Special Feature: What happens when a foreigner dies in Thailand???

[scorecard]

2 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

If you have a sound relationship then putting all your finances into joint accounts is a good thing?  ???? 

Done - me and my adult Thai son who I totally trust, and the joint savings accounts are set up so that only one signature is needed for withdrawals at the bank, etc. 

[IvorBiggun2]

12 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

So what to do with the gold from the teeth after the body is cremated? Do they give it to the monk, or go and cash it in after melting it.  of course they keep it, I watched an old lady take the gold teeth to the gold shop and after they rinsed them off they weighed the gold and cashed her out....

Wrong. After cremation, the remaining gold is essentially indistinguishable from the ashes to such a point it cannot be found.

[IvorBiggun2]

7 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Done - me and my adult Thai son who I totally trust, and the joint savings accounts are set up so that only one signature is needed for withdrawals at the bank, etc. 

Same for me. My wife will have easy access to her share of my works pension which will be paid monthly into our joint UK online bank account. Basically no need for a will.

[scorecard]

On 8/17/2022 at 3:19 PM, tandor said:

...so you reckon Thailand should just pick up the tab...i call that being ultra irresponsible.

"I don't have any children and I would not necessarily want my next of kin making any arrangements." 

 

So make a simple will, you can easily find simple templates on the WWW for guidance about the overll format. in your case perhaps the content you include could be;

1). Distribution of your assets.

2). your wishes re your funeral/cremation etc.

3). Who should be informed of your passing in your home country (and in Thailand), and include as much current detail you can about address, telephone no, e.mail address of family abroad.

BUT REMEBERING THAT THE CONTENT OF YOUR WILL IS TOTALLY UP TO YOU AND NOT ACCORDING TO THE SUGGESTED SUBJECTS THAT YOU MIGHT FIND ON A BASIC WILL TEMPLATE.

 

None of the above is complicated, doesn't really take much time to complete and it's doesn't need lawyer English.

 

It can be prepared as a Word document or it can be hand written.

 

Just ensure it's properly signed, witnessed and dated, and the executor is named in the will, and ensure the executor/family etc., have a copy of the will. 

 

NOTE: Some will try to tell you the will must be prepared by a lawyer - NOT TRUE.

and some will try to tell you the will must be registered (E.G. at the local amphur office) - AGAIN NOT REQUIRED AT ALL. 

Edited August 20, 2022 by scorecard

[IvorBiggun2]

24 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

I watched an old lady take the gold teeth to the gold shop and after they rinsed them off they weighed the gold and cashed her out....

Total BS

[scorecard]

3 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Same for me. My wife will have easy access to her share of my works pension which will be paid monthly into our joint UK online bank account. Basically no need for a will.

But a simple will could help by providing clear details of:

1). Your wishes re funeral/cremation etc.

2). Who should/should not be informed in your home country that you have passed on. And contact details.

3). Name and contact details of the person who has agreed to be the executor of your will.

 

Simple will templates are easy to find on the WWW. If the details in the will are only as per points 1)., 2)., and 3). above the will can be prepared, signed and witnessed etc. in maybe 10 - 20 minutes. 

[IvorBiggun2]

2 minutes ago, scorecard said:

But a simple will could help by providing clear details of:

1). Your wishes re funeral/cremation etc.

2). Who should/should not be informed in your home country that you have passed on. And contact details.

3). Name and contact details of the person who has agreed to be the executor of your will.

1) Only one way to go where I live.

2) No person to be informed. Other than the embassy.

3) No will. All my assets the wife can access without a lawyer.

[Excel]

1 minute ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

1) Only one way to go where I live.

2) No person to be informed. Other than the embassy.

3) No will. All my assets the wife can access without a lawyer.

Exactly. Nothing can be more simpler than that.

[ThailandRyan]

11 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Total BS

Maybe I should have taken a photo my friend.  Your barking up a tree that has real leaves on it.  Next time I will take a photo for you since you are always a true sceptic and call BS on things that are real.  Just because you did not see it you call BS.....

[IvorBiggun2]

1 minute ago, ThailandRyan said:

 Just because you did not see it you call BS.....

I don't have to see it to know it's BS. Try Googling.

 

Quote

After cremation, the remaining gold is essentially indistinguishable from the ashes to such a point it cannot be found.

 

[ThailandRyan]

33 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Wrong. After cremation, the remaining gold is essentially indistinguishable from the ashes to such a point it cannot be found.

Bone fragments such as knuckles and teeth are often found when they burn the body in a casket outside of a crematorium.  I have photos from attending such a funeral in a small village in Sakhon Nakhon for my ex-wifes aunt who died.  They built a pyre of branches, put the casket on top, then the family walked around in a circle pouring oil from coconut shells onto the branches and casket.  The eldest son nicknamed "Bird" then lit a torch and started the pyre.  While the fire roared to life they lit off fire works and threw candy and small coins into the air for those who were in attendance.  The next morning we returned to where the pyre had been, behind the small temple, and the family sorted through the ashes, picking up fragments which also included the gold teeth.  Try again.  You obviously have never attended such a family funeral.

Edited August 20, 2022 by ThailandRyan

[ThailandRyan]

3 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

I don't have to see it to know it's BS. Try Googling.

 

 

That once again is if a crematorium is used.....try again.

[IvorBiggun2]

7 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

That once again is if a crematorium is used.....try again.

You funny man.

[Neeranam]

On 8/17/2022 at 5:58 AM, JimTripper said:

Please rest in peace soldier, we are sorry this happened to you

'we'?

 

Why be sorry about someone dying? It happens to us all. 

[ThailandRyan]

21 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

You funny man.

The truth sometimes is not what is found in google but in real life....you believe what you want, I know what I saw and witnessed.  It disturbed me greatly to see the family picking through the ashes to find the large knuckles and the teeth, which they all placed in small boxes and kept for posterity........maybe the lady I saw selling the gold teeth had them pulled and received them prior to cremation, however what I saw in person after a funeral pyre tells me differently. 

[JimTripper]

53 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

'we'?

 

Why be sorry about someone dying? It happens to us all. 

Because he may have enjoyed living a bit longer.

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, JimTripper said:

Because he may have enjoyed living a bit longer.

How old was he?

[Simple Jack]

On 8/17/2022 at 9:11 AM, Wuvu2 said:

So what happens if you die here without any family or friends? Lets say my condo staff follows the smell and finds me bloated on the sofa, surrounded by Indian Viagra knockoffs and empty bottles of jack Daniels. What then?

Thats not a circumstance bro. That's a goal ????

[scorecard]

7 hours ago, stupidfarang said:

I think you will find it depends what part of Thailand you are in and what the local officials say or how they interpret the law. A Canadian friend died here, police informed, body taken to the morgue. I informed his children in Canada about his death, they flew over. The police informed the Embassy, no papers were required from the embassy to cremate the body, did not have to wait for any paperwork to sell his bikes and belongings, BKK Bank allowed them to take the money out of his bank account via the ATM (left a few Bhat in there). I sent his passport back to the embassy and they cancelled it. I am sure what you have said is correct but if you live here you will know local officials have their own way of doing things, some by the book or some with the least amount of work.

I live here (PR for 25 years), I don't disagree with any point in your valuable post. 

[NE1]

My friend died last night from an ongoing battle with cancer. He has had laser treatment etc. He is an Englishman who has lived near Ubon Ratchathani for 10 years and married to a Thai lady.

She plans on cremation Monday but as of yet she has no death certificate , and she has just telephoned and asked what the procedure is for informing Embassy , Police etc. She has spoke to her husbands daughter in England who has been aware of her fathers battle , and only requires a Death Certificate for personal reasons.

Can anybody enlighten me as to what I can tell her.

Edited August 20, 2022 by NE1

[Wuvu2]

8 hours ago, Simple Jack said:

Thats not a circumstance bro. That's a goal ????

And there's only one way that we reach our goals- practice, practice, practice ???? 

[JimTripper]

11 hours ago, Neeranam said:

How old was he?

I don't know how old he was, but he may have enjoyed living a bit longer.

[jacko45k]

21 hours ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Same for me. My wife will have easy access to her share of my works pension which will be paid monthly into our joint UK online bank account. Basically no need for a will.

Will that account be left open when your death is registered by the UK.? 

[VBF]

10 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Will that account be left open when your death is registered by the UK.? 

IF the death is registered in UK, the correct procedure is that the account is frozen until Probate is achieved.

At that point the duly appointed Executor takes control of the account and is supposed to distribute its contents in accordance with the Will.

When all monies are removed, the account is then closed by the Executor.

 

If the death is NOT registered in the UK, then any use of the account is illegal as soon as the account holder dies. Having said that, I presume it happens but NOT something one could advocate! 

 

I had this issue when my Mother died (I was her Executor) and had to ensure there was enough money in her account to cover her household bills until I could get them all put in my name. Luckily I had full knowledge of Mother's financial affairs and everything went fairly smoothly. This was in 2014 and I don't think UK law has changed in this regard.

 

[IvorBiggun2]

10 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Will that account be left open when your death is registered by the UK.? 

In the event of my death there really is no need to inform the bank as my wife can carry on making withdrawal's. She has her own Debit Card. She can make withdrawal's with that in Thailand or she can transfer via 'Wise' 

[IvorBiggun2]

24 minutes ago, VBF said:

IF the death is registered in UK, the correct procedure is that the account is frozen until Probate is achieved.

No need. My wife just carries on with the joint account as if I'm still here. She's been doing my/our annual money transfer with her Debit Card for a few years now.

I could have died 10 years ago but they still don't refuse payment cuz my wife does the annual transfer. Same applies in Thailand. Joint bank accounts and she makes the withdrawals. No need for wills etc. Just joint bank accounts if you have a stable relationship. 

[stoutfella]

On 8/17/2022 at 6:53 AM, Kerryd said:

The process is pretty straight forward and doesn't require a multi-part story.

From personal experience (when my father died here in 2010).

Dad was in the hospital (age 77 - late stage lung cancer) when he died.
No need for autopsy. (If the cause of death is known, they don't need to do an autopsy.)

Assuming you are the next of kin/legal guardian.

1. Hospital issues Death Certificate. (Body taken to the morgue.)
2. Death Certificate has to be take to City Hall (to be authenticated or something).
3. Death Certificate and passport of the deceased taken to national Embassy. (Passport is cancelled. Get Death Certificate translated and notarized copies made.)
4. Embassy issues Letter authorizing disposal of the body.
5. With copies of the Death Certificate and Letter from the Embassy, make an appointment at whichever temple you like for a cremation ceremony. 
6. Make arrangements to move the body from the morgue to the temple on the appropriate day. 

Notes:
* The Embassy should try to contact next of kin if possible. If you are the next of kin, you need that letter from the Embassy authorizing you to dispose of the body, either locally (in Thailand) or transported back home (at your expense of course).
* You HAVE to have that Letter authorizing you to dispose of the body. The temple can't do a cremation without it.
* Cremation ceremonies can be one day affairs up to 5 days. But if the body has been in the morgue for a few days, they will want to do a "one and done" ceremony.
* You will be expected to dispose of the ashes the morning after the cremation.

That's pretty much it as far as Thailand is concerned.

Many foreigners won't have a Last Will and Testament which will muck things up a lot. Normally in Thailand, you have to wait 45 days before you can go to court to have the Will probated (read and approved by a judge).
(Got to have time for people, including any possible family members and/or creditors to lay claim to the assets.)

You can't dispose of any of the deceased's assets before then.

Which means someone has to pay for the cremation and (presumably) storage of personal effects.

I was the heir and only relative when my dad died. I paid for everything of course. Due to work issues, it was nearly 3 months before I could get back and go to court to have the Will probated (Dad did have a Will in Thailand and one in Canada as well).

I had to make a trip "home" later that year to notify the various gov't agencies (hence the need for the notarized copies of the translation of the Death Certificate) and to get his (Canadian) Will probated.

Most of that won't apply here though, as I doubt too many "bar stool buddies" are going to put much (if any) effort into settling someone's affairs (and paying out a wad of cash in the process).

Final Note - If you die in Thailand and don't have a Will, your relatives (if any) are screwed. Basically, the "gov't" (City Hall presumably) would take control of any personal effects and, if no claims are made against the estate, dispose of them after a period of 7 years.

A friend of mine died some years ago. Old Vietnam Vet. He actually travelled back the USA after he got sick and died there.
But he left assets in Thailand, including vehicles and money in the bank. No one could touch any of it because he didn't have a Will. Even his sister in the USA. 
She could have flown here and petitioned the court and maybe they would have given her his stuff but apparently she didn't want to make the trip or something.
So what will happen is that, after a period of time, his bank account will go "dormant" and after about 7 years, they will close it. I'm guessing any assets he had will have long since disappeared.

What if a foreigner dies and there's no one to do anything ?
Basically, the body would be taken to the hospital for an autopsy.
The Embassy would be notified. The body would stay in the morgue.
If the Embassy can't find any relatives, they would be expected to authorize the disposal of the body.
(I'm guessing City Hall would then make the arrangements with a temple for a "pauper's" cremation and the temple staff would dispose of the ashes.)
As to the person's assets, who knows ? Probably gone to whoever got there first.

By rights, any money in the bank would stay there until 7 years have passed. Then the account would be closed and the money (in theory) transferred to the (Federal) government.

If it is a friend of yours, you can go the "e-beggar" route, set up a GoFundMe and try to cash in (by claiming you need the money to settle his affairs and pay for his funeral).

(A few years ago some "Youtube" guy that was worth a bit of money died in Thailand. His relatives didn't want to spend their own money so they set up a GoFundMe with a ridiculous amount, like $100,000 US, to travel to Thailand to get the body and fly it home. I'm guessing after they spent a couple weeks in 5 star hotels and flying back and forth on chartered jets.)
 

I think this section:

"Assuming you are the next of kin/legal guardian.

1. Hospital issues Death Certificate. (Body taken to the morgue.)
2. Death Certificate has to be take to City Hall (to be authenticated or something).
3. Death Certificate and passport of the deceased taken to national Embassy. (Passport is cancelled. Get Death Certificate translated and notarized copies made.)
4. Embassy issues Letter authorizing disposal of the body.
5. With copies of the Death Certificate and Letter from the Embassy, make an appointment at whichever temple you like for a cremation ceremony. 
6. Make arrangements to move the body from the morgue to the temple on the appropriate day. "

might depend on which country you are a citizen of as this certainly wasn't the case when a friend of mine died a few years ago and his Thai wife asked me to contact our embassy to find out what she had to do and whether they were even interested. The answer was that unless the body was to be re-patriated to our country they, the embassy, were not at all interested.

[3NUMBAS]

coins placed in deceased mouths are found in not bad shape i have seen

 

 

[lungbing]

Then who paid the ferryman?

[lungbing]

22 hours ago, NE1 said:

My friend died last night from an ongoing battle with cancer. He has had laser treatment etc. He is an Englishman who has lived near Ubon Ratchathani for 10 years and married to a Thai lady.

She plans on cremation Monday but as of yet she has no death certificate , and she has just telephoned and asked what the procedure is for informing Embassy , Police etc. She has spoke to her husbands daughter in England who has been aware of her fathers battle , and only requires a Death Certificate for personal reasons.

Can anybody enlighten me as to what I can tell her.

Ring the Consular section of the British Embassy on  02  305  8333 and they will advise you.  I suspect they will need a copy of the death certificate and a copy of your friend's wedding certificate.   It may be possible to send them as email attachments, the Embassy will know.  I think the phone is open 24/7.

 

If you would be so kind, can you come back and post what happens to give us a definitive answer for UK people.