To Marry or NOT

[TT1951]

Afternoon All 

 

 I have a few questions regarding getting married in Thailand and would appreciate your thoughts.

OK so I have gone through all the necessary procedures required and have my CNI etc meaning all good to go.

I have been with my girl for 6 years and after 2 failed (western) marriages had never really given it a thought as if I fail at something twice then that is enough and move on.

It was brought up by her and in a way that sounded reasonable.

We have 2 homes paid for by me and she said that in the event of her passing before me if married would mean I would have HALF or one house.

No mum or dad just a <deleted> son 19 that does not like farangs meaning no effort to talk to me etc even know his whole lazy existence is paid for by me.

1.       The first thing that came to my mind was I would not live in this village anymore if she had passed.

2.       The second reason not to go along with her is she may be thinking of me but I know with an Aunty both sides of us and her son it would be difficult for me to end up with anything.

          I also doubt it would be sellable as they are penniless and doubt anyone would want to live in the middle of their <deleted>.

3.       I have read many posts where it is possible for me to own the house and a Thai the land. With all the Lawyers fee’s etc in having all this drawn up only to end up with nothing seems pointless.

4.       I also don’t have the money to live out my retirement here and will probably have to go back home and work for a while to build up the bank account which we have talked about.

5.       SO, I believe I would be marrying to just make her happy which is fine (BUT)

6.       I do not know if there are benefits, she is thinking of or been told about and that there may be downfalls I don’t know about.

7.       If you men out there married could give me some advice that would be appreciated.

 

+/- to being Married

 

1.       Are there benefits to being married and I am already on a retirement VISA..

2.       What are the downfalls

3.       Am I liable, accountable for anything if I’m no longer in Thailand but still married to her.

 

Appreciate your comments

 

Regards, Jack

[hotandsticky]

That list of questions suggests "No" as the resounding answer.

 

 

If you want to protect your 'investment' do it with a Usufruct. In reality a waste of time - you have identified two keys factor; what is spent is spent and you have no intention of staying put in the event of her demise.

 

She could bequeath the house to you, giving you a year to transfer it toa Thai.......good luck with that one.

 

 

As an aside, if you do decide to marry, remember that marriage invalidates existing Wills; you would need a new one if, for example, there are assets and beneficiaries back home.

[OneMoreFarang]

To me it seems marriage has a lot of advantage for the females and lots of disadvantages for the males.

 

When people want/have kids then there is a good reason to marry.

If a guy wants to bring his Thai gf to Farangland, then that might be a reason.

 

In Thailand, no kids, I don't see any good reason to do that. Too many (possible) downsides. 

[scubascuba3]

Marriage is really for the woman, to get a big financial benefit usually, often win\lose scenario. Why get married? if you both like\love each other then that should be enough. As men get elderly they lose any power they had

[NanLaew]

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15 minutes ago, TT1951 said:

It was brought up by her and in a way that sounded reasonable.

What was brought up by her? The marriage question?

 

15 minutes ago, TT1951 said:

We have 2 homes paid for by me and she said that in the event of her passing before me if married would mean I would have HALF or one house.

Assuming both properties are in her name, not without a Will and a usufruct you wouldn't. If she passes before you, I believe you can legally stay in the house that she owns for up to 12 months which is to allow time to close the estate, sell the house, etc.. But chances are the relatives will have other ideas and you already say that you wouldn't have any reason to stay in Bahn Nawk anyway.

 

You are already on an 'independent' long stay entitlement with the Retirement Extension in place so as a twice married man (happily the second time) with two children (both mine), I don't see any reason you should not stay single. You say you will need to return to your home and work more to ensure a better, full retirement so why encumber yourself with dependents that fundamentally offer you nothing?

[FritsSikkink]

If you are married and she creates debt, you are liable.

If you are not married and the houses are in her name, you have nothing when she dies. 

[FritsSikkink]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

As men get elderly they lose any power they had

Nonsense.

[scubascuba3]

1 minute ago, FritsSikkink said:

Nonsense.

Wait and see, often happens especially when the wife has control of the money 

[KhunLA]

I would try to liquidate as much as possible now, and move you and GF to someplace you may actually enjoy living.  A condo would be best.

 

Marry ... NO

[FritsSikkink]

2 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Wait and see, often happens especially when the wife has control of the money 

Till when, 64 atm.

[bkk6060]

You are already a 2 time loser why make it 3? Your post alone should be enough for any reasonable man to say No.  If you must; live with them, rent, and put nothing in their name.

Edited October 8, 2023 by bkk6060

[Chris Daley]

They will drain your bank account dry.  The family will double overnight.  You will start to see the sisters cousins' best friend that needs a new phone to play games on.  The kids by the 3rd husband need a new school uniform.  The drug addict brother needs to pay off debts.

 

I would advise against marriage.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Chris Daley

[cnx1204]

Go back to your country to build up a retirement fund but you are over 50.  What makes you think you can find employment at that age.

 

 And what is your nationality?  How old is she?   How is her health?   That makes a difference in the suggestions you would get.   I bet you are significantly older than she is so the likelihood she predeceases you is slim.

 

If the only reason to marry is for YOU to have an inheritance, it doesn't sound the right reason.   If you die first, what would she have to live on?   Do you care? 

 

Too much info is missing.

 

 

 

 

[scubascuba3]

12 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Till when, 64 atm.

64 still relatively young, maybe 75+ but of course depends on the relationship

[NoDisplayName]

53 minutes ago, TT1951 said:

We have 2 homes paid for by me and she said that in the event of her passing before me if married would mean I would have HALF or one house.

No mum or dad just a <deleted> son 19 that does not like farangs meaning no effort to talk to me etc even know his whole lazy existence is paid for by me.

Not quite.

 

You two are not married.

 

SHE has 2 homes paid for by you.

 

With no parents, in the event of her passing before you, and assuming no will,her <deleted> son will own two houses paid for by you. 

 

Assuming no usufruct, you, as legally just some dude she shacked up with, can pay rent to the son who now owns the house you paid for.

[OneMoreFarang]

40 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Marriage is really for the woman, to get a big financial benefit usually, often win\lose scenario. Why get married? if you both like\love each other then that should be enough. As men get elderly they lose any power they had

I think it is fair when a woman gives up her job and takes care of the children and when the couple divorces that the husband still supports her. But IMHO this support should be reasonable.

There are too many guys who have to pay huge amounts of "support" so that the ex can live according to the standards which he provided when they were married.

That is stupid! I think the guy should support her enough that she can survive and sort out her life in maybe a year or two. But that's about it.

Guys don't marry because of the stupid divorce laws. If the laws were reasonable then I am sure a lot more guys would marry.

[Furioso]

You already gave her two houses that's enough. Absolutely 100% DO NOT get married because you will LOSE A LOT MORE.

[GreasyFingers]

You have creayed a problem for yourself buying 2 houses already, would be better to sell one now. There is nothing wrong with being married, as I am, but the wife immediately made a will at the Amphur that everything goes to me and not her children. That is the minimum you should require from her (knowing she can change it at any time without you knowing).

As has been mentioned above, you will have 12 months to sell after probate is granted but there will be problems with the family. I would not be staying long term in the house either.

On the other side of the coin if you have 2 houses to sell you should not have any trouble finding W4.

[JimTripper]

what about you?

how do you retire in half a house if needed?

[Red Phoenix]

Your girlfriend brought up the marriage option.

Obviously if you have some 2nd thoughts if she is the right one for you, you should not marry.

But if you have already long time a loving relationship, you could indeed consider it. 

The benefits of getting married with her are:

1 - every woman in a long relationship would be very happy with that 'ultimate' confirmation that she is the one for you

2 - it will allow you to switch your current 1-year extension of stay from retirement to marriage, meaning that you do not need to semi-permanently keep 800K-400K on your personal thai bank-account, as a marriage extension only requires 400K during the 2 months prior to application renewal

3 - it would be easier when you are married, when you want to take her on a holiday to your home-country

You also have to consider the consequences of being married when one of you comes to decease.

1 - If you decease first, your assets will go to her (and not to your family abroad, unless you have made a will to that effect after your married her)

2 - If she deceases first, you would have half of the houses (the other half would be for her son) - but as there would be little reason for you staying there, you might as well give that up.

Finally, if you come to the conclusion that - besides the emotional aspect - getting married has too little benefits to go that road, you could also discuss with your girlfriend the following:

1 - Not marrying officially, but simply having a 'village marriage' complete with a big party for all family and friends.  

2 - Making a will so that in case of your demise, that she is not left with empty hands.  There are many ways to do this.

Cheers! 

[richard_smith237]

Wow... some very bitter losers on this thread already.

 

One positive of getting married...  

IF your Wife passes before you, you have one year to sell the house.

IF you are not married, I don't believe you have access to anything. 

 

Thats as I understand it anyway.

[grain]

I've been in a very close loving relationship with my TGF for these past 10 years, the subject of marriage has cropped up a couple of times but I can't see one benefit for me to get legally married. Not even visa - even if I was legally married I'd still remain on a retirement ext, as it's far simpler to do than the married ext. I've already made a will for her that covers all my Thailand assets. So as I say I've considered it and don't see a single benefit for me.

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, TT1951 said:

Afternoon All 

 

 I have a few questions regarding getting married in Thailand and would appreciate your thoughts.

OK so I have gone through all the necessary procedures required and have my CNI etc meaning all good to go.

I have been with my girl for 6 years and after 2 failed (western) marriages had never really given it a thought as if I fail at something twice then that is enough and move on.

It was brought up by her and in a way that sounded reasonable.

We have 2 homes paid for by me and she said that in the event of her passing before me if married would mean I would have HALF or one house.

No mum or dad just a <deleted> son 19 that does not like farangs meaning no effort to talk to me etc even know his whole lazy existence is paid for by me.

1.       The first thing that came to my mind was I would not live in this village anymore if she had passed.

2.       The second reason not to go along with her is she may be thinking of me but I know with an Aunty both sides of us and her son it would be difficult for me to end up with anything.

          I also doubt it would be sellable as they are penniless and doubt anyone would want to live in the middle of their <deleted>.

3.       I have read many posts where it is possible for me to own the house and a Thai the land. With all the Lawyers fee’s etc in having all this drawn up only to end up with nothing seems pointless.

4.       I also don’t have the money to live out my retirement here and will probably have to go back home and work for a while to build up the bank account which we have talked about.

5.       SO, I believe I would be marrying to just make her happy which is fine (BUT)

6.       I do not know if there are benefits, she is thinking of or been told about and that there may be downfalls I don’t know about.

7.       If you men out there married could give me some advice that would be appreciated.

 

+/- to being Married

 

1.       Are there benefits to being married and I am already on a retirement VISA..

2.       What are the downfalls

3.       Am I liable, accountable for anything if I’m no longer in Thailand but still married to her.

 

Appreciate your comments

 

Regards, Jack

the answer to your yes/no question is === run Forrest run....

[TT1951]

48 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

The benefits of getting married with her are:

1 - every woman in a long relationship would be very happy with that 'ultimate' confirmation that she is the one for you

2 - it will allow you to switch your current 1-year extension of stay from retirement to marriage, meaning that you do not need to semi-permanently keep 800K-400K on your personal thai bank-account, as a marriage extension only requires 400K during the 2 months prior to application renewal

3 - it would be easier when you are married, when you want to take her on a holiday to your home-country

You also have to consider the consequences of being married when one of you comes to decease.

1 - If you decease first, your assets will go to her (and not to your family abroad, unless you have made a will to that effect after your married her)

2 - If she deceases first, you would have half of the houses (the other half would be for her son) - but as there would be little reason for you staying there, you might as well give that up.

Cheers for the positive benifits and I think it would take to long to reply (quote) all the negatives but have read ll and thank you.

 

1 -  Yes I believe this is her main reason as we are very happy together.

2 - I didn't know so thank you.

3 - Yes a plus also as it took 3 goes last time to get her holiday Visa to take her home for a holiday.

1 -  I have already made a will so that everything I own goes to her. It was in the event that something happens to her I was wondering.

2 - And you answered that and it sounds about right.

 

Cheers

[TT1951]

2 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

If you are married and she creates debt, you are liable.

If you are not married and the houses are in her name, you have nothing when she dies. 

Are you liable for debt even if your now back in your home country ?

 

Cheers

[proton]

Buying two houses is ideal, you live in one and her in the other. I actually knew somebody who bought two next to each other here who did that, he could not stand the nagging!

[motdaeng]

12 hours ago, TT1951 said:

15 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

If you are married and she creates debt, you are liable.

Are you liable for debt even if your now back in your home country ?

 

Cheers

"Are you liable for debt even if your now back in your home country ?" 

of couse you are, it does not matter where you are!

 

if the debt comes from a loan shark, you will be held responsible married or not married,

and for sure they will also wait till you back to thailand ...   
 

[FritsSikkink]

16 hours ago, TT1951 said:

Are you liable for debt even if your now back in your home country ?

 

Cheers

Of course, but if you never come back then you can get away with it.

[JayClay]

19 hours ago, TT1951 said:

I would be marrying to just make her happy which is fine

How is that fine?

[ThaiLawOnline]

Marriage is a very personal question and asking people with so many different backgrounds or experiences won’t give you and answer. But I think I know what answer you re seeking and what she is also seeking.

 

Why is it a personal question? Because it is about belief, religion, a paper that might give you more or less rights. But you can love a person without being married. So your real question is more, I think, about how much will it cost me to get married and what are the benefits.

 

For her and many Thai ladies, it is first, something suitable to achieve. They love their family and marriage is well seen. It is also suitable to be with a foreigner and it is for stability. They wrongly or not believe that foreigners are more faithful, do care about their wives and treat them better. I might be wrong, but this is my 19 years in Thailand having done hundreds or marriages and divorces for clients.

 

So what are you real benefits? Well, you can protect your assets with a simple prenuptial. You can also protect properties with usufruct, Sap Ing Sith, lease agreements or others. Including mortgage that often not married couple forget. I was one of the first writing about usufruct in Thailand in 2008 as I studied civil law.

 

These are real benefits:

1. You might get some tax benefits if you declare incomes here. If abroad, I am not sure.

2. if you have a child with her, you have automatically parental powers. Not if you are not married but with 2 marriages before, I doubt that you are looking for new children.

3. you can have a cheaper extension with 40k incomes per month or 400,000 baht at the bank. More complex for papers than retirement, but cheaper.

4. by being married to her, you could also help the family and kind of help her in a business without asking a work permit but I do not want to enter into the unknown and complexity of what is work and how it is apply. I just hope you are not in Pattaya or Phuket as some are very greedy there and laws could be applied with the wrong intentions (I am thinking about bridges games not so far ago and others).

5. If your lady works for the government, you could her some benefits. I doubt it.

6. maybe more but taxes, parental rights, possibility to “help” for a business, I forgot to mention that you would be a clear legal statutory heirs under 1635 of civil code.

 

but my personal experience is when you are married to a Thai, you become a part of Thailand. You are not just a tourist and you can be part of the family especially if you start to learn Thai and try to fit into the culture.

 

what are the cons?

1. you seem worried about losing money. Prenup, simple contract about property and do not need to buy a house. You can rent and you talk that you already have two.

2, what you are married adultery is an infraction and can means you could have damages to pay.

3. when you are married, my own experience is passion start to go down. Maybe not for everyone.

 

So if you are wise, do not spend more than you can afford, have a good understanding of how much money you will spend, I do not think you will lose a lot. I was married 11 years with a Thai wife and we split everything fairly when we divorced. I am not alone. But make the contracts and this understanding BEFORE you get married. Not after.

 

i thought I would not get married. I got married at 38. For me, there were benefits. Visa, business, I did not know if e would have children or not, and I thought she was different. And in a certain way, she was. I do not regret it, it also gave me permanent residency but that was not planned. Living together is sharing a life, good and bad parts, sharing experiences and maybe expenses, but you can do that also unmarried.

 

Getting divorce in Thailand if a party does not agree is not easy. (Clause 1516 of civil code for grounds). So it looks obvious to me that you want to secure your life, your assets, married or not, and I would do that before you got married.

 

You are not young. Do you really have tax benefits, insurance benefits, medical benefits, from a marriage? Or will it be social benefits like I said, being part of a family, a culture, which can be quite interesting but all families are not the same.

 

i was not closed to the family or my wife for 11 years.

i was closed to the family or my ex girlfriend of 3 years and I miss them. But I have no contact as our relationship was toxic and I couldn’t stand it more.

 

Talk to your friends, your neighbours, ask questions to people older than you, with different experiences and see what is good for you.

 

we only have one purpose in life : to be happy. What will make you happier? Search that route, this is what matters and happiness is often much more in relationships than in money.