O visa retirement extension - monthly income requirements - clarification

[simon43]

This requirement doesn't affect me right now, but I wanted to understand the documentary requirements if one applies for a 'retirement' extension based on a monthly income of 65,000THB+.

 

As far as  I recall, this will only be considered if one is able to show documentary evidence that this income comes from a pension.  Other sources of overseas income will not be considered.  Is my understanding correct?

 

I bring about 75,000 THB into Thailand each month, and spend this for the (small) benefit of Thailand.  But if that income cannot be considered for a monthly income retirement extension application, then I might as well not bring it into Thailand, except for a minimal sum!!

[cnx1204]

The bank papers only need to show it is foreign funds being transferred into Thailand, not the source of those funds.   Retired people could have any number of sources for that money, a pension is just one of them.

[Lite Beer]

As long as it is comming in every month from abroad they could not care less where it came from.

[DrJack54]

24 minutes ago, simon43 said:

As far as  I recall, this will only be considered if one is able to show documentary evidence that this income comes from a pension.

I assume your embassy does not provide income letter.

 

There is a possibility that your particular immigration office wants to see the word "pension"or evidence of such.

I suggest you name your immigration office and hopefully will receive first hand report regarding funds from things such as rents and other investment returns being used to meet the 65k per month. 

 

 

[simon43]

^^ As I mentioned, it's not a concern right now, (because I have a WP, not a retirement extension).  I'll continue bringing in 65k+ each month and see whether I need to apply for a retirement extension in the future ????

[statman78]

As mentioned above, I’ve heard that some IOs may require you to show that it is from a pension.  Here in Chiang Rai all I need to show transfers from abroad every month of at least 65k.  Since my US embassy does not provide the income letter I provide an annual statement from my bank along with a copy of of my passbook with the monthly transfers highlighted.  I’ve never had any problems.

[mtls2005]

On 5/1/2022 at 8:55 AM, simon43 said:

that this income comes from a pension.  Other sources of overseas income will not be considered.  Is my understanding correct?

No.

 

The regulation says "income such as pension, interest or other income".

 

Rarely do people aged 50 have a pension, yes, I'll stipulate that some do. U.S. Social Security is not a "pension".

 

The source of the transferred funds are detailed in a Credit Advice/Receipt, and cna be supported by documents from the originating or intermediary bank.

 

As with all things here, individual offices and IOs can ask/demand any documents they deem required.

 

 

On 5/1/2022 at 8:55 AM, simon43 said:

I bring about 75,000 THB into Thailand each month, and spend this for the (small) benefit of Thailand. 

Maybe just build up to 800,000? Or 400,000 if married to a thai.

 

[jimn]

14 hours ago, simon43 said:

^^ As I mentioned, it's not a concern right now, (because I have a WP, not a retirement extension).  I'll continue bringing in 65k+ each month and see whether I need to apply for a retirement extension in the future ????

It can come from any source transferred internationally. A pension is one example. If you are using an app like WISE to transfer the money, which is the cheapest method, the transaction has to specifically show it comes from abroad. WISE uses local banks to complete the transaction in many cases. Although the transaction originated abroad it doesnt count if its completed locally. Just be aware.

[RafPinto]

On 5/1/2022 at 9:25 AM, DrJack54 said:

I assume your embassy does not provide income letter.

 

There is a possibility that your particular immigration office wants to see the word "pension"or evidence of such.

I suggest you name your immigration office and hopefully will receive first hand report regarding funds from things such as rents and other investment returns being used to meet the 65k per month. 

 

 

I am soon due my renewal.
I applied for an Affidavit from my Embassy and probably on Friday, on my way to immigration.

[RafPinto]

14 hours ago, simon43 said:

^^ As I mentioned, it's not a concern right now, (because I have a WP, not a retirement extension).  I'll continue bringing in 65k+ each month and see whether I need to apply for a retirement extension in the future ????

Didn't you tell us you moved from Laos to Turkey or something like that, a couple of months ago and now, you have a WP for Thailand?

[CharlieH]

3 minutes ago, RafPinto said:

I am soon due my renewal.
I applied for an Affidavit from my Embassy and probably on Friday, on my way to immigration.

You are fortunate many Embassies discontinued the "proof of income" letters causjng many people problems.

[RafPinto]

Just now, CharlieH said:

You are fortunate many Embassies discontinued the "proof of income" letters causjng many people problems.

I know.
Last year, my Embassy started to request bank statements to back my declaration up.
Fair enough.

[Siameaze]

It's important to have the monthly transfer appear on a Thai bank statement as International Transfer.

I transfer sufficient US Dollars but they must be verifiable as International Transfer and not Bhatnet on the Thai bank statements that Udon Thani Immigration requires as the proof source.

Udon Thani asks for source of income documentation. I also use annual Social Security letter and recent letters of Income Verification from pension funds. For me, these are easy to get from my pension providers and I usually use letters less than 2 months old

[chilly07]

2 hours ago, RafPinto said:

I know.
Last year, my Embassy started to request bank statements to back my declaration up.
Fair enough.

Untill the UK Embassy reneged on income letters I used to send copies of my P60 tax certs to them as proof. They still reneged for no good reason. Immigration just want the bank certs proving that the Embassy had absolutely no grounds for reneging on the income letters

[fceligoj]

I don't know what other Immigration Offices require as supporting documentation other than the proof that the transfers are from abroad, but Khon Kaen does request that additional supporting documentation says where the sources of funds are from.  This is over and above what is provided by the Thai banks defining the transfers.  Since I am from the US, the IRS Form 1099R's which my previous employers, my IRA, and Social Security provide for completing one's Form 1040 Tax Return, these are adequate.  Or at least that is what I have offered and they have accepted.

[lopburi3]

23 hours ago, jimn said:

WISE uses local banks to complete the transaction in many cases. Although the transaction originated abroad it doesnt count if its completed locally. Just be aware.

Wise uses local transfer but tracking paperwork show it was international - for Bangkok Bank if they use their account at BBL it will be recorded a FTT (foreign transfer) in passbook and on statement - if no such indication such paperwork can be obtained from the Wise account bank to show foreign origin.  

[DrJack54]

On 5/2/2022 at 9:34 AM, jimn said:

Although the transaction originated abroad it doesnt count if its completed locally. Just be aware.

That is not correct. 

[bbko]

On 5/2/2022 at 9:34 AM, jimn said:

Although the transaction originated abroad it doesnt count if its completed locally.

A little bit incorrect, if completed locally you can still get proof of it being an overseas transfer but it take a few more steps/baht.  Go to the "local" bank that made the transfer (some cases the international branch) along with photocopies of the Wise transfers details, your passport/visa, your bankbook and 200b and they'll print out a letter showing the money came from an international transfer.

Edit; if doing monthly Wise transfers, it's best to contact Wise and tell them to "tag" your transfers to only use certain banks, in my case Bangkok Bank and when doing monthly transfers only select "Long Term Stay in Thailand" for the reason.

[jimn]

19 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

That is not correct. 

Come on then clever clogs. Explain. If its classed as an international transfer the bank book will show International Funds Transfer, FTT. If its just a local transaction it doesnt, it just shows transfer from a/c at another bank. These are not accepted. Unless you go through a complicated process to get it changed. Now give your explaination like you do on every topic. 

[lopburi3]

20 minutes ago, jimn said:

Come on then clever clogs. Explain. If its classed as an international transfer the bank book will show International Funds Transfer, FTT. If its just a local transaction it doesnt, it just shows transfer from a/c at another bank. These are not accepted. Unless you go through a complicated process to get it changed. Now give your explaination like you do on every topic. 

It is international in that the funds are paid outside Thailand - but the funds are transferred into local account from a local account.  Much like the old shophouse system where local merchant in foreign country accepts money and pays out from his account in Thailand.  As original source for funds can be provided by the paying bank in Thailand this is accepted as proof of foreign origin.  The FTT on Bangkok Bank accounts is a transfer from WISE Bangkok Bank account - just that Bangkok Bank knows the origin and so indicates (without added paperwork).

[OJAS]

On 5/2/2022 at 9:34 AM, jimn said:

It can come from any source transferred internationally. A pension is one example. If you are using an app like WISE to transfer the money, which is the cheapest method, the transaction has to specifically show it comes from abroad. WISE uses local banks to complete the transaction in many cases. Although the transaction originated abroad it doesnt count if its completed locally. Just be aware.

Should @simon43 opt in due course to go down the retirement extension route based on 65k monthly income, the best way in which he could guarantee the coveted FTT or International Transfer coding in passbooks or supporting bank statements would be to open a Bangkok Bank account into which he could make monthly transfers through a Wise account, which will, however, need to be tagged so to ensure that Wise always use Bangkok Bank as their Thai partner bank in the case of his transfers.

 

He should also be aware that, with the exception of Bangkok Bank, SCB and Kasikorn, the maximum single transfer permitted by Wise into Thai bank accounts these days is 50k - which is, of course, 15k short of the required monthly IMM minimum.

[lopburi3]

3 minutes ago, OJAS said:

the maximum single transfer permitted by Wise into Thai bank accounts these days is 50k - which is, of course, 15k short of the required monthly IMM minimum.

Yes but you can do as many transfer as you want - there is no requirement that 65k has to be one transfer for extensions of stay.

[OJAS]

1 minute ago, lopburi3 said:

Yes but you can do as many transfer as you want - there is no requirement that 65k has to be one transfer for extensions of stay.

True - but I just wonder whether passbooks and statements which don't actually show individual monthly transfer figures of 65k+ could drive immigration officers into a state of apoplexy as they attempt the necessary number-crunching to establish whether a series of random figures indicated do, indeed, total at least 65k per calendar month!????

[JAS21]

Early every month I bring into this country a sum of 65,100thb from the UK using WISE. 

 

Every year Nonthaburi Immigration asks me to prove that my pension is at least that amount.

 

How stupid of them,  do they think MrsJ can survive on that….

[jimn]

4 hours ago, JAS21 said:

Early every month I bring into this country a sum of 65,100thb from the UK using WISE. 

 

Every year Nonthaburi Immigration asks me to prove that my pension is at least that amount.

 

How stupid of them,  do they think MrsJ can survive on that….

Its such a flawed system. Because I go back to the UK for 4 months or so every year I choose to keep my money in my UK bank account. I pay all my shopping bills and most restaurant bills on my no fee credit cards where I get the mastercard exchange rate which is close to the Wise rate. This means I need nowhere near 65k a month cash. I therefore use an agent for my retirement extension.

[JAS21]

3 hours ago, jimn said:

Its such a flawed system. Because I go back to the UK for 4 months or so every year I choose to keep my money in my UK bank account. I pay all my shopping bills and most restaurant bills on my no fee credit cards where I get the mastercard exchange rate which is close to the Wise rate. This means I need nowhere near 65k a month cash. I therefore use an agent for my retirement extension.

From what I hear the going rate for what you do is around 13Kthb, so seems you are well set up.

 

Us on the other hand, even though the cars and house are paid for, on average get through more than 1.2Mthb a year,,,Golf/holidays/ medical etc etc. and that doesn’t include if we change a car. So bringing money in through WISE for us is the best way.

 

We have never been back to the UK since we left in 2007. Often thought it would be nice to visit May-June or June-July but guess never will now.

 

Maybe others would be interested to know who these no-fee credit cards are with… I read a lot of complaints about card charges……

[jimn]

14 hours ago, JAS21 said:

From what I hear the going rate for what you do is around 13Kthb, so seems you are well set up.

 

Us on the other hand, even though the cars and house are paid for, on average get through more than 1.2Mthb a year,,,Golf/holidays/ medical etc etc. and that doesn’t include if we change a car. So bringing money in through WISE for us is the best way.

 

We have never been back to the UK since we left in 2007. Often thought it would be nice to visit May-June or June-July but guess never will now.

 

Maybe others would be interested to know who these no-fee credit cards are with… I read a lot of complaints about card charges……

Yes 12,900 baht I renewed my extension yesterday. We go back to the UK in 3 weeks until October 5th.

You have to have a UK bank account, a decent credit rating and obviously a UK address. I have 2 cards. The Halifax Clarity Mastercard and The Barclaycard Platinum Visa card. Both use either the Mastercard or Visa exchange rates which are excellent. I manage the accounts via their apps and pay monthly by direct debit. No foreign transaction fees whatsoever. Easy if you can get.