2 hours ago, ozimoron said:

If you buy a bitcoin today you will own it. It's exactly the same as buying a useless 400 year old painting. The issue here is that people can't get their heads around "if I can't touch it it, it's not real". Deal with it, bitcoin didn't go from 0.30c to $65,000 for no reason over ten years. You might not like it but that's hardly an argument against it.

Tulips were once very expensive too…

delete

 

1 hour ago, lkn said:

I would argue it has moved an enormous amount of wealth.

 

Something crypto investors fail to understand is that profit must come from somewhere. If I buy stock in Pfizer, and they pay me $1-2 per stock in annual dividend, then that money is from the profit they made by selling medicine.

 

If I bought the stock 3 years ago for $35 and it is now trading at $50 then that is because 3 years ago we had no idea about all the revenue Pfizer would be making from selling their Comirnaty vaccine, which in turn should increase their annual dividend / company value.

 

Of course all that profit made on the Pfizer stock comes from people buying Pfizer products, so one could argue that here we are also just moving money.

 

The big difference is that those who buy Pfizer products (or goods and services from any company) hopefully get something they need/want for their money.

I agree with what you stated. I meant it has created an enormous amount of wealth for many of its investors.  Someday it might even add functionality as paper money does.  The current crypto currencies may be even superior to paper money in the future but I have serious doubts.  I do think  forms of crypto currencies will replace paper money but what will this future crypto currency will look like? It is currently an investment that is 100% timing and has nothing to do with functionality for most  of its investors.

 

 The odds of the current crypto currencies being worth anything in real terms is minimal 10 years from now but I think we both realize we could be wrong.  I'm just a curious observer in much the way I was with Covid.  People are interesting and extremes bring out the oddest behavior.

3 hours ago, ozimoron said:

If you buy a bitcoin today you will own it. It's exactly the same as buying a useless 400 year old painting. The issue here is that people can't get their heads around "if I can't touch it it, it's not real". Deal with it, bitcoin didn't go from 0.30c to $65,000 for no reason over ten years. You might not like it but that's hardly an argument against it.

It's not that they don't like it, they just don't know how to buy it. 

 

 

5 minutes ago, atpeace said:

I agree with what you stated. I meant it has created an enormous amount of wealth for many of its investors.  Someday it might even add functionality as paper money does.  The current crypto currencies may be even superior to paper money in the future but I have serious doubts.  I do think  forms of crypto currencies will replace paper money but what will this future crypto currency will look like? It is currently an investment that is 100% timing and has nothing to do with functionality for most  of its investors.

There will be no paper money soon. China is already a cashless society, with Thailand not far behind.  

 

15 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

Tulips were once very expensive too…

I bet you don't like using a mobile phone ????

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

There will be no paper money soon. China is already a cashless society, with Thailand not far behind.  

 

Yes, that is what will be the demise of the current forms of crypto IMO.  Too many better options will become available and IMO  most  be controlled by powerful countries.  You seem to think we all don't get it?  We do and have seen this many times before. 

 

Progress never stops but the current crypto crowd think it revolves around them. We get it or at least most of us do.  Paper money is not the future!!!

16 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I bet you don't like using a mobile phone ????

Looks like you lost again…

This is a pretty well researched article, talking with both proponents, critics, and trying to “trade crypto” (on Uniswap): https://www.vox.com/the-goods/23071245/bitcoin-price-crypto-ethereum-nfts-defi-stablecoin

 

There’s no right or wrong.

From where I stand, the crypto guys have that missionary zeal in their eyes and that’s ok…

They have “faith” and those that don’t, won’t.

15 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

Looks like you lost again…

Lost what?

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Lost what?

Another bet my child…

3 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

Another bet my child…

What are you talking about Gramps?

18 minutes ago, lkn said:

This is a pretty well researched article, talking with both proponents, critics, and trying to “trade crypto” (on Uniswap): https://www.vox.com/the-goods/23071245/bitcoin-price-crypto-ethereum-nfts-defi-stablecoin

 

Excellent article. Thank you.

I think I know why the haters are out in force in this thread. 

The stock market is imploding and they are annoyed that they didn't listen to the advice of the wise, who told them to put 1% into crypto as a hedge. Attacking crypto is like self-righteous indignation to raise their spirits ????

34 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Progress never stops but the current crypto crowd think it revolves around them. We get it or at least most  us do.  Paper money is not the future!!!

Seems like a clan or a religion. Does who do not agree with them are haters and all other things that can be named. We all go to hell (missing out and excluded from future) and are complete morons and idiots who do not understand! 

 

Well, we will see at the end of this decade, we should have the answers by then if not before.

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I think I know why the haters are out in force in this thread. 

The stock market is imploding and they are annoyed that they didn't listen to the advice of the wise, who told them to put 1% into crypto as a hedge. Attacking crypto is like self-righteous indignation to raise their spirits ????

Good timing on your post while I was writing mine ????

2 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Seems like a clan or a religion. Does who do not agree with them are haters and all other things that can be named. We all go to hell (missing out and excluded from future) and are complete morons and idiots who do not understand

Same could be said for any new technology. 

18 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

Excellent article. Thank you.

+1, great read and the author admits he really doesn't know what will happen to crypto but in its current state it sure seems silly.

 

29 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

There’s no right or wrong.

From where I stand, the crypto guys have that missionary zeal in their eyes and that’s ok…

They have “faith” and those that don’t, won’t.

I suggest you read this -  https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/what-the-luddites-really-fought-against-264412/

9 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Seems like a clan or a religion. Does who do not agree with them are haters and all other things that can be named. We all go to hell (missing out and excluded from future) and are complete morons and idiots who do not understand! 

 

Well, we will see at the end of this decade, we should have the answers by then if not before.

I've been the bull in a China shop in my past but now I enjoy the recreation of watching what I don't fully understand unfold/unravel. 

 

My bet is we see new highs in Bitcoin but it is becoming less likely.  It seems a little too early to see it all fall apart.  I think by the end of the decade it will be toast and replaced with better alternatives that are not even referred to as crypto but resemble it.

26 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I think I know why the haters are out in force in this thread. 

The stock market is imploding and they are annoyed that they didn't listen to the advice of the wise, who told them to put 1% into crypto as a hedge. Attacking crypto is like self-righteous indignation to raise their spirits ????

Put 1% into crypto? ???? As a hedge?  Not at all wise, my friend.

Got any more drunken advice to peddle? This is hilarious!

20 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Same could be said for any new technology. 

I just dont see what new technology have to do with crypto currency’s. It have no what so ever advantage for normal people, and cashless payment system is already available, and im sure new systems will come along and be more environmental friendlier than todays solutions. 
 

It is a bubble, end of discussion from my side of it. 

13 minutes ago, atpeace said:

I've been the bull in a China shop in my past but now I enjoy the recreation of watching what I don't fully understand unfold/unravel. 

 

My bet is we see new highs in Bitcoin but it is becoming less likely.  It seems a little too early to see it all fall apart.  I think by the end of the decade it will be toast and replaced with better alternatives that are not even referred to as crypto but resemble it.

Im sure it have been a hell of a ride for those who have the guts to pull out in time. For the rest, it will be desperate times ahead. Anyway hard to predict, but one more all time high, and who knows

6 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Im sure it have been a hell of a ride for those who have the guts to pull out in time. For the rest, it will be desperate times ahead. Anyway hard to predict, but one more all time high, and who knows

What I have found is that those with the  guts are the biggest losers.  Those that use their heads, not me, and hedge or completely exit while the bubble has potentially many years left are the winners.   Also those that don't use their heads at all and invest in an index fund and don't trade seem to do well.

 

I did it at the beginning of 2007 and sat in cash until it unraveled.  My foresight has been awful the last 10 years.  Still don't understand how  increasing money supply had such an impact on on stock, bonds, real estate values.  I knew it would put  upward pressure on asset valuation but thought there would be short term consequences and I was wrong.  It took 20 years of easy money policies to get to where we are today.  It is what it is and life goes on.

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

I bet you don't like using a mobile phone ????

An extremely nonsensical analogy. Clearly other people have made smarter investment decisions than you. It's understandable if you're upset about your beloved bitcoins evaporating, but you should learn from the winners and start over again.

44 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I just dont see what new technology have to do with crypto currency’s. It have no what so ever advantage for normal people, and cashless payment system is already available, and im sure new systems will come along and be more environmental friendlier than todays solutions. 
 

It is a bubble, end of discussion from my side of it. 

Then stop with the posting if you have reached the end of the rope.

Haters

 

Luddites

 

Flat Earthers

 

I don’t know about anybody else, but if someone feels the need to cajole or insult me into investing in something (similar to real estate agents circa 2006) then I feel that it’s probably not in my best interest to do so.

 

YMMV

5 hours ago, lkn said:

I am just asking what it does, where the value comes from, what these use-cases are, and the response is: You just don’t understand.

"You just don't understand" is actually a translation of "I have no answer" ????

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

It's not that they don't like it, they just don't know how to buy it. 

please tell us again how do you buy it? ????