American man faces dilemma as Thai girlfriend’s parents demand 1 million baht dowry

[Eric Loh]

Dowry is not practiced in western countries. I can understand the out-pouring of outrage in this forum of mostly westerners. In many countries in Asia. dowry is common and is necessary. However the reason varied from country to country. In Thailand, parent want to be assured that the groom is financially able to support and care for their daughter and is expected in the Thai culture. If the man is sincere in his marriage intention, he should discuss with the parents to convince them that he has the financial ability and find an amicable amount. He has to understand the feelings of the parents and wife and not only on his own. To make the marriage work, it has to start with a harmonious relationship with the new family. 

[NorthernRyland]

3 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

No, I don't understand. It's a Thai-American marriage, but HE must be the only one culturally sensitive and understand women are chattel and must be purchased like a rug or used Toyota.

 

This seems to go ignored often. They think because the wedding is in Thailand the man must conform 100% to Thai-everyting, never mind a marriage is 50/50 by law and they very well may be living aboard at some point. It's not their fault but most Thai's are very narrow minded and haven't lived in Western countries so they don't understand these finer details.

[transam]

I notice a large number of members reading this thread, do many have bum burps learning about Thai tradition and having to cough up...........????

[Watchit]

53 minutes ago, Hakuna Matata said:

If you refuse to pay sin sod, you don't deserve to have a Thai wife!

Even most Thai men have to pay sin sod.

This is a very good thing to do.

You can always negotiate the amount of sin sod.

But YOU MUST PAY!

Rubbish, each to their own. I never paid one or never would. But then i'm a good catch and that was enough for her.

[quake]

58 minutes ago, Hakuna Matata said:

If you refuse to pay sin sod, you don't deserve to have a Thai wife!

Even most Thai men have to pay sin sod.

This is a very good thing to do.

You can always negotiate the amount of sin sod.

But YOU MUST PAY!

Bs.

 

[Walker88]

 

 

51 minutes ago, Hakuna Matata said:

If you refuse to pay sin sod, you don't deserve to have a Thai wife!

 

 

Do Thai women spit gold coins or something? Don't deserve? That's rather provincial thinking.

 

I guess I'm just going to have to suck it up and live with my lack of worthiness.

 

 

[Walker88]

The modern term for sinsod is 'barfine'.

 

In both cases, 'traditional' or modern, one is buying a human being's services and affection, feigned or real. Of course with the 'traditional' comes the showing off and face, so neighbors might be jealous. It's a village pissing contest. Perfect way to start a loving relationship, isn't it.

 

[Umlungu]

Pathetic and typically Thai. All about money, especially greed, as her family seems well off. The farang should get rid of her and go look for a dowry elsewhere.

[Stargeezr]

Yup better to leave in 2 weeks and not return to that city in Thailand. Bye Bye greedy parents and bride.

   It would appear that some Thais think that all people in other countries are filthy rich.

[GroveHillWanderer]

15 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Some do... some don't.. It all depends on the individuals involved...

 

My general sense is it's becoming a somewhat less common thing, particularly among younger, modern thinking Thais....

 

But even when sinsod DOES occur, it's very common lately for the family to put up the big money for show at the ceremony, and then take it back after everyone's gone home... As I said above, thus face is satisfied.

 

This.

 

I think possibly the following phrase from the OP is very telling:

 

"the amount was reasonable because they had to show the dowry during the wedding ceremony."

 

I have been to a number of Thai weddings where the sinsod money had been borrowed from wealthier relatives, was there just for show, and was returned after the ceremony was over.

 

I wonder if this guy had just asked the family if it would be okay to simply show the money at the ceremony and then get it back afterwards, whether he might not have been pleasantly surprised by the response.

[malthebluff]

Well I never paid a single baht dowry , the dowry is just for show at the wedding so the family can more or less show off  in front of naugbours and if a good family it is returned to the married couple after the wedding to help create a better start in life. And 1 million is way to much this is duel pricing at the extreme  normal thai guy would show 200/300k, and that's a lot for a young thai man earning 15k a month

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Thank god that I could care less about you... there's an old saying... "when in Rome......" It's not about the money at all... it is about outward display of caring and devotion... it is common in many many cultures including the USA just expressed differently.  I wouldn't expect you to understand...

It's BS.

Caring about money yes

Caring about him, not at all.

 

Most farangs won't even need to pay it as marry divorcees or women with children. If she ain't a virgin, don't pay a satang.

[Sydebolle]

Walk in huge great steps in the other direction. Sinusod is soooooo outdated but if the Isanis can find a fool to pay ......

 

[Watchit]

Lots of guys here married bar girls or divorcees and still paid sin sod. Then there were the houses and cars, her kids education and so on. Rather sad really.

[Airalee]

 

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, malthebluff said:

Well I never paid a single baht dowry , the dowry is just for show at the wedding so the family can more or less show off  in front of naugbours and if a good family it is returned to the married couple after the wedding to help create a better start in life. And 1 million is way to much this is duel pricing at the extreme  normal thai guy would show 200/300k, and that's a lot for a young thai man earning 15k a month

I showed 50,000 and that was 50,000 more than she turned out to be worth.

 

Do any of the suckers that GIVE the money ever ask for it back when the blushing bride turns into something not wanted and divorce is necessary?

[Adumbration]

43 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

And yet the most upper of upper class Thai women married a White American.

LOL...most...

 

Some rare well publicised examples.  Most end in divorce as you well know.

 

Oh...and Americans are no longer de rigueur....Koreans are now the catch of the day.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 minutes ago, Watchit said:

Lots of guys here married bar girls or divorcees and still paid sin sod. Then there were the houses and cars, her kids education and so on. Rather sad really.

What is really sad is that many of them were like me and didn't want anything to do with a western woman, but made the mistake of thinking a Thai woman was different.

[Jackbenimble]

16 hours ago, bignok said:

Smart guy. 60% likely to get divorced and the 1m baht is lost plus maybe extra money lost. He just saved himself 5 years of grief and 2m probably.

 

On 2m baht he could visit Thailand 20 times on visa exempt and have a great time with many women.

Why do you just assume he is of a mind to go with working girls? Apart from this dowry incident his relationship with the Uni student appear to be perfectly normal and happy. 

I think his "dilemma" is should I ditch her OR pay the dowry. 

In my country a wedding costs about 1M baht anyway so if - as was said in the article - she gets half of it then he's only risking 500,000 baht which............if he loves her the way he says he does might be a risk worth taking.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Hakuna Matata said:

If you refuse to pay sin sod, you don't deserve to have a Thai wife!

Even most Thai men have to pay sin sod.

This is a very good thing to do.

You can always negotiate the amount of sin sod.

But YOU MUST PAY!

My Thai wife didn't deserve me. Should she have paid me to marry her?

[malthebluff]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I showed 50,000 and that was 50,000 more than she turned out to be worth.

 

Do any of the suckers that GIVE the money ever ask for it back when the blushing bride turns into something not wanted and divorce is necessary?

If the family had asked for any money from me even a single baht that would have told me what sort of family I was marrying into and  to runaway. Lucky they paid for everything and have never asked me for anything. They are very hard working but poor.  now 9 years married and before people comment she is a lot younger then me with a very good job so it is her supporting me.

[Hummin]

20 minutes ago, Jackbenimble said:

Why do you just assume he is of a mind to go with working girls? Apart from this dowry incident his relationship with the Uni student appear to be perfectly normal and happy. 

I think his "dilemma" is should I ditch her OR pay the dowry. 

In my country a wedding costs about 1M baht anyway so if - as was said in the article - she gets half of it then he's only risking 500,000 baht which............if he loves her the way he says he does might be a risk worth taking.

If the parents pay for the wedding and the gold, it is not that much.

 

Ordinary village girls with university who marry Thai boys, pay now around 500 000 in sin sod.

 

Many do not marry before they have kids, and saving together to make the marriage. 

 

It is a highly alive tradition among thais many places, and not just  foreigner and Thai thing

 

[Walker88]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxW789jHXII

18 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Dowry is not practiced in western countries. I can understand the out-pouring of outrage in this forum of mostly westerners. In many countries in Asia. dowry is common and is necessary. However the reason varied from country to country. In Thailand, parent want to be assured that the groom is financially able to support and care for their daughter and is expected in the Thai culture. If the man is sincere in his marriage intention, he should discuss with the parents to convince them that he has the financial ability and find an amicable amount. He has to understand the feelings of the parents and wife and not only on his own. To make the marriage work, it has to start with a harmonious relationship with the new family. 

And in India it's the woman's family who has to buy the groom. Then the wife moves in with the MIL and sits on the floor at her feet, treated like a slave.

 

These sorts of things are corollaries to slavery and bondage. Since I am opposed to buying and selling other humans, I guess I'll never marry into a place where I must show my 'outward display of caring and devotion' (as another poster wrote) via money. It's materialism, pure and simple. Love and devotion have nothing to do with it.

 

Like slavery, dowries ought to be tossed into the dustbin of history. Let the chumps...oooh, sorry, the 'culturally sensitive' pay.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, Jackbenimble said:

Why do you just assume he is of a mind to go with working girls? Apart from this dowry incident his relationship with the Uni student appear to be perfectly normal and happy. 

I think his "dilemma" is should I ditch her OR pay the dowry. 

In my country a wedding costs about 1M baht anyway so if - as was said in the article - she gets half of it then he's only risking 500,000 baht which............if he loves her the way he says he does might be a risk worth taking.

If it's a risk marrying someone that ups the chances of a divorce which are already 50%.

If they want him to buy her and she agrees with that, then she's just not worth it.

[quake]

Oops.  

[kaneko86]

Always keep in mind guys that women are the gatekeepers of sex and men of marriage. Mostly women benefit of wedding.

So my advice is:

If she wants to get married than I am the one setting the rules and not her. Her family can't be not okay but just wait a few years until she is older because remember... The wall is still undefeated.

And, actually a Thai girls family with only the passport she gets when married and the social benefits from that should pay us not the other way around. If she marries a Farang there shouldn't be sinsod, ever heard of a Thai paying it to the Farang brides parent?

[chuang]

OP this is not the correct forum, the majority here will tell you not to pay a baht,

the thais are greedy and scammers. etc etc  this is a thai bashing forum....Giving sinsod is thai culture . In India you get marry you dont have to pay a cent whereas the bride will give you a dowry, its their culture.

I suggest you use your head and heart or marry from your own kind.

[ChrisKC]

it is not normally mentioned, as it isn't here, that a dowry can only be considered authentic or justified when the daughter is a virgin; a sensitive question to establish such a thing of the girlfriend or the parents for the prospective husband!

 

Marriage traditions have been handed down through many generations. For many years it was more the norm that a girl would be a virgin and thus, the dowry system would be enacted by most prospective couples, bearing in mind that near to 100% of both parties would then have been Thai and as I understand it, it was a token amount to show good faith and even a modest sum would be given back after the marriage ceremony.

 

Now that there are numerous Interracial marriages, it isn't surprising, that certain of the traditions have been diluted in favour of a more mutual understanding of each others culture.

 

The final point from my own personal perspective is that I see dowrys nowadays as a way to extract money mainly from rich Thais or from foreigners. I am not prepared to buy my girl. If she is Thai and we marry in Thailand, I am absolutely OK with a Thai wedding ceremony - that I did 5 years ago!

[transam]

1 minute ago, chuang said:

OP this is not the correct forum, the majority here will tell you not to pay a baht,

the thais are greedy and scammers. etc etc  this is a thai bashing forum....Giving sinsod is thai culture . In India you get marry you dont have to pay a cent whereas the bride will give you a dowry, its their culture.

I suggest you use your head and heart or marry from your own kind.

How true...........

[Jackbenimble]

15 minutes ago, quake said:

I very much doubt that is true.

But you can spend 1m baht or more  if you wish to on a wedding.

There is a difference.

What?