Will Thailand’s new residency visa achieve results?

[K2938]

24 minutes ago, Pib said:

According to the primary BoI spokeman for the LTR program (the lady in below post/video) you would just need to prove your "total" investments would cover a 10 year period, like at least 800K USD which would provide 80K USD per year.   And those investments would need to be in under a pension or annuity type fund to qualify.  And with so many different types of investment funds called different names in different different countries I expect there is flexibility in your investment fund type.   

Real life data points were the basis for my above comment.  Common sense would dictate what you said, but that is unfortunately not true

Edited January 14, 2023 by K2938

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, K2938 said:

I know real life data points....

Such as? 

[K2938]

12 minutes ago, Pib said:

Such as? 

The application experience of other people

Edited January 14, 2023 by K2938

[Caldera]

Just like with any other similar program before (Elite, Smart Visa), they'll attract a few thousand qualifying applicants and that's it. Or in other words, they will miss their target by orders of magnitude.

 

Two reasons:

 

Most of those who qualify for the new LTR visa would have qualified for one of the previously existing visas as well. If they had been interested, they would already be here, or maybe they switch from their current visa to the LTR - no net gain in wealthy foreigners for Thailand!

 

Some conditions don't make sense and/or put off potential applicants. As always, they start with a grand idea, only to let the bureaucracy spoil it. It's comical and saddening at the same time. 

[K2938]

33 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Most of those who qualify for the new LTR visa would have qualified for one of the previously existing visas as well. If they had been interested, they would already be here, or maybe they switch from their current visa to the LTR - no net gain in wealthy foreigners for Thailand!

Yes, if I remember correctly based on some previous data released over 50% of applications were from people already in Thailand anyway.

And since the shortfall between the official goal of 1 million visas in 5 years and the real number of visas issued is now so huge that it is clear to everybody that this will never ever be reached, this goal now allegedly was never really meant seriously anyway.

The visa is attractive for a very small group of people who happen to meet its criteria.  But to expect huge numbers of visas to be issued just seems to be based on the fallacious idea that all the world's wealthy are just dying to move to Thailand.  They are not.

Edited January 14, 2023 by K2938

[Enoon]

7 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I doubt there's anyone wanting to invest $500,000 in Thailand to get a VISA.

A lot of money got "invested" in Cuba under Batista.

 

Thailand seems to be just the sort of place to appeal to that sort of wealth.

 

Prostitution rife, soft drugs legit, major trading hub for illegal drugs, awash with illegal guns, casinos on the way, all under the smiling, benevolent, accessible stewardship of the RTP.

 

It's a bargain at 500k.

 

 

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by Enoon

[worldexpress]

14 hours ago, webfact said:

the LTR program will attract wealthy, ‘high-potential’ and talented individuals

You have to meet all three? I don't see too many Elon Musks knocking on the door.

I think it's safe to assume 'wealthy = high-potential or talented' in Thailand.

[Blumpie]

It depends how you look at it:

 

1)  Delusional?  Great success!!  Incredible!!!

2)  Non-Delusional?  Uh not at all.

 

Thai government will pick 1, which one do you want?  

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, Pib said:

And that 250K USD investment can be something like a condo/house that was bought years ago..

Slips off the tongue quite well but that is over 8 million baht place, so certainly at a higher end of the market.. and not something I would recommend in Thailand myself...with their very restrictive foreign ownership rules. It may work for you, but I am in a circle more of retired people. I admit to not grasping the requirements well.. even the link I posted does not make it clear if the monetary requirements are 'either' or 'and'! I was intrigued that you mention the Visa can cover dependents, which is what got my attention, having a pal who seems to spend a lot of money (not to mention effort)  each year keeping his foreign wife and child here..... 

A also am a bit repelled by the need to prove all these requirements to Thai authorities...... they are often quite obtuse (not to mention corrupt) over things like that.... look what people are required to do for a marriage extension, being an example. 

Edited January 14, 2023 by jacko45k

[Andycoops]

The jokers who come up with this <deleted> must have all had some form of mental illness.

It just laughable that they think 1M people, individuals, are going to invest that sort of money in such a corrupt regime.

[lujanit]

23 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Then she has more money than common sense it would appear, or she just doesn't care.  For the next 10 years and then 10 years after that and so on, as long as the program doesn't sunset, I am in a good position and never need to be concerned with traveling in and out and neither will my GF soon to be spouse as her visa will be like mine.

She is very wealthy and doesn't like any type of government bureaucracy at all.  The thought of waiting at BOI sent her to look for other alternatives.  The amount she paid to an agent is nothing to her.

[Iknow]

IMO anyone with Bht1.5 million should get the 20 year Thailand Elite Card THE END https://thailand-elite.com/?no_lredirect=true&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIn6faptzI_AIVxaDYBR34rwhGEAEYASAAEgIeZfD_BwE

[Iknow]

12 hours ago, Enoon said:

A lot of money got "invested" in Cuba under Batista.

 

Thailand seems to be just the sort of place to appeal to that sort of wealth.

 

Prostitution rife, soft drugs legit, major trading hub for illegal drugs, awash with illegal guns, casinos on the way, all under the smiling, benevolent, accessible stewardship of the RTP.

 

It's a bargain at 500k.

 

 

 

Not when for Bht1.5 million you can get a 20 year Thailand Elite Card https://thailand-elite.com/?no_lredirect=true&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIn6faptzI_AIVxaDYBR34rwhGEAEYASAAEgIeZfD_BwE

[ThailandRyan]

32 minutes ago, Iknow said:

IMO anyone with Bht1.5 million should get the 20 year Thailand Elite Card THE END https://thailand-elite.com/?no_lredirect=true&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIn6faptzI_AIVxaDYBR34rwhGEAEYASAAEgIeZfD_BwE

@Iknow Care to explain Why? you responded in a OP where the cost for a 10 year LTR Visa is only 50K Thb, not 800K Thb for the Elite, and the payment is not due until you are approved for the LTR Visa so no chance you loose the funds if denied.  Another plus is no further fees for the year are due, and with That you do not have to go to immigration and pay 1900 Thb a year for an extension as you currently do with the elite visa if you do not leave the country. No 90 day reports are needed either. 

 

Are you advocating the Elite Visa is better if one has money?  Not in my view.  Could I have purchased the Elite Visa, sure, by why? What I have now with the LTR-P is just as good, if not better in my view and I do not golf, my health insurance gives me a free once a year medical, and with the LTR Visa I get a 10 year multiple re-entry permit to come and go and can use the fast track just like the Elite Visa holders can, sure no limo ride, but dont need it as I have my own vehicle.

Edited January 15, 2023 by ThailandRyan

[pomchop]

How about a new visa policy

 

1.  Visa is $1 per day PLUS $10 admin fee.  30 days $30, 365 days...$365  Payable in advance online or for additional $25 fee in person at special desk on arrival.

 

2.  Renewals or extensions at immigration office for admin and additional days fee

 

3.  Upon renewal passport will be checked against police data base.  Any legal violations other than very minor no more $1 a day visas period.  End of the line and deal with immigration like before.

 

4.  Max visa is one year.  Then must be renewed and admin and police check done to add additional year.

 

5.  People caught with expired or no visa big fine and future visa requests strictly in person at immigration with appropriate penalties.

 

Keep it simple.

 

How many tourists would likely stay a week a month or ?  a bit longer if it were simple.

 

Of course many current immigration staff would need to be reassigned or eliminated but such is life and there seem to be no shortage of jobs for thai govt staff.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JimGant]

On 1/14/2023 at 1:41 PM, Pib said:

All any visa agency will be able to do is hand-walk a person thru submitting the required docs online.

I hope not, because what's stopping me from applying is having to go to Bangkok, for at least the initial visa, then maybe for the five year follow-up requirement. Certainly a satellite BOI office, in the guise of agent, could accomplish all's that needed. Certainly if I can get a LTR visa from one of a hundred Thai embassies and consulates -- I should be able to get one from an agent established in the larger Thai cities, like Chiang Mai....

 

Certainly seems easy enough for BoI, especially if part of their target market includes Bangkok-adverse country bumpkins.

[ThailandRyan]

19 minutes ago, JimGant said:

I hope not, because what's stopping me from applying is having to go to Bangkok, for at least the initial visa, then maybe for the five year follow-up requirement. Certainly a satellite BOI office, in the guise of agent, could accomplish all's that needed. Certainly if I can get a LTR visa from one of a hundred Thai embassies and consulates -- I should be able to get one from an agent established in the larger Thai cities, like Chiang Mai....

 

Certainly seems easy enough for BoI, especially if part of their target market includes Bangkok-adverse country bumpkins.

Tell me if that's how the Thai Elite Visa works?....because I can assure you it does not and you still have to travel to BKK CW with yourself, your passport, and meet the agent from Thai Elite there for your appointment to have the TE Visa placed in your passport.  No other place to do it.  The same will be the way this BOI LTR Visa will be done with an agent.  You still can not do it in person with turning in an application and the required paperwork as it can only be done by using the LTR website application. 

 

So no hand carried paperwork like when you do an extension of stay I am afraid.  If and when the day comes that an agent can do it all for you as you think can be done then the BOI will no longer be in business.  This is an Investment style Visa and nothing more.  You either meet the requirements or you do not and until they decide to widen the locations within Thailand where you can obtain the Visa one will still have to go to BKK Chamchuri Square BOI on one side and the BOI Immigration unit on the other side of the building.  Some folks speculate that an agent will be able to rub the immigrations and BOI's shoulders and just obtain the LTR type of visa, 5 different classes, by paying a fee without actually having the requirements as some do with the money in the bank issues for the O and O-A visas.  That will never occur, in my view, because if it did then the BOI would be no more.

Edited January 15, 2023 by ThailandRyan

[Pib]

49 minutes ago, JimGant said:

I hope not, because what's stopping me from applying is having to go to Bangkok, for at least the initial visa, then maybe for the five year follow-up requirement. Certainly a satellite BOI office, in the guise of agent, could accomplish all's that needed. Certainly if I can get a LTR visa from one of a hundred Thai embassies and consulates -- I should be able to get one from an agent established in the larger Thai cities, like Chiang Mai....

 

Certainly seems easy enough for BoI, especially if part of their target market includes Bangkok-adverse country bumpkins.

You do have a good point that if a person opts to have their LTR visa issued at a Thai Embassy/Consulate that the person does not have to go anywhere.   If it's OK to do it that way then it's not absolutely essential that "only" the BOI Bangkok Chamchuri Square Immigration Office could issue the visa within Thailand with the person showing up in person.  

 

I expect it really boils down to if HQ Immigration is willing to add LTR issue authority workload to every or various Immigration offices around Thailand even if it is small workload.  Like maybe at immigration offices such as Chiang Mai since there is also a BoI regional office there.  The BoI has 7 regional BoI offices around Thailand not including the Bangkok BoI Office.   Most organizations are reluctant to take on additional workload unless more manpowera/money comes with the responsibility.....and government organizations typically hate transferring manpower/money from their budget to another government organization unless someone high-up the totem pole orders it.  And I doubt the BOI is willing/able to transfer manpower/budget unless someone way-up the totem just says, "Make It Happen!!!"   

 

Plus, I think the great majority of LTR applicants who select that they want their LTR visa issued within Thailand are applicants who live in Thailand and are able & willing to travel to Bangkok to get the LTR visa issued since it only has to be done initially and at the 5 year mid point of the 10 year visa....and actually that 5 year mid point process is still something in the works as far as I know.  So, the BoI and Immigration are probably not too concerned about travel by applicants within Thailand.

 

But who knows, as mentioned in an earlier post the BoI is going thru the process of selecting "Certified Agents" and I expect how much authority/responsibilities Certified Agents will have is maybe something not yet fully decided.  Maybe, just maybe, they would be authorized to do "all of the legwork" to including the applicant having to go to Immigration in person to accomplish the final step of having the LTR visa inked into their passport. 

 

Because that final step is really nothing more than having your photo taken twice and fingerprints taken once while at Immigration, signing a few docs, and paying the Bt50K fee.   And the fingerprints thingie doesn't apply if getting the LTR visa issued outside of Thailand via the evisa system.  Throw-in a power of attorney and maybe, just maybe, it would be possible for BoI and Immigration to allow an applicant to never show-up at Immigration just to get the LTR inked into your passport.  But my gut is also telling me that is probably a Wish Upon a Star ending vs a reality ending.   Time will tell.   

 

You know (and I know) you can meet the income and medical coverage requirements....if you can handle a two day trip Chiang Mai-Bangkok (if traveling via ground transportation) for a simple final step taking only 1 to 2 hour at BoI Chamchuri Square then go-for-it.  Heck, maybe even take a morning flight from Chiang Mai to Bangkok with an evening flight back to Chiang Mai.  Yeap, a long day but no overnight stay in Bangkok. 

 

 

 

 

[2009]

On 1/14/2023 at 1:37 PM, Jonathan Swift said:

Doing it without an agent is pretty easy once you know the ropes. I don't like the idea of placing such important matters in anyone else's hands, plus the money saved is significant, around a few hundred dollars. But that's just me and my way, not everyone has equal skills with bureaucratic systems. 

Skill?

 

I mean, you're just compiling paperwork and hopping in a taxi to immigration.

 

Dealing with the taxi driver takes some bureaucratic skill, okay, I'll give you that.

Edited January 15, 2023 by 2009

[fusion58]

On 1/14/2023 at 10:06 AM, webfact said:

This target seems overly optimistic. The LTR visa enters a highly competitive global industry of long-term and second-home visa programs because of its focus on attracting wealthy global citizens. But it is difficult to envisage why applicants would invest at least US$500,000 in Thai property or low-yield Thai government bonds to be approved for this visa if they are expected to hold US$1 million in assets.

Hey, I was assured that it's only a matter of time before the hordes of deep-pocketed foreigners who have chosen Thailand over the French Riviera arrive on these shores.

[Boomer6969]

I got it, the WP version, and it was totally effortless. My pension, my health insurance and of course my Swiss bank had all the documents needed available on line. So it was just a bit more work than a 90 days report... The visit at Chamchuri took about 90 minutes, that was it. All highly civilised too..

[Misty]

10 hours ago, Iknow said:

IMO anyone with Bht1.5 million should get the 20 year Thailand Elite Card THE END https://thailand-elite.com/?no_lredirect=true&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIn6faptzI_AIVxaDYBR34rwhGEAEYASAAEgIeZfD_BwE

And if they want to work here?  I've got a 5 year digital work permit now, no need for 4 Thai employees, thanks to the LTR visa. Can't do that with an elite card, or any other visa.

[MaiChai]

On 1/14/2023 at 3:26 PM, NorthernRyland said:

I'm not rich and probably never will be but isn't 500k USD a lot to invest for a measly 10 year visa into a country like Thailand that flip flops at break neck speeds as we saw recently with the COVID requirements?

 

If this whole thing blows up how do you get your 500k out of the country now and is it even liquid or will you get stuck with bad investments? Seems mighty risky to me.

Thats why you don't need to be rich to live in Thailand, and there are other visas that are much more friendly to the wallet. Alot of people are rich because they are smart or simply good with money rather than wasting it on visas like this. The 400k/800k in a Thai bank makes it very easy for immigration to confirm you have enough money to live on here rather than trying to comprehend peoples wealth and background.

[spidermike007]

On 1/13/2023 at 11:44 PM, Jackbenimble said:

The idea itself is a great idea but..........the financial constraints they've attached to it make it unworkable. 

I can only assume the government have taken the position that Thailand is a 1st World country and that the desire to be here is such that foreigners will pay whatever is necessary in order to live here.

Unfortunately that isn't the case.

A rethink will make this a very viable option but as it is it wont wash. 

A rethink requires humility, vision, creativity, and the ability to admit the current program has not had the kind of success they had hoped for. None of that is possible from the goon squad. 

[Boomer6969]

7 hours ago, MaiChai said:

Thats why you don't need to be rich to live in Thailand, and there are other visas that are much more friendly to the wallet. Alot of people are rich because they are smart or simply good with money rather than wasting it on visas like this. The 400k/800k in a Thai bank makes it very easy for immigration to confirm you have enough money to live on here rather than trying to comprehend peoples wealth and background.

I would agree that the range of visa possibilities now offered by Thailand is simply outstanding. But why are there still so many people whingeing about stupid requirements and even cheating when bribing corrupt agents and Immigration officers?

[ThailandRyan]

4 minutes ago, Boomer6969 said:

I would agree that the range of visa possibilities now offered by Thailand is simply outstanding. But why are there still so many people whingeing about stupid requirements and even cheating when bribing corrupt agents and Immigration officers?

People claim they are saving time, keeping money where it can make money, they don't trust the country, or they are too young for any other long term visa as they dont have big money and so using an agent suits there needs

[Boomer6969]

13 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

People claim they are saving time, keeping money where it can make money, they don't trust the country, or they are too young for any other long term visa as they dont have big money and so using an agent suits there needs

By which they make their contribution to perpetuating the corruption of this third world country. 

Edited January 16, 2023 by Boomer6969

[jacko45k]

58 minutes ago, Boomer6969 said:

By which they make their contribution to perpetuating the corruption of this third world country. 

They simply wish to perpetuate their stay in this third world country. And they have facilitated a quick and easy withdrawal if they need to. The corruption was there before they came and will remain after they have gone.......

[JCCR6]

Can anyone clarify what the situation is if you change companies when you’re on the LTR work from thailand visa, but decide to change companies - is this visa cancelled like a normal visa/wp would be? 
 

 

[SuperSilverHaze]

On 1/14/2023 at 10:54 AM, ThailandRyan said:

Once a tear residence report instead of 90 days

So, immigration really doesn't need us to do 90 day reports - apparently it provides little or nothing.

 

So, why do any of us have to do it? Yellow shirt employment scheme