions related to Thrombosis ?

 

More people die of Thrombosis than car accidents, breast cancer road traffic accidents..... 

 

https://www.worldthrombosisday.org/issue/thrombosis/

 

900,000 people in the US suffer a thrombotic event each year - 1 in 9 of them die. 

 

 

We are being told to remain hydrated by every medical professional we come across ??? why ???

Thrombosis is one of the greatest silent killers known. 

 

So... Of course some of the people who have been vaccinated suffer from a Thrombotic condition... it was always going to happen. 

 

 

1. The woman in the OP didn't die from Trombosis, or an trombotic event.  The current reported cause was she died from a seizure.

 

"She then took two paracetamol tablets in the evening, followed by her migraine medication about four hours later.   15 minutes after, she had a seizure."

 

2. The link between the AZ vaccine and blood clots has been known for a while now.  I am sure they screen people for trombosis before administering AZ.  This means that any recent cases of blood clots are happening in people with no peviously known trombosis/clotting problems.

 

3. She started feeling unwell, and died within hours of the vaccin.  Not "between 4 and 22 days" as in the cases of most blood clots.  This makes it far more suspicious and likely that it was caused/triggered by the vaccin.  Look at it this way: if the seizure happened within 5 minutes of the vaccin, the suspicion would be even much stronger.

[berybert]

2 hours ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

very sad indeed. not sure who is the idiot who replied with smiley.

when i took the vaccine i also felt some unusual phisical stress, i decided to take a rest

and relax for two weeks after each vaccine.

one sceintist calculted it this way, according to data about the deceased from vaccive vs. virus:

 

there is a chance of 1 to 100,000 to die from the vaccine, and 1 to 5000 to die from the virus.

the chance to die from the virus can be reduced to allmost zero once herd immunity is achieved.

herd immunity is achieved once 70% of the population has been vaccinated.

thailand might get there within 3-4 months.

The UK has been jabbing for the best part of 6 months and 40%  of adults have had both jabs. 

That's adults not the population, will take 2 or 3 more months before herd immunity is reached there.

Think you are being somewhat hopeful Thailand will manage it  within 4 months. 

[sezze]

1 minute ago, berybert said:

The UK has been jabbing for the best part of 6 months and 40%  of adults have had both jabs. 

That's adults not the population, will take 2 or 3 more months before herd immunity is reached there.

Think you are being somewhat hopeful Thailand will manage it  within 4 months. 

All is needed is the stock of vaccines , syringes , needles , people . UK started sooner then rest of Europe , but the story is the same everywhere , you can't vaccinate 10 people when you only got 1 in stock . As long as you got the vaccines all can be done extremely fast . I am not saying Thailand got them , highly doubt it , but it matter of time frame  , even 1 month is possible ( or less , as long you got all the stocks needed ) .

[richard_smith237]

27 minutes ago, wadman said:

4 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

You mean like the 1 in 4 people world wide who die from a conditions related to Thrombosis ?

 

More people die of Thrombosis than car accidents, breast cancer road traffic accidents..... 

 

https://www.worldthrombosisday.org/issue/thrombosis/

 

900,000 people in the US suffer a thrombotic event each year - 1 in 9 of them die. 

 

 

We are being told to remain hydrated by every medical professional we come across ??? why ???

Thrombosis is one of the greatest silent killers known. 

 

So... Of course some of the people who have been vaccinated suffer from a Thrombotic condition... it was always going to happen. 

 

Expand  

 

1. The woman in the OP didn't die from Trombosis, or an trombotic event.  The current reported cause was she died from a seizure.

 

"She then took two paracetamol tablets in the evening, followed by her migraine medication about four hours later.   15 minutes after, she had a seizure."

 

Thank you...  I know. Everyone else know. We read the thread which naturally migrated onto the concerns surrounding the safety of AstraZeneca safety after GrandPapillon [poster] comments that nobody in Europe wants the AZ vaccine. 

 

27 minutes ago, wadman said:

2. The link between the AZ vaccine and blood clots has been known for a while now.  I am sure they screen people for trombosis before administering AZ.  This means that any recent cases of blood clots are happening in people with no peviously known trombosis/clotting problems.

 

A complete and total guess on your part. No screening whatsoever, just a medical questionnaire (we can argue the semantics of whether or not that means ’screening’ but I just ticked no for everything so I could get the vaccine). 

I had PE last year. 

Thrombotic events happen to a lot of people and totally out of the blue, no pre-warning.

 

27 minutes ago, wadman said:

3. She started feeling unwell, and died within hours of the vaccin.  Not "between 4 and 22 days" as in the cases of most blood clots.  This makes it far more suspicious and likely that it was caused/triggered by the vaccin.  Look at it this way: if the seizure happened within 5 minutes of the vaccin, the suspicion would be even much stronger.

 

It is not impossible that the vaccine caused the death of this lady. Neither is it impossible that an existing medical cerebral problem (she had migraine medication to hand) caused the seizure and the timing was coincidence. 

 

Based on statistics 1526 people will die every hour in Thailand, with mass vaccination campaigns underway some of those deaths will be within 24 hrs of taking a vaccine. 

 

Thus: Did the vaccine cause the migraine? did the migraine medication cause the seizure ? did the vaccine cause the seizure outright irrelevant of the medication? or is all of the above irrelevant and the lady had a medical condition anyway the timing in relationship to the vaccine is nothing more than coincidence?

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

46 minutes ago, wadman said:

"She then took two paracetamol tablets in the evening, followed by her migraine medication about four hours later.   15 minutes after, she had a seizure."

 

 

3. She started feeling unwell, and died within hours of the vaccin.  Not "between 4 and 22 days" as in the cases of most blood clots.  This makes it far more suspicious and likely that it was caused/triggered by the vaccin.  Look at it this way: if the seizure happened within 5 minutes of the vaccin, the suspicion would be even much stronger.

 

I wanted to address this point separately. 

 

The lady died within hours of the vaccine - you suspect the vaccine. 

The lady died within 15 mins of taking migraine medication - you suspect the vaccine. 

 

 

 

 

 

[retsdon]

Correlation is not causation.

[berybert]

55 minutes ago, sezze said:

All is needed is the stock of vaccines , syringes , needles , people . UK started sooner then rest of Europe , but the story is the same everywhere , you can't vaccinate 10 people when you only got 1 in stock . As long as you got the vaccines all can be done extremely fast . I am not saying Thailand got them , highly doubt it , but it matter of time frame  , even 1 month is possible ( or less , as long you got all the stocks needed ) .

You could do it in a day if you had 70 million doses and 35 million people to jab each other. 

So this time tomorrow it's all over. Wonderful.

[richard_smith237]

11 minutes ago, berybert said:

You could do it in a day if you had 70 million doses and 35 million people to jab each other. 

So this time tomorrow it's all over. Wonderful.

 

There are 1318 hospitals in Thailand.

 

Send a two of nurses out in 20 vans from each hospital each with a van and a supply of vaccines (which can be stored with refrigeration). 

 

If those nurses can each vaccinate 200 people per day the nations adults could be vaccinated in 3 weeks. 

 

They can set up at markets, temples etc...  Hospitals can also continue to issue vaccines by appointment. 

 

 

So... why can’t this happen ???? Its mathematically feasible and there are plenty or realistic hurdles... But really, why is not happening ????

 

I’ve not yet read a news report where the government owns up - 'We don’t have enough vaccines’ !!!! 

 

Instead were’ just getting lies and lies and lies.. then the government are blaming people for not registering on an app which is virtually unusable when it is functional.

 

 

 

[SunsetT]

11 hours ago, Surelynot said:

Mmmmmmmm........healthy diet, don't drink or smoke, plenty of light exercise, avoid unnecessary risks...........??????

.....And get killed in a Thai road accident.....555.

[SunsetT]

11 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Always a lack of info in these stories. Did she have pre existing conditions other than Migraines. Had she had seizures before

Yes, I would think that the 1st question to the neice would have, should have been: "Did your auntie suffer from epilepsy?"

Edited June 9, 2021 by SunsetT

[wadman]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

I wanted to address this point separately. 

 

The lady died within hours of the vaccine - you suspect the vaccine. 

The lady died within 15 mins of taking migraine medication - you suspect the vaccine. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Paracetamol has been around for a long time, and used a lot.  That's plenty of data saying that such rapid death was caused by those 2 Paracetamols alone (i.e. not in conjunction with the AZ vaccine) is exceedingly small.

 

She quite possibly has a drink of water in the preceeding 4 (or 8 ) hours too.  Same logic, water causing a seizure leading to death isn't so common, so you don't suspect that either.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by wadman

[SunsetT]

11 hours ago, jackdd said:

If you bring feelings into it you can make everything look bad. But if looking at it objectively the previous poster is right.

Especially because we don't even know if it had anything to do with the vaccine. If you give a paracetamol to 800k people there might also be one that dies from a stroke, but this doesn't mean that it's because of the paracetamol.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by SunsetT

[SunsetT]

19 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

Would this be classified as a COVID-19 death?

 

I'm guessing no.

 

 

My neighbor, healthy, fit 30 - 35 YO Thai male, vaxxed Monday morning with AZ, had a mild fever, groggy/dizzy, body ache/joint pain. He's nearly back to normal today.

 

Others, six people, I know with AZ over the last month, zero side effects.

 

 

I had no side effects with the 1st AZ jab for 3 days, apart from a bit sore at the site, but then I felt like   <deleted>  for the next 3 days with a muzzy head, aches all over and extreme fatigue. Fine since then.

[wadman]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

A complete and total guess on your part. No screening whatsoever, just a medical questionnaire (we can argue the semantics of whether or not that means ’screening’ but I just ticked no for everything so I could get the vaccine). 

 

If you want to knowingly lie on the questionnaire, that's your prerogative.  I don't see how that's not screening.

Flight attendant to traveller: do you have any nut allergies?

Traveller: no

Flight attendant:  well, here is a bag of peanuts then

Parents of traveller: we are suing you for the death of our son!!!

 

  

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

It is not impossible that the vaccine caused the death of this lady. Neither is it impossible that an existing medical cerebral problem (she had migraine medication to hand) caused the seizure and the timing was coincidence. 

 

Based on statistics 1526 people will die every hour in Thailand, with mass vaccination campaigns underway some of those deaths will be within 24 hrs of taking a vaccine. 

 

Thus: Did the vaccine cause the migraine? did the migraine medication cause the seizure ? did the vaccine cause the seizure outright irrelevant of the medication? or is all of the above irrelevant and the lady had a medical condition anyway the timing in relationship to the vaccine is nothing more than coincidence?

 

 

 

 

At least you are acknowledging that the cause might have been the vaccine, we are getting somewhere.  It may or may not have been the vaccine, but with what is known (been made public) so far, for me, the number 1 suspect in this case is the vaccine.  Maybe not on it's own, possibly as a trigger, or in combination with her other meds.

[ray666]

2 hours ago, retsdon said:

Correlation is not causation.

The vaccine is safe. Get a life people

 

[richard_smith237]

4 minutes ago, wadman said:

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

I wanted to address this point separately. 

 

The lady died within hours of the vaccine - you suspect the vaccine. 

The lady died within 15 mins of taking migraine medication - you suspect the vaccine. 

 

 

 

 

 

Expand  

 

Paracetamol has been around for a long time, and used a lot.  That's plenty of data saying that such rapid death was caused by those 2 Paracetamols alone (i.e. not in conjunction with the AZ vaccine) is exceedingly small.

 

She quite possibly has a drink of water in the preceeding 4 (or 8 ) hours too.  Same logic, water causing a seizure leading to death isn't so common, so you don't suspect that either.

 

 

My point is that the lady died 15 minutes after taking migraine medication... so why blame anything else ?

Answer: Because all possibilities exist. So, why is only the vaccine being blamed ?

 

The vaccine is ofcourse a possible cause of seizure and death, but the patient was also on migraine medication, not heart medication, or medication for arthritis etc... but specifically medication for the ‘brain’.... the lady died while having a seizure. 

 

 

Shall we look at the patient / deceased: Someone who has been having headaches / migraines, doctors have prescribed her ‘migraine medication’... maybe the Dr’s were correct. Or, maybe her headaches / migraines were a symptom of something else.....  Then she had a seizure. 

 

Was her seizure caused by the Migraine medication ? was her seizure caused by the vaccine ? or was her seizure going to happen anyway because she had an existing brain condition ?

 

 

None of this seems to matter to those who are intent of blaming the vaccine.

 

I reiterate, the vaccine could have been the cause, but lets not blindly omit other information available to us just suit an anti-covid-vaccine agenda - that is confirmation bias.

 

 

 

[wadman]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

 

My point is that the lady died 15 minutes after taking migraine medication... so why blame anything else ?

Answer: Because all possibilities exist. So, why is only the vaccine being blamed ?

 

The vaccine is ofcourse a possible cause of seizure and death, but the patient was also on migraine medication, not heart medication, or medication for arthritis etc... but specifically medication for the ‘brain’.... the lady died while having a seizure. 

 

 

Shall we look at the patient / deceased: Someone who has been having headaches / migraines, doctors have prescribed her ‘migraine medication’... maybe the Dr’s were correct. Or, maybe her headaches / migraines were a symptom of something else.....  Then she had a seizure. 

 

Was her seizure caused by the Migraine medication ? was her seizure caused by the vaccine ? or was her seizure going to happen anyway because she had an existing brain condition ?

 

 

None of this seems to matter to those who are intent of blaming the vaccine.

 

I reiterate, the vaccine could have been the cause, but lets not blindly omit other information available to us just suit an anti-covid-vaccine agenda - that is confirmation bias.

 

 

 

 

Presumably she didn't get the migraine medication at the same time as her vaccin in a one stop shopping exercise.  That being so, she had taken the migraine meds before, and they had not killed her, or caused any serious effects.

 

1. was this time the unlucky time, where the migraine meds would cause a seizure and kill her?  Even though they did not the previous times?

 

2. Did the migraine meds IN CONJUNCTION WITH the vaccin cause the seizure?  Or maybe just the vaccin on its own?

 

Again, the probabilities is more likely to be number 2.

[richard_smith237]

35 minutes ago, wadman said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

A complete and total guess on your part. No screening whatsoever, just a medical questionnaire (we can argue the semantics of whether or not that means ’screening’ but I just ticked no for everything so I could get the vaccine). 

 

If you want to knowingly lie on the questionnaire, that's your prerogative.  I don't see how that's not screening.

Flight attendant to traveller: do you have any nut allergies?

Traveller: no

Flight attendant:  well, here is a bag of peanuts then

Parents of traveller: we are suing you for the death of our son!!!

 

Strawman argument....   No toddler involved, I know my medical history and the risks I face.

 

If you wish to counter my argument - please remember what it was, then address it directly.

i.e. I had a Pulmonary Embolism last year, I just answered no to everything on the questionnaire (the questionnaire didn’t ask if I had ever suffered a thrombosis). 

 

The medical questionnaire covered questions such as: 

- Are you feeling sick today

- Have you a dose of any vaccine already

- Have you never had an allergic reaction to a vaccine

- Any allergies 

- Have you had Covid-19 and been treated (details of treatment)

- Have you been diagnosed with Multisystem Inflammatory Syndrom

- Do you have a weakened immune system (HIV, Cancer treatment)

- Do you take immunosuppressive medication

- Do you have a bleeding disorder 

- Do you have history of heparin induced thrombocytopenia 

(and a couple more similar questions I can’t quite remember). 

 

Quote

  

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

It is not impossible that the vaccine caused the death of this lady. Neither is it impossible that an existing medical cerebral problem (she had migraine medication to hand) caused the seizure and the timing was coincidence. 

 

Based on statistics 1526 people will die every hour in Thailand, with mass vaccination campaigns underway some of those deaths will be within 24 hrs of taking a vaccine. 

 

Thus: Did the vaccine cause the migraine? did the migraine medication cause the seizure ? did the vaccine cause the seizure outright irrelevant of the medication? or is all of the above irrelevant and the lady had a medical condition anyway the timing in relationship to the vaccine is nothing more than coincidence?

 

 

 

Expand  

 

At least you are acknowledging that the cause might have been the vaccine, we are getting somewhere.  It may or may not have been the vaccine, but with what is known (been made public) so far, for me, the number 1 suspect in this case is the vaccine.  Maybe not on it's own, possibly as a trigger, or in combination with her other meds.

 

A trigger may have been a combination of Migraine Medication and the Vaccine... All possibilities.

 

But... IF the argument is ‘the deceased died within hours of taking a vaccine’... Well the argument should also be, 'the decease died within minutes of taking Migraine medication’ ....  

 

... How is the fact that she was suffering ‘pain’ in her brain prior to taking the vaccine any less of a factor especially when considering the cause of death, a seizure ?

 

 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by richard_smith237

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, wadman said:

 

Presumably she didn't get the migraine medication at the same time as her vaccin in a one stop shopping exercise.  That being so, she had taken the migraine meds before, and they had not killed her, or caused any serious effects.

 

1. was this time the unlucky time, where the migraine meds would cause a seizure and kill her?  Even though they did not the previous times?

 

2. Did the migraine meds IN CONJUNCTION WITH the vaccin cause the seizure?  Or maybe just the vaccin on its own?

 

Again, the probabilities is more likely to be number 2.

 

Playing devils advocate here - I’ve made my point enough already I think. 

 

1) She was on medication for migraines (pain in the brain) and died of a brain problem (a seizure). Is the fact that she was prescribed medication indication of an underlying condition? - the medication didn’t kill her, the underlying condition did. 

 

2) Migraine Meds in conjunction with her vaccine cause the seizure? possible. 

 

3) Vaccine on is own cause the seizure? again, possible. 

 

All of these are possibilities......  depending on ones level of ‘vaccine concern' why is it so readily assumed, by many that the cause of death was the vaccine. 

 

I doubt we will ever find out for certain. But one thing is for sure, the media and those who may be described as ‘anti-covid-vaxxers’ will count this as a ‘vaccine death’ and won’t let any other realistic possibilities interfere with their bias. 

 

 

 

 

[jak2002003]

12 hours ago, audaciousnomad said:

Over 800,000 administered in 2 days. One fatality. 0.001%. Not bad.
Probably should not have hastily downed a couple of paracetamols plus migraine meds though. ????

Would that will be the reaction of your family and friends if that happened to you after you got the vaccination?  

[jak2002003]

12 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Playing devils advocate here - I’ve made my point enough already I think. 

 

1) She was on medication for migraines (pain in the brain) and died of a brain problem (a seizure). Is the fact that she was prescribed medication indication of an underlying condition? - the medication didn’t kill her, the underlying condition did. 

 

2) Migraine Meds in conjunction with her vaccine cause the seizure? possible. 

 

3) Vaccine on is own cause the seizure? again, possible. 

 

All of these are possibilities......  depending on ones level of ‘vaccine concern' why is it so readily assumed, by many that the cause of death was the vaccine. 

 

I doubt we will ever find out for certain. But one thing is for sure, the media and those who may be described as ‘anti-covid-vaxxers’ will count this as a ‘vaccine death’ and won’t let any other realistic possibilities interfere with their bias. 

 

 

 

 

Yes. Similar to the pro Covid vaccination people that count ever death as a Covid 19 death even if the people died of heart attacks or cancer but happened to test positive to the virus.